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Author Topic: What is stopping the 21 million limit from being increased?  (Read 74 times)
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Today at 01:34:19 PM
Merited by stwenhao (1)
 #1

Maybe this has been mentioned before, but I didn't bother to search.

Bitcoin has a "hard" 21 million limit.  So what's stopping it from being increased?

It is coded into the software?  Has no one ever updated software before?  You're telling me that someone the Bitcoin software is the one piece of software in the world that can't ever have its number adjusted?

I'd love to see what would happen if the 21 million limit was increased.  One of the founding principles of Bitcoin would be gone.  Prices would instantly crash like never before.

I'd still buy some, just to have some, in case prices ever rose again.

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Today at 01:41:18 PM
Merited by stwenhao (1)
 #2

If there should be any change in the 21 million limited supply, there must be a consensus. But who is going to agree that bitcoin supply should be increased? No one. There can not be such a proposal, not to talk of consensus from node runners because anyone that like the progress of bitcoin will not want its price to fall because of making it inflationary.

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Today at 02:33:32 PM
Merited by stwenhao (1)
 #3

Bitcoin has a "hard" 21 million limit.  So what's stopping it from being increased?

The simple answer is you are creating more supply and demand will reduced, the economics scarcity of Bitcoin will die immediately.

If there is a concern regarding an increase in supply of Bitcoin, a  consensus agreement must be reach. You can't push what's not agreed on the network. If there is an agreement to increase the supply which is unlikely, then expect an update to be roll out for miners and node.

Quote
It is coded into the software?  Has no one ever updated software before?  You're telling me that someone the Bitcoin software is the one piece of software in the world that can't ever have its number adjusted?

I'd love to see what would happen if the 21 million limit was increased.  One of the founding principles of Bitcoin would be gone.  Prices would instantly crash like never before.

I'd still buy some, just to have some, in case prices ever rose again.


There is one over flow incident that created 184B BTC in 2010. You can see the detail in this block https://www.blockchain.com/explorer/blocks/btc/74638

A new version of Bitcoin(the client was release) and the 184B bitcoin became invalid.

If you have it on your mind to see Bitcoin supply increase, I will assume you are selfish person that want to destroy Bitcoin.


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Today at 02:40:35 PM
 #4

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So what's stopping it from being increased?
The code of all old nodes. Even if 99% miners will start producing coins out of thin air, then still, they will be hard-rejected by all old nodes.

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It is coded into the software?
Yes. If a block is invalid, then all following blocks also are.

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Has no one ever updated software before?
There were many updates, but lots of them were backward-compatible. Which means, that many changes are possible, but there are some rules, which are set in stone, and are hard to change. For example: the maximum block reward is hardcoded, and if you try to increase it, then the whole block will be invalid.

Quote
You're telling me that someone the Bitcoin software is the one piece of software in the world that can't ever have its number adjusted?
It can be adjusted, as long as you keep proportions unchanged. For example, Lightning Network uses millisatoshis, instead of satoshis, as the smallest unit. And it is possible to change the software of some second layer, to provide some features there. But then, they won't be present on the main layer.

Quote
I'd love to see what would happen if the 21 million limit was increased.
If it will be a typical hard-fork, then it would be just another altcoin, not the first one, and not the last one.

In case of a soft-fork, it is a matter of what users will do. Because if the chain will be splitted, then it is quite likely, that people will keep holding the original coins, and start selling the forked ones. And then, even if there will be a soft-fork, then it will still need majority support, otherwise a minority chain can be easily turned into an altcoin.

And then, there are also no-forks, like what Lightning Network did with millisatoshis. Then, nothing spectacular will happen, just a different proportions will be used to peg coins in and out, like 1:1000, instead of 1:1, as used in LN.

Quote
But who is going to agree that bitcoin supply should be increased? No one.
There were users proposing things like tail supply: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5405755

So, of course, there may be some users, willing to change the rules. But then, they should really know upfront, what they want, because it is easy to end up with an altcoin. And in that case, there are better ways to make an altcoin, than to keep all Bitcoin properties, depending on what is the purpose.

Quote
There can not be such a proposal, not to talk of consensus from node runners because anyone that like the progress of bitcoin will not want its price to fall because of making it inflationary.
Forking the mainchain is nothing new. People will just sell the coins they don't want, and buy the coins they want, and everything will continue as usual.

