Shouldn't there be a forum rule against obvious AI-generated content?

[SquirrelJulietGarden]

OP, some users are well-professional writers or they come from countries with good English and writing. Yes, anyone who plagiarised or used AI to generate responses should be punished. But some make use of AI to correct spelling errors, place punctuation marks, commas, or full atop where necessary, and other assistance in writing is not an offense. I know that ost people use grammar as a tool to help them write good English. Do you consider that to be cheating?

That's true. If you feel your written English is not good, and want to improve it, you can use grammar checking tool, AI tools, to improve your post quality in grammar and vocabularies, but that's it.

The core idea for your post is from your brain, and its structure, words are mostly from your brain. Grammarly or AI tools only help you to correct grammar mistakes and use more relevant vocabularies, but it won't change the main content of yours. It means your post content is actually yours and your post won't be red flagged as AI-genrated post.

It's annoying if someone writes in terrible English and posts, members will complain, and if the Engish is clean and excellent members still will complain. Then what do we expect from ourselves?

It is annoying and it's up to these people to improve their written English, to communicate better with other forum members.

They can use whatever tools that are helpful for them to learn Writing and sharpen their Writing skills, including Grammarly, AI etc.

[FinneysTrueVision]

They can use whatever tools that are helpful for them to learn Writing and sharpen their Writing skills, including Grammarly, AI etc.

Anytime someone gets caught using AI to write a significant amount of their posts always claims that they are only using Grammarly to fix their mistakes and improve their vocabulary. I’m sure most people are being honest but sometimes I will come across posts where people don’t seem to have a good understanding of the topic they are discussing and it is clear that they are taking things a step further and are using AI for more than basic assistance.

I understand the appeal of wanting to be more efficient with our time and being able to communicate clearly but there has to be a limit where it is considered a misuse of these tools. A permanent ban seems too harsh but I still think something besides simply deleting a few posts is necessary to discourage excessive use of AI.

[SquirrelJulietGarden]

Anytime someone gets caught using AI to write a significant amount of their posts always claims that they are only using Grammarly to fix their mistakes and improve their vocabulary. I’m sure most people are being honest but sometimes I will come across posts where people don’t seem to have a good understanding of the topic they are discussing and it is clear that they are taking things a step further and are using AI for more than basic assistance.

They can use it as their reason for their stolen content but it's not true.

I used Grammarly in the past, and I knew that it won't change your content 100%. Otherwise, Grammarly only gives you some suggestions and never entirely change your content with any extreme suggestion like this.

I don't use AI to generate content or to check grammar, but I believe they operate not too different than Grammarly in checking grammar, words and correct mistakes.

Generally using a machine tool to generate content is completely different than using a tool to check and fix mistakes in grammar or vocabulary usages.

[dkbit98]

University professors are getting pissed off at the use of ChatGPT for thesis creation

Lazy rich kids literally don't have to pay anymore for someone else to write their thesis anymore  
I don't understand how some people think this is not considered cheating, but I see more tools are being developed to detect AI generate content.
It is cat and mouse game.

One good use of AI tools is ability to translate something from foreign languages and create new audio recording from that.
Even same voice can be used if original audio record in long enough.
Foe example Kaiser Wilhelm II English AI reconstruction:
https://youtu.be/FvFNPYuM8Ps

[Alone055]

OP, some users are well-professional writers or they come from countries with good English and writing. Yes, anyone who plagiarised or used AI to generate responses should be punished. But some make use of AI to correct spelling errors, place punctuation marks, commas, or full atop where necessary, and other assistance in writing is not an offense. I know that ost people use grammar as a tool to help them write good English. Do you consider that to be cheating?

When and where did I say using AI or other tools to rectify your mistakes is an offense or should be treated as one? I use Grammarly myself, you can check my post history. Do you think I sound like I'm using an AI to write my posts?

