Protect your right to P2P

[EluguHcman]

Don't let anyone bully you into not buying or selling your crypto P2P.

If only the exchanges control the onramps and offramps, then the governments around the world can do whatever they want to your access and put your coins in a chokehold, when you try to spend them.

They have already failed at stopping Bitcoin itself. Now they are trying to make it harder for people to buy and sell it.

Because they know their currencies are failing and people are running away.

If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

Be a visionary.

Embrace BTC.

If you must have self custodian right to your Bitcoin, stay off from the exchange or any regulatory affiliating platforms because, that is a territory Centralized under governments control.

While trading or exchanging of our Bitcoins to the fiats may put users in such a high jump of loosing custody to their Bitcoins, then I must say that I fear if there is ever going to be a safe means to process such transaction without loosing right to your Privacy and even while alternating to used the Decentralized exchange or having someone offline as physical P2P, there you would be standing on more risks because trust in the system is not guaranteed.
The truth is that... To find its flexibility of individual rights with your Bitcoin, then you must use the Bitcoin core network.

Of course buying and selling of your crypto will also be a big problem against privacy because you are therefore either making yourself vulnerable for physical threats or KYC.
This situations is also a means the governments think they can go against Bitcoin since it can not be controlled by any authority.

[PrivacyG]

If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

Be a visionary.

I will be a visionary and say that I am not entirely sure that they understand what consequences their new laws may cause.  I imagine things like Atomic Swaps, Decentralized Exchanges et cetera would have appeared much later if most Governments showed support for Bitcoin or at least left it alone rather than trying to cunningly crack down on it while pretending we are friends.

Of course I will try to step back more the more they try to take my rights or Privacy away.  They do not understand that Hardware Wallets can be 'Do It Your self' too or that you can make an Airgapped Wallet out of an old computer at any time with out even giving them a single hint that you are about to have one.  If they get you to a point where you are afraid of being the only owner of an Asset because the Government says they should have a hand on it too, it may be time to re consider things.

[Churchillvv]

The basic thing they are trying so hard to gain now is full control but if we get to do bitcoin and having not to do with their platforms that they can control it’s the real freedom which they do not want from us. P2P will be slowly pushed to the wall that it might seem to be something difficult for people that they will just want the simple way which will end up giving the opportunity for them to get the control but we must be fully self custodians of our bitcoins that the only way.

[Mrbluntzy]

As a bitcoiner that understand the meaning of decentralization, what we owe our self is to maintain our privacy while using Bitcoin, there's no standard p2p decentralized exchange in my country that's why I even had to buy Bitcoin from centralized exchange but I don't hold my Bitcoin in any of those exchange, so even if they are going to freeze my account any day because of non compliance to their policies, I won't have my coins in their exchange when that will happen. Although there a DEx on this forum which I am would be using for buying Bitcoin, since it's a simple p2p service here, it will help me skip the rules with CEX unless I'm just converting my coin to fiat.

[taufik123]

-snip-
Of course I will try to step back more the more they try to take my rights or Privacy away.  They do not understand that Hardware Wallets can be 'Do It Your self' too or that you can make an Airgapped Wallet out of an old computer at any time with out even giving them a single hint that you are about to have one.  If they get you to a point where you are afraid of being the only owner of an Asset because the Government says they should have a hand on it too, it may be time to re consider things.

They all want to control without exception, In the end when the regulations are really tightened, everything will go to the place where they should and have provided.

The government makes us afraid of the rules for using crypto and using P2P, P2P services outside the centralized market are illegal and not in accordance with the rules that have been made,
so it could be an indication that I have violated the rules and my account can be blocked.

In my country I am still bound by the rules of the central bank and in the end it will all come to an end and there will have to be the intervention of the central bank.
There is no complete privacy, everything only applies at the beginning but not in the end when you want to take advantage and use it with the local currency.

[Donneski]

~snip~
If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

Be a visionary.

Embrace BTC.

I have written many times in the past "be careful what you wish for because you might just get it", all in the context of some people thinking that Bitcoin will only succeed if it is accepted by governments and various crypto messiahs. People want their government to say "Bitcoin is good," their bank to put the BTC logo on their door, and to have a crypto president.

So how can you expect someone to protect their right to something if they don't even understand it or simply don't care?

I understand your concern about government's participation in crypto and how it' posses more advantages than disadvantages especially the level threat it has against decentralisation which happens to be one of the major problems in global finance that Satoshi wanted to solve but don't you think completely rejecting government participation might be unrealistic?

Without any form of regulation, we'll likely end up with more scams, less trust and fewer new users willing to come in because many will not trust a system that's not regulated in any form. If you ask me, I think real issue is finding a balance where governments don’t choke access especially to things like P2P while still maintaining some level of order.

