Are we trying to solve an unsolvable problem?

[defau1tuser0]

Bitcoin which was meant to be decentralized, most people are using it through centralized mediums.

As most people(I think) have bought bitcoin through centralized institutions i.e. Coinbase, Binance, etc.

This current fall of bitcoin's price is like a great filter. Filtering those who joined us for quick big gains not for what Bitcoin stands for. Now that it's easier for such people to move on to gambling market for quick money, they have dropped out of bitcoin.

Not all problems can be solved by just better programming, The issue we are trying to fix is SOCIAL one at it's root. While we are trying to make a better tool(decentralized, scares... digital currency) to help us solve it, a weapon is only as strong as it's Wielder.

For me what makes me wanna join Bitcoin(and I hope I can do my best) is that it is a very new concept for people and change takes time(Though they do show how internet took off in such short period of time while bitcoin still has to proof what it has promised). The hope that things will change, people will change and one day when they need such tool they don't have to create one from scratch.

In mean time let's do our best to improve it. Issues like how to make mining sustainable? especially since it's constantly halving, and I'm not just talking about after year 2140 but TODAY as some of the mining data centers are shifting to being data centers for AI,
Making it quantum resistance if need be, etc.

Let's see what future has store for us.

[noorman0]

In mean time let's do our best to improve it. Issues like how to make mining sustainable?

As long as there's demand for Bitcoin and energy is cheap worldwide, there will always be miners. I even think that one day mining becomes completely unprofitable; the hash rate drops, the difficulty drops, then mining becomes profitable again for those who remain, and so on. Lol.

That's not a bug, it's a feature.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

The next time you create a thread, it's best to focus on one main point, otherwise the conversation becomes too heterogeneous. You talk about centralisation, price and mining.

Regarding the point that I believe would be the most important, no one has been forced at gunpoint to use CEX and other centralised entities, but I don't see that as an unsolvable problem. Rather, for many people, Bitcoin offers a solution to a problem that many people don't really care about. What has attracted the masses to Bitcoin is the price, the possibility of getting rich with it.

[FortuneFollower]

You can just buy BTC if you don't want to mine.

BTW, your nickname is.. interesting choice, to say the least.

[Dave1]

Not all problems can be solved by just better programming, The issue we are trying to fix is SOCIAL one at it's root. While we are trying to make a better tool(decentralized, scares... digital currency) to help us solve it, a weapon is only as strong as it's Wielder.

Who says Bitcoin was created by Satoshi to fix or solve social problem? It's not, it's just one options for people to used. He didn't forced us or anything to have his creation be the untapped tool like a magic bean that will grow and then solve all of mankind's problem.

So your argument is flaw in the beginning and it seems that you didn't understand what Bitcoin is. I urge you to go back and read the white paper again.

https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

[FortuneFollower]

Not all problems can be solved by just better programming, The issue we are trying to fix is SOCIAL one at it's root. While we are trying to make a better tool(decentralized, scares... digital currency) to help us solve it, a weapon is only as strong as it's Wielder.

Who says Bitcoin was created by Satoshi to fix or solve social problem? It's not, it's just one options for people to used. He didn't forced us or anything to have his creation be the untapped tool like a magic bean that will grow and then solve all of mankind's problem.

So your argument is flaw in the beginning and it seems that you didn't understand what Bitcoin is. I urge you to go back and read the white paper again.

https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

It's about giving an alternative to those who want to use it.

[Hazink]

Regarding the point that I believe would be the most important, no one has been forced at gunpoint to use CEX and other centralised entities, but I don't see that as an unsolvable problem. Rather, for many people, Bitcoin offers a solution to a problem that many people don't really care about. What has attracted the masses to Bitcoin is the price, the possibility of getting rich with it.

Price has attracted the masses to Bitcoin, not security, and not freedom, which is why most of them don't care about privacy and use a centralized exchange to buy and hold their coins. It's just a personal problem for those who choose to entrust their coins with the exchange and not a general problem like the OP is trying to make it look.
But if KYC policies keep on increasing and the government keeps pushing for stricter regulation, it might come to a point where buying bitcoin using other sources might appear to be a crime, as it might be labeled as someone who has something to hide.

[Z-tight]

What exactly do you think should be solved? You have not clearly stated it in the op, or maybe i missed it, did i? If you are referring solely to people using centralized platforms, then that is not a flaw, neither is it something that needs solving. What BTC users decide to do with their coins has nothing to do with BTC in itself. Their keys, their coins.

This current fall of bitcoin's price is like a great filter. Filtering those who joined us for quick big gains not for what Bitcoin stands for. Now that it's easier for such people to move on to gambling market for quick money, they have dropped out of bitcoin.

