Arbitrage Betting or Bookmaker Scams?

[UberV]

Just recently I encountered a problem that some casinos (not all) refuse to verify your account before you start playing! When asked why? they simply answer "we have such rules". Then I tried to convey to the Bitcointalk community that such a refusal may of course be in the casino rules, but it simply must have a negative rating! This is bad form! And the refusal to verify your account before you start playing directly indicates a dishonest trick on the part of the casino, which allows you to cancel your winnings in case of violating the casino rules, but does not prevent you from losing your new and new deposits over and over again. Considering that 98% of players lose everything over the long term, then there is a very high probability that, knowing in advance that you are violating the rules, the casino keeps silent about it and accepts your money until you suddenly get lucky and want to withdraw something! A representative of the Betcoin.AG casino wrote that everything about your account is immediately known at the time of registration. That no verification is needed. However, when asked why you provide a deposit address if you know in advance that such a player will be disqualified, the casino representative did not comment. But it is immediately clear that the casino will gladly accept your money, even if it knows in advance that no one will pay you any winnings, and maybe they will also take away your deposit.
And please do not write that only scammers have problems of this kind and that they are punished correctly. There are a huge number of cases when honest players are robbed under the pretext of violating the rules!
I hope that each of you has clearly established for yourself that it is necessary to permanently exclude casinos that refuse to verify your account at your request before the start of the game!!!

Now we will discuss another problem that I saw on the forum - theft of money from customer accounts under the pretext of arbitrage bets! There are a lot of such disputes. In some cases, bookmakers allow themselves to steal even the deposits of such a client. The purpose of my article is to very simply prove to you that such an action is illegal and immoral! I really hope that the all-knowing representative of the bookmaker Betcoin.AG will also comment on this issue. As a representative of the business, he will show us a view from the other side.

For those who do not know, an arbitrage bet is a bet that was made on a coefficient with a higher, relative to the market, valuation. If most bookmakers offer a coefficient of 1.4 for Barcelona to win, and your bookmaker offered 1.6 (why he did this, we will analyze further), then rest assured that the bet on this outcome will be regarded as an arbitrage!!!

I do not know how it works. But I know for sure that the bookmaker does not like when players place arbitrage bets, this is a fact. Another fact is that arbitrage bets are immediately determined. And if you made an arbitrage bet, rest assured that it will be 100% marked. And I really want to get an answer to the question - WHY DO BOOKMAKERS OFFER ARBITRAGE ODDS FOR BETS, BUT SO CRUEL PUNISH THOSE WHO MAKE THEM??? Why are arbitrage bets so easy to determine, but why are they not excluded from the possibility of making them at all??? What is this, a provocation? Or does the bookmaker create a situation for itself in which, on the one hand, bets with an increased margin, and on the other hand, all bets will be canceled? One-way acceptance under the best conditions? I really want to hear a comment from a business representative, why do you offer such bets and then punish so harshly!?

I also came across some explanations from experienced bookmaker employees who explain the possibility of arbitrage situations in general. The thing is that when a situation arises when almost all players make the same bets, the bookmaker deliberately understates one side and unintentionally raises the other side. THIS IS DONE DELIBERATELY! The bookmaker also consciously accepts bets on arbitrage bets because everything is fine with him and there is an even win. And here we need to draw a conclusion: 1. the bookmaker is happy to accept your bets and he needs them 2. the bookmaker definitely does not like it if you bet only on such situations. Here it has become even more difficult to assess, so why do you punish such players so harshly if you do it all with your own hands??? the answer is simple, bookmakers with harsh punishments for arbitrage bets cannot be called bookmakers at all! in fact, they are copying stations that do not have their own opinion and only copy numbers without looking. So when a real bookmaker with a huge customer base is doing well, these small guys go betting in one direction and create risks to either win or lose. But even in this case, your odds were set with a pre-set margin! Why do you allow yourself to steal customers' money with such bets???

