Why is the Dollar good and Bitcoin bad for people

[vjudeu]

The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks

You know, what does it mean? It means, that the banking system was so bad, and failed so hard, that it pushed Satoshi to create Bitcoin in the first place. If dollar would be so good in 2008, then Bitcoin could never exist. But it was created, because of that exact reason: because of "second bailout for banks". So, when we can expect the next "bailout"?

Also note, that from purely technological point of view, it could happen much earlier. The "bailout" only pushed things further, and it was a trigger to make it real: https://gwern.net/bitcoin-is-worse-is-better

[JamesNZ]

I said that I hate people that spread lies and propaganda. This is the main tool of scammers and fraudsters. That of course can be someone I never met. It's enough to hear what they are saying.

Then by your own logic, you should hate yourself too. You also spread lies and propaganda just like the scammers and fraudsters. What your goal is, I have no clue. But educating people? Absolutely not. Lies and propaganda aren't tools for education.

You're the one of such people. You spread lies and propaganda. And of course that I hate you.

In your last thread, I challenged your statements because you made at least three demonstrably false claims in a single post. Here's the reference. Now, can you point to any specific instances where I lied? Do you have evidence to support such claims?

But I don't hate you for that.  Disagreement doesn't have to lead to hatred.

You're the scammer that wants to extract as much fiat(good numbers) as possible from the public in exchange for bad numbers that you have. It would be a sign of a moral decline not to hate people like you.

Scammer? Really? Spit it out then. What's your specific accusation? Got any evidence to back it up, or is this just another one of your pathetic lies?

No need to provide any evidence of that kind. This is not topic about you. Its about the difference between bad and good numbers in payment systems. I have my own reasons why I think you are a scammer and a liar. You can think about me the same way. But it's obvious who is selling something here.

[legiteum]

The US Dollar, like any currency, can have one or more of the following uses:

1. A means of transacting value between two parties.

2. An investment instrument.

3. A measurement metric.

Bitcoin is primarily used for #2, an investment instrument. It is very poor for transactions unless they are very large, and even then Bitcoin is typically more expensive than even international bank transfers. Bitcoin is basically useless as a measurement metric since it's value is extremely volatile and not widely understood.

The US dollar can be all three of these, and is surely the most common means of transacting value in the world. The Dollar is also often used as an investment instrument, although anything could be used this way, not just currencies.

Where the US dollar is unique is its ability to provide a ubiquitous measurement metric for value, and the US Dollar is, far and away, the most common means for this usage in the world. Other major currencies e.g. the Euro and the British Pound also fill this role in their respective dominions, but only the US Dollar is used throughout the world as a "reserve metric" that gives everybody in the world a way to ascertain a value. In other words, whether it's Bitcoin, a lesser-known currency, or car, or an hour of labor of some kind, of an acre of land, or anything else, the value in question is always converted to a metric well-known to both trading partners, and that is almost always the US Dollar.

In my opinion, the US Dollar will live forever in this last role, even if other currencies completely take over its role for #1, and other investments take over for #3.

In the future you will have a universal "wallet" that will hold value using a variety of investment instruments, which will be drawn from automatically when you need to transact.

The mechanism to transact will be some digital currency, presumably one that scales to handle all of the daily transactions in the world e.g. not be blockchain-based.

And the means of measurement will be US Dollars: in other words, your "wallet" will have a total value, listed in US Dollars, and each investment instrument will have a US Dollar measurement as well--and yet the wallet may not even have any actual US Dollars, in the same way your investment account or crypto wallet has no US Dollars in it.

[FanEagle]

What the difference is that your bitcoin is your bitcoin, it is in your wallet, it's yours, whereas dollars or any other fiat basically is not yours, firstly it's the bank's money and not yours and if the bank collapses then your money goes with them, which means that the money was never yours, it's attributed to your name by the bank but it's the banks money.

Secondly, it is also terrible because government could seize it anytime they want, not that they would because it would mean that they would never be elected again and it must be some coup or something for that to be real, but it is also not impossible neither, that's the issue. All of this combined means that while bitcoin is also just numbers on a screen, at the very least nobody else but you could touch them ever even if they want to, whereas in the fiat world a lot of things could go wrong without you touching it and make you lose it. Plus bitcoin goes up when fiat gets weaker so it is a much better asset too.

