Voluntary account declaration

[Xiestar]

What do you think about this idea?

Pros:

• This will help lessen the multiple account cheating since accounts are already disclosed and monitor.
• Less guilt on hiding your alt account if you are trying to change from your past wrongdoing.
• More opportunity for other users to join on a single campaign.

We should be honest that multiple account is already in existing regardless if we caught them through account connection or not since farm account is already being smart on merit whoring. The only cleanup we can do is hunting old user that make a mistake in the past or joining the same campaign after changing hands already while the old transaction is just being use to determine account connection.

I don’t believe someone is posting 10+ account on his own while still getting merit from other user outside their circle. Either they sold it or transfer ownership to a friend to share profit. While other country with excessive merit source can easily farm a new account from scratch without traces just for the merit whoring.

I believe merit whoring is much terrifying problem of the forum since it’s obvious that they are controlled by a few people based on the merit circle while they grow their account fast and join a single campaign without the risk of being tagged since merit abused is not enough evidence to tagged them.

[Bch219]

With the few months I have spent in this forum, I have seen people who tagged their alt accounts with a neutral note so everyone can see that it’s theirs. So what’s stopping others from doing the same?

I don’t really see this as necessary, but it’s still in place. If anyone wants to declare their alts, then they should do it here and also leave a tag on their account, or even better, declare it here and use this as a reference for the tag.

[Hazink]

Such idea have been proposed before make all the accounts you control public info but do you think anyone will actually want to do that?

In as much as the idea might appear to be a good one, how many people do you think will actually feel comfortable doing that? Only a few have been able to tag their own alt account with neutral the rest prefer to give the forum cleanup team a little job to do that for them.

[yahoo62278]

Do you really think that people that are trying to br greedy and cheat campaigns are going to want to let their alts be known? Or do you think that people whom have been banned for past offenses want to let you know they are on an alt and evading ban?

While it could be a good idea kind of, it is not 1 that I think would be too accepted by those are are trying to stay hidden.

[Xiestar]

With the few months I have spent in this forum, I have seen people who tagged their alt accounts with a neutral note so everyone can see that it’s theirs. So what’s stopping others from doing the same?

Such idea have been proposed before make all the accounts you control public info but do you think anyone will actually want to do that?

In as much as the idea might appear to be a good one, how many people do you think will actually feel comfortable doing that? Only a few have been able to tag their own alt account with neutral the rest prefer to give the forum cleanup team a little job to do that for them.

Because they are afraid for the repercussions of their previous action. If there will be a consensus about giving immunity for those account declarations to protect their account in exchange for being honest onwards I believe this will make a difference.

But the success of this suggestion relies on the DT will take on this matter because they different opinion.

Do you really think that people that are trying to br greedy and cheat campaigns are going to want to let their alts be known? Or do you think that people whom have been banned for past offenses want to let you know they are on an alt and evading ban?

I do believe that some user wants to changed if they will be given a 2nd chance. Those greedy people that choose to continue despite having an option to change deserves no consideration.

I’m just suggesting this for those trying to be on the right track.


Minor miner account is the best example here. It’s known that this account comes from suspicious ownership transfer yet he is contributing now to the forum. If this people was given a chance after doing good even with shady background I believe there’s still hope for betterment.

[Vod]

If the forum does not moderate scams, it should not provide any official expectations of safety. 

[PostQuantumBTC]

Nobody is saying people should not disclose their accounts so that other users can know the alt or alts but spammers, ban evaders and account farmers will prefer not to do that.

[Xiestar]

If the forum does not moderate scams, it should not provide any official expectations of safety. 

Moderator don’t moderate scam but community do that. Same idea on busting account sells and other violators on the rules that set only by users not by the moderators so community have the power to give safety on the rules that is not existing on the forum.




The majority of account bust recently are not part of same signature campaign. While the campaign run smoothly on the round which these user was joined through their post quota.

Some user suggest that having multiple account decrease post quality but there are known user even mods have their own alt account joined on different signature campaign. I don’t see the point busting accounts that is not actively engaging on cheating while there’s a sever merit whore issue that joined on a signature campaign cheating with their massive farm account just because all the evidence are circumstantial.

[yahoo62278]

Do you really think that people that are trying to br greedy and cheat campaigns are going to want to let their alts be known? Or do you think that people whom have been banned for past offenses want to let you know they are on an alt and evading ban?

I do believe that some user wants to changed if they will be given a 2nd chance. Those greedy people that choose to continue despite having an option to change deserves no consideration.

I’m just suggesting this for those trying to be on the right track.


Minor miner account is the best example here. It’s known that this account comes from suspicious ownership transfer yet he is contributing now to the forum. If this people was given a chance after doing good even with shady background I believe there’s still hope for betterment.

That's the problem, once you are perma banned from this forum you get no second chance. You decided to be a retard(no you, just the user in general), you don't need to be a part of this community.

Making a new account doesn't change the fact that you previously scammed. It doesn't change any other action either and if people think well we can just make a new account and be forgiven they will probably scam more often actually.