But things turned out to be even worse! In fact, this has become one of the forms of fraud by bookmakers! By accusing a player of arbitrage bets, a bookmaker gets an unsubstantiated base in which there is no way to dispute it! Moreover, the Bitcointalk community even takes the side of the bookmaker "aaah, he placed such bets. oh, not good. right that you take away all his money!" ARE YOU SERIOUS??? At what point did your community decide for itself that the odds that the bookmaker itself offers, suddenly cannot be placed??? Tell me, is the arbitrage bet highlighted in red? How can I know that it is definitely not arbitrage? I have a question for the bookmaker's representative (or maybe there is a very competent expert) HOW CAN I, WRITING DOWN EVERY BET, IN CASE OF ACCUSATION OF ARBITRATION BETS, PROVE THAT THIS IS NOT SO? and even more importantly, will the bookmaker itself accept this evidence, hinting that it is all drawn, and that its data is correct!?

I was looking at this bookmaker
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5177893.460
and the last post, a community member with the status of a legendary writes that his account was closed due to arbitrage bets. I went to the website of this bookmaker and was simply shocked! These are super low odds! I am more than sure that no arbitrage situations can arise there at all in principle! That such tricky accusations are just another way of fraud! (I don’t want to say this outright, but it looks like that’s the case)

In the 21st century, I can easily register two good bookmakers and place bets on my favorite teams where they offer the best odds! BUT you are in the risk zone! An ordinary player cannot bet on a best offer from a bookmaker because you can get an arbitrage bet, and there they will take everything away from you at once. Do I now need to look at what other bookmakers offer and bet where the odds are lower??? And if there is one inadequate bookmaker who creates an arbitrage situation with everyone!? Will I be guilty again?
From this moment on, I want to understand once and for all how I can 100% exclude the possibility that my future bet will be arbitrage? And how can I document such evidence???

Now let's all prove to any bookmaker that canceling winnings in arbitrage bets is extremely illegal and immoral! And that this action must lower the bookmaker's rating and lead to its gradual withdrawal from the market! What if I make several arbitrage bets and document that the bets were arbitrage. Then, by chance, my bets lose. I submit a request on the forum that, according to the casino rules, arbitrage bets are prohibited and all such bets must be cancelled!!! WILL THE BOOKMAKER RETURN MY LOST MONEY IF I PROVE WITH DOCUMENTARY PROOF THAT MY BETS WERE ARBITRATION AND ACCORDING TO THE BOOKMAKER RULES THEY SHOULD BE CANCELLED? I'll tell you how it will be. You will either be prohibited from placing bets for no reason, or you will simply be allowed to continue placing bets! THIS IS THE SAME FRAUD on the part of the bookmaker and nothing more! The arbitrage player himself is not a fraudster, because everything is fair!

There is a lot of text, but if you read it all, I hope you will once and for all look with a negative judgment at the bookmaker who stole the winnings from the client, referring to arbitrage bets! You must have the right perception.

[seoincorporation]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

[aprotya]

The fact that bookmakers leave such a loophole is either deliberate fraud or sheer stupidity on the part of those who build the bookmaker’s lines—followed by shifting the responsibility onto the players.

You’ve raised a really important point, but I fear this thread will now attract a crowd of not-so-smart people trying to argue that “those are the rules” and “you just have to play by them.”

[DGUDGUDGU]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

It is not "forbidden on casinos" it is not allowed on a VERY SMALL percentage of sketchy ass scammy crypto casinos.
97% of the sites I've used in my lifetime paid me out no issues and have nothing about not allowing arbitrage or sportsbook advantage play/valuebetting in their terms of service.
and I am a longterm advantage player doing this for a living, I have easily played at 200+ different betting sites and only been scammed 5 or so times?

It is the small minority of terribly ran greedy casinos:
betpanda, sportbet.one, WE88 and rainbet from the top of my head.
That have forced this narrative on people of this forum that it's somehow in their right to take winnings from players under the guise of "arbitrage betting".