[BTC_pokaop]

Dollar value will lose value day by day due to inflation. But the price of Bitcoin will continue to rise in the future. Many believe that Bitcoin will be worth $1 million or more in the future. Today you can buy 1 chocolate for 1 dollar, 10 years from now you won't get 1 chocolate for 1 dollar. If today you can buy 1 car with 1 bitcoin, 10 years from now you can buy 5 or more cars with 1 bitcoin. So I think bitcoin is better than dollar at present.

[FatFork]

No need to provide any evidence of that kind. This is not topic about you. Its about the difference between bad and good numbers in payment systems. I have my own reasons why I think you are a scammer and a liar. You can think about me the same way. But it's obvious who is selling something here.

On the contrary. When you call someone a scammer, especially without proof, the burden falls on you to back it up.  Accusations are cheap, facts are what matter.  You're right, this conversation isn't about you either, but your baseless attacks make you look pathetic, not me.  Frankly, if anyone's "selling" something, it's desperation.

But hey! Even a payment system with "bad numbers" (as you so ignorantly claim) still gets the job done. So, there's that.  

[ditec_wrogn]

Hey JamesNZ,

Once again, you've proven yourself to be a liar and a fool. Your complete lack of understanding when it comes to Bitcoin is astounding, and your attempts to spread misinformation are pathetic.

The fact that you think there's "literally no one and nothing in the system to protect people" shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. The consensus rules and proof-of-work mechanism in Bitcoin ensure that the system is secure and that users are protected.

But let's be real, you're not here to have a genuine discussion. You're just a troll who enjoys spreading lies and causing chaos. Your rude and disrespectful behavior towards other users is unacceptable, and it's clear that you have no interest in engaging in a civilized conversation.

So here's a suggestion: how about you do some actual research and educate yourself on the topic before spouting off your nonsense? Or better yet, why don't you just shut up and stop wasting everyone's time?

No one has any patience for your lies and your bullshit. Get a clue or get lost.

[unlimitedmoneygenerator]

Hey JamesNZ,

Once again, you've proven yourself to be a liar and a fool. Your complete lack of understanding when it comes to Bitcoin is astounding, and your attempts to spread misinformation are pathetic.

The fact that you think there's "literally no one and nothing in the system to protect people" shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. The consensus rules and proof-of-work mechanism in Bitcoin ensure that the system is secure and that users are protected.

But let's be real, you're not here to have a genuine discussion. You're just a troll who enjoys spreading lies and causing chaos. Your rude and disrespectful behavior towards other users is unacceptable, and it's clear that you have no interest in engaging in a civilized conversation.

So here's a suggestion: how about you do some actual research and educate yourself on the topic before spouting off your nonsense? Or better yet, why don't you just shut up and stop wasting everyone's time?

No one has any patience for your lies and your bullshit. Get a clue or get lost.

No, absolutely not.

Bitcoin is safe, and secure, in a sense, of anonymity. Where as I am 90%, sure, sending this transaction, you will not be able to trace it back to my face.

But.

As far as security, if I steal your money. That is very limited. If I steal your money, there is very little you can do about it.

Now there will be a digital trail left.

And, if the amount is high enough you can get legal authorities involved.

But by then I would have already mixed your money, and I will be in paradise, sipping, a margarita.

I am saying this because I have studied, federal investigations, of fraudsters, and crypto scammers, and have somewhat-of a decent knowledge, around crypto currency.

Hopefully, you cannot be offended by this opinion.

Bitcoin is not as secure as your bank account, that's for sure.

It is easier to steal one million bitcoin, rather than, one million out of someone's bank account.

But heres the real problem....


Mr. JamesZ. You may be a very smart individual, and are actually not trying to scam anyone.

Nonetheless, we live in a digital age, where everyone, has a very short-attention span.

Try articulating your thesis, within the first 5 seconds.

Whatever your point, or argument is, let that be the one of the first thing you say, to provide context to the reader.

Because I like the other viewers, do not know what your point, or thesis is. Or maybe like you said you are just educating people. But what are you educating us on.

[PrivacyG]

Why is it that whenever you Bitcoin evangelists see some argument against Bitcoin you always repeat literally the same childish accusations: "you don't understand Bitcoin"

It is not a childish accusation.  You clearly do not understand Bitcoin.  Talk to Peter Schiff, he once did not understand Bitcoin either while pretending to fully understand it.  It worked partially, until he embarrassingly tried to accuse Bitcoin of Scamming him when it was clearly his own fault for not understanding how Bitcoin works.

You do not understand Bitcoin.

[JoyMarsha]

Another shity thread from a long term spammer and Bitcoin hater. No need reading this guys, it's just full of shit. Let's leave it for his likes

You are right. His account trust rating says it all about him, that he's a troll, needs to be ignored, and has a ban evasion from the forum.

