Between the gambler and the casino who lose more

[Odusko]

I don't know if this have been discussed before, but this question was born out of the discussions that we hard today on one of the threads in the forum about, the risk of casino's losing money as a start up, what it means is that, most cryptocurrency casino that are New start up have been faced with the challenges of gambler's winning big amount even on the first day of their lunch, so for that we have to make out time to discuss this topics as for who lose more between the casino operator or the gamblers and how can you compare the risk of casino Dev and against the gambler himself?

Offcourse we are aware of the some features that could put the casino at advantage such as the house Edge, but even for that some gambler's are lucky win big despite the house edge that put the casino t advantage, so between the two who risk more.

[Nwada001]

For startup, unless the casino is hit with bad luck and they don’t start up with enough funds that will keep the business going, I don’t see any amount of winning that will be able to surpass the losing percentage. You can start up a casino with $100,000 for paying winnings and expect it not to get exhausted in most cases before you can even start making profit.
 
Gambling winning is a game of probability in most cases, which means the chance of the player winning against the casino is very minimal, and I always believe that in every 1-100 bets placed by gamblers, more than 70% of those bets always end up losing, and the little percentage that wins in most cases can’t be compared to the amount the casino can make from the loss.
 
Although high rollers win big amounts in some cases, that doesn’t happen all the time. In conclusion, I always see the casino as the one with the upper hand when it comes to winning against gamblers.

[PX-Z]

If you're talking about these new casinos losing money on its first few days of opening, then its possible only if they don't have huge or enough bankroll to start the business. But its only rare, once the operation starts casino business will be in total of profits in the long run. But once this new casino have different marketing approach from different platforms, it's good to say that they have enough balances to operate.

[Akbarkoe]

An intriguing subject is comparing the risk between casino operators and gamblers. While, on an individual basis, gamblers may risk losing their money with every game they play, the casino has the whole system working for them over the long run through house odds. For newly established casinos, especially in the world of crypto, these can be very large risks. They have to consider that some gamblers are extremely lucky and can win huge sums, which would make a dent in their resources, particularly at such an infant stage.

While the risk is for casinos, statistically speaking, they are still safer because of their advantages and the volume of the game. As for the gamblers, they are always at greater risk because they wager with odds that are meant to favor casinos. Therefore, even though there can be situations where casinos can lose big, typically it is gamblers who stand a greater risk in the long run.

[Cantsay]

I’ve never worked in a casino before so my answer is purely based on what I’ve read here in Bitcointalk and also my observation as a gambler. To me I feel the casino is always at the upper hand when it comes to profits - even if a gambler manage to log out with some profit during that session the casino will still be in profit when the whole history of that player is calculated.

Only a few casino that fail to make proper calculations before going public with some of their promotions that’s when they hit some losses - but if we consider just the betting aspect (excluding any form of promotion) of the business then the casino will be in profit.

[bitbollo]

Online casinos that end without money is really a rare event.
Sometimes I had the impression that it was a simple way to hide a scam...
For the other times, its related to bad management and wrong choice... likewise small Bankroll or simply having attracted a lucky whale on the site.
Other reason could be related to bug or in general test of the site not sufficient or just issues not immediately identified.
However in these case there are 2 scenarios. Scam or bankrupt...

[Charles-Tim]

I’ve never worked in a casino before so my answer is purely based on what I’ve read here in Bitcointalk and also my observation as a gambler. To me I feel the casino is always at the upper hand when it comes to profits - even if a gambler manage to log out with some profit during that session the casino will still be in profit when the whole history of that player is calculated.

This is not about what was or is posted on Bitcointalk but the truth. See gambling sites as hoteliers while you see gamblers as people that come for the hotel products and services. The gambling sites are making money while the gamblers are losing money. I do not think it should be called losing money because the gamblers are enjoying the games while gambling.

[yahoo62278]

Casinos that are semi new and have a smallish bankroll have been implementing the max cashout per week rule to their customers so they don't go bankrupt in the 1st week and partially to hope that some of those players lose a little back to them while waiting to do their cashouts.

Most times the casinos are going to come out on top because smaller casinos also have higher house edges set on most games, but there is the rare occasion where someone makes a deposit and goes on a run.

Back in the old days casinos used kelly criterion and made the max win 1/100th of the casinos bankroll virtually making it impossible for them to go broke. Not possible when a site offers 3rd party slots I don't think, but I could be wrong. Not sure if they can set a max bet on 3rd party slots.

