MtGox vs USA IRS question

[ccHammer]

If someone were to have had, for example, 338 btc at MtGox and lost it, how will they be able to file that on taxes now? How can we prove that we had it to begin with if it's gone now? According to what I have read, the IRS is treating btc as property vs currency which would put it into capital gains. Would someone just file it as 338*600 capital gain loss for 2014? What type of documentation can/would we/they need to provide to do this?

Thanks

[1715375793]

1715375793

[1715375793]

1715375793

[Beliathon]

You don't have the money = they can't tax the money.

Don't even worry about it.

I've tried to explain this before, that the only thing anyone has to do to defeat the IRS tax code is report on their filings, "I lost my private key(s), I no longer have access to those funds"

Related: https://darkwallet.unsystem.net/

I love how they refer to nation-state fiat currency as "state-issued scrip"! That is so apt in the age of global currency!!

Bitcoin (global money) makes the need for a "reserve currency of the world" laughably outdated and totally irrelevant. On a planet with a decentralized global money network, nation-state fiat currency will be thought of as 'local money', "state-issued scrip", worth - less.

[ccHammer]

Although I may not have any way to prove that I had and lost it, could they find it and if so can they tax it considering it is gone. Yeah, I cried a bit (like a biatch).

[khjghki44f]

What?? For the missing BTC IRS to collect taxes.

[seriouscoin]

You don't have the money = they can't tax the money.

Don't even worry about it.

I've tried to explain this before, that the only thing anyone has to do to defeat the IRS tax code is report on their filings, "I lost my private key(s), I no longer have access to those funds"

Related: https://darkwallet.unsystem.net/

I love how they refer to nation-state fiat currency as "state-issued scrip"! That is so apt in the age of global currency!!

Bitcoin (global money) makes the need for a "reserve currency of the world" laughably outdated and totally irrelevant. On a planet with a decentralized global money network, nation-state fiat currency will be thought of as 'local money', "state-issued scrip", worth - less.

If you lost your private key, you wouldnt be able to spend your btc would you?

The whole point is taxable event happens when you spend/sell your coins.

[Luno]

Wasn't OP asking if he could deduct his loss?

[Beliathon]

The whole point is taxable event happens when you spend/sell your coins.

So if I go down to any Starbucks in NYC with my laptop, and sell BTC in person for cash, I'll make sure to write down everything that happened for the IRS.

Just like every time anyone downloads a movie or album, they write it down and immediately report it to copyright.gov.

"Given that there are an estimated 150 million people using BitTorrent websites to download content, the CAS could impact quite a lot of Americans once it is in full swing."

Throttle the internet for 1/3rd of America! Yep, clearly this plan is fool-proof!

The government-corporation unholy alliance e-thugs are so clueless.. Desperately clinging to their old strings of power in a world that is transcending them via technology... we're cutting the strings.

[ccHammer]

Yes, it is gone, can't spend it. Last question, if it considered property and it's gone, can't I file it as a loss?

Thanks

[Beliathon]

Yes, it is gone, can't spend it. Last question, if it considered property and it's gone, can't I file it as a loss?

Yes you can, because it is a loss. Ooh, that's a new can of worms!

"Help mr IRS, I lost my private key(s)! I'm broke, give me all my tax money and more, please sir!"

[ccHammer]

Yes, it is gone, can't spend it. Last question, if it considered property and it's gone, can't I file it as a loss?

Yes you can, because it is a loss. Ooh, that's a new can of worms!

"Help mr IRS, I lost my private key(s)! I'm broke, give me all my tax money and more, please sir!"

Oh, faking it? hahaha, in that case I can say I lost 100,000 btc. Seriously though, 338 is a drop in the bucket compared to the 850k (200k found?). If I can't file it as a loss due to no documentation/proof then so be it, it is what it is. Doesn't hurt to ask though.

[thejewelrytech]

I wouldn't worry since There is NO SUCH LAW forcing anybody to file a tax return its completely VOLUNTARY and they even tell you listen and watch.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7lefFz81BCo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNICz9CZOgw and there is NO such LAW ON BTC a ruling means jack shit its not LAW and the IRS can't make LAW they work for the FEDERAL RESERVE and the FEDERAL RESERVE is about as FEDERAL as FEDERAL EXPRESS.........so filing one is just asking for trouble for oneself..... Why do it? you have a 5th amendment right not to incriminate yourself. I would almost guarantee anyone who files one for BTC will be quickly audited and you will be put on gov shit list and Black Lists quicker then voting for Ron Paul....... and by filing your pretty much asking them too and giving them that right too..... you think their going to just except anyone's filing AS Is? the jokes going to be on YOU! lol

[keithers]

I believe you can only claim losses up to 3k per year based on current tax rules. Not 100% sure though...

[bitcointaxes]

Ok, first, it's going to be a loss in 2014 (so for filing in 2015) not 2013. So there's nothing you can do right now anyway. It may even extend beyond that, we don't know.

If and when the bankruptcy is declared and you know what's going to happen, then you can take the loss of your coins. They are effectively sold for zero, unless you are given some compensation for your coins.

If you had downloaded your trading records, then you'll be able to work out the cost basis for those coins and report them as a loss. However, you can only claim the loss on the cost of the coins, not their worth. So if you bought 300 BTC at $10 each in Feb 2013, your loss is only $3k.

File it like any capital loss. You can offset any gains first, and then the remaining against your income up to $3k per year. You have to carry the remaining into the following years, where it can be offset against any amount of gains or income up to $3k.