Debt not real

[Agathamay]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

So what's your point here? because what you said is obvious and everybody knows about it. The actual monetary system is a continious system of non-stopping debts. The story had started longtime ago when human thought to migrate from coins to paper money. Without this development, central banks hadn't to be existed at first place with the simple role is to manage the operation of general debt. Paper money is the perfect way for governors to scam their citizens.

the last part really got my attention really hard and yes the government scams it's citizen mostly through paper money and from my point of view, it think paper money is the easier to steal without so much traces and that's  what the government has been doing over time and that's also why they don't feel comfortable accepting other form of money because they are not yet ready to forfeit what they might of looted

op  please you should make your points obvious and straight so you can get the actual discussion you desire

[0x000369]

op you got it half right

fractional reserve is a total scam banks create money from nothing and call it debt

usa's 38 tril is mostly hot air backed by nothing but threats from the fed

but try not paying your loan and see how real it gets lol

they'll rekt your life with fees and seizures

that's the fiat game designed to keep us poor

bitcoin hodl is the way out no more fake money printer go brrr

@pooya87 yeah that movie shows the bs but real life is worse banks own everything

[o48o]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

Bank reserves (in US), need to be even lower now thanks to Trump, so it's all play money until harsh reality and panic hits and bank runs start.

But what do you even mean by "real", or "actual" money? It's all promised wealth, even the value of the bills you cash out from ATM are just based on agreement. Mechanisms of it having "real" value can stand less and less daylight when safeguards are being dismantled.

[Yucky]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

I wouldnt say ''debt is not real''.....
Yes banks can accumulate money with loans, which is not air but real debt thats backed by laws, assets and taxes. The 1-9$ rule im pretty sure thats outdated, and US debt is not just 10% real cash.
Its mostly bonds, people actually bought. So yes debt is real, mostly based on trust in the system.

[Nathrixxx]

Don't go into depth if possible, try to avoid it because it enslaves, not only that it's also deprives you the freedom and privacy you may have, being in depth is not good because it does not even benefit us in the first place, we may think collecting loan is part of what aid to a quick relief from any hardship conditions we find ourselves, but considering the latter-end, it does more of bad than good for us at the end.

[Salahmu]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

Op I have read twice to get a point from this but you have not actually made me to understand what you want us to no about debt that we have not seen from the normal debt people took. If you have not taking a loan or got some money borrowed you can't pay or go into debts on anybody because you weren't owing, there is no loan a bank would give they will not get an interest from you to pay them even if they gave you 10 dollars you would be required to give them there interest when paying, except they have some certain way they gave non interest loan to people but I haven't actually seen banks that does that.

[Davidvictorson]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

Dude, you have to calm down and reread your posts before you hit send. You are writing for the public and not in your personal diary. So, to ensure you have a message you want to pass or stimulate for discussion ensure that it is clear enough rather than leaving us guessing what you mean.

[viljy]

J. P. Morgan once said that gold is money, and everything else is debt (not literally, but that's the meaning). So there is no "real" money in this government debt at all, because after the abolition of the gold standard, all the money is "not real". However, for these debts, the population of the United States ate and drank quite realistically. However, it is clear to everyone that this debt can never be repaid.

[barbara44]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

Can you explain better? I have against how the government makes fiat to be like scam and I do not like inflation, but I do not condemn that debt is real because they are actually real.

If you think debt is not real, go and borrow $1000 and pay back just 10 to 15% of it which is $100 to $150 and let us see why you said that debt is not real.

I don't think that's what he meant by saying that. One can't possibly think that the money you borrow and have to repay isn't real because you get real money, so you have to pay it back, obviously, and then you will also have to pay back a percentage of that as interest because the entity or individual have given you their money so that you can get your work done at that time, and they will surely take some service charges for it. So, I don't know in what sense OP has said that debt is not real, because it surely is, it is just that the amount you take is not the amount you are going to give back, it will be a higher amount than that.

