Decided on Trezor Safe 5. It needs to be connected to computer to create seed?

[Johnds1]

After being late to the party of becoming aware that ledger pooped in everyone's cornflakes, I've decided to go with Trezor Safe 5.  I was watching setup videos on youtube and I am concerned about having to connect to a computer BEFORE it releases the seed phrase.

Is this the case?  Can it not give out seed phrase with just a power source?

One of the videos appeared to be someone from the Trezor company, so I would think if it were possible to retrieve seed phrase without computer, that would have been mentioned, but wanted to be sure.

If it is possible, you would think it woukd have been stated because to me it defeats the whole purpose of an air gap.  I'm uneasy about having it connected to a computer while giving me the most important words.  Though its said it is only shown on the Trezor screen, thats not too convincing in my opinion.

[leonair]

Yes you must have to connect your Trezor safe 5 to the computer to create seed.

Just comment your Trezor safe 5 wallet to the USB and open Trezor Suite and Install firmware and then simply create a wallet.

But always remember this, not your key not your crypto so always keep safe your seed phrase on secret zone and do not share it to anyone. if someone get your seed then he can directly access your wallet and move your fund without any authorizations.

[Johnds1]

Yes you must have to connect your Trezor safe 5 to the computer to create seed.

Just comment your Trezor safe 5 wallet to the USB and open Trezor Suite and Install firmware and then simply create a wallet.

But always remember this, not your key not your crypto so always keep safe your seed phrase on secret zone and do not share it to anyone. if someone get your seed then he can directly access your wallet and move your fund without any authorizations.

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

[The Cryptovator]

I was confused like you when I bought Trezor Safe 3 because I had been using Ledger previously, and I was used to Ledger. Due to having no battery, Trezor must be connected with the computer to make transactions or create a seed phrase. At the beginning you may not feel comfortable, but you must need to know the reality. Still, Trezor is better than Ledger at all. Ledger is closed source, but Trezor is open source. Even if you connect your Trezor with a computer and create a seed, you are safe; it's not because only the seed is generated on the device but also the device doesn't pass the seed to the computer software.

Your seed can't be read by the Trezor Suite or by your computer. Because Trezor communicates with the computer by encrypted data. Trezor's secure element isolates the environment when creating your seed phrase. The device connected with your computer through USB, but your computer or Trezor Suite can't read or store your seed phrase due to encrypted data. You know Trezor uses open-source firmware that can be audited by anyone. So there is no backdoor on the firmware. However, you must need to secure your seed phrase in a safe place; I hope you know better.

[nc50lc]

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

I can see where you're coming from.
Even with open-source code, the difficulty of auditing all those lines; the client Trezor Suite and the firmware, isn't going to be simple.
Without time, expertise and/or effort, you'll just be trusting the verdict of other users/developers on the code.

If still in doubt, you may consider a full "air-gap" hardware device which can be used for transaction signing (PSBT) and initial setup without connecting to a computer.
E.g. Coldcard.

[Outhue]

Yes you must have to connect your Trezor safe 5 to the computer to create seed.

Just comment your Trezor safe 5 wallet to the USB and open Trezor Suite and Install firmware and then simply create a wallet.

But always remember this, not your key not your crypto so always keep safe your seed phrase on secret zone and do not share it to anyone. if someone get your seed then he can directly access your wallet and move your fund without any authorizations.

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

I understand you very well and I will feel the same way too because I don't want to have anything to do with me connecting my hardware wallet to my pc for anything, this is why I choose Keystone wallet.

It's air gapped, you don't need the Internet connection to make transactions and when it comes to updating the firmware you are given the open to keep your device as an air gapped and instead download the firmware on a memory card and insert the memory card into the hardware device and update.

No Internet connection is needed to complete the update which makes it way more safer than few hardware wallets out there. If you don't like the idea, then look for devices that are made like smartphone, with full phone like operational screen. E.g

Their updates are mostly offline, or straight in the hardware itself, no need to connect to PC.