Proof of Work puzzle in mainnet, testnet4 and signet.
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Today at 02:41:15 PM
 #5

If bitcoin 21 million fixed supply is increased, I don't think that investors will have trust and confidence in bitcoin anymore because the price will drop and bitcoin will become like every other shitcoins out there. Bitcoin will lose her trust and credibility because it will compromise the network security and it will affect miners incentives.

Bitcoin will lose the purpose of her creation which is financial freedom and decentralized nature.

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Today at 02:43:19 PM
 #6

If there should be any change in the 21 million limited supply, there must be a consensus. But who is going to agree that bitcoin supply should be increased? No one. There can not be such a proposal, not to talk of consensus from node runners because anyone that like the progress of bitcoin will not want its price to fall because of making it inflationary.

I absolutely agree with this.

Nobody wants to vote for a proposal to create inflation in Bitcoin, thereby making each coin worth less. If that ever happens, I am going back to fiat as it would be the ultimate proof that Bitcoin has failed.

Good thing the community has to weigh in on these kinds of decisions. Otherwise we would have chaos.



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Today at 02:47:14 PM
 #7

I think it's not going to be possible unless there's a global consensus.

Bitcoin is very guided, which is why nothing can be done to it because it has undergo so many processes, and to change it's software, you have to rerun the software globally to a new one.

Bitcoin is guided or controlled by nodes and apart from the 21 millions total supply, any new version created will be rejected by an existing node. Developer or miners don't control it which is why they can not change the total supply.
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Today at 03:08:51 PM
Merited by stwenhao (1)
 #8

Bitcoin is not some software that can be updated. It is a set of rules that shape the Bitcoin Protocol and because Bitcoin is decentralized, no individual can just change these rules without breaking the chain. Any change has to be accepted by a supermajority of the network, in other words we have to reach consensus. And there is no consensus for increasing the cap (since there is no need for it) so it cannot be changed.

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Today at 04:20:45 PM
Merited by PrivacyG (2), stwenhao (1)
 #9

Consensus is not the best answer to this question, because consensus is not immutable. In fact, as we're experiencing in the real world, it is very possible to program consensus and conceive majority.

The real reason is that what determines "bitcoin" is something called "economic majority". This is the kind of majority that selected Bitcoin in 2017 instead of Bitcoin Cash. In short, it is a sum of market signals that will ultimately determine the rules of the "original bitcoin". If someone changes the hard cap to 22 million, then he is immediately disconnected from the network, and needs to convince the economic majority that his bitcoin is the original, or the one they should sell their BTC for. It's infeasible to accomplish, though, if you understand game theory and use some common sense.



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Today at 06:16:48 PM
 #10

 Unlimited supply of Bitcoin would cause inflation of the coin cause the demand for it would be less when more people would have it at ease but when the supply is not too much like it is currently there would be more demand for it making it more scarce and very valuable as time goes.
 Satoshi was very wise enough to make Bitcoin decentralised and created limited supply of it to be mined for a reason, and your question is one of the reasons, so it won't be inflated like Fiat and depreciat over time like shitcoins.

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Today at 07:11:23 PM
 #11

Unlimited supply of Bitcoin would cause inflation of the coin cause the demand for it would be less when more people would have it at ease but when the supply is not too much like it is currently there would be more demand for it making it more scarce and very valuable as time goes.
 Satoshi was very wise enough to make Bitcoin decentralised and created limited supply of it to be mined for a reason, and your question is one of the reasons, so it won't be inflated like Fiat and depreciat over time like shitcoins.

OP didn’t say unlimited but to increase the amount probably to a higher amount but as you have rightly said it will create more demand and less supply which actually increase the price of this coin, so bitcoin having this little supply is actually the way to go. But you need to understand that it is not only the low limit of a Coin that actually guarantees a high demand of it, although it’s part of the reason but seriously there are other advantages like the trust one has for the coin and this is exactly what make many people to actually trust the network. Now imagine a consensus is reached to increase the cap, wouldn’t that even break the trust people have for bitcoin, they will be scared to that many fundamentals would be broken too in the future

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