Does bitcoin actually offer the freedom humanity strive ?

[ColdLava40]

I’ll like to here others view about freedom and if truly bitcoin offer such.

When you chose to use centralized systems, you chose to give up your freedom.

Bitcoin is the true definition of freedom but investors are shifting the whole concept. Still that doesn't make Bitcoin decentralized. Decentralization isn't something that can be taken out because people use cex systems.

If you choose to use centralized systems, you give up privacy, you give grant access of your money to these systems.

If anything happens in case of hack or scam, they may not be held accountable. You will not be able to blame them because they too are a victim.

[macson]

Some people simply don't care about the decentralization offered by Bitcoin. Their primary focus when they first learn about Bitcoin is profit, so they only care about the ease of trading, which CEXs offer. They don't prioritize self-custody or anything related to decentralization, and instead trust the CEXs to manage their assets, believing it's easy and secure.

However, despite this, Bitcoin still offers freedom to everyone. Whether you care about that or not is your own decision.

[lionheart78]

How you or anybody else decide to use BTC, does not change what it actually is, neither does it change the protocol. If Bob decides to use a centealized exchange to store their BTC, does it mean BTC does not offer freedom to those who store their coins in Electrum and store the backup safely in their home. I believe we have gone over these things one time too many.

Satoshi created a p2p electronic cash, and that's what BTC is. However, such a 'revolutionary' product cannot exist for a single use case. And since we are also talking about freedom, i believe it is right to allow people use BTC how they want to. I would never support the idea of trying to police people into a certain way of using BTC, all in the name of 'the main idea of Satoshi'.

Well, said, tying to police people of certain way of using BTC and telling that Bitcoin offers freedom is itself voiding the freedom Bitcoin is offering.  Anyway, Satoshi is a visionay, with a single aim of removing third-party financial institutions in a transaction, have pave ways to a lot of things, especially the freedom from the chain of these intermediaries.

Thus, the aim is simple, but the outcome is so huge that it becomes revolutionary.

[suzanne5223]

This thought has been on my mind for a while now, if the bitcoin is actually offering the freedom humanity strive! As that was the bases of creation of the bitcoin it self.

The freedom aspect of BTC is still intact, and BTC still delivers the freedom humanity strives for. However, it still depends on how we all define the freedom that comes with BTC.
The basis of Bitcoin creation is not only freedom, but it also has a basis of not trusting a third party, which we could say removes the interference of the middleman.

Have we adopted the wrong way of using bitcoin and shy away from the main idea of satoshi?

Yes, in some ways, but it happened because everyone prefers Bitcoin creation and use to be different.

Are we going about the use of bitcoin the way satoshi would have appreciate more if he were to be here with us?

With the huge number of BTC users, it is impossible for us all to use BTC the way Satoshi would appreciate, and I believe Satoshi understands that when an innovation gains mainstream attention, it will be used in diverse ways.

Is there any freedom as in the use of centralized  network when we can actually use a decentralized network?

Based on my understanding, there's no freedom in it, but to some people, there's freedom in it since they didn't use a centralized platform as storage. It all comes to how we understand/see freedom.

Whats freedom if holding could be freeze on centralized exchange and also be taxed as capital gain ?

I don't support the idea of not paying tax, but there's no freedom in holding BTC on a centralized platform.

[gforce16one]

if you had 1000+ bitcoin does it offer you freedom?
answer yourself.

[EL MOHA]

Q) Which side are you on now, do you desire and attempt to be truly free, or have you given up?
ps. I pretty much "gave up" a long time ago, but I do not recommend this for anyone else.

Why did you give up, the only clear cut reason someone could be forced to give up on freedom is giving up on bitcoin and that can be only enforced by the government and with bitcoin no matter how the government might have put out restrictions around it’s still doesn’t makes one stay away from bitcoin. Mind you using centralized exchanges can actually make one not have his total freedom with bitcoin if that’s what you meant by not been free then I will say that you can still take off your coins off third party platforms.

if you had 1000+ bitcoin does it offer you freedom?
answer yourself.

What do you mean by this because the number of bitcoin doesn’t changed the bitcoin protocol. So yes with any amount of bitcoin one still guarantees freedom if the protocol is used properly

[Churchillvv]

Reality is that bitcoin is not on the track or concept that we upheld it for, just like the you have mentioned, freedom is pure decentralization but bitcoin on its own is decentralized but using this days still have people using centralized system which is a deviant concept from its original ideology but however if one still want to uphold the characteristics of bitcoin to be decentralized and pure freedom then they have many tools out there to use but while using it the centralized system still friend to suffocate those means and tools so people can be dependent on centralized systems.