[rdluffy]

Yes you must have to connect your Trezor safe 5 to the computer to create seed.

Just comment your Trezor safe 5 wallet to the USB and open Trezor Suite and Install firmware and then simply create a wallet.

But always remember this, not your key not your crypto so always keep safe your seed phrase on secret zone and do not share it to anyone. if someone get your seed then he can directly access your wallet and move your fund without any authorizations.

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

Your question is completely understandable
However, even with your wallet connected to your computer, the seed is only being generated and displayed in your own wallet, it is not shared with the PC or the program

You're right to be paranoid, but you're safe with Trezor because that's the purpose of the hardwallet, to keep the seed only on the device

[Lucius]

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

Some still call this type of device a "cold wallet", although your "problem" clearly proves that this is not exactly the case. My advice would be that if it's about Bitcoin, look for a solution in one of the proven air-gapped devices, and with them you certainly won't have such a problem. And no, the price of such devices is not much higher than standard hardware wallets, although you will have to get used to doing everything via QR codes or an SD card, but that is actually an advantage, not a disadvantage.

You can read more about Hardware wallets

[satscraper]

~

If you are already bound toTrezor Safe 5 you could try setting it up on air-gapped machine with pre-installed trezorctl. Reportedly "support for Trezor Safe 5 was added in 0.13.9" version of this tool but I didn't check this because I don't have Trezor Safe 5. The basic commands for trezorctl are here. You may use commands related to either initialization or restoring device. If you're restoring, you'll need the valid BIP-39 seed phrase, which you can generate using coin flips.

That said, I recommend this route only if you're tech-savvy and comfortable working in command-line. Otherwise, you might be better off with the off-the-shelf solution like Passport Core,

[dkbit98]

Is this the case?  Can it not give out seed phrase with just a power source?

You can literally generate compatible seed words offline and import them later to your Trezor device.
Internet connection is going to be needed later for sending transaction and for checking your coin balance.
If you want to be fully airgapped and without any connection there are airgapped wallets like Passport, Keystone, Jade, Seedsigner and few others.

[rdluffy]

Is this the case?  Can it not give out seed phrase with just a power source?

You can literally generate compatible seed words offline and import them later to your Trezor device.
Internet connection is going to be needed later for sending transaction and for checking your coin balance.
If you want to be fully airgapped and without any connection there are airgapped wallets like Passport, Keystone, Jade, Seedsigner and few others.

Before I had a hardwallet I used to do this (generate seeds offline)
I would install Linux (tails, mint, ubuntu etc) on a flashstick, generate several wallets, write down the seeds offline and use them as needed

But honestly, having a Trezor, I don't know if OP need to be that paranoid
But it's a valid alternative

[NotATether]

Yes you must have to connect your Trezor safe 5 to the computer to create seed.

Just comment your Trezor safe 5 wallet to the USB and open Trezor Suite and Install firmware and then simply create a wallet.

But always remember this, not your key not your crypto so always keep safe your seed phrase on secret zone and do not share it to anyone. if someone get your seed then he can directly access your wallet and move your fund without any authorizations.

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

Well personally, I would rather just generate the seed myself and then import that into the hardware wallet device directly through its own user interface.

I wouldn't trust hardware wallets to generate my seed phrase due to the risk of tampered firmware.

[Lucius]

Well personally, I would rather just generate the seed myself and then import that into the hardware wallet device directly through its own user interface.
I wouldn't trust hardware wallets to generate my seed phrase due to the risk of tampered firmware.

If you don't trust a device to generate a seed for you, does it even make sense to enter a seed that you generated in some other way into that same device? If the firmware is malicious in any way, then it can compromise even the seed you enter into it.

An example is one of the better-known hardware wallets that has the possibility to send the seed from the device to third parties, which means that it does not matter at all whether you generated the same seed on the device or created it in some other way.

[BitGoba]

After being late to the party of becoming aware that ledger pooped in everyone's cornflakes, I've decided to go with Trezor Safe 5.  I was watching setup videos on youtube and I am concerned about having to connect to a computer BEFORE it releases the seed phrase.