Once you are banned, you are no longer welcome in the community. That's how it should stay IMO. There's no reason we should subject ourselves or the other members here to the worry of will you scam again.

[Xiestar]

Do you really think that people that are trying to br greedy and cheat campaigns are going to want to let their alts be known? Or do you think that people whom have been banned for past offenses want to let you know they are on an alt and evading ban?

I do believe that some user wants to changed if they will be given a 2nd chance. Those greedy people that choose to continue despite having an option to change deserves no consideration.

I’m just suggesting this for those trying to be on the right track.


Minor miner account is the best example here. It’s known that this account comes from suspicious ownership transfer yet he is contributing now to the forum. If this people was given a chance after doing good even with shady background I believe there’s still hope for betterment.

That's the problem, once you are perma banned from this forum you get no second chance. You decided to be a retard(no you, just the user in general), you don't need to be a part of this community.

Making a new account doesn't change the fact that you previously scammed. It doesn't change any other action either and if people think well we can just make a new account and be forgiven they will probably scam more often actually.

Once you are banned, you are no longer welcome in the community. That's how it should stay IMO. There's no reason we should subject ourselves or the other members here to the worry of will you scam again.

You have my full support on perma banned since this is against the rules of the forum. What I’m considering is the past multiple account mistake cheat on signature campaign because this rules is only set by the community while the forum allows and don’t moderate it.

[nutildah]

Its not the worst idea and I do appreciate it when people take the initiative to self-label their alt accounts. It seems likes this should be standard procedure. However, once an account is publicly associated with another account, it can't be resold unless the connection is erased. If an account was purchased and someone proactively announces it was purchased by them, its better to be first to tag your own account than somebody else having to do it. Of course you run the risk of being tagged for account trading but if you'd had the account for a long time, maybe DT would look the other way.

Minor miner account is the best example here. It’s known that this account comes from suspicious ownership transfer yet he is contributing now to the forum. If this people was given a chance after doing good even with shady background I believe there’s still hope for betterment.

There's a few problems with this:

- the owner benefits from the account having Legendary status and being from 2013, even though they had nothing to do with it
- they are misrepresenting themselves by taking de facto credit for the thousands of older posts they didn't write
- although he only has 1 untrusted positive trust, the little reputation he has hinges on it, and it was left to describe the old owner, and not the new owner.

Basically its dishonest to pretend to be somebody you're not. No amount of time changes this.

[mindrust]

Do you really think that people that are trying to br greedy and cheat campaigns are going to want to let their alts be known? Or do you think that people whom have been banned for past offenses want to let you know they are on an alt and evading ban?

While it could be a good idea kind of, it is not 1 that I think would be too accepted by those are are trying to stay hidden.

People don’t have to cheat campaigns to benefit from owning multiple accounts and I have seen somebody else doing the exact same thing before i start raising my alt. (The dude was controlling  2 legendary or hero accounts if i remember right, both in a signature campaign)

Putting a neutral tag on your alt and let people know what you are doing is the right way to do it so nobody faces a surprise.

The example i was talking about above, alt acc don’t wear a signature now but i have seen it do at some point  if i remember correctly

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1292764

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2729230

[yahoo62278]

Do you really think that people that are trying to br greedy and cheat campaigns are going to want to let their alts be known? Or do you think that people whom have been banned for past offenses want to let you know they are on an alt and evading ban?

While it could be a good idea kind of, it is not 1 that I think would be too accepted by those are are trying to stay hidden.

People don’t have to cheat campaigns to benefit from owning multiple accounts and I have seen somebody else doing the exact same thing before i start raising my alt. (The dude was controlling  2 legendary or hero accounts if i remember right, both in a signature campaign)

Putting a neutral tag on your alt and let people know what you are doing is the right way to do it so nobody faces a surprise.

The example i was talking about above, alt acc don’t wear a signature now but i have seen it do at some point  if i remember correctly

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1292764

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=2729230

I am well aware that people can use alts and not be cheaters, but there are those that would rather put 10 accounts in the highest paying campaign regardless of the rule that 1 account per person. The risk to them is not as great as the reward.

Ban evaders are not going to want to say hey I was banned on this account but I am back with this account as being banned is a lifetime ban.

In general it's a good idea with conditions, but it would not go over well with those that have bad intentions.

[lovesmayfamilis]

I eagerly ran to check your tag on your account, OP, to find out your real, active account. But, to my regret, I didn't see anything .
I must say that your ideas are utopian, although I recently wrote the same thing.
The truth is that if accounts behave honestly in the community and know how to properly distribute their resources among their alt accounts, they don't need to reveal themselves.
Let those who are overly greedy start worrying about their possible past mistakes, as everyone understands that the methods by which linked accounts were previously discovered are practically irrelevant today. For new alt accounts, there are already good guidelines on what not to do.
It would be better for those who doubt their past mistakes to tag their accounts with the understanding that once they reveal the truth, no one will touch their accounts with any tags.
But if they don't, they will have to worry every time, wondering about their fate and the time for their discovery.