[Odusko]

Online casinos that end without money is really a rare event.
Sometimes I had the impression that it was a simple way to hide a scam...
For the other times, its related to bad management and wrong choice... likewise small Bankroll or simply having attracted a lucky whale on the site.
Other reason could be related to bug or in general test of the site not sufficient or just issues not immediately identified.
However in these case there are 2 scenarios. Scam or bankrupt...

On the contrary, what I focused on is not in the direction you are pointing from and at, I know exit scam, insider's job and also bug aware among the ways that the casino risk losing money, we have seen alot of crypto casino's falling victim of that befor and it won't end there, but my focus is on the risk of winning and losing bet on the casino and what the risk level is for both casinos and the gambler, we have all hard the phrase house edge and the rest, and also jackpot winning which are what the discussions in focused on right now.

Your comment above open up another different thought in me which I never considered while creating this thread, may be that was because, I already narrowed my view to that of risk as regards to winning and losing a bet and not some sort of possible attack risks.

[Churchillvv]

I have used an online casino where I staked a bet with a kind of amount that the reward was supposed to be very huge but I was restricted because the potential win is too huge, so for new casinos in the business they literally do not allow some kind of bet in the main time of opening untill they become very strong to handle such wins.

Perhaps with the experience I believe they can't lose to gamblers more than they can afford.

[AmoreJaz]

Online casinos that end without money is really a rare event.
Sometimes I had the impression that it was a simple way to hide a scam...
For the other times, its related to bad management and wrong choice... likewise small Bankroll or simply having attracted a lucky whale on the site.
Other reason could be related to bug or in general test of the site not sufficient or just issues not immediately identified.
However in these case there are 2 scenarios. Scam or bankrupt...

If the bookie or the casino has small bankroll to begin with, then, they should put some constraints in their features such as -
- setting their bet limits, so they know how much will be the max payout in case the bettor won
- they can have withdrawal limit per day also, so they know how much is allocated per player, at least rough estimate and see where they are at in terms of their financials
So better observe your casino's activities to know where you are at and implement some restrictions as soon as possible before everyone is crying out for a scam owed to withdrawal issues.

[JollyGood]

This has to be the main issue. Those gamblers that place huge bets will end up winning phenomenal amounts of money from to time. Even those that are not high rollers also win too but when you accumulate the total amount from the wins against the total amount from the losses then overall the balance of power will always fall towards the casino (whether online or a physical building).

If it were possible to see a balance sheet from a casino, I am sure the income from customers losing would exceed the payout for winners virtually every day.

Although high rollers win big amounts in some cases, that doesn’t happen all the time. In conclusion, I always see the casino as the one with the upper hand when it comes to winning against gamblers.

[nelson4lov]

There is one quote I learnt about doing my early gambling days on the forum and it's "The house always wins". That quote has stuck me with over the years and after gambling for the past 5-6 years, I can say for a fact that like trading, Gambling is a zero-sum game. And after winnings, the house (casino) will still have enough bankroll to go on. But if the gambler is lucky enough to win more than they lose then in such a scenario, the house loses. But if we're talking about cumulative PnL of all gamblers, I think the amount won is no where close to the amount lost.

This isn't backed by any data btw. Just personal observations.

[mirakal]

I’ve never worked in a casino before so my answer is purely based on what I’ve read here in Bitcointalk and also my observation as a gambler. To me I feel the casino is always at the upper hand when it comes to profits - even if a gambler manage to log out with some profit during that session the casino will still be in profit when the whole history of that player is calculated.

This is not about what was or is posted on Bitcointalk but the truth. See gambling sites as hoteliers while you see gamblers as people that come for the hotel products and services. The gambling sites are making money while the gamblers are losing money. I do not think it should be called losing money because the gamblers are enjoying the games while gambling.

Well, gamblers should really enjoy playing their games even if means losing at the end, so that their money won't literally go into waste. Unlike those who play with high greed, I don't think they still manage to enjoy their games as their attention is focused more on making big amount of money. They will only enjoy if they are winning.

Meanwhile, when it comes to who are in huge profits, it's certainly the casinos or the gambling sites. Otherwise, they won't be here for long if they aren't having an edge over its players.

[Potato Chips]

It's not backed by data of course but I've always felt like in hindsight, only a small percentage ends up bagging big profits while most will lose it hence more likely to profit in the long run.