Is this the case?  Can it not give out seed phrase with just a power source?

One of the videos appeared to be someone from the Trezor company, so I would think if it were possible to retrieve seed phrase without computer, that would have been mentioned, but wanted to be sure.

If it is possible, you would think it woukd have been stated because to me it defeats the whole purpose of an air gap.  I'm uneasy about having it connected to a computer while giving me the most important words.  Though its said it is only shown on the Trezor screen, thats not too convincing in my opinion.

If you want a real air-gapped hardware wallet, check out Coldcard or Blockstream Jade. They never connect to the internet and the seed phrase never leaves the device.They don’t support shitcoins these are very high-quality Bitcoin-only wallets.

[Johnds1]

Honestly, it kind of makes me want to look elsewhere for another device.  Why would you feel comfortable with your device connected during the most important part of setup(releasing seed phrase)?

I can see where you're coming from.
Even with open-source code, the difficulty of auditing all those lines; the client Trezor Suite and the firmware, isn't going to be simple.
Without time, expertise and/or effort, you'll just be trusting the verdict of other users/developers on the code.

If still in doubt, you may consider a full "air-gap" hardware device which can be used for transaction signing (PSBT) and initial setup without connecting to a computer.
E.g. Coldcard.

Thanks, everyone.

I currently use the Ledger Nano X and am very familiar with its features. One aspect I really appreciated was the ability to generate the seed phrase offline, before connecting the device to any internet-connected platform. That feature gave me a real sense of security.

However, with Ledger Recover becoming a concern and the closed source coding, I decided to purchase the Trezor Safe 5 as a more privacy-focused alternative.

To be clear, I’m not opposed to connecting a hardware wallet to the internet when performing transactions. But I’m genuinely puzzled by Trezor’s decision to require a connection to a computer just to generate the seed phrase. Why not allow for a basic power source — like a wall charger — for initial setup, so users can create the seed phrase without any data interface involved?

As someone else mentioned, yes, Trezor is open source, which is commendable. But unless you personally review the code — which I don’t — you're still relying on the assurance of others. They say the seed phrase is never shared with the computer, but how can we truly verify that? Just because it’s displayed on the device doesn’t guarantee it’s not being leaked or cached through some vector we’re unaware of.

Even if Trezor’s intentions are completely honest and the code is clean, is it really worth waking up two years from now to find your seed phrase was compromised — simply because you weren’t given the option to generate it offline using something as simple as a power outlet?

Now I’ve got the Safe 5 sitting here, and I’m reconsidering whether transferring all my assets from the Ledger Nano X is actually a safer move. I’m trying to figure out if I’m trading one set of risks for another.

So here’s my question:
Are there any hardware wallets that match the user-friendliness of the Nano X, but allow for true offline seed phrase generation — ideally without requiring a computer connection at the start?  Again, I'm m fine with connecting for transactions and setup after that.

Thanks in advance.

[nc50lc]

Again, I'm m fine with connecting for transactions and setup after that.

This still falls under your concern of not reviewing the code and just trusting it.
Since it's connected to an internet-connected device, you'll not know if any other sensitive information is being transferred even during transaction signing.

Anyways, they wouldn't have the confidence to set it open-source if they're tying to do that.
At least that'll give you "a little bit" of assurance even if you haven't reviewed and compiled the code.

So here’s my question:
Are there any hardware wallets that match the user-friendliness of the Nano X, but allow for true offline seed phrase generation — ideally without requiring a computer connection at the start?

If only the initial setup is the concern and you'll still be connecting the hardware wallet on an online machine:
AFAIK, you can do the rest of the steps offline after firmware installation and device verification. (haven't tested though)
Or follow the other alternatives that others have suggested like generating the seed phrase offline physically or through a well-reviewed tool/wallet and just import it to your hardware wallet offline.
For the latter, you'll have to ask them for the steps that they've done to accomplish it.