A fake debt could be a debt that is put on someone by force, or maybe forced interests on a small loan, but this doesn't happen, because there could be legal consequences if a firm or a company, or even a bank, tries to put illegal or irregular interests on a loan that has been given to a customer. So this concept of fake debts is actually out of my understanding and OP definitely needs to explain what he is trying to say and prove with his thread because we are unable to comprehend his points on this matter.

[maydna]

Debt is real. If you don't pay the loan, the debt collector will chasing and forcing to pay in full. I don't know that is what happens but if you have a debt, you will need to pay. If you don't want to gets into trouble, you don't have take a loan.

Taking a loan needs to be careful and a right calculation how using the money and how to pay the debt. If you don't have a plan to the money, better not to take a loan.

[Bitcoin Smith]

Money aka the fiat isn't even 1% real, they just print a paper and said it has value and we are still trusting it.

And that is how banks make money, they are not providing a service rather doing business, you give them 1 dollar and they will give 3% interest but when you take 1 dollar as loan then they will charge you 10 to 40% as interest depends on loan type.

[Coyster]

Money aka the fiat isn't even 1% real, they just print a paper and said it has value and we are still trusting it.

I know the money printers are always at work printing money and pumping it into the system, but that does not make the fiat in your hand "fake", of course it is "real". You can definitely spend it as you wish. The only thing that happens is that due to excess printing of money, the fiat in your pocket is less valuable as it loses its purchasing power, but it is very much real.

If you don't have a plan to the money, better not to take a loan.

Unless it is a no-collateral loan, if you take a loan and you do not pay, your creditors would force a sale of your collateral and recover their money plus the interest accrued.

[Bitcoin Smith]

Money aka the fiat isn't even 1% real, they just print a paper and said it has value and we are still trusting it.

I know the money printers are always at work printing money and pumping it into the system, but that does not make the fiat in your hand "fake", of course it is "real". You can definitely spend it as you wish.

I am not saying I can't use a bill, but I am saying it is entirely built on trust with no intrinsic value to consider it as money. Bitcoin is money, fiat is money, any commodity can be used as money and even paper too but a small paper that says it holds $100 value is not holding the equivalent value for real. If someone doesn't want to accept that as money and it brings a domino effect then imagine money with no value at all.

[Cryptomultiplier]

Money aka the fiat isn't even 1% real, they just print a paper and said it has value and we are still trusting it.

I know the money printers are always at work printing money and pumping it into the system, but that does not make the fiat in your hand "fake", of course it is "real". You can definitely spend it as you wish.

I am not saying I can't use a bill, but I am saying it is entirely built on trust with no intrinsic value to consider it as money. Bitcoin is money, fiat is money, any commodity can be used as money and even paper too but a small paper that says it holds $100 value is not holding the equivalent value for real. If someone doesn't want to accept that as money and it brings a domino effect then imagine money with no value at all.

The money you spend is real of course and that's why it is called a legal tender which is quite difficult to fake. It's not just my kind of paper, it's a special paper.

Back to the question of if debt is real or not, of course, debt is real even though money was created out of nowhere to give out as debt, the banking system or lender obviously opens an account entry for the debt and it is the job of the debtor to fulfill the repayment of the debt and interest on the money borrowed to them or face some major consequences that may be really inflicting.

[Coyster]

I am not saying I can't use a bill, but I am saying it is entirely built on trust with no intrinsic value to consider it as money. Bitcoin is money, fiat is money, any commodity can be used as money and even paper too but a small paper that says it holds $100 value is not holding the equivalent value for real. If someone doesn't want to accept that as money and it brings a domino effect then imagine money with no value at all.

Okay, i get what you are saying now, you initially said fiat is not "real" and that is the point i disagreed with. You are correct that fiat has no intrinsic value and its value comes from trust in the government that issues it. And since the government makes the laws and decrees of the land, fiat (being a legal tender) would continually be accepted as a medium of exchange, and would be valuable if the issuing government has a stable and viable economy.

[Bitcoin Smith]

~
The money you spend is real of course and that's why it is called a legal tender which is quite difficult to fake. It's not just my kind of paper, it's a special paper.

