Investment Become Gambling

[JayJuanGee]

One thing is to have interest in Bitcoin and the next to have a basic knowledge of what Bitcoin investment is all about and then try to figure out your discrestionary income because these are the things that will help anyone who is starting new because without a basic knowledge and your discretionary income, you cannot really understand how Bitcoin works. The feeling of selling off our Bitcoin or Investment is always as a result of someone not been interested in Bitcoin and in the long term. Note, our return in Bitcoin investment is not certain that is why we use our discretionary income to invest.

I believe the real problem here remains that a lot of new folks who come into bitcoin investment, often end up coming in with a major misconception about bitcoin, and this gives them the wrong mindset about bitcoin investment, and trust me, the moment that the mindset becomes wrong, every other thing that follows would automatically become wrong too, including the approach, strategy and expectations. So it's crucial to always try to first of all deal with the mindset before thinking of tackling any other sub issues.

Some people think it's a get rich quick scheme and once that expectation isn't met they dub it a scam and start spreading this misunderstood perspective like it's the real deal, if they had understood from the start that investing in bitcoin doesn't bring immediate profits then they would be better placed as investors, some don't even know to limit their investment to just their discretionary income and this still banks on them thinking they will be reaping profits very quickly so they are willing to invest outside their discretionary income out of their greed to get as much profit as they can in that short period of time.

I'm quite new here but still think investing in bitcoin is a lovely idea ,tho its a long time investment which may seem like a waste of time,I am still trying to understand the basics in bitcoin completely before I enter or turn into and investor in the market ,but definitely would someday ,Any advice for a newbie here?

Sure.  Start out small.  Figure out your discretionary income, and then try to buy bitcoin weekly with 1/3 of your discretionary income.  the other 2/3 goes into your back up funds and your discretionary consumption.

Plan to buy bitcoin for 4-10 years or longer, and then try to learn along the way and to make various adjustments as you go.  Bitcoin is an investment and not a trade, and there are no guarantees that what you do (even if you do it perfectly) will be successful, but as long as you are learning as you go and tweaking your approach to your own situation, then you likely will benefits from the organization and discipline and even the learning that you do within the process of both building your bitcoin stash and strengthening your cashflow management, to the extent that it needs to be strengthened.

It seems that the only way for bitcoin investment to have any chance at success is if it's done for the long term, it's going to be a very long journey but I think the most important thing to do is to start, I don't see the point in waiting unnecessarily, I just need to see how far my discretionary income can go, I won't be able to use all of it to invest in bitcoin but then I don't even need to use all to invest, just a part of it and like you said 1/3 of it sounds nice, and my backup funds too.

Of course, you can sell whenever you want, yet over the years, there have been so many guys who got into bitcoin and even established a decent amount of bitcoin, yet they ended up selling way too much too soon, and sure no one really knows for sure at the time, and so it could take time for you to learn enough about bitcoin and why you are buying bitcoin to start to feel comfortable with a long-term commitment, and perhaps you even have to figure out aspects about yourself, but you surely do not need to know everything about yourself and/or about bitcoin from the start so long as you can at least figure out your cashflow management so that you are not overdoing it, and so if you, perhaps, start out investing 1/3 of your discretionary funds and put 1/3 into back up funds and discretionarily consume 1/3, then maybe you are bringing some balance and you can study the matter as you go and perhaps figure out if you have changes in your perspective after further and further looking into bitcoin, ideas about your cashflow and your other 9 individual factors.

[ZeroVinsonN]

It seems that the only way for bitcoin investment to have any chance at success is if it's done for the long term, it's going to be a very long journey but I think the most important thing to do is to start, I don't see the point in waiting unnecessarily, I just need to see how far my discretionary income can go, I won't be able to use all of it to invest in bitcoin but then I don't even need to use all to invest, just a part of it and like you said 1/3 of it sounds nice, and my backup funds too.

As long as you’re able to figure out your discretionary income and it is enough to purchase even the smallest unit of sats(bitcoin), then you can start your ongoing accumulation process. You don’t need very big amounts before you can buy bitcoin and even if you have plenty discretionary income, you don’t need to use everything to buy bitcoin if it’s not within your budget; just do what it easy for you and aligns well with your financial circumstances. Prioritize having emergency funds; it’s importance cannot be overstated because it is what will help you to be able to hold your bitcoin well and you will not be under pressure to spend from it to take care of unexpected expenses or situations.