Now this next point is VERY IMPORTANT to everyone, so PLEASE READ THIS CAREFULLY:
Casinos will NEVER EVER be able to know if someone is arbitrage betting.
In order for them to know if you are arbitrage betting, they need to have the other side of your bets which would be placed at a completely different casino (and different oddset/odds provider)
So unless the same parent company owns two casinos, and they are communicating with each other (very rare situation) it's just not possible for them to know.
This is CRUCIAL to understand, because lots of people on this forum: holydarkness I'M SPEAKING TO YOU HERE. Believe that arbitrage is somehow possible on a single set of odds, it is not.

These bookies also do not allow valuebetting or anything that would put the customer in an advantage over the casino.
This is completely insane considering valuebetting is just having a better opinion on the probability of an outcome occurring.

If I think the Golden State Warriors should be favourites against their opponent from some basic analysis, form and lineup news, but the bookmaker disagrees.
Then over a big sample I am correct more than them, I am now a sharp and a value bettor. Sites like betpanda would literally confiscate your funds for using your brain in this way.

You just have to avoid these terrible businesses and do research before signing up, stick to the legit sites that have been reputable for a long time in this space.

To the OP:

Great thread, this really need to be said.
I am sick of reading scam reports on this site and seeing the replies just not understanding how betting works.

But I am really glad right now it is just the small miniority of sites abusing their ability to steal winnings from players, hopefully more sites DO NOT adopt this approach.

[Davidvictorson]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

I agree with you. It is wrong because the casinos think you are trying to play smart. And by smart, it means make more profits from your bet than necessary. They'll be thinking to themselves, they should be the one making more profits off of our bets and not you, the gambler. How they know about gamblers who do it is still something I am yet to figure out myself but they just know.

[Charles-Tim]

Let me hope this wall of texts is not pasted from somewhere.

If you want to do arbitrage betting or gambling and you are not cheating, use two or different gambling sites for it. If you are using the same gambling site for it, the gambling site will consider you as a cheater.

[Rating Place]

The fact that bookmakers leave such a loophole is either deliberate fraud or sheer stupidity on the part of those who build the bookmaker’s lines—followed by shifting the responsibility onto the players.

You’ve raised a really important point, but I fear this thread will now attract a crowd of not-so-smart people trying to argue that “those are the rules” and “you just have to play by them.”

The same with the book can steal your withdrawals and deposits if they think you multi-accounted. I have no idea why people succumb to illegal sports book rules.

Let me hope this wall of texts is not pasted from somewhere.

If you want to do arbitrage betting or gambling and you are not cheating, use two or different gambling sites for it. If you are using the same gambling site for it, the gambling site will consider you as a cheater.

That's in-house arbitrage and that should be banned. Otherwise the book is just guessing and penalizing you for betting a good line.

[UberV]

I really want some bookmaker representative to join this thread and finally answer a basic question - If a bookmaker can easily and quickly determine a player's arbitrage bets, then why does the bookmaker offer such odds for bets at all? Why doesn't the bookmaker adjust the odds just as quickly to eliminate even the possibility of such bets forever?


If at 13-00 this bet was not arbitrage and you happily accepted it. Then at 14-00 the same bet on the same odds suddenly became arbitrage and at this particular time, you are no longer happy with such a bet! Why? Are you not professionals in your field? Do you have no opinion of your own and you rely only on the opinions of others? You will never punish me if I bet on roulette on red at odds of 1.9, if suddenly some idiot will offer 2.2 on black!? Because you know for sure that it is profitable for you! Why can the same bet on the same match, but at different times, be considered undesirable??? and some fraudulent bookmakers can even steal all your money for such a bet!