Back to the question of if debt is real or not, of course, debt is real even though money was created out of nowhere to give out as debt, the banking system or lender obviously opens an account entry for the debt and it is the job of the debtor to fulfill the repayment of the debt and interest on the money borrowed to them or face some major consequences that may be really inflicting.

Legal doesn't make it as real this is where people get mostly confused. I am not saying it is not real too but my point is the money we have doesn't hold the equivalent amount other than just a promise, either it is a special paper still it is not holding $100 value in a $100 bill.

Debt helps the banks to create money, I  mean they give real paper money and users need to pay them back no matter what, but this process helps the banks to keep generating unlimited amount of profits but with very gradual rate.

[iv4n]

op you got it half right

fractional reserve is a total scam banks create money from nothing and call it debt

usa's 38 tril is mostly hot air backed by nothing but threats from the fed

but try not paying your loan and see how real it gets lol

they'll rekt your life with fees and seizures

that's the fiat game designed to keep us poor

bitcoin hodl is the way out no more fake money printer go brrr

@pooya87 yeah that movie shows the bs but real life is worse banks own everything

"And they tell us not to be so violent while they drop bombs on another continent."

The whole game is designed, and it's rigged... and it's not like we can do much about it. Even hodling Bitcoins is a wayout for some, but it's not really solving anything. It can't solve anything when the majority of people are still against it... the same people who don't know what fiat is, but they are against BTC. The shit around is piling up, so I guess we will have to wait to see what tomorrow has for us.

[Odohu]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

I would have loved when you add more explanation to this so we can understand where you are headed to. Sincerely, this post is just like what anyone can sit someone are say without substance, just like me telling you that there are on twenty people in China and the rest of the people you see are their images. For the records, before a country is said to be owing debt, they have spend more money than they actually have and they do thus by creating Treasury Bills and anyone who buys this becomes a creditor to the government. The debt US is owing is mostly to their citizens followed by Japan as their biggest creditor.

[Agbamoni]

This is the reason why we have Bitcoin as a financial freedom. A system that is transparent and can not be manipulated by any government or individual because everything is outrightly transparent on the blockchain. This is why the government would never want to run their system through blockchain as many of them could be caught because we know that out of 99% percent of money they are borrowing only 20% are being used for the said purpose of borrowing that particular money, especially country like Nigeria they aren't always transparent with the money they are borrowing.

Bitcoin is an open ledger, everyone can see the transaction, what came in, and what left the address. The records cannot be tampered because no one controls the system. Most countries claim they have a large amount of debt, golds in reserves, bitcoin in reserves, all are figures with claims. If the debt log is not shared to the public how will the citizen know if they are truthful or not. No Bitcoin address was made public, the video footage of the golds in reserve. What if the governments are just lying about everything?

[SUPERSAIAN]

Debt not real since there never borrowed real actual money on banks only small % of real money but the rest is just debt of air created.
For every 1$ banks can lend out 9$.
So if usa debt are now 38tril.... then only 10%-15% are real money.

So what's your point here? because what you said is obvious and everybody knows about it. The actual monetary system is a continious system of non-stopping debts. The story had started longtime ago when human thought to migrate from coins to paper money. Without this development, central banks hadn't to be existed at first place with the simple role is to manage the operation of general debt. Paper money is the perfect way for governors to scam their citizens.

This is the reason why we have Bitcoin as a financial freedom. A system that is transparent and can not be manipulated by any government or individual because everything is outrightly transparent on the blockchain. This is why the government would never want to run their system through blockchain as many of them could be caught because we know that out of 99% percent of money they are borrowing only 20% are being used for the said purpose of borrowing that particular money, especially country like Nigeria they aren't always transparent with the money they are borrowing.

Bitcoin is a robust form of money that emerged precisely to address these problems and realities. Money in circulation only arose from borrowing, and there's no end to it; everyone is aware of this, which is why people are trying to escape cash and invest in other assets. This is also why inflation is higher than ever in every country.

The more supply there is, the more money loses value; even the most stable fiat currency, the dollar, is experiencing insane inflation.