Regardless of the amount of discretionary income a person has it's still very important for them to accumulate with what they can tolerate, alot of people think that their discretionary income is meant only for accumulating bitcoin and to some extent this won't be a wrong thing to do if a person has already set of their backup funds but if they haven't then it's not smart to go all in into bitcoin investment with all of their discretionary income, even some people who already have their backup funds ready still won't be aggressive enough to invest in bitcoin with all of their discretionary income, people have discretionary spending that even though they are not a part of their basic needs are still important to them, this varies from individual to individual so when a person uses all of their discretionary income to buy bitcoin they become unable to do these other things.

[Fash33]

However, a few weeks after my investment, a close friend of mine also started investing. He also talked about long-term investment. Our goals were similar. However, even though the goals were the same, our behavior was not the same over time, and this is where the difference between investment and gambling was created.

He start take profits when price increased. After doing this a few times, he started monitoring the market regularly and analyzing the opinions of YouTube and Telegram. At one point, he started making decisions with the market fluctuations. Sometimes he would buy out of FOMO and sometimes he would sell out of panic. In this way, he would make profits at times and sometimes he would lose.

 Even when I warned him about such behavior, he  misunderstand me that maybe I did not want to let him make a profit.
However, at one point, after significant financial loss, he realized his mistake. The problem was in his behavior.  He had the ability to continue investing well in the long term and even though he started investing with this intention, due to his inability to control his behavior, the investment turned into a gamble. 

Do you think that mental and behavioral control are similar important with financial management, risk management  in investing?

✨

I think that your friend experienced is also a good example, he do not begin the investment with the mindset of gambling, he begins with long term investment strategy, but as time goes behavioral changed, instead of following his original plan he become focused on short time price movement, fear and greed begin making his decision for him than his investment strategy.

In investment my believe is that investing is not really define only by assets you buy, but your reaction toward it after purchasing it, two people can purchase same asset together with long term mindset, yet one build wealth via discipline and patience while other turn it into speculation, to manage your finances and risk is so important, but behave is what allows you to stick to that plan during period of volatility.

[Crakryptvest]

It seems that the only way for bitcoin investment to have any chance at success is if it's done for the long term, it's going to be a very long journey but I think the most important thing to do is to start, I don't see the point in waiting unnecessarily, I just need to see how far my discretionary income can go, I won't be able to use all of it to invest in bitcoin but then I don't even need to use all to invest, just a part of it and like you said 1/3 of it sounds nice, and my backup funds too.

Yes long-term is regarded as the best approach to work with if any investor wants to get rewarded in the future although is not guaranteed but it has happened severally and that's why we believe that it is the aproach that works in Bitcoin investment, I'm glad you understand it that way.

Waiting is procrastination and I hate that mindset because of what it can result to, many guys wasn't able to invest because they were waiting for nothing, what I keep asking is what if the price some guys have in their mind didn't come reality, what will they do after all those delays, I don't know why it is very difficult for some guys to know that Bitcoin investment can be done gradually with what they have within aiding delay shit, there isn't any reason to wait, as soon one has his discreationary income, the investment should kick start immediately without no further delay.

[Merit.s]

Of course, you can sell whenever you want, yet over the years, there have been so many guys who got into bitcoin and even established a decent amount of bitcoin, yet they ended up selling way too much too soon, and sure no one really knows for sure at the time, and so it could take time for you to learn enough about bitcoin and why you are buying bitcoin to start to feel comfortable with a long-term commitment,

Honestly, this is the part that every bitcoin investor should be very careful about because selling too much bitcoin too soon will make the investor become a low coiner and start accumulating bitcoin again due to wrong selling approach and wrong selling time. I think, it's better for investors to have a bitcoin target so that, they can focus on reaching their target and if time permits them, they can increase their bitcoin target to an over accumulation stage before thinking of selling.

It's even good to hodli for some years which is the maintenance stage of their bitcoin investment and sell when the right time comes using the sustainable withdrawal method you wrote the thread that gives them the option to sell based on a time duration or at a targeted time.