I read through his created posts thread, and all I saw was someone saying thrash, no meaningful post about bitcoin other than him being a bitcoin hater.

[PrivacyG]

Bitcoin is not as secure as your bank account, that's for sure.

I disagree entirely.  Bitcoin is WAY more Secure than a Bank Account.  You say it is not as Secure because Bitcoin can be stolen and nobody can do any thing about it.  Well.  Banks can fail with Millions in your Accounts and chances are you can do nothing about it.  Maybe except recovering up to 100 Thousand Dollars or less.  Banks can seize Money from your Accounts if the Government decides to forcefully seize it or to attack you.  And there is nothing you can do about it.

Bitcoin on the other hand is impossible to attack.  Unless someone miraculously generates the exact same Private Key or Seed as yours, which is almost impossible, or unless you did not take care of your Seed or Private Keys which is your own responsibility.

It is easier to steal one million bitcoin, rather than, one million out of someone's bank account.

I doubt that.  Why do you think so?

[unlimitedmoneygenerator]

Bitcoin is not as secure as your bank account, that's for sure.

I disagree entirely.  Bitcoin is WAY more Secure than a Bank Account.  You say it is not as Secure because Bitcoin can be stolen and nobody can do any thing about it.  Well.  Banks can fail with Millions in your Accounts and chances are you can do nothing about it.  Maybe except recovering up to 100 Thousand Dollars or less.  Banks can seize Money from your Accounts if the Government decides to forcefully seize it or to attack you.  And there is nothing you can do about it.

Bitcoin on the other hand is impossible to attack.  Unless someone miraculously generates the exact same Private Key or Seed as yours, which is almost impossible, or unless you did not take care of your Seed or Private Keys which is your own responsibility.

It is easier to steal one million bitcoin, rather than, one million out of someone's bank account.

I doubt that.  Why do you think so?

Rug-Pulls. Wallet Sniffers.

We even have sam friedman, who stole 8 billion from customers using a hedge fund.

The underlying, economy behind bitcoin are even criminal marketplaces.

Thats the reason bitcoin, was sustainable in the first place, you could use it for illegal things.

All around, bitcoin is one of the best crypto currencies, but' it is very easy to exploit.

I could even fake it like I am sending you bitcoin, and reverse the transaction.

It is a new currency compared to the US, dollar so this is normal.

Don't forget stake being hacked for 42 million in bitcoin, all because they accidentally leaked their seed phrase.

Try and do that with chase, your done.

[Moreno233]

Another shity thread from a long term spammer and Bitcoin hater. No need reading this guys, it's just full of shit. Let's leave it for his likes

That's called educating people. I am educating people about Bitcoin. Because the internet is full of propaganda and lies about Bitcoin. The purpose of propaganda is to extract as much good money(fiat) from the public as possible and dump them bad money (bitcoins). That's why the public must be educated.

Like Hatchy rightly said, you are a Bitcoin hater and even you believe so much in the dollar, what are you doing here? What are you trying to achieve being here instead of focusing on the dollar. Your post is bias and shows you lack a full comprehension of what Bitcoin is and how it can impact on human lives. You have also dispel the problems bedeviling the fiat system such as inflation, control by the authorities and many others. If you know the freedom that Bitcoin offers, you will not make a skewed post like this that ignore the fact that people do not have access to even FX for international business in some part of the globe because their governments controls and restricts everyone. I will leave you to wander in your narrow knowledge of the power of Bitcoin and hope that one day you will wake up and start accumulating Bitcoin to benefit from the gains it has been delivering to those who trust it so much to hold.

[serjent05]

What the difference is that your bitcoin is your bitcoin, it is in your wallet, it's yours, whereas dollars or any other fiat basically is not yours, firstly it's the bank's money and not yours and if the bank collapses then your money goes with them, which means that the money was never yours, it's attributed to your name by the bank but it's the banks money.

Going with this logic, does not our Bitcoin holding value crash when the Bitcoin market collapses?  I do not see any difference when the main factor that generates the value of each currency collapses.

I wanted to be neutral here and I think both monetary system are great in their own ways.  Bitcoin enables us to have better privacy and freedom while fiat currency enables us to confidently spend our fiat holdings due to the support and insurance of the government.

I believe they have both strengths and weaknesses and instead of making these two systems compete, why not take advantage of the opportunity these two monetary systems give?  Make these two systems a tool for our growth and convenience.

