Quantum threats and legacy (abandoned) wallet addresses

[dracocephalum]

We are eventually approaching a point that we must confront this issue. I think Ethereum is using a more centralized, extreme approach to "solve" this e.g. locking old accounts, allow blockchain rollback when issue happens. But as you can see, these are all against the spirit of Bitcoin.

While on the technical side it shouldn't be too difficult for us to have new types of wallet addresses that are quantum resistant, and migrate our funds to these new address types, legacy wallet addresses that have been abandoned wouldn't be able to migrate on their own.

Therefore, it seems inevitable that these addresses would be eventually hacked. If that's the case, rather than locking those addresses which is against the spirit of Bitcoin, we could:

- Create an "ethical" alliance with top quantum tech companies, publicly.

- Having an agreement with the alliance members such that when they have hacked any legacy addresses, they transfer the funds to an invalid address (burning the coins).

This way, for those who are refusing to join the alliance or to agree with our terms, they will be publicly known. For those who have accepted to join the alliance, it might also be a good advertisement for them.

Of course, we can't rule out that any of them would be doing things at the back of us, but at least, we tried.

Thoughts?

[NotATether]

We are eventually approaching a point that we must confront this issue. I think Ethereum is using a more centralized, extreme approach to "solve" this e.g. locking old accounts, allow blockchain rollback when issue happens. But as you can see, these are all against the spirit of Bitcoin.

What? That's crazy! I don't want to use a blockchain where they can lock my account when I didn't do anything wrong. How is that different from using an exchange like Binance? Or Tether USD?

While on the technical side it shouldn't be too difficult for us to have new types of wallet addresses that are quantum resistant, and migrate our funds to these new address types, legacy wallet addresses that have been abandoned wouldn't be able to migrate on their own.

So just leave them that way. Abandoned addresses should stay abandoned without any locking mechanisms. This primarily only affects old P2PK addresses anyway, not even P2PKH where only the address hash is seen. The early Bitcoin developers had incredible foresight.

[Satofan44]

- Create an "ethical" alliance with top quantum tech companies, publicly.

Unless this alliance has all of the top and leading companies onboard it is completely useless, a single member outside of this alliance can do whatever they want. Now tell me, why would these companies which often have nothing to do with Bitcoin, want to do this?

- Having an agreement with the alliance members such that when they have hacked any legacy addresses, they transfer the funds to an invalid address (burning the coins).

This can be done, but the alliance members would have to rush to do this before anyone else is able to do it. Who is willing to burn so much money and who is willing to burn so value in discovered coins? Depending on the timing of when this happens we could be speaking about $100 000 000 000 or more dollars just for 1 million coins. Most people don't even want to donate a few bucks regularly, but you want to ask some people to essentially donate more than a hundred billion USD?  

This way, for those who are refusing to join the alliance or to agree with our terms, they will be publicly known.

There will be zero consequences for this.

Of course, we can't rule out that any of them would be doing things at the back of us, but at least, we tried.

There is nothing wrong with trying, and this remains a possibility. It all depends on who gets to these coins first and what their motivations are.

What? That's crazy! I don't want to use a blockchain where they can lock my account when I didn't do anything wrong. How is that different from using an exchange like Binance? Or Tether USD?

The whole point of the account-based system is not the technological superiority to the UTXO-based system (it is not superior at all), it is the ability to provide a foundation for doing protocol-level single-address freezes and reversals. So yes, they can do this in Ethereum and they have already done a rollback in the early days and yes most altcoins can also do this.

While on the technical side it shouldn't be too difficult for us to have new types of wallet addresses that are quantum resistant, and migrate our funds to these new address types, legacy wallet addresses that have been abandoned wouldn't be able to migrate on their own.

So just leave them that way. Abandoned addresses should stay abandoned without any locking mechanisms. This primarily only affects old P2PK addresses anyway, not even P2PKH where only the address hash is seen. The early Bitcoin developers had incredible foresight.

Any solutions that involve someone else, in this case specifically referring to the part "wouldn't be able to migrate on their own", is centralized and corrupt. Absolutely it should not be done. If some people want to do it, then they should place me as the supreme overlord of this process.  

[skylerclooney]

We are eventually approaching a point that we must confront this issue. I think Ethereum is using a more centralized, extreme approach to "solve" this e.g. locking old accounts, allow blockchain rollback when issue happens. But as you can see, these are all against the spirit of Bitcoin.

While on the technical side it shouldn't be too difficult for us to have new types of wallet addresses that are quantum resistant, and migrate our funds to these new address types, legacy wallet addresses that have been abandoned wouldn't be able to migrate on their own.

Therefore, it seems inevitable that these addresses would be eventually hacked. If that's the case, rather than locking those addresses which is against the spirit of Bitcoin, we could:

- Create an "ethical" alliance with top quantum tech companies, publicly.

- Having an agreement with the alliance members such that when they have hacked any legacy addresses, they transfer the funds to an invalid address (burning the Cool Games coins).