 This will help the investor manage his bitcoin portfolio properly while his portfolio keeps compounding instead, of reaching your bitcoin target after a very long time with commitment, patient and discipline but later end up being a low coiner because of the rush in selling without knowing how to take profit in a sustainable way.

[Nwaswago]

One thing is to have interest in Bitcoin and the next to have a basic knowledge of what Bitcoin investment is all about and then try to figure out your discrestionary income because these are the things that will help anyone who is starting new because without a basic knowledge and your discretionary income, you cannot really understand how Bitcoin works. The feeling of selling off our Bitcoin or Investment is always as a result of someone not been interested in Bitcoin and in the long term. Note, our return in Bitcoin investment is not certain that is why we use our discretionary income to invest.

I believe the real problem here remains that a lot of new folks who come into bitcoin investment, often end up coming in with a major misconception about bitcoin, and this gives them the wrong mindset about bitcoin investment, and trust me, the moment that the mindset becomes wrong, every other thing that follows would automatically become wrong too, including the approach, strategy and expectations. So it's crucial to always try to first of all deal with the mindset before thinking of tackling any other sub issues.

Some people think it's a get rich quick scheme and once that expectation isn't met they dub it a scam and start spreading this misunderstood perspective like it's the real deal, if they had understood from the start that investing in bitcoin doesn't bring immediate profits then they would be better placed as investors, some don't even know to limit their investment to just their discretionary income and this still banks on them thinking they will be reaping profits very quickly so they are willing to invest outside their discretionary income out of their greed to get as much profit as they can in that short period of time.

I'm quite new here but still think investing in bitcoin is a lovely idea ,tho its a long time investment which may seem like a waste of time,I am still trying to understand the basics in bitcoin completely before I enter or turn into and investor in the market ,but definitely would someday ,Any advice for a newbie here?

Sure.  Start out small.  Figure out your discretionary income, and then try to buy bitcoin weekly with 1/3 of your discretionary income.  the other 2/3 goes into your back up funds and your discretionary consumption.

Plan to buy bitcoin for 4-10 years or longer, and then try to learn along the way and to make various adjustments as you go.  Bitcoin is an investment and not a trade, and there are no guarantees that what you do (even if you do it perfectly) will be successful, but as long as you are learning as you go and tweaking your approach to your own situation, then you likely will benefits from the organization and discipline and even the learning that you do within the process of both building your bitcoin stash and strengthening your cashflow management, to the extent that it needs to be strengthened.

It seems that the only way for bitcoin investment to have any chance at success is if it's done for the long term, it's going to be a very long journey but I think the most important thing to do is to start, I don't see the point in waiting unnecessarily, I just need to see how far my discretionary income can go, I won't be able to use all of it to invest in bitcoin but then I don't even need to use all to invest, just a part of it and like you said 1/3 of it sounds nice, and my backup funds too.

Of course, you can sell whenever you want, yet over the years, there have been so many guys who got into bitcoin and even established a decent amount of bitcoin, yet they ended up selling way too much too soon, and sure no one really knows for sure at the time, and so it could take time for you to learn enough about bitcoin and why you are buying bitcoin to start to feel comfortable with a long-term commitment, and perhaps you even have to figure out aspects about yourself, but you surely do not need to know everything about yourself and/or about bitcoin from the start so long as you can at least figure out your cashflow management so that you are not overdoing it, and so if you, perhaps, start out investing 1/3 of your discretionary funds and put 1/3 into back up funds and discretionarily consume 1/3, then maybe you are bringing some balance and you can study the matter as you go and perhaps figure out if you have changes in your perspective after further and further looking into bitcoin, ideas about your cashflow and your other 9 individual factors.

I think one big thing i understand from long term bitcoin investors is that success is about how good you manage yourself not even how much you buy.
As you advised earlier, starting little with 1/3 and buying consistently with  time is more sustainable than trying to predict and time the market, the main focus should be discipline, patience and it's also important to avoid making decisions with emotions in the market.

[Hardyrobust]

It seems that the only way for bitcoin investment to have any chance at success is if it's done for the long term, it's going to be a very long journey but I think the most important thing to do is to start, I don't see the point in waiting unnecessarily, I just need to see how far my discretionary income can go, I won't be able to use all of it to invest in bitcoin but then I don't even need to use all to invest, just a part of it and like you said 1/3 of it sounds nice, and my backup funds too.