[Grease5000]

This thought has been on my mind for a while now, if the bitcoin is actually offering the freedom humanity strive! As that was the bases of creation of the bitcoin it self.
this has left a lot of questions on my mind which I’ll like to discuss on this thread.

- Have we adopted the wrong way of using bitcoin and shy away from the main idea of satoshi?

- Are we going about the use of bitcoin the way satoshi would have appreciate more if he were to be here with us?

- Is there any freedom as in the use of centralized  network when we can actually use a decentralized network?

- Whats freedom if holding could be freeze on centralized exchange and also be taxed as capital gain ?

- All this are making me think bitcoin isn’t still treated as it’s supposed to be because if was treated the proper way, all this challenge would not even be there.
In my opinion freedom has more to do than just being able to send funds from cross countries without the involvement of any banking institution.
I’ll like to here others view about freedom and if truly bitcoin offer such.

I get what you’re trying to get at, and I think the freedom idea is often misunderstood In my view, Bitcoin was designed to give people control over their value without permission, not to remove every form of structure around how it’s used.
The core idea from Satoshi wasn’t about avoiding responsibility like taxes or regulations, but about removing the need for trust in centralized control.

I don’t think we have misused Bitcoin as much as we’ve seen it grow in different directions some people use it for sovereignty, others treat it like an investment asset, and both realities now exist side by side Whether Satoshi would approve is hard to say, but the system is doing exactly what it was built to do operate without a central authority. How people interact with it is beyond that original design. True decentralization exists at the protocol level, but other access point like exchange are still control because of convenience, regulation, and user needs.

Freedom in Bitcoin isn’t about avoiding all rules it’s about having an alternative system where you can hold and transfer value without needing permission from a single gatekeeper. So for me, Bitcoin doesn’t eliminate structure it introduces choice. You can stay in centralized systems or move into self-custody, but the option itself is the real shift.

[Odusko]

You will be shocked by how many customers banks are going to have when they start offering crypto services, this I bet with anyone who doesn't believe it.

Even now in Binance, those p2p agents that are buying or selling bitcoin with millions are bank managers and senior rank staffs in the bank. I have encountered with two or 4 persons from the bank. I was expecting the decentralized marketplace in the cryptocurrency space most specifically bitcoin but that has been thrown away and centralized system has taken over everything. Bitcoin developers and non custodial wallets developers have to do more on this issue.

You mean that Bank allow their staff to now deal in cryptocurrency, binance was banned in my country for some times now, an the SEC have placed a watch list on that platform there was even a time that government asked binance o reveal the accounts of all citizens to enforcement officers, if you suddenly see people from Bank on cryptocurrency market place, you have to be very careful in dealing with them, some are set up together your account flagged or trading crypto.

[SamReomo]

Freedom as a word was never mentioned in the whitepaper directly but reading the whitepaper all indicates towards freedom. The words like permissionless, censorship resistance and all talks about decentralization all of them points to one thing which is freedom. So bitcoin was actually here for freedom, to actually liberate us from some centralized monetary system not to take over totally but to be an alternative.

Bitcoin was created so those who're not happy with the centralized system could choose it over the traditional centralized system that was set many years ago.

Bitcoin isn't property of a country or of centralized authorities, but as we know that in current times we can't buy Bitcoin with fiat without using a centralized exchange and that's something most of us know and yet we can't do anything.

One can buy Bitcoin using P2P decentralized system like BISQ but still there are a limited number of fiat/country option for users. We have many good instant exchanges that don't require any kind of KYC details. But, there's somehow involvement of centralized system in it nowadays and we can't ignore that.