There is a difference between AI-generated posts and posts that have been corrected using AI or tools such as Grammarly. And, this agenda isn't against people who are good in writing English, it's about people using AI and the patterns I have discussed in the opening post refer to that and not to native English speakers.

It's annoying if someone writes in terrible English and posts, members will complain, and if the Engish is clean and excellent members still will complain. Then what do we expect from ourselves?

Just for your reference, I earlier defended a guy for writing original posts but having mistakes in his posts. This proves that I'm never against people who make grammar or spelling mistakes or even words they use as long as I can understand what they are trying to say. I believe that a person who writes original content with mistakes is much better than someone who posts perfect content but generates it using AI or copies it from others.

[skarais]

I believe that a person who writes original content with mistakes is much better than someone who posts perfect content but generates it using AI or copies it from others.

Not always agree. AI content that can be confirmed based on data and facts is also better if you know how to use it. Use quotes and tell everyone that what you are quoting is information gathered by the AI ​​instead of hiding everything as if it were yours. Typo errors made by native English speakers are understandable, but misleading information is also unacceptable.


Here is one example:

Code:

AI used: Gemini AI
keyword: Who is Satoshi Nakamoto

Satoshi Nakamoto is the pseudonym of the person or group who created Bitcoin, the first and most well-known cryptocurrency. Despite extensive research and speculation, their true identity remains a mystery.

Nakamoto published the Bitcoin whitepaper in 2008 and launched the Bitcoin network in 2009. They remained active in the Bitcoin community for a few years, contributing to its development and addressing technical issues. However, they disappeared from public view around 2010.

[Alone055]

I believe that a person who writes original content with mistakes is much better than someone who posts perfect content but generates it using AI or copies it from others.

Not always agree. AI content that can be confirmed based on data and facts is also better if you know how to use it. Use quotes and tell everyone that what you are quoting is information gathered by the AI ​​instead of hiding everything as if it were yours. Typo errors made by native English speakers are understandable, but misleading information is also unacceptable.


Here is one example:

Code:

AI used: Gemini AI
keyword: Who is Satoshi Nakamoto

Satoshi Nakamoto is the pseudonym of the person or group who created Bitcoin, the first and most well-known cryptocurrency. Despite extensive research and speculation, their true identity remains a mystery.

Nakamoto published the Bitcoin whitepaper in 2008 and launched the Bitcoin network in 2009. They remained active in the Bitcoin community for a few years, contributing to its development and addressing technical issues. However, they disappeared from public view around 2010.

Bro, we are talking about people using AI-generated content as their own. I don't want to repeat myself again and again, so please read the previous posts in this thread for a better understanding of the context and my post you quoted.