This way, for those who are refusing to join the alliance or to agree with our terms, they will be publicly known. For those who have accepted to join the alliance, it might also be a good advertisement for them.

Of course, we can't rule out that any of them would be doing things at the back of us, but at least, we tried.

Thoughts?

Trusting an ethical quantum alliance contradicts Bitcoin’s permissionless, adversarial model and would be unenforceable in practice. The Bitcoin-consistent approach is to add quantum-resistant addresses, encourage migration, and accept that abandoned coins are an unavoidable form of entropy.

[goldphysicalbitcoin]

Even if those forgotten Bitcoin wallets are cracked by quantum computers in the future, wouldn't that just be a new form of mining, without affecting the total supply of Bitcoin, like gold found on a sunken ship...?

[FortuneFollower]

Even if those forgotten Bitcoin wallets are cracked by quantum computers in the future, wouldn't that just be a new form of mining, without affecting the total supply of Bitcoin, like gold found on a sunken ship...?

By the time it will happen, there will be much bigger fishes to fry than said wallets with quantums.

[zasad@]

https://www.techspot.com/news/109964-google-claims-quantum-breakthrough-willow-chip-runs-algorithm.html
Google claims quantum breakthrough as Willow chip runs algorithm 13,000× faster than supercomputers
"Pushing quantum computing into practical territory
Michel H. Devoret, a Yale physicist who shared the 2025 Nobel Prize in Physics for research that laid the foundation for quantum computing, helped lead the experiment. He and his colleagues at Google's Quantum AI Lab in Goleta announced this week that their quantum processor, powered by a superconducting chip called Willow, successfully executed a new algorithm known as Quantum Echoes.
The results, published in Nature, showed the machine performing certain computations 13,000 times faster than the world's most powerful supercomputers."

I've seen research showing that this chip has already helped solve complex scientific problems. This chip isn't enough to crack modern encryption, but that could change in 10 years.

[hero_the_bossman]

^ And now imagine how many years would be needed for it to become available for the masses to use quantums..

[Satofan44]

Trusting an ethical quantum alliance contradicts Bitcoin’s permissionless, adversarial model and would be unenforceable in practice.

Wrong, it does not do no such thing. The alliance is independent of Bitcoin and has no relation to its protocol. Actually, trying to prevent others from building their own alliances on or outside the protocol would go against the ideals that Bitcoin was founded on. Ironic, isn't it?  

The Bitcoin-consistent approach is to add quantum-resistant addresses, encourage migration, and accept that abandoned coins are an unavoidable form of entropy.

None of this is related to the proposal, you didn't even fully read the thread before you shitposted.

Even if those forgotten Bitcoin wallets are cracked by quantum computers in the future, wouldn't that just be a new form of mining, without affecting the total supply of Bitcoin, like gold found on a sunken ship...?

By the time it will happen, there will be much bigger fishes to fry than said wallets with quantums.

It can be considered another form of mining, but unfortunately this type of mining does not bring any benefit to the Bitcoin network. I know that we would prefer it to be otherwise, but it simply doesn't do anything for us in these terms. I don't think there is much we can do with this fact without confiscating coins (to reintroduce them as real mining supply or something similar) and thereby we would destroy everything that Bitcoin stands for.

https://www.techspot.com/news/109964-google-claims-quantum-breakthrough-willow-chip-runs-algorithm.html
Google claims quantum breakthrough as Willow chip runs algorithm 13,000× faster than supercomputers
"Pushing quantum computing into practical territory
Michel H. Devoret, a Yale physicist who shared the 2025 Nobel Prize in Physics for research that laid the foundation for quantum computing, helped lead the experiment. He and his colleagues at Google's Quantum AI Lab in Goleta announced this week that their quantum processor, powered by a superconducting chip called Willow, successfully executed a new algorithm known as Quantum Echoes.
The results, published in Nature, showed the machine performing certain computations 13,000 times faster than the world's most powerful supercomputers."

I've seen research showing that this chip has already helped solve complex scientific problems. This chip isn't enough to crack modern encryption, but that could change in 10 years.

The chip didn't do anything significant, stop writing misinformation you 3rd world lowlife imbecile. These are topics that go way beyond your comprehension and intellect, and you should stay in other places where you can shitpost while hidden in the masses. Reading headlines and posting links to things of which you understand nothing is classic shitposting behavior here, you are not better than the average snake oil peddler.

^ And now imagine how many years would be needed for it to become available for the masses to use quantums..

Nobody knows anything or has any timelines for any of this, and whoever claims otherwise is a charlatan or an idiot. It could be 5 years away from now and it could also be 500 years away from now. The average person here is extremely dumb, that is why they buy any kind of propaganda by various entities even if it is the most basic type. Nobody who has a strong incentive for this to be delivered as soon as possible should be consulted about these matters, that should be plainly obvious even if many dumb people don't understand that. If my whole financial future is invested in building quantum computers, what would I as a biased and shady top-researcher say? That it is not going to happen within this century?  Quantum peddlers are not any better than AI or shitcoin peddlers.