[Hispo]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

I also wonder how they manage to know one is using multiple casinos in order to do arbitrage, it has always been a question without resolution to me.
Either casinos talk to one another in order to prevent abuse or major casinos use some sophisticated software to perform chain analysis on the withdrawal of our money and compare of our crypto addresses also interact with addresses which are known to be under the control of other casinos. In the similar manner the addresses of exchanges are sell known and are even tagged on the most popular block explorers.

Regardless of what they do, they fact they reserve the right to confiscate your funds if you are caught doing arbitrage would be enough to make anyone reluctant of trying to take advtange of the differences of odds in several casinos.

[memehunter]

LOL, OP you have opened a new thread to vent out again against casinos . I remember when you stretched one simple issue so far previously against a reputed casino that they told you clearly that they do not want you on their platform. You started this OP with exactly the same background. I have to say that you have overgeneralized things too much.
You have to understand one thing: no scalable business can operate on a case-to-case (individual) basis. They have to take a utilitarian view (maximum happiness for the maximum number of people). For example, in your case, the casino has a policy to not use KYC except in suspicious cases as it caters to the demand of a wider audience compared to some individuals who want to verify without even placing a bet.   

[UberV]

LOL, OP you have opened a new thread to vent out again against casinos . I remember when you stretched one simple issue so far previously against a reputed casino that they told you clearly that they do not want you on their platform. You started this OP with exactly the same background. I have to say that you have overgeneralized things too much.
You have to understand one thing: no scalable business can operate on a case-to-case (individual) basis. They have to take a utilitarian view (maximum happiness for the maximum number of people). For example, in your case, the casino has a policy to not use KYC except in suspicious cases as it caters to the demand of a wider audience compared to some individuals who want to verify without even placing a bet.   

I spent a lot of time to convey to you the real situation. But you just tie everything to a specific case... I did not demand mandatory verification of each participant! I only pointed out that the casino's refusal to ask the client to verify his account is bad form and should lower the casino's rating very much! Do you understand the difference???

The casino has a rating. And it is influenced by various factors. My message on this forum is to convey from inexperienced community members how the casino cheats them even before the game starts! So if the client wants to get verification before the game starts, then the casino is obliged to do it! If the casino refuses, then this should lower the casino's rating! And I do not demand mandatory verification of each player at all, but there is not a single casino without verification (except for outright scam casinos)! And if you are promised that there will be no verification - this is an outright deception! Also, if the casino itself requires verification before starting the game, it is honest and respectable!
And please do not think that I came to someone else's business and started telling them how to work. If you have your own casino, you can do whatever you want, but you should know that your rating will be very low if you do not follow the basic rules of fair play!

Specifically, this topic is related to another fraud - confiscation of winnings due to suspicion of arbitrage bets.
There is no unfair play in these bets. I described above that the same bet on the same outcome but made at different times can be arbitrage or not arbitrage!
Therefore, if you see that a bookmaker confiscates a client's winnings based on arbitrage bets, you must clearly understand - this bookmaker is engaged in fraud!

And I would really like a truly knowledgeable person to write an answer to my question - how can I document each of my bets that it is not arbitration? What if a bookmaker accuses me of arbitration and confiscates my money, and in response I send him a lawsuit with evidence that each of my bets was 100% not arbitration!!! How to prove this? And if you do not have an answer, then this topic is 100% in the dark zone, the zone where the bookmaker steals money without proof! This means that this behavior must be harshly condemned by the entire community and, naturally, greatly lower the casino rating!!!


We are not naming specific names or cases now. I want the community to form the correct view of reality!

[memehunter]

I only pointed out that the casino's refusal to ask the client to verify his account is bad form and should lower the casino's rating very much!

And I see no reason for it.
Apart from that, no reputable casino will refuse your documents because there are thousands of accounts from your country using the same documents. Unless you are trying to deceive, by using forged documents just avoid any future trouble.

My message on this forum is to convey from inexperienced community members how the casino cheats them even before the game starts! So if the client wants to get verification before the game starts, then the casino is obliged to do it! If the casino refuses, then this should lower the casino's rating!