[skarais]

~~~

Bro, we are talking about people using AI-generated content as their own. I don't want to repeat myself again and again, so please read the previous posts in this thread for a better understanding of the context and my post you quoted.

I know what you mean, so don't worry.
I am just giving an example that content written by AI is not always bad when the information contained in it is correct and valid. But unfortunately, some users don't want to admit that they use AI to post. So again, don't worry because I get what you have been trying to explain.

[LoyceV]

University professors are getting pissed off at the use of ChatGPT for thesis creation

Lazy rich kids literally don't have to pay anymore for someone else to write their thesis anymore  

Lazy rich kids always had this possibility: they could pay someone to write their thesis. Now lazy poor kids can do the same.

[Pmalek]

As long as the admins delete AI-generated posts, I don't really care if we have a new unofficial rule added to the list of other unofficially official rules. It's plagiarism, and we already have a rule against plagiarised content.

Someone said you can recognize AI content by the lack of mistakes, commas, and/or grammatical errors. I think it's dangerous to use that as an argument.

I try to pay close attention to how I write my responses and I am sure there are others just like me. People shouldn't have to answer to anyone why there are no or very little mistakes in their forum posts. It's because we try to avoid making mistakes, that's why.

[dzungmobile]

As long as the admins delete AI-generated posts, I don't really care if we have a new unofficial rule added to the list of other unofficially official rules. It's plagiarism, and we already have a rule against plagiarised content.

Plagiarism rule can be applied for AI-generated posts and without any new rule, it's fine with current existing rule for plagiarism.

Someone said you can recognize AI content by the lack of mistakes, commas, and/or grammatical errors. I think it's dangerous to use that as an argument.

The content is more important than mistakes in commas, grammatical errors. AI-generated content can be very generic and is not relevant to a discussion but AI usually used by these people to create topics, than normal posts inside a thread.

I try to pay close attention to how I write my responses and I am sure there are others just like me. People shouldn't have to answer to anyone why there are no or very little mistakes in their forum posts. It's because we try to avoid making mistakes, that's why.

Do careful checks by ourselves or can use support from Grammarly or AI or similar tools, it's good. Having mistakes in a post is not too good and if we can sharpen our posts with better grammar, more relevant words, it's better.

This use is not plagiarism and corrected contents by Grammarly, AI will be different than contents completely created by AI.

[dkbit98]

Lazy rich kids always had this possibility: they could pay someone to write their thesis. Now lazy poor kids can do the same.

Until they start charging for all AI generating services, and believe me they will do it soon

As long as the admins delete AI-generated posts, I don't really care if we have a new unofficial rule added to the list of other unofficially official rules. It's plagiarism, and we already have a rule against plagiarised content.

I agree, and rules can easily be changed, look how quickly they added latest mixer ban rule.
Like I said, use of AI generated tools is fine for me, but only if use of this tools is correctly mentioned.

[Alone055]

As long as the admins delete AI-generated posts, I don't really care if we have a new unofficial rule added to the list of other unofficially official rules. It's plagiarism, and we already have a rule against plagiarised content.

Is it okay if a person is found guilty of plagiarism but as a punishment, only his plagiarized posts are removed and he is left to keep doing that? I have said this repeatedly in this thread, I understand that AI-generated posts are removed, and that is great, but if there is no official rule about it and if it falls under the rule about plagiarism, and if users who get either temporary or permanent ban for plagiarism, the same thing should apply for AI content posters if they are found or proven guilty of it.

Someone said you can recognize AI content by the lack of mistakes, commas, and/or grammatical errors. I think it's dangerous to use that as an argument.

I try to pay close attention to how I write my responses and I am sure there are others just like me. People shouldn't have to answer to anyone why there are no or very little mistakes in their forum posts. It's because we try to avoid making mistakes, that's why.

It's not only about punctuation marks or correct grammar, there is a pattern most AI models use to generate texts. I use tools such as Grammarly as well to find mistakes in what I write so that I don't have mistakes, but that doesn't make my posts look like they have been generated using an AI model because there will always be a difference in content that you write yourself and rectify using a tool and content that you generate using a tool.

[Pmalek]

@dkbit98
You are right. I hadn't noticed that the admins actually added a new rule that prohibits the promotion and linking to mixing sites. I went to check after seeing your reply, and it's there towards the bottom.

That shows that they are still making officially unofficial changes to the forum rules when needed. There is no mention of AI-content still. To me, it fits perfectly under rule #33 that prohibits copying content from other sources and websites. AI-generated content is something you copy from an external source/website to paste here and pretend it's your own.