As long as you’re able to figure out your discretionary income and it is enough to purchase even the smallest unit of sats(bitcoin), then you can start your ongoing accumulation process. You don’t need very big amounts before you can buy bitcoin and even if you have plenty discretionary income, you don’t need to use everything to buy bitcoin if it’s not within your budget; just do what it easy for you and aligns well with your financial circumstances. Prioritize having emergency funds; it’s importance cannot be overstated because it is what will help you to be able to hold your bitcoin well and you will not be under pressure to spend from it to take care of unexpected expenses or situations.

Regardless of the amount of discretionary income a person has it's still very important for them to accumulate with what they can tolerate, alot of people think that their discretionary income is meant only for accumulating bitcoin and to some extent this won't be a wrong thing to do if a person has already set of their backup funds but if they haven't then it's not smart to go all in into bitcoin investment with all of their discretionary income, even some people who already have their backup funds ready still won't be aggressive enough to invest in bitcoin with all of their discretionary income, people have discretionary spending that even though they are not a part of their basic needs are still important to them, this varies from individual to individual so when a person uses all of their discretionary income to buy bitcoin they become unable to do these other things.

It will be considered over aggressive if an investor decides to used all there discretionary income for accumulating bitcoin.  An investor should not put all there discretionary income in bitcoin to avoid putting themselves into tight corner. An investor can decide to be aggressive by using a certain percentage of there discretionary for buying bitcoin. An investor should only invest a percentage of there discretionary income.

[Dzwaafu11]

To be successful in investing in Bitcoin, it is very important to first achieve the right knowledge because without the right knowledge, it is not possible for an investor to achieve success. Along with achieve the right knowledge, consistency is very important. If there is no consistency in investment, then success cannot be achieved, so you should buy Bitcoin consistently with a long-term plan with prudent money and do not be disappointed by the instability of the market. You should wait patiently for a good time with confidence, as a result of which long-term profits can be expected. We must remember that it is never possible to achieve success by investing in Bitcoin long-term investment or short-term plans, so success can be achieved buy Bitcoin with a long-term plan with confidence and patiently waiting for the right time.

Knowledge is of the most inportant thing when someone want to investement in bitcoin,  because without the knowldge there is high possiibily that such investor will sell that Bitcoin at loss. Because he don't really know how to handle the market movement and he will think any small rise is  time to sell.

which is not how bitcoin investmeng need to be as an knowledgeable person who is ready to invest you need to do a planning for a long time. so you can see that any bitcoin investor who want invest will actually plan for a long time.

[L E G E N D A R Y]

Some people think it's a get rich quick scheme and once that expectation isn't met they dub it a scam and start spreading this misunderstood perspective like it's the real deal, if they had understood from the start that investing in bitcoin doesn't bring immediate profits then they would be better placed as investors, some don't even know to limit their investment to just their discretionary income and this still banks on them thinking they will be reaping profits very quickly so they are willing to invest outside their discretionary income out of their greed to get as much profit as they can in that short period of time.

This is pretty much why I don’t like it when people address bitcoin as crypto, because this is often where the big misconception starts. Some folks have this understanding of crypto as some asset or commodity where people just put in their money and expect some quick profits, and that’s why that’s mostly how they approach all of them shitcoins, so the problem starts when they begin to approach Bitcoin the same way, and when they don’t get the expected result, they begin to see it as a scam, but they fail to understand that the problem was never from Bitcoin itself but their mindset and approach towards Bitcoin.

[PhilosopherKing]

Of course, you can sell whenever you want, yet over the years, there have been so many guys who got into bitcoin and even established a decent amount of bitcoin, yet they ended up selling way too much too soon, and sure no one really knows for sure at the time, and so it could take time for you to learn enough about bitcoin and why you are buying bitcoin to start to feel comfortable with a long-term commitment, and perhaps you even have to figure out aspects about yourself, but you surely do not need to know everything about yourself and/or about bitcoin from the start so long as you can at least figure out your cashflow management so that you are not overdoing it, and so if you, perhaps, start out investing 1/3 of your discretionary funds and put 1/3 into back up funds and discretionarily consume 1/3, then maybe you are bringing some balance and you can study the matter as you go and perhaps figure out if you have changes in your perspective after further and further looking into bitcoin, ideas about your cashflow and your other 9 individual factors.