Same bs.

Therefore, if you see that a bookmaker confiscates a client's winnings based on arbitrage bets, you must clearly understand - this bookmaker is engaged in fraud!

It is good that most of us don't have your level of clarity 

What if a bookmaker accuses me of arbitration and confiscates my money, and in response I send him a lawsuit with evidence that each of my bets was 100% not arbitration!!! How to prove this?

Arbitrage opportunities are very rare and can be easily narrowed down by bet providers. No reputable casino is built upon malpractice; it is simply not sustainable. 

[Cointxz]

The fact that bookmakers leave such a loophole is either deliberate fraud or sheer stupidity on the part of those who build the bookmaker’s lines—followed by shifting the responsibility onto the players.

You’ve raised a really important point, but I fear this thread will now attract a crowd of not-so-smart people trying to argue that “those are the rules” and “you just have to play by them.”

The same with the book can steal your withdrawals and deposits if they think you multi-accounted. I have no idea why people succumb to illegal sports book rules.

The main issue is how you can proved as spectator who’s telling the truth. This kind of multiple account issue is always on trust basis on the casino handling it whether they have solid reputation or not.

Same with the point being raised here. It’s a one-sided assumption that players are not cheating when they are accused of multiple account.

Also I wonder why the issue of arbitrage is still a big deal anymore. If casino doesn’t allowed it why you will keep doing it? They are refunding the deposit if user caught doing it despite bookie clearly stated that it’s not allowed.

We agree on those ToS the moment we keep playing in the casino.

[rachael9385]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

If a gambler is using arbitrage on different casinos how are they all traced and connected? Are the casinos working together to fetch out those doing it ? I think it is traceable through KYC verifications, this is how they are identify w particular user that uses different platforms to try and cheat the system. I haven't tried this betting system before and i don't really know if it's something that actually works.

[UberV]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

If a gambler is using arbitrage on different casinos how are they all traced and connected? Are the casinos working together to fetch out those doing it ? I think it is traceable through KYC verifications, this is how they are identify w particular user that uses different platforms to try and cheat the system. I haven't tried this betting system before and i don't really know if it's something that actually works.

oh my god. there is no question here how they do it... the question of the legality of stealing winnings by referring to arbitration...

I completely exclude the exchange of data between casinos on customer bets. Moreover, any business will not tell you on a silver platter about what activity it has. I will tell you more, an arbitrage bet (or a bet on an overvalued value) should not have a downside at all! Most likely, this happens like this: there are certain bookmakers - idols, which are considered market-forming. They have huge turnovers and they can turn over any small casino (I mean that the odds line will be stronger and the small casino is forced to adapt to the strong one) for the very reason that I described above - small casinos do not have their own opinion! So let's imagine that we took 5 idol bookmakers and every second scan their displayed odds for each market. every second we will form a chain of 5 numbers 1.51 1.52 1.51 1.50 1.53 and, accordingly, the coefficient inverse to them. A graph is built based on the highest value from time and then this graph is superimposed on the graph of your coefficients on the inverse coefficient. Then it is a matter of chance, what a particular bookmaker considers arbitrage, it will be superimposing a graph on plus several percent or it will be approaching the graph to minus several fractions of a percent. This is elementary mathematics, the point is not even whether the bookmaker exchanges the graph of the movement of its coefficients or the bookmaker steals someone else's line.
No need to discuss the detection method. All you need to know about it is that bookmakers do it very quickly and very well. However, they continue to offer you such coefficients for bets! Why?

[Riceandbean]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

There are many ways for different casinos to find arbitrage players, the simplest way is Pattern Analysis:
Very fast bets placed right after odds changes

Always betting on specific markets prone to arbitrage (e.g., over/under, 1x2)

Always betting max stakes at value lines

Never taking poor odds (suggesting you’re scanning odds across platforms)

then other methods are using direct technical tracking, they can detect arbitrage via:
Many casinos and sportsbooks outsource fraud detection and risk control to third-party services like:

SBTech

Kambi

Sportradar

BetRadar

OddsMatrix

These providers operate across multiple platforms and share intelligence about suspicious behavior, including arbitrage patterns. If you’re taking one side of a market on one site and the opposite on another — they see both sides.