Weak hands would always be a part of the network, there is nothing you or i can do about it. There would be people who come for quick gains and sell as soon as the price drops or there is news of fud. The good thing is that with time weak hands get smaller, so yeah.

[Somegory]

In mean time let's do our best to improve it. Issues like how to make mining sustainable?

As long as there's demand for Bitcoin and energy is cheap worldwide, there will always be miners. I even think that one day mining becomes completely unprofitable; the hash rate drops, the difficulty drops, then mining becomes profitable again for those who remain, and so on. Lol.

That's not a bug, it's a feature.

We can not ignore the fact that Bitcoin mining is no longer meant for average people, it's costly to run Bitcoin mining right now, even if you have cheap energy Asic miners aren't cheap.The simplest thing that average people can do this days is to buy Bitcoin, 1 BTC consists of millions satoshis, they don't have to buying 1 BTC, all they need is small part of 1 BTC and they are good.

Bitcoin mining is not easy, it is something that group of people come together using their funds to start, gone are those days that average people can use graphics cards or CPUs to mine Bitcoin.

For mining difficulty to drop significantly to the extent that mining becomes profitable again? That's definitely going to be one of a kind event, something that can make people and miners give up on Bitcoin totally for a while, I wonder what that could be.

[noorman0]

The simplest thing that average people can do this days is to buy Bitcoin, 1 BTC consists of millions satoshis, they don't have to buying 1 BTC, all they need is small part of 1 BTC and they are good.

The OP's point is to understand the correct steps to acquire bitcoin while maintaining its decentralization. In reality, some people don't really want to use decentralized services because they're too complicated, expensive, and high-risk. Furthermore, more people are investing in them for volatility, not benefits.

[Potato Chips]

In reality, these centralized platforms are the easiest way to onboard folks as oppose to decentralized ones that typically has a learning curve. Though without the constant regulatory pressure and crackdowns, perhaps they could've had friendlier terms and/or more privacy friendly CEX would show up.

TBH, what people do with their bitcoins, whether it's for quick gains or whatnot is out of our control. We will always have different types of folks in the community. I wouldn't worry about it. Feels like a waste of energy.

[KiaKia]

That one thing bout Bitcoin is that it can be used anyhow you want, I don't go around correcting people to use or buy Bitcoin through centralised exchanges or not, not anymore.

If you care about decentralisation services Bitcoin got you covered, all you have to do is use it the right way, don't pass any KYC verification or submit any information when you want to buy your Bitcoin.

Since I've been around this crypto thing I have come to accept that many people don't really need decentralisation that bItcoin offers, they are fine using and surrounding everything to the hands of centralised organisation and authority.

I have learnt to live with this.

[SquirrelJulietGarden]

That one thing bout Bitcoin is that it can be used anyhow you want, I don't go around correcting people to use or buy Bitcoin through centralised exchanges or not, not anymore.

If you care about decentralisation services Bitcoin got you covered, all you have to do is use it the right way, don't pass any KYC verification or submit any information when you want to buy your Bitcoin.

Since I've been around this crypto thing I have come to accept that many people don't really need decentralisation that bItcoin offers, they are fine using and surrounding everything to the hands of centralised organisation and authority.

The thread Reminder: do not keep your money in online accounts was pinned since late of 2022, some years ago and there are even other reminders in previous and years after 2022. People if are careful will easily do their searching and find necessary resources for learning and improving their practice with Bitcoin, exchanges, transactions, KYC and privacy.

Many people don't mind about Bitcoin white paper and simply buy it with speculation on getting profit later easily. People don't care about privacy, where to buy & sell bitcoin, what will happen with documents they submitted for KYC. You're right, most people don't mind about these things that are important but it needs time for people to recognize its importance.

[Asuspawer09]

There are always people that is just buying people for profit, centralized platform wasn't really a thing that is going to destroy Bitcoin or something in fact it help a lot of investors for convinient we dont really need to store everything on a centralized platform in fact it is always recommended to store your crypto into decentralized wallet so that it is safe especially for long term investments. Not everyone is going to take advantage of Bitcoin features, and not everyone is buying Bitcoin because of that features, some are going to sell for sure, depending on their strategy.

I guess mining was just going to balance it's market price, I mean being a miner is a huge investment as well, market price is also increasing and dumping at the same time, so miners are also taking a huge risk when they are mining, we can't blame them for going for a more profitable approach if there are other options, but I guess there will be a limited miners since I think it is always going to equalize because of the demand, profitability etc.

[TheUltraElite]

Well someone has to sell the coins for you to buy them. For that CEXes exist and there are a lot of things bad about them, but do we have much more choices? You buy stocks at a stock exchange through a broker, do you have much alternative to the broker?