[AmoreJaz]

The basic thing they are trying so hard to gain now is full control but if we get to do bitcoin and having not to do with their platforms that they can control it’s the real freedom which they do not want from us. P2P will be slowly pushed to the wall that it might seem to be something difficult for people that they will just want the simple way which will end up giving the opportunity for them to get the control but we must be fully self custodians of our bitcoins that the only way.

I don't think anyone can have the full control of this market as it is decentralized. Also, the worry about p2p is the reputation of the other party. This is why a lot are now patronizing the centralized trading platforms.

[nelson4lov]

What the crypto space needs urgently is a practical way to trade crypto for cash peer-to-peer. Right now, there exist some exchanges like Bisq or Peach which have the option to trade peer-to-peer for physical cash, but there's barely any liquidity there globally, let alone in your own country.

What we need is a smart solution that requires no banking institution to settle fiat and bitcoin trades. I cannot think of how this kind of trade could be settled securely, but it would allow the next levels of independence.

Tbh, I don't think it's possible to create a "smart solution"  that would serve as the trustless bridge to the physical world. It’s impossible to have a decentralized reputation layer at the protocol level because there is no way to verify if a suitcase of cash actually changed hands in the real world. Any 'reputation' system we build is just a layer of digital trust sitting on top of a physical uncertainty.

Trust and centralization work together because you need a 'referee' for the physical part of the trade. Until we can settle the fiat leg as trustlessly as the BTC leg, P2P (Bitcoin <> Cash) will always have a ceiling.

[o48o]

Don't let anyone bully you into not buying or selling your crypto P2P.

If only the exchanges control the onramps and offramps, then the governments around the world can do whatever they want to your access and put your coins in a chokehold, when you try to spend them.

They have already failed at stopping Bitcoin itself. Now they are trying to make it harder for people to buy and sell it.

Because they know their currencies are failing and people are running away.

If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

Be a visionary.

Embrace BTC.

Sure, i agree with you on some level and i have done p2p trade in the past, but when you deal with cash, or physical cash versus bitcoin, then their interest to force regulations to deal with that depends where you live and how much cash you are dealing with.

Because these new regulations aren't just about crypto, but crypto is just covered in them to fit these regulations. It's mainly about need of the proof for the origin of your money, so it's harder to launder it.

It will become harder to use huge amounts of cash in same way it's harder to use huge amounts of crypto. I don't think they want to waste resources for small amounts, so those regulations won't make it us needlessly hard to buy groceries for example.

[NotATether]

Sure, i agree with you on some level and i have done p2p trade in the past, but when you deal with cash, or physical cash versus bitcoin, then their interest to force regulations to deal with that depends where you live and how much cash you are dealing with.

Please read the replies!

It's not just cash... this is basically bank transfer to BTC and vice versa.

Or mobile money to BTC.

Of course most people aren't receiving actual cash nowadays, but for many, selling their coins on the P2P market remains a lifeline for them.

[Fivestar4everMVP]

Don't let anyone bully you into not buying or selling your crypto P2P.

If only the exchanges control the onramps and offramps, then the governments around the world can do whatever they want to your access and put your coins in a chokehold, when you try to spend them.

They have already failed at stopping Bitcoin itself. Now they are trying to make it harder for people to buy and sell it.

Because they know their currencies are failing and people are running away.

If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

Be a visionary.

Embrace BTC.

I completely agree, we really need to make peer to peer trading of bitcoin more popular than running to all this centralized exchanges to trade without selfs, I perfectly understand when some one says the trust is really an issue in this this type of trading since one person must have to send funds first before the other person reciprocates, but trust can be built, especially when we have a forum like this  which is nothing but a very good advantage to us all..

Trading bitcoin peer to peer locally was and Is Satoshi's true vision for bitcoin, because this was the only way bitcoin would have succeeded in becoming a true asset for payment for goods and services without any government interference, but unfortunately, centralized exchanges came, p2p scams came, traders had no choice but to run to exchanges since that was the only place they believed they can trade safely without getting scammed, but I think it's time for us to rewrite this narrative..

[suzanne5223]

They have already failed at stopping Bitcoin itself. Now they are trying to make it harder for people to buy and sell it.

The sad scenario is that some people are yet to understand they are making it hard for people to buy and sell BTC, while some who have the privilege to buy BTC indulge in going for the cage created by institutional investors to buy shitoin by going for BTC ETFs with the belief that it BTC they invested in.

Because they know their currencies are failing and people are running away.

People will definitely seek an alternative, but the funny thing is that they know the cause of the loss of purchasing power of fiat currency, and they still choose to practice the 2% inflation.
Whenever i think about this concept, what always comes to my mind is that they are using this concept to steal from us every year.

If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

Be a visionary.

Embrace BTC.

I know this is just the beginning, and this is why i never liked the idea of institutional investors coming into the BTC market and Bitcoin going mainstream when others are happy about the good things that will follow it, but choose not to focus on the disadvantages and what the government always does to every setting they participate in.
The last time i read about hardware wallet regulation was days ago, and what i read is that the amendment is yet to push through in Kentucky, where the bill was proposed by the Senate.