[Rating Place]

Arbitrage betting is forbiden on casinos, they consider it as an abuse, and I don’t know how but they will know if you are doing it with multiple casinos, so, users must be careful about this linda of practices because just as op mention they will close your account and keep your money of you they it.

There are many ways for different casinos to find arbitrage players, the simplest way is Pattern Analysis:
Very fast bets placed right after odds changes

Always betting on specific markets prone to arbitrage (e.g., over/under, 1x2)

Always betting max stakes at value lines

Never taking poor odds (suggesting you’re scanning odds across platforms)

then other methods are using direct technical tracking, they can detect arbitrage via:
Many casinos and sportsbooks outsource fraud detection and risk control to third-party services like:

SBTech

Kambi

Sportradar

BetRadar

OddsMatrix

These providers operate across multiple platforms and share intelligence about suspicious behavior, including arbitrage patterns. If you’re taking one side of a market on one site and the opposite on another — they see both sides.

This is a really good post. One thing to add is most don't arbitrage, they just play the weak side.

I only pointed out that the casino's refusal to ask the client to verify his account is bad form and should lower the casino's rating very much!

And I see no reason for it.
Apart from that, no reputable casino will refuse your documents because there are thousands of accounts from your country using the same documents. Unless you are trying to deceive, by using forged documents just avoid any future trouble.

My message on this forum is to convey from inexperienced community members how the casino cheats them even before the game starts! So if the client wants to get verification before the game starts, then the casino is obliged to do it! If the casino refuses, then this should lower the casino's rating!

Same bs.

Therefore, if you see that a bookmaker confiscates a client's winnings based on arbitrage bets, you must clearly understand - this bookmaker is engaged in fraud!

It is good that most of us don't have your level of clarity  

What if a bookmaker accuses me of arbitration and confiscates my money, and in response I send him a lawsuit with evidence that each of my bets was 100% not arbitration!!! How to prove this?

Arbitrage opportunities are very rare and can be easily narrowed down by bet providers. No reputable casino is built upon malpractice; it is simply not sustainable.  

Go look at scam accusations. All the big books are scamming with the arbitrage rule and multi-accounting. I should say all the crypto books here, not fiat.

[mindrust]

The answer is easy.

Arbitrage betting makes you win in the long run. As you are already aware, most gamblers lose in the term. If the players were the winners, then the casino would be the loser.

Since both the player and the casino can’t be the winners at the same time, the casino can’t afford to have long term winning players making bets on the casino.

That’s why in the ToS they usually ban arbitrage/EV betting.

If you can’t handle this, don’t play.

[DGUDGUDGU]

The answer is easy.

Arbitrage betting makes you win in the long run. As you are already aware, most gamblers lose in the term. If the players were the winners, then the casino would be the loser.

Since both the player and the casino can’t be the winners at the same time, the casino can’t afford to have long term winning players making bets on the casino.

That’s why in the ToS they usually ban arbitrage/EV betting.

If you can’t handle this, don’t play.

yap yap yap but not reading , go spin your slots buddy.

[memehunter]

Since both the player and the casino can’t be the winners at the same time, the casino can’t afford to have long term winning players making bets on the casino.
That’s why in the ToS they usually ban arbitrage/EV betting.

It is simply not good for business (from the casino's perspective). There is a difference between not being good for business (therefore not allowed) and trying to rob a player's winning, which OP does not seem to understand. I have a direct question for OP: would he accept a bet knowing that he will lose for sure? Or will he do any business where losses are inevitable? We all know the answer, so why expect the same thing from others?

If you can’t handle this, don’t play.

Exactly.