[Cricktor]

Is it okay if a person is found guilty of plagiarism but as a punishment, only his plagiarized posts are removed and he is left to keep doing that? I have said this repeatedly in this thread, I understand that AI-generated posts are removed, and that is great, but if there is no official rule about it and if it falls under the rule about plagiarism, and if users who get either temporary or permanent ban for plagiarism, the same thing should apply for AI content posters if they are found or proven guilty of it.

I don't find it OK to only delete AI-content that has been presented as own. For me this is plagarism and as such it is supposed to be not tolerated in this forum. The rules for plagarism abuse are there and pretty much clear.

Providing hard evidence for copy/pasted AI-content without proper labelling might be more complicated than simple copy/pastes from "normal" online content. But I would expect same outcome once properly "found and proven guilty" as you say.

Thinking about it again, this forum probably doesn't need a specific rule targeting copy/pasting AI-content, though it wouldn't hurt. The plagarism rule could have an additional sentence clarifying that AI-content without proper labelling it as such is considered to be plagarism, too.

[SamReomo]

As long as the admins delete AI-generated posts, I don't really care if we have a new unofficial rule added to the list of other unofficially official rules. It's plagiarism, and we already have a rule against plagiarised content.

That's right, as long as AI-generated posts that get reported are deleted by moderators we don't actually have to care about it being a unofficial rule. I'm pretty sure that admins aren't adding it as a rule because in future things will change a lot and there's chance that AI will continue to get improve overtime.

The tools that detect AI content may not be able to detect the content when AI gets more smart and mimics human writing perfectly. We all know that AI content is just plagiarized content and there's actually an unofficial rule against plagiarized content and that's enough to report such posts and so far whenever I've reported any such posts they were deleted by admins/moderators within few minutes to hours and that's a good thing.

[Alone055]

I don't find it OK to only delete AI-content that has been presented as own. For me this is plagarism and as such it is supposed to be not tolerated in this forum. The rules for plagarism abuse are there and pretty much clear.

Exactly. Users who are not banned for posting AI-generated content might take advantage of the fact that moderators are lenient with it and that there is no official rule against it which shouldn't be the case, in my opinion. If plagiarism is punishable, proven AI-content plagiarizers should be punished as well.

Providing hard evidence for copy/pasted AI-content without proper labelling might be more complicated than simple copy/pastes from "normal" online content. But I would expect same outcome once properly "found and proven guilty" as you say.

It's true, that you can't provide much evidence for AI-generated content because you can't match the post with the content just like how we do with plagiarism because the content is only accessible by the user who generated it, however, if there is clear cut cases where it is very easy to understand that a user is posting AI-generated content again and again, they should get some treatment for it.

The plagarism rule could have an additional sentence clarifying that AI-content without proper labelling it as such is considered to be plagarism, too.

That would do, I guess. Even if there is no separate rule for it, having it mentioned in the official rules should be enough for it to be imposed and acted upon when needed.

[Franctoshi]

AI-generated content should be reported immediately without a delay, this to me is an advanced way of plagiarism, which is a bit difficult to detect. Practically, this is you claiming to be better than what that you are not really are. Well, in other hands, the victims aren't doing themselves that good as overtime you may become dump, can't become a better version of yourself, it means you can't think outside the box ,and offer something from your inner-self

[Smartvirus]

The forum isn’t one that changes easily and quickly. Before any chnage is been made on the forum although, the sort you are asking isn’t exactly a change but, an update on specifics with regards to rules and developments on the forum.
However, though AI generated content is hardly regarded as plagiarized content, it’s agreeable that they lack originality and don’t relay the opinion of the user. Hence, this counts as spam and could be treated in the same way.

Spams do get deletes accompanied with temp bans in serious cases and after some series of these temp bans, the sword is allowed to swing.

[Pmalek]

Exactly. Users who are not banned for posting AI-generated content might take advantage of the fact that moderators are lenient with it and that there is no official rule against it which shouldn't be the case, in my opinion. If plagiarism is punishable, proven AI-content plagiarizers should be punished as well.

Moderators and admins might have become more lenient towards banning plagiarized content altogether. We don't know. They are not going to tell us that they will be tolerating some cases of plagiarism. Why do I think that?

Two reasons:
1. The forum isn't as active as it was in the past. Issuing more bans will only decrease the activity further. 
2. I see no ban appeal threads in Meta dating back to mid-August. Usually, there are at least a few. I only checked using the keyword "appeal."