[PX-Z]

If you've seen any of the proposed laws for hardware wallet regulation, that is just the beginning. Their objective is to seize more money for personal gain.

I haven't heard anything like this with proposed bills, but i guess this is from EU where anything from financial related activity should be monitored by them. Of course, this kind of policy is expected on authoritarian governments so they are exempted and people should be leave those country.

[Darker45]

Unfortunately, I'm afraid the mainstream perception of P2P right now is highly skewed. It's far from the P2P that Satoshi must have meant.

You talk of the dangers of exchanges having control of the ramps as if they're exactly the ones being carefully avoided by opting for P2P. In reality, however, it's precisely these exchanges that offer P2P. There's the irony, but that's the truth. The largest P2P volumes belong to Binance, Bybit, and other top centralized exchanges.

Public understanding is going down this road. Is Binance P2P truly P2P? It's subject for debate. In the same manner that non-KYC platforms could demand KYC, non-custodial swaps could ask you to send funds to a wallet out of your control, privacy-focused services are also screening coins for AML scores, and so forth. What used to be unacceptable is beginning to be accepted.

[m2017]

I have written many times in the past "be careful what you wish for because you might just get it", all in the context of some people thinking that Bitcoin will only succeed if it is accepted by governments and various crypto messiahs. People want their government to say "Bitcoin is good," their bank to put the BTC logo on their door, and to have a crypto president.

Bitcoin requires neither approval nor consent from the regulator. Bitcoin exists as an independent system, and a decentralized system certainly doesn't need crypto-capital or crypto-presidents.

Free State of Bitcoin

So how can you expect someone to protect their right to something if they don't even understand it or simply don't care?

They're simply willing to hand over their management rights to third parties. The right to financial freedom isn't a privilege, but a responsibility that not everyone is willing to accept and defend. People prefer to trust the government and their employer to manage their lives, banks to manage their finances, and their spouse to manage their family life. Being the head of their own life isn't for everyone.

[crwth]

In legal terms, there should be things that should be allowed and defined in terms of P2P. It's not all about rejecting regulation, but about being firm in P2P that it is legal and allowed for use. There should be certain thresholds so that you can protect yourself and understand what is not allowed as well.

I believe we are still in the grey area in most P2P jurisdictions. Whether we like it or not, there would still be regulation with this, so better to have enforcement criteria that are acceptable.

[X-ray]

In legal terms, there should be things that should be allowed and defined in terms of P2P. It's not all about rejecting regulation, but about being firm in P2P that it is legal and allowed for use. There should be certain thresholds so that you can protect yourself and understand what is not allowed as well.

I believe we are still in the grey area in most P2P jurisdictions. Whether we like it or not, there would still be regulation with this, so better to have enforcement criteria that are acceptable.

Legal is the biggest roadblock for P2P. It's always a problem when transacting with people we don't know about and suddenly getting accused of money laundering and all. It is the main reason why P2P can't really thrive.

If there is anyway that can help legitimize P2P, making the legality a lot more clearer and not in a grey area, P2P would be booming and we don't even need an exchange anymore, but that is not the case for now.

[FinneysTrueVision]

I was not aware of any hardware wallet regulation, but after searching on Google I saw there was a stupid law they are trying to pass in Kentucky that would require a backdoor. This kind of absurdity is why we shouldn’t have politicians that are either too old and/or too incompetent to serve. Political leaders today are not even trying to do anything useful. It is all about how much money you can extract by abusing your power before eventually being replaced by somebody who is just as corrupt. They might try to sell these kinds of laws as consumer protection, but who is being protected if third parties have the ability to recover my seed and steal my funds?

[davis196]

Nobody has ever "bullied" me for using peer-to-peer crypto transactions and decentralized exchanges. OP, has anyone "bullied" you for doing P2P transactions? The governments are trying to stop Bitcoin growth and P2P transactions? Which governments are you talking about? Most big western countries are friendly(or at least neutral) towards Bitcoin and crypto in general. I know that this might change in the future, but right now there's no such thing as the governments forcing anyone to use centralized crypto exchanges. How do you plan to "protect your right to P2P"? Do you want to organize protests or sign a petition?

[Outhue]

Traders are the ones making Centralised exchanges performance to be better, sorry to say but right now there is no Dex that's suited for trading than those Centralised exchanges, because they have better tools and also better volumes, I have said something similar in 2021 that not until Dex can provide the same experience as Cex does, they will never take over.

Someone who wants to get stucked with P2P must be ready for the inconvenience that comes with using Dex, there is no deny that centralised exchanges are far more easier to use that many other, I will also like to ask where the P2Ps really at? The most popular ones are all from centralised exchanges whom already have all your information, you can't even use their P2P services without passing KYC verification first. I am rooting out for a more decentralised future but it's becoming pain in the ass so far.