Reminds me of the recent interview I've read about bch.games. Someone nearly depleted their bankroll at first couple of days but they were able to make a comback after as well and the business continued to flourish from there. If you wanna read it, see: https://bitcasinosrank.com/bch-games-team-interview/

[passwordnow]

who lose more between the casino operator or the gamblers and how can you compare the risk of casino Dev and against the gambler himself?

Offcourse we are aware of the some features that could put the casino at advantage such as the house Edge, but even for that some gambler's are lucky win big despite the house edge that put the casino t advantage, so between the two who risk more.

You already answered your question that it is the gamblers that losses more money than of the casino. Regardless of the casino as a startup, they're bound to make money as long as their plans go well and they're able to gain significant number of users into their platform. The house edge is a real thing for these casinos because they make a lot of money from it from the volume of the users that they're having. So even it's just 1% house edge but they've got thousands and more of users, that's still a lot of buck to make for them everyday.

I think that even with gamblers winning huge jackpots, they're anticipating that to happen and they have enough funds to cover that and for them to recover. Unless that startup casino didn't planned that and they're able to miss out that scenario and it happened on them when they're unprepared but I doubt that because most of them have enough money for these jackpots and it's one way for them to also gain more players when someone hits a jackpot playing on them.

[Adbitco]

I don't know if this have been discussed before, but this question was born out of the discussions that we hard today on one of the threads in the forum about, the risk of casino's losing money as a start up, what it means is that, most cryptocurrency casino that are New start up have been faced with the challenges of gambler's winning big amount even on the first day of their lunch, so for that we have to make out time to discuss this topics as for who lose more between the casino operator or the gamblers and how can you compare the risk of casino Dev and against the gambler himself?

Offcourse we are aware of the some features that could put the casino at advantage such as the house Edge, but even for that some gambler's are lucky win big despite the house edge that put the casino t advantage, so between the two who risk more.

If i could recall correctly this topic or something similar to this has been discussed over here before but that notwithstanding, usually casino owner do have reserved fund to operate the platform for the first 2 to 6 months of their launched before they could start raising money from the casino. This their personal funds which serves as a reserved funds is to pay out winning and dev also staff who are working under them, this is a reason why most casinos do not allow heavy withdrawal even though you had passed kyc with all their requirement you would have to withdraw about $100k for about 3 weeks to 1 months interval to enable also payout to other people, since the restriction wouldn't allow you to make huge withdraw so the little funds they had in reserved would served round for that period of time while more people keep losing. You should also take note that winning are very hard unlike lost that is so easily and the casino wouldn't take much time to make profits from their customers.

[Hatchy]

Offcourse we are aware of the some features that could put the casino at advantage such as the house Edge, but even for that some gambler's are lucky win big despite the house edge that put the casino t advantage, so between the two who risk more.

The casino literally has the upper hand when it comes to winning. No matter how much profits the gamblers makes from a casino, the total losses made from playing each day on casino is bigger in ratio compare to the wins. The players are the in responsible for their losses though but the algorithm is designed to let the hux have an upper edge in winning.so we can say that the one who loesse more is actually the gamblers.

[uneng]

Of course it's the casino which profits more and that is why they are active and operating on this industry for several years already. On long term they always have the advantage. Even if a gambler wins a nice jackpot and bring a considerable loss for the house, it's just a matter of time until the casino recovers from the prejudice through making profit from another gamblers' bets.

For people who were familiar with bankroll investment in previous years, they know what I'm talking about. Sometimes we had our investments in loss for few days or weeks, but after some time the loss suddenly turned into profit, once a whale lost huge money to the casino. That is why to have a large bankroll is important for the betting shop, so they can absorb the losses on short run without going bankrupted and scamming their customers.

[TelolettOm]

Just imagine, maybe there is 1 person who wins a jackpot with a very large nominal. However, on the other hand, there are hundreds of thousands or maybe millions of other people who lose at that time, so the nominal is compared to what the casino must issue for JP. much greater accumulation of losses from all gamblers.

I quoted this from  a site:

Casinos and bookmakers are businesses designed to make money from gamblers, and they are good at doing it. They know that gamblers are more likely to gamble more in the future if they believe they almost won

Source: Why Gamblers Rarely Win

Casinos definitely get more benefits:
- They are the experts in designing all the possibilities that exist
- They have the system
- They are the ones who manage it
- Even though there are cheaters in the casino, they have their counters, and they still have bigger chances for other gamblers
- They have their strategies so that gamblers don't want to stop and continue gambling there