Crypto trading really works in our country?

[LucyFurr]

99% of the crypto users in our country are traders but I am very curious to know is it really profitable with 30% tax, 1% TDS, no tax exemption and all the bank freeze issue, difficulty tracking all the trades and report for the ITR filing?

Apart from this, influencers promote ponzi as trading and crypto investing. YouTubers promoting random shitcoins with no idea what it is even about yet we are trading cryptos in huge number as per my understanding. So we are trading cryptos even if it is not profitable or even if we got no idea what it is?

[TheUltraElite]

File tax on capital gains on your trades, you can get details from the exchange that you are using and self file the tax payments.

This is to avoid problems in future, although you can hire a CA to help with it for the initial few years, you might be able to do it yourself later.

Also youtubers and social media influencers dont come into this middle class game. They often do not have indian bank accounts but with overseas banks often held by other members of their family which they use to liquidate their money. Dont expect them to help you file taxes because they are only looking for their 10% commission.

[pawanjain]

99% of the crypto users in our country are traders but I am very curious to know is it really profitable with 30% tax, 1% TDS, no tax exemption and all the bank freeze issue, difficulty tracking all the trades and report for the ITR filing?

Apart from this, influencers promote ponzi as trading and crypto investing. YouTubers promoting random shitcoins with no idea what it is even about yet we are trading cryptos in huge number as per my understanding. So we are trading cryptos even if it is not profitable or even if we got no idea what it is?

That's a nice question. India has a large population and a lot of people do trade in crypo these days.
As far as I know many people who actually trade crypto end up making losses in one way or another.
There are some people who do make huge profits but they find their way through the taxation part.
Ponzi schemes, scams and shitcoins are a global issue now but for India, yes, we are having a good volume of trades.

[Bitcoin Smith]

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That's a nice question. India has a large population and a lot of people do trade in crypo these days.
As far as I know many people who actually trade crypto end up making losses in one way or another.
There are some people who do make huge profits but they find their way through the taxation part.
Ponzi schemes, scams and shitcoins are a global issue now but for India, yes, we are having a good volume of trades.

Crypto trading in India thrives only on the tax evasion, and we all know hoe strict our IT when it comes to tracking and tax collection but we also can't ignore the warning/notices or penalty that will be levied on us for tax evasion after years.

I think it is just better to hold cryptos in our country since the 30% capital gains is not worthy of what we get back in returns.

[pawanjain]

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That's a nice question. India has a large population and a lot of people do trade in crypo these days.
As far as I know many people who actually trade crypto end up making losses in one way or another.
There are some people who do make huge profits but they find their way through the taxation part.
Ponzi schemes, scams and shitcoins are a global issue now but for India, yes, we are having a good volume of trades.

Crypto trading in India thrives only on the tax evasion, and we all know hoe strict our IT when it comes to tracking and tax collection but we also can't ignore the warning/notices or penalty that will be levied on us for tax evasion after years.

I think it is just better to hold cryptos in our country since the 30% capital gains is not worthy of what we get back in returns.

Exactly. We should just let our portfolio grow in size over the years while waiting for the taxation reduced on crypto gains.
I won't encourage tax evasion but people have already found their way out of this using P2P trading.
So better to just hold funds and only exchange crypto to fiat when in emergency.

[LucyFurr]

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Exactly. We should just let our portfolio grow in size over the years while waiting for the taxation reduced on crypto gains.
I won't encourage tax evasion but people have already found their way out of this using P2P trading.
So better to just hold funds and only exchange crypto to fiat when in emergency.

I am not using any Indian based exchanges and also not used Binance for over a year, and I seized my trading activity completely since then. As you said I sell via p2p with very trusted users and if they are not available then I go for the CDM which is like 15-20% over the market price so when I am selling if I sell 1000INR worth of bitcoin then I would receive like 900INR max and it also only for bigger amounts like minimum of 25KINR.

So Indian crypto market deliberately needs a place where retail investors can safely trade but also not get caught in the taxation, business idea if anyone is interested.

[pawanjain]

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Exactly. We should just let our portfolio grow in size over the years while waiting for the taxation reduced on crypto gains.
I won't encourage tax evasion but people have already found their way out of this using P2P trading.
So better to just hold funds and only exchange crypto to fiat when in emergency.

I am not using any Indian based exchanges and also not used Binance for over a year, and I seized my trading activity completely since then. As you said I sell via p2p with very trusted users and if they are not available then I go for the CDM which is like 15-20% over the market price so when I am selling if I sell 1000INR worth of bitcoin then I would receive like 900INR max and it also only for bigger amounts like minimum of 25KINR.

So Indian crypto market deliberately needs a place where retail investors can safely trade but also not get caught in the taxation, business idea if anyone is interested.

Isn't it better to go for USDT to INR instead ?
Currently USD to INR exchange rate is around 90 INR but USDT is selling at a premium rate of 95 INR, almost 6% extra profits.
We don't even require any minimum amount in this case when we are trading USDT/INR pair in P2P.

[Bitcoin Smith]

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Isn't it better to go for USDT to INR instead ?
Currently USD to INR exchange rate is around 90 INR but USDT is selling at a premium rate of 95 INR, almost 6% extra profits.
We don't even require any minimum amount in this case when we are trading USDT/INR pair in P2P.