Secondly, it is also terrible because government could seize it anytime they want, not that they would because it would mean that they would never be elected again and it must be some coup or something for that to be real,

I think the Bitcoin system and other cryptocurrencies' can be made to seize. freeze or reject transactions of their respective coins.   It is that the Bitcoin developers and miners choose not to. But to think that the instruction is just a piece of code, any time the Bitcoin developers and miners agree to implement such a thing, the Bitcoin network can freely freeze or seize any asset.  We are just lucky that most of the miners and developers are not as corrupt as these government officials are. Although they have their agendas, the Bitcoin developers and miners are good enough to prioritize the purpose behind the creation of Bitcoin .

[JamesNZ]

No need to provide any evidence of that kind. This is not topic about you. Its about the difference between bad and good numbers in payment systems. I have my own reasons why I think you are a scammer and a liar. You can think about me the same way. But it's obvious who is selling something here.

On the contrary. When you call someone a scammer, especially without proof, the burden falls on you to back it up.  Accusations are cheap, facts are what matter.  You're right, this conversation isn't about you either, but your baseless attacks make you look pathetic, not me.  Frankly, if anyone's "selling" something, it's desperation.

But hey! Even a payment system with "bad numbers" (as you so ignorantly claim) still gets the job done. So, there's that.  

Someone who joined the Bitcoin scheme just thinking they will profit is not a scammer. They are just greedy, naive or ignorant for thinking that if someone in the past managed to get a big bank-issued number in exchange for a small one issued by the Bitcoin system,so will they. But someone who actively spreads propaganda about the latter system and lies about the former system in order to get more bank-issued numbers is a scammer. Because let's be real - the ultimate dream of everyone that joined this Bitcoin scheme is to get as much of bank-issued numbers as possible. All of you Bitcoin evangelists are here only because you want to dump bad numbers(bitcoins) on greedy and naive people and get their money (good numbers). Those romantic stories that you preach, stories about the salvation that Bitcoin will bring is just cheap propaganda invented to scam the public out of their money. It's that simple.

[JamesNZ]

Hey JamesNZ,

Once again, you've proven yourself to be a liar and a fool. Your complete lack of understanding when it comes to Bitcoin is astounding, and your attempts to spread misinformation are pathetic.

The fact that you think there's "literally no one and nothing in the system to protect people" shows that you have no idea what you're talking about. The consensus rules and proof-of-work mechanism in Bitcoin ensure that the system is secure and that users are protected.

But let's be real, you're not here to have a genuine discussion. You're just a troll who enjoys spreading lies and causing chaos. Your rude and disrespectful behavior towards other users is unacceptable, and it's clear that you have no interest in engaging in a civilized conversation.

So here's a suggestion: how about you do some actual research and educate yourself on the topic before spouting off your nonsense? Or better yet, why don't you just shut up and stop wasting everyone's time?

No one has any patience for your lies and your bullshit. Get a clue or get lost.

Hahaha, how pathetic. First you deliberately misrepresent my words and then, based on that misrepresentation, you create a wall of text with ad hominem attacks. How pathetic you have to be to do something like that? The OP is not saying that the system doesn't protect numbers. It says that it doesn't protect people. The Bitcoin system does protect the numbers it issues. However, it doesn't protect people by ensuring they get goods and services back once they traded them for the numbers.

[Kakmakr]

You really want to tell us "Fractional reserve banking" are better than Bitcoin? This is what is wrong with some people.... they see the danger and they experience the danger, but they ignore it.

What have you learnt from the previous economic crisis, when the Banks nearly collapsed the global economy? Only people who worked in that system, benefitted from it, because they got bailed out with tax payer money and they received huge bonuses for preventing a collapse for something they created.  

[iBaba]

Another shity thread from a long term spammer and Bitcoin hater. No need reading this guys, it's just full of shit. Let's leave it for his likes

While I agree with you that the message of OP is ill-fated and pessimistic over the Bitcoin, responding to the silly analysis and epistle is the best way to go about these kind of people. It is also good to note that, while everyone is entitled to their own opinions and interests, like that of OP, applying common sense is golden. This includes analysising and experimenting information before sharing such long-text of opinion that could be misleading.

Bitcoin is a decentralized system and unlike the centralized system of the fiat currencies like dollar, Bitcoin is not controlled by any entity, either by the private sector or the government. When you talk about speed of transactions and reliability, bitcoin is definitely faster and more reliable as you can make boundless transactions across the world within a blink of an eye. This specially makes bitcoin and cryptocurrency space more interesting to me. Also due to its cryptographic algorithms, bitcoin is far more secure to operate than the fiat currency and when you talk about transparency, bitcoin among other cryptocurrencies are recorded on the blockchain network which is accessible to other nodes and anyone else.