When investing, there is time for everything. It is wrong when person start to be selling when their are supposed to be ongoingly accumulating and building their BTc stash.

If after accumulating to a point and the person feel that he has reach his investment horizons then he could go ahead to sell some and reallocate it back inside bitcoin. I like that your idea that person can start with 1/3 of discritionary.

It is a solid idea because at time person can still be finding it hard to get discritionary income and when they later get they may want to use some part for other things like saving emergency funds and for consumption, so if they share their discretionary income into different portions, they can now use them appropriately.

[Ummeettaa]

The first mistake your friend made was, his aim and intention of investing in Bitcoin for the sake of making fast money ignoring the facts that Bitcoin investment supposed be have been made with the aim of a long time investment that increases it value with time not instantly. Someone can only be successful in Bitcoin investment when he/she is patient, persistent and not investing for the purpose of making fast money.

Another mistake is for an investor to always be panicking, listening to news seen in social media, videos or being influenced by another person or investor.

For an investor not to able to control his/her feelings and behaviour when investment is done, following his instincts and putting fear on him/herself is also not an attribute of a good investor and the investment can likely no be successful.

An investor also needs to put it at back of his/her mind not to expect all investment being done to always be a success and always have a backup plans for any investment done.

[The Founding Titan]

Some people think it's a get rich quick scheme and once that expectation isn't met they dub it a scam and start spreading this misunderstood perspective like it's the real deal, if they had understood from the start that investing in bitcoin doesn't bring immediate profits then they would be better placed as investors, some don't even know to limit their investment to just their discretionary income and this still banks on them thinking they will be reaping profits very quickly so they are willing to invest outside their discretionary income out of their greed to get as much profit as they can in that short period of time.

This is pretty much why I don’t like it when people address bitcoin as crypto, because this is often where the big misconception starts. Some folks have this understanding of crypto as some asset or commodity where people just put in their money and expect some quick profits, and that’s why that’s mostly how they approach all of them shitcoins, so the problem starts when they begin to approach Bitcoin the same way, and when they don’t get the expected result, they begin to see it as a scam, but they fail to understand that the problem was never from Bitcoin itself but their mindset and approach towards Bitcoin.

The moment a person starts to see bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme they are already setting themselves up for their own disappointment and you are right, the crypto distinction is very important for people to know, they assume that because they've seen shitcoins that shot up in value over night due to extremely high and unsustainable volatility that bitcoin works the same way, sure bitcoin is volatile but just not the way they think it is.

[ZeroVinsonN]

It seems that the only way for bitcoin investment to have any chance at success is if it's done for the long term, it's going to be a very long journey but I think the most important thing to do is to start, I don't see the point in waiting unnecessarily, I just need to see how far my discretionary income can go, I won't be able to use all of it to invest in bitcoin but then I don't even need to use all to invest, just a part of it and like you said 1/3 of it sounds nice, and my backup funds too.

As long as you’re able to figure out your discretionary income and it is enough to purchase even the smallest unit of sats(bitcoin), then you can start your ongoing accumulation process. You don’t need very big amounts before you can buy bitcoin and even if you have plenty discretionary income, you don’t need to use everything to buy bitcoin if it’s not within your budget; just do what it easy for you and aligns well with your financial circumstances. Prioritize having emergency funds; it’s importance cannot be overstated because it is what will help you to be able to hold your bitcoin well and you will not be under pressure to spend from it to take care of unexpected expenses or situations.

Regardless of the amount of discretionary income a person has it's still very important for them to accumulate with what they can tolerate, alot of people think that their discretionary income is meant only for accumulating bitcoin and to some extent this won't be a wrong thing to do if a person has already set of their backup funds but if they haven't then it's not smart to go all in into bitcoin investment with all of their discretionary income, even some people who already have their backup funds ready still won't be aggressive enough to invest in bitcoin with all of their discretionary income, people have discretionary spending that even though they are not a part of their basic needs are still important to them, this varies from individual to individual so when a person uses all of their discretionary income to buy bitcoin they become unable to do these other things.

It will be considered over aggressive if an investor decides to used all there discretionary income for accumulating bitcoin.  An investor should not put all there discretionary income in bitcoin to avoid putting themselves into tight corner. An investor can decide to be aggressive by using a certain percentage of there discretionary for buying bitcoin. An investor should only invest a percentage of there discretionary income.

