Frostsnap Frontier ❄ Next Gen Bitcoin Security Now Available for Early Adopters

[utxoclub]

Frostsnap is bringing the next generation of self-custody technology to Bitcoin.
We've reimagined Bitcoin security from the ground up, designing and architecting the future of self-custody.

https://frostsnap.com/assets/frostsnap-devices.png

Distilled into a mobile-first hardware wallet, Frostsnap is pioneering radical improvements to the entire Bitcoin experience. For both the hodlers and the p2p cash enjoyers.

Multisignature is now a physical experience with daisy chained devices, accessible to all for the first time.
By making multisig easy, we're addressing the increasing physical attack risks faced by bitcoiners today.

Frostsnap is the first hardware device that is not a trusted third party. We achieve this by involving your phone in the security of your wallet.
Utilizing advancements in cryptography, your phone will verifiably participate in key generation and signing with your Bitcoin keys.

Next, we're expanding on our vision for self-custody:

• Solving bitcoin inheritance: separate access pathways that allow your loved ones to access your wallet in your absence.
• Convenient spending: spending your life savings should be inconvenient. But small spends should not be. We're working towards limited spending devices that can spend up to a certain amount per day in conjunction with your phone.

We'll be elaborating on our approach in the coming months.

The wait is over - we'd like to invite you as an early adopter to join us with next generation self-custody.
Be among the first in the world to experience ultimate bitcoin security, with the very first batch of the Frostsnap Frontier.
An invitation to take bitcoin saving seriously. See our website for more info, or happy to answer any questions here.

See you on the Frontier.
https://frostsnap.com
https://frostsnap.com/assets/stay-frosty.svg

[Pmalek]

I am quoting the beginning of your post so that the image becomes visible on the forum. If you want, you can buy a copper membership which allows you to post images and increases your PM limitations. Click on the link I provided if you want some more information about that.

BTW, are you an official representative of Frostsnap Frontier or are you just someone who likes their products?

Frostsnap is bringing the next generation of self-custody technology to Bitcoin.
We've reimagined Bitcoin security from the ground up, designing and architecting the future of self-custody.

[satscraper]

~

Overcharge price ^{around $150 for a single hardware signer}. Dropping it closer to $100 would make the whole set much more attractive.

Could we get the detailed overview of the key features planned for relevant mobile app?

Will the app allow to pair Frostsnap signers with other clients like Sparrow, Electrum, or similar?

[utxoclub]

BTW, are you an official representative of Frostsnap Frontier or are you just someone who likes their products?

I am a Co-Founder of Frostsnap! So feel free to ask any questions.
Thanks for the info, long time lurker first time poster on bitcointalk.

Overcharge price ^{around $150 for a single hardware signer}. Dropping it closer to $100 would make the whole set much more attractive.

Could we get the detailed overview of the key features planned for relevant mobile app?

Will the app allow to pair Frostsnap signers with other clients like Sparrow, Electrum, or similar?

The comfort of self-sovereign multisignature in a seamless UX with understandable recovery requirements is well worthwhile.
Costs of other products in a 2-of-3 or collaborative setups can quickly add up to a similar cost.

We've spent spent years engineering, designing and iterating these tools. Early adopters are strongly supporting our mission and we'll look after you well!

Here's a demo video of the app:
https://frostsnap.com/demo.mp4

The key features as of now are: distributed key generation, receive, send, verify addresses, PSBT signing, and recovery.
Many more to come including remote signing (shared multisig), inheritance access pathways, limited spending devices.

We'll have more to share on the recovery process soon.

Currently you can only sign with the devices through our app, since FROST is quite an evolution in the integration between signers and coordinators.
But you can export your descriptor to other wallets, craft custom PSBTs (i.e. coin selection) and sign them within our app.
Getting a coordinator into Sparrow or other wallets is certainly a longer-term goal, and crucially our core libraries (as well as other software) is all FOSS.

[Pmalek]

I watched your demo video and I have a few questions and a suggestion.

First of all, will Frostsnap Frontier be a mobile-only signing device or are you also planning to release an app for desktop that people could use on their PCs?

Back to the video.
After you create your 2/3 multisig wallet, the software doesn't display the seed or instruct users to back it up. I think that should be an optional if not even a mandatory step immediately after wallet creation and certainly before you fund any of your addresses.
The displayed BTC addresses are divided in shards. It makes sense because they are easier to check that way. I assume that if you copy them, the addresses will be pasted as a whole, right?

[satscraper]

I also watched the video and found the basic procedures demonstrated in the Frostsnap Frontier to be straightforward and easy to follow. However, one aspect that wasn’t covered by video was the app’s connectivity. Specifically, I'm curious about how the app connects to blockchain. Does it use public RPC/API endpoints or it rely on its servers run by your company? Particularly for users who want to buy Frostsnap signers it would be great if the app had the flexibility to connect to private node.