USDT or BTC, there is not much difference, there is slight margin for the p2p traders when it comes to UPI, IMPS or other online payment methods and the minimum amount to start trade will be around 1000INR even with expert traders but the only problem is with the Cash deposit payment option which I have always seen for over 50K or above which is fair because we can't expect someone to visit ATM just to deposit 1000 or 5000 rupees.

[pawanjain]

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Isn't it better to go for USDT to INR instead ?
Currently USD to INR exchange rate is around 90 INR but USDT is selling at a premium rate of 95 INR, almost 6% extra profits.
We don't even require any minimum amount in this case when we are trading USDT/INR pair in P2P.

USDT or BTC, there is not much difference, there is slight margin for the p2p traders when it comes to UPI, IMPS or other online payment methods and the minimum amount to start trade will be around 1000INR even with expert traders but the only problem is with the Cash deposit payment option which I have always seen for over 50K or above which is fair because we can't expect someone to visit ATM just to deposit 1000 or 5000 rupees.

6% extra is quite a decent amount when you are exchanging at premium prices.
Besides that, I don't think anybody would be trading below 1000 INR that's why I said we don't require any minimum amount in P2P.
We can trade as low as 1000 INR which is the bare minimum anyone would trade.

[Bitcoin Smith]

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6% extra is quite a decent amount when you are exchanging at premium prices.
Besides that, I don't think anybody would be trading below 1000 INR that's why I said we don't require any minimum amount in P2P.
We can trade as low as 1000 INR which is the bare minimum anyone would trade.

6% extra is fair but not 15% that is what I am trying to say but it is the price we need to pay for the secure and no issue payment mode. But I have been using IMPS all the time with only 2 trusted traders ever since I am started using Paxful and now they also switched to Noones and I didn't have any issues with their payment.

So pick your traders wisely...

[M47AK16]

99% of the crypto users in our country are traders but I am very curious to know is it really profitable with 30% tax, 1% TDS, no tax exemption and all the bank freeze issue, difficulty tracking all the trades and report for the ITR filing?

Apart from this, influencers promote ponzi as trading and crypto investing. YouTubers promoting random shitcoins with no idea what it is even about yet we are trading cryptos in huge number as per my understanding. So we are trading cryptos even if it is not profitable or even if we got no idea what it is?

I would say trading might not really work out for you if you do not have enough experience in trading. We can't deny the fact that there is heavy taxation applied which reduces the profits drastically. TDS is nothing to be worried about because we can claim it back after the filing so that is something that we can get back. But the 30% tax on profits sounds too much for a new trader who wants to start the trading journey. We will have to pay the tax only on profits and loses will not even be considered so it just makes things difficult.

I am able to make profits out of trading even after considering the taxation amount because my target every month will be vary between 10% to 30% on my capital. I now know ways to avoid loss so I can make stable profits, and I won't mind paying tax on the profits. I just consider it as an extra trading fee, and I consider that to be an expense.

[pawanjain]

I would say trading might not really work out for you if you do not have enough experience in trading. We can't deny the fact that there is heavy taxation applied which reduces the profits drastically. TDS is nothing to be worried about because we can claim it back after the filing so that is something that we can get back. But the 30% tax on profits sounds too much for a new trader who wants to start the trading journey. We will have to pay the tax only on profits and loses will not even be considered so it just makes things difficult.

I am able to make profits out of trading even after considering the taxation amount because my target every month will be vary between 10% to 30% on my capital. I now know ways to avoid loss so I can make stable profits, and I won't mind paying tax on the profits. I just consider it as an extra trading fee, and I consider that to be an expense.

Well that is good for you that you are able to make good profits even after the 30% flat tax.
The worst thing about the taxation part is that the government doesn't allow us to set off the losses against the profits.
The first thing they should do here is to allow the users to set off their losses otherwise the government is just looting us off our money.

I read an article recently which highlighted the same issue. One crypto trader had to pay 50k INR in tax despite losing money in trading.
He initially made a deposit and did a few trades out of which he made profits in some trades but lose money in rest.
He didn't have to pay tax on the trades lost but had to pay on the profits he made but since he was in a over all loss he still had to pay those taxes.
This is by far the worst thing to happen that you are losing money and yet have to pay tax to the government because of their shitty rules.

[Bitcoin Smith]

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I read an article recently which highlighted the same issue. One crypto trader had to pay 50k INR in tax despite losing money in trading.
He initially made a deposit and did a few trades out of which he made profits in some trades but lose money in rest.
He didn't have to pay tax on the trades lost but had to pay on the profits he made but since he was in a over all loss he still had to pay those taxes.
This is by far the worst thing to happen that you are losing money and yet have to pay tax to the government because of their shitty rules.

Allowing the loss should be the priority if government ever decide to restructure the taxation system for crypto and the reason is as you said if one made profits in the few trades but lost while doing others still we had to pay for the one where we made profits even if we are zero or in negative on the net value.

As I always say this ignorance is causing a loss of revenue for the government, making amendments will be a good thing for the government as well as for the traders so it's just a win-win situation, yet our government is not interested in doing that.