Which is why i said they should invest only with what they can tolerate, most people think that the only purpose of their discretionary income is to buy bitcoin and that's why you will see them talking about using all of their discretionary income for bitcoin investment, a bitcoin investor isn't competing with anyone on who's going to accumulate more, anyone who is doing something like this should really reconsider their life's choices because when they crash they will only have themselves to blames.

[samadam007]

In investment my believe is that investing is not really define only by assets you buy, but your reaction toward it after purchasing it, two people can purchase same asset together with long term mindset, yet one build wealth via discipline and patience while other turn it into speculation, to manage your finances and risk is so important, but behave is what allows you to stick to that plan during period of volatility.

I get your point, but I think it better to mention Bitcoin instead of you just using the word "investment"…. That is what the thread discussion is all about. Different investment works in their own different ways , so you using a general term can make the message unclear and incomplete
In Bitcoin, discipline is important but it's not the only thing that matters. Having a long term plan too, managing risks and consistently accumulating BTC are very important.All of them work together, especially during volatile periods

[Son Of Blockchain (SOB)]

Of course, you can sell whenever you want, yet over the years, there have been so many guys who got into bitcoin and even established a decent amount of bitcoin, yet they ended up selling way too much too soon, and sure no one really knows for sure at the time, and so it could take time for you to learn enough about bitcoin and why you are buying bitcoin to start to feel comfortable with a long-term commitment, and perhaps you even have to figure out aspects about yourself, but you surely do not need to know everything about yourself and/or about bitcoin from the start so long as you can at least figure out your cashflow management so that you are not overdoing it, and so if you, perhaps, start out investing 1/3 of your discretionary funds and put 1/3 into back up funds and discretionarily consume 1/3, then maybe you are bringing some balance and you can study the matter as you go and perhaps figure out if you have changes in your perspective after further and further looking into bitcoin, ideas about your cashflow and your other 9 individual factors.

You guys shouldn't misunderstand JayJuanGee and decude to sell at lose because he said you can sell whenever you want. What he meant was that everyone is responsible for their actions afterall it's your coin and your lose to suffer but in the right sense, it's not nice to sell too early, except the person is a trader.
 I guess some of those early birds who got a decent amount didn't fully understand when or when not to sell, some might not have the vision that Bitcoin would be this successful so they sold out of ignorance. We might be a bit later than the early birds but the information we have currently on Bitcoin investment is what many of them wish they had which puts us in a better position to  be successful in our investment than some of those early investors.

[GoldBitcoin112]

Year 2023. I started investing in Bitcoin. The market has fluctuated many times until now. However, I have always had a long-term goal. Although I had to sell once due to circumstances, but I started investing again.

However, a few weeks after my investment, a close friend of mine also started investing. He also talked about long-term investment. Our goals were similar. However, even though the goals were the same, our behavior was not the same over time, and this is where the difference between investment and gambling was created.

He start take profits when price increased. After doing this a few times, he started monitoring the market regularly and analyzing the opinions of YouTube and Telegram. At one point, he started making decisions with the market fluctuations. Sometimes he would buy out of FOMO and sometimes he would sell out of panic. In this way, he would make profits at times and sometimes he would lose.

 Even when I warned him about such behavior, he  misunderstand me that maybe I did not want to let him make a profit.
However, at one point, after significant financial loss, he realized his mistake. The problem was in his behavior.  He had the ability to continue investing well in the long term and even though he started investing with this intention, due to his inability to control his behavior, the investment turned into a gamble. 

Do you think that mental and behavioral control are similar important with financial management, risk management  in investing?

✨

Actually your friend was taking risk and he didn't know about risk management and he was trading instant of investing that is what he was doing he was trading and it was said countless time that  trading is 100% gambling so why would an investor trade at first when he knows that he is investing in a long time investment, so to answer to your question it is not important because in this case newbies are actually learning from from this mistake and it is quite unfortunate that' an investor who planned for a long time investment turn otherwise to start treading this is not a good practice this investor is greedy that is why he keep losing instant of having profits he was losing completely so in addiction this is not a good practice to anyone who wants to invest in Bitcoin.