[Pmalek]

<Snip>

It would be great if the website had detailed documentation and FAQ sections that cover questions like that and everything else you need to know about the software and hardware of Frostsnap Frontier. Maybe that's something that will come in the future. Right now, they have a Twitter account and the basic information available on their homepage.

[utxoclub]

First of all, will Frostsnap Frontier be a mobile-only signing device or are you also planning to release an app for desktop that people could use on their PCs?

Back to the video.
After you create your 2/3 multisig wallet, the software doesn't display the seed or instruct users to back it up. I think that should be an optional if not even a mandatory step immediately after wallet creation and certainly before you fund any of your addresses.
The displayed BTC addresses are divided in shards. It makes sense because they are easier to check that way. I assume that if you copy them, the addresses will be pasted as a whole, right?

Yes our app builds for Linux, Windows, and soon MacOS!

Agree that the backup stage should immediately be shown after wallet creation! We actually hid the popup and warning banner for this demo. We'll show the backup process in a later video.

Yeah if you copy those chunked addresses or amounts it will not include the empty spaces.

[satscraper]

It would be great if the website had detailed documentation and FAQ sections that cover questions like that and everything else you need to know about the software and hardware of Frostsnap Frontier. Maybe that's something that will come in the future. Right now, they have a Twitter account and the basic information available on their homepage.

They’ve significantly improved their site and it now includesthe section filled with relevant documentation and an FAQ as well.


Firmware ^{which is open source, by the way} has been updated to v0.2.0.

P.S. Now is a good moment to buy this device, since its price is denominated solely in BTC. One unit costs 150,000 sats. To set up a 2‑of‑3 quorum, you need three units, which comes out to roughly $300 at the current exchange rate.

I’m curious what the shipping cost to US would be. I might actually place an order.

[utxoclub]

They've significantly improved their site and it now includesthe section filled with relevant documentation and an FAQ as well.

Firmware has been updated to v0.2.0.

I'm curious what the shipping cost to US would be. I might actually place an order.

Thanks for keeping an eye on our progress, and sharing!

To answer your question -- shipping to the US is currently ~60k sats.

Here's a new video guide showing the multisig setup and backups.

[satscraper]

They've significantly improved their site and it now includesthe section filled with relevant documentation and an FAQ as well.

Firmware has been updated to v0.2.0.

I'm curious what the shipping cost to US would be. I might actually place an order.

Thanks for keeping an eye on our progress, and sharing!

To answer your question -- shipping to the US is currently ~60k sats.

Here's a new video guide showing the multisig setup and backups.

I watched this video. The setup procedure seems very simple ^{even a child could do it}.

Regarding the backup scheme, I don’t like the idea of keeping the paper with 25 words attached to the device itself. In my view, they should be stored separately. If I buy it, I would use my own method.

Shipping to the US is a bit expensive. In fact, I have two options, since I can receive it either in the US or in Cyprus, but the shipping cost probably won’t differ much. I need to think about this.

 

[satscraper]

how do they arrange the recovery procedure in case the given phone is lost?

why to encrypt shares with the key which can be reconstructed from media that hold these encrypted shares?

We've devised an elegant solution here. Any threshold number of devices (or backups) can share the public images of their secret shares, and interpolating them rederives the root public key. So restoring to a new phone is straightforward: connect 2-of-3 devices to the new phone -> the phone learns the root public key -> it can now provide this key (to the device) to decrypt device shares during signing sessions.

The reason we encrypt shares with a key reconstructible from those same shares is that it collapses security and recovery into a single requirement: do you have t-of-n devices? That's what you need to spend, and that's what you need to recover. One simple rule with no extra secrets to manage separately.

Well, it’s essentially  MPC model you’ve adopted here, which is great for security. The only drawback for home user ^{as I see it} is the need to go to another location to get the second device ^{participating in a 2‑of‑3 quorum} in order to sign the transaction. For everyday use that’s not very convenient, but for long term storage ^{or for inheritance planning} it might be considered as the solid option.

[Pmalek]

Here's a new video guide showing the multisig setup and backups.

I liked the video. The setup is very simple and self-explanatory. Experienced users wouldn't even need to watch it. The mobile app explains everything.

The only thing I didn't like is your recommendation what to do with the backup phrases in case the user is unsure where to store them. Your recommendation in those cases is to keep them together with the devices and inside the packages. I wouldn't recommend it. It's better to keep backups away from the signing devices. Everyone can find some way of hiding a piece of paper. In case someone finds the hardware at least they don't have the backup seed that comes with it.