The price will jump up and down because of demand and supply. The main thing is that the cost of 1BTC is always 1BTC, but since people are buying against fiat, the price will continue moving. For learning how to deal with it, read the old charts and see from what level 10years back Bitcoin has reached to today.

Mining on the other hand is a niche sector and because the system is such that number of miners is inversely proportional to profit, more miners will join when old ones stop mining.

[Joy_learns_crypto]

Not all problems can be solved by just better programming, The issue we are trying to fix is SOCIAL one at it's root. While we are trying to make a better tool(decentralized, scares... digital currency) to help us solve it, a weapon is only as strong as it's Wielder.

Who says Bitcoin was created by Satoshi to fix or solve social problem? It's not, it's just one options for people to used. He didn't forced us or anything to have his creation be the untapped tool like a magic bean that will grow and then solve all of mankind's problem.

So your argument is flaw in the beginning and it seems that you didn't understand what Bitcoin is. I urge you to go back and read the white paper again.

https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

Satoshi may not even care about social problem and bitcoin wasn’t created to fix it, social problem is a problem to be fix by leaders the society elected and the lives living in that society.
The understanding is that bitcoin can fix mankind problems no matter where the problem is or what is creating the problem.

[Odogwu-Blockchain]

In reality, these centralized platforms are the easiest way to onboard folks as oppose to decentralized ones that typically has a learning curve. Though without the constant regulatory pressure and crackdowns, perhaps they could've had friendlier terms and/or more privacy friendly CEX would show up.

OP needs to know where and how to buy Bitcoin on a cex than just getting confused and complicated on the whole process of doing it, nothing more to be dazzling about purchasing elsewhere, OP is pretty new into the game as I think, maybe he could be needing the help now.

TBH, what people do with their bitcoins, whether it's for quick gains or whatnot is out of our control. We will always have different types of folks in the community. I wouldn't worry about it. Feels like a waste of energy.

Yeah, it's nobody's business how others spend their Bitcoin, and it's nobody's business how you spend yours also, different bitcoiners, different viewpoint of usage. I also find it disrespectful if a homie ask me what I do with my stored Bitcoin.

[nakamura12]

In mean time let's do our best to improve it. Issues like how to make mining sustainable?

As long as there's demand for Bitcoin and energy is cheap worldwide, there will always be miners. I even think that one day mining becomes completely unprofitable; the hash rate drops, the difficulty drops, then mining becomes profitable again for those who remain, and so on. Lol.

That's not a bug, it's a feature.

This is true. If there's a lot cheaper energy then there will be miners who will mine Bitcoin. Even others are finding ways to have other source of energy like solar energy to provide for the mining rig. It's impossible that it won't happen as we all know solar energy already exist and many people have been using it because of the cost of paying for the electricity bill and even find a way to make use of the heat generated by the mining tools. That leaves the demand and as you have said that as long as there's demand then it's there's always a miner.

[PrivacyG]

You started talking about Decentralization and ended up talking about Sustainability.

I believe all these issues can be split in to a different group of people each.  Decentralization does not work for most people because most people do not want Financial Freedom.  They want Money.  The group of people who actually use Bitcoin as they should are only a handful of people.  And at the end of the day, I do not think any of us expected that the entire World suddenly thought Decentralization is a great idea.  Bitcoin is a revolutionary Asset but it requires that people do not have a sleeping brain.  It requires that people want to fight and look for their own Freedom.

The Sustainability issue comes very often from people who do not even care about Bitcoin.  Bitcoin could be banned tomorrow and they would be happy.  How green Mining is does not matter as long as the only Free Currency in the World is alive in the same way environment getting destroyed by nukes and bombs does not seem to matter during a conflict as long as the end goal is reached.

And after all, what is the problem you are talking about?  Most of the old problems have been solved.  A problem appears, Bitcoin is Open Source and can be adapted to the issue and it always showed it can adapt really well.  We now have Sustainability, Quantum and people choosing Centralized over Decentralized.  The first two are much, MUCH easier to solve than the last one because Sustainability requires that people go 'greener', Quantum requires that Bitcoin adapts but Decentralization requires that people change the way they think and see.  Good luck changing that.

[Ambatman]

Are we trying to solve an unsolvable problem?

Sorry what's the unsolvable problem?

The issue we are trying to fix is SOCIAL one at it's root. While we are trying to make a better tool(decentralized, scares... digital currency) to help us solve it, a weapon is only as strong as it's Wielder.

If a gun is used for decoration doesn't stop it from being a weapon that can kill
People using Bitcoin through centralised means doesn't make Bitcoin any less decentralized
Some people are in for the control
Some for profit
Some as a store of value
Some as money.

The understanding is that bitcoin can fix mankind problems no matter where the problem is or what is creating the problem.

Uhhh I don't recall Bitcoin being that powerful
It's just money like money. Not an elixir.