Although, the OP seems to already have a mindset before coming here which could include that he's been sent or employed to do so. But what OP may not realize is, he's only setting up the fiat currencies to be more exposed as there are many faults and misnomer around the centralized system of banking including artificial inflation which is caused by the unlimited printing of the dollar for the purpose of popularizing it against other currencies in the world.

[JamesNZ]

Another shity thread from a long term spammer and Bitcoin hater. No need reading this guys, it's just full of shit. Let's leave it for his likes

While I agree with you that the message of OP is ill-fated and pessimistic over the Bitcoin, responding to the silly analysis and epistle is the best way to go about these kind of people. It is also good to note that, while everyone is entitled to their own opinions and interests, like that of OP, applying common sense is golden. This includes analysising and experimenting information before sharing such long-text of opinion that could be misleading.

Bitcoin is a decentralized system and unlike the centralized system of the fiat currencies like dollar, Bitcoin is not controlled by any entity, either by the private sector or the government. When you talk about speed of transactions and reliability, bitcoin is definitely faster and more reliable as you can make boundless transactions across the world within a blink of an eye. This specially makes bitcoin and cryptocurrency space more interesting to me. Also due to its cryptographic algorithms, bitcoin is far more secure to operate than the fiat currency and when you talk about transparency, bitcoin among other cryptocurrencies are recorded on the blockchain network which is accessible to other nodes and anyone else.

Although, the OP seems to already have a mindset before coming here which could include that he's been sent or employed to do so. But what OP may not realize is, he's only setting up the fiat currencies to be more exposed as there are many faults and misnomer around the centralized system of banking including artificial inflation which is caused by the unlimited printing of the dollar for the purpose of popularizing it against other currencies in the world.

This is a textbook example of Bitcoin propaganda that I mentioned - banks are bad Bitcoin is good. Tell me, why did you write this text? The question is of course rhetorical. You wrote it because you want more people to join in. You want bigger demand. Why? Why is Bitcoin community so obsessed with the demand? With the price. Why is it that whenever Bitcoin is accepted by some institution or a country you are so happy sharing the news? It's simple. The bigger demand means that you will get more fiat and thus, more goods and services. Because this is your ultimate goal -  getting good numbers issued by the banks because they ensure you'll get goods and services back. It is cars, houses, food, mobile phones, etc. what you want. Not numbers on the screen. So, your ultimate goal is to dump Bitcoin on someone else. That's why you talk positive about Bitcoin and negative about the banks. Because you know that Bitcoin is bad numbers that don't ensure the return of goods and services. It's a simple reverse psychology trick. It's propaganda, it's scamming people.

[FatFork]

No need to provide any evidence of that kind. This is not topic about you. Its about the difference between bad and good numbers in payment systems. I have my own reasons why I think you are a scammer and a liar. You can think about me the same way. But it's obvious who is selling something here.

On the contrary. When you call someone a scammer, especially without proof, the burden falls on you to back it up.  Accusations are cheap, facts are what matter.  You're right, this conversation isn't about you either, but your baseless attacks make you look pathetic, not me.  Frankly, if anyone's "selling" something, it's desperation.

But hey! Even a payment system with "bad numbers" (as you so ignorantly claim) still gets the job done. So, there's that.  

Someone who joined the Bitcoin scheme just thinking they will profit is not a scammer. They are just greedy, naive or ignorant for thinking that if someone in the past managed to get a big bank-issued number in exchange for a small one issued by the Bitcoin system,so will they. But someone who actively spreads propaganda about the latter system and lies about the former system in order to get more bank-issued numbers is a scammer. Because let's be real - the ultimate dream of everyone that joined this Bitcoin scheme is to get as much of bank-issued numbers as possible. All of you Bitcoin evangelists are here only because you want to dump bad numbers(bitcoins) on greedy and naive people and get their money (good numbers). Those romantic stories that you preach, stories about the salvation that Bitcoin will bring is just cheap propaganda invented to scam the public out of their money. It's that simple.

Hold on, conspiracy theorist. You directly accused me of being a liar and a scammer, so I'll ask you again, where exactly did I lie? Show me one single instance of me spreading propaganda or making false claims.  You built a strawman argument bigger than your ego. Where did you get the idea that I am actively spreading propaganda about Bitcoin? Show me the proof.