[Xiestar]

I eagerly ran to check your tag on your account, OP, to find out your real, active account. But, to my regret, I didn't see anything .
I must say that your ideas are utopian, although I recently wrote the same thing.
The truth is that if accounts behave honestly in the community and know how to properly distribute their resources among their alt accounts, they don't need to reveal themselves.
Let those who are overly greedy start worrying about their possible past mistakes, as everyone understands that the methods by which linked accounts were previously discovered are practically irrelevant today. For new alt accounts, there are already good guidelines on what not to do.
It would be better for those who doubt their past mistakes to tag their accounts with the understanding that once they reveal the truth, no one will touch their accounts with any tags.
But if they don't, they will have to worry every time, wondering about their fate and the time for their discovery.

I don’t have any financial dealings in the forum that will lead to my main account. I’m just happy to become involved here by dealing on the injustices that I saw here based on my observations.

I just can’t stand the idea that those new account that already well versed on hiding their tracks is benefiting on the forum signature campaign with blatant cheating using massive farm that have same pattern of merit whoring and came from same local board.

So I’m thinking the idea of giving chance to those commit mistake in the past and trying to avoid cheating now as much as possible.


Maybe giving them warning first that they are being watched then let’s see if they will change or not. This is the kind of idea that I’m thinking on cases that involve less account or not sever cases of cheating in the past.

But if being caught right handed on current campaign they don’t deserve second chance like @Baofeng case.

But this case https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5566189.0 is the example that maybe they might be a change on his behavior if he was warned first since being greedy is sometimes irresistible when no one watching you.

[lovesmayfamilis]

But this case https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5566189.0 is the example that maybe they might be a change on his behavior if he was warned first since being greedy is sometimes irresistible when no one watching you.

Why warn? After all, any signature company already clearly states its rules. If someone commits fraud, they're already guilty of violating them and should understand that. I was talking about something else: if someone has a history of dishonest behavior and no longer behaves in the same way. As they say, a confession is a sincere confession. Here's an example of what seems to be alternative accounts, which are difficult to accuse of anything other than a single wallet number.

https://ninjastic.space/address/0xce7bb2ced4f86e14844d9416630e6c6148500770

If these are two accounts belonging to the same person, why should this be hidden?

[rohang]

For me it makes no sense someone would do it

Whats the possible reason of making an alt account?

Participating in multiple campaigns
Participating in giveaways
Merit trading
Support/defending original accounts accusations
Something else??

Voluntarily announcing it would make all of the above impossible

[yahoo62278]

For me it makes no sense someone would do it

Whats the possible reason of making an alt account?

Participating in multiple campaigns
Participating in giveaways
Merit trading
Support/defending original accounts accusations
Something else??

Voluntarily announcing it would make all of the above impossible

There are a few that have a mobile alt account and aren't using them for malicious purposes. Off the top of my head LoyceV and Little Mouse are 2 that come to mind. I know hilariousandco has his alt known and it might be a mobile alt, other than those 3 I don't recall anyone else.

I know another user that has an alt account that he uses to fuck with people, but again just a troll account nothing really malicious.

[rohang]

For me it makes no sense someone would do it

Whats the possible reason of making an alt account?

Participating in multiple campaigns
Participating in giveaways
Merit trading
Support/defending original accounts accusations
Something else??

Voluntarily announcing it would make all of the above impossible

There are a few that have a mobile alt account and aren't using them for malicious purposes. Off the top of my head LoyceV and Little Mouse are 2 that come to mind. I know hilariousandco has his alt known and it might be a mobile alt, other than those 3 I don't recall anyone else.

I know another user that has an alt account that he uses to fuck with people, but again just a troll account nothing really malicious.

Ofcourse those are old respected members who have good reasons to use alts and declare them

But in most cases it will be some sort of abuse intentions behind it, and they would never declare

Unless the forum admins themselves do some alt detecting and announcing, but thats a slippery slope
I do think there could be many alts undetected as the weekly signature amounts are pretty decent amounts for third world countries giving them huge incentive to perhaps work this as a job with multiple alt accounts

Maybe some experienced respected members could work with admins to figure out a way to bust alts that would improve forum massively

[nutildah]

Maybe some experienced respected members could work with admins to figure out a way to bust alts that would improve forum massively

This is a good idea but even if alts are busted and tags are issued there will always be some campaign that will hire these accounts. Thankfully its not all campaigns.

I kind of like the approach that the altcoinstalks admin has to weeding out cheaters, and it involves matching IP addresses of accounts in the same campaigns together. Many of you know this already but your account will receive a red dot that renders it unable to participate in campaigns until it pays a certain amount of money. At least that's how I understand it (I'm not 100% sure).

I don't think our forum would ever do something like that, and since having alts aren't against forum rules, I don't think any sort of action is likely to be taken by admins or moderators that contradicts long-standing policy. Nevertheless, a signal from the administration that cheating is bad is of course always welcomed.