[Onyeeze]

if you had 1000+ bitcoin does it offer you freedom?
answer yourself.

bitcoin does not offer a freedom, likewise other currencies they cannot give you a freedom, only thing is that bitcoin is a currency that depend on it own, and the most of the people who is investing in Bitcoin they are into it because it does not have a dot party so that does not mean that the Bitcoin will give you a freedom, another thing that you have to know is that the amount of Bitcoin the hold will you determine the benefit you will make if the prices increase so if the prices increase that does not mean that you will have a freedom through Bitcoin except that you are saying about investment freedom not all about last time freedom and which I know bitcoin cannot give to you

[ThemePen]

Although Satoshi Nakamoto intended that Bitcoin would be direct peer to peer payment system but much of it has since been locked up in centralized exchanges and ETFs, becoming like traditional banks and allowing governments to freeze funds or to fully track every transaction to collect taxes. I believe true Peace of Mind is that Bitcoin itself is not broken, but other vast majority of users have not chosen responsibility at cost of convenience of holding their own personal keys. When you do not have control of your own wallet, you are not truly using decentralized network, but you are merely holding corporate IOU and can have others control it. However, only few, who can afford to cease being part of centralized service and go as far as taking complete ownership of their own digital currency, can be truly free in Bitcoin.

[Bastketsrus]

If we look at the whitepaper, there is no way in it that discuss about freedom the humanity strive (whatever you are hinting).  It is about removing the intermediaries or third party institution in our transactions.  It is that, people who are so dedicated in promoting Bitcoin emphasis this so called freedom propaganda to propagate the use of Bitcoin, which is later accepted by many users of Bitcoin and is implanted to many new users.

If ever, these so called freedom is the result it is never been the written goal in the Bitcoin whitepaper.

Freedom as a word was never mentioned in the whitepaper directly but reading the whitepaper all indicates towards freedom. The words like permissionless, censorship resistance and all talks about decentralization all of them points to one thing which is freedom. So bitcoin was actually here for freedom, to actually liberate us from some centralized monetary system not to take over totally but to be an alternative.

On till today bitcoin has never change from this view, it depends on how you use bitcoin. Take for example it’s actually pseudonymous and at that you can decide to be anonymous or not, it’s not in place of bitcoin to dictate which one to be, same thing as using centralized exchanges or decentralized exchanges, bitcoin doesn’t enforces any thing.

It remains an alternative for anyone seeking freedom which isn’t offered in fiat currency

Yeah true, even if “freedom” isn’t directly said, that’s what Bitcoin is about in practice. It gives more control and choice, even in things like betting.

[UchihaSarada]

Although Satoshi Nakamoto intended that Bitcoin would be direct peer to peer payment system but much of it has since been locked up in centralized exchanges and ETFs, becoming like traditional banks and allowing governments to freeze funds or to fully track every transaction to collect taxes. I believe true Peace of Mind is that Bitcoin itself is not broken, but other vast majority of users have not chosen responsibility at cost of convenience of holding their own personal keys. When you do not have control of your own wallet, you are not truly using decentralized network, but you are merely holding corporate IOU and can have others control it. However, only few, who can afford to cease being part of centralized service and go as far as taking complete ownership of their own digital currency, can be truly free in Bitcoin.

It's multiple diversifying options for people to choose from and if they are fearful of traditional financial system and bank system as well as centralized governments, they will try to move away from such centralized systems. Clearly they will have to use and interact with centralized systems when necessary but they can minimize their practice and money stored on such risky centralized systems.

Risk exits, and they can not avoid risk completely but by only storing small and enough fund to spend on such dangerous centralized systems, if any fund freeze happens, they won't lose all money, all bitcoins they have because the main fund is stored in non custodial Bitcoin wallets.

[tygeade]

The harsh reality is that most people don't care about the freedom that Bitcoin provides, they are all behind money and profits, and no one cares about decentralization, freedom of having your own bitcoins kept in a non-custodial wallet where only you know about them and you can access them, most people nowadays don't even know what a non-custodial wallet is, because they have never learned much about Bitcoin and the tools used for it, and that is because people are here for the money, they don't care about the possible use cases of Bitcoin other than buying it low and selling it high, and they can wait for years for this to happen.

It is true that Bitcoin was never created to become an investment asset, the purpose behind it was different, but that purpose has been clouded now, because as soon as people started buying Bitcoin in the initial days, as more people got involved, they noticed a change in the price because the supply and demand mechanism, and since that day until now, Bitcoin has mostly been used only for investment purposes to make money. There are some people who are still interested in the other side, but that number is very small, and it's getting smaller day by day.

[lovesmayfamilis]

Where have you seen that all of humanity is striving for freedom? All I see is always two halves. One half strives to manage and monitor; the other half serves and obeys the laws. Everything that was invented when Bitcoin was created, namely the freedom that the OP is probably talking about now, so all of humanity is not striving for such freedom, but only some very small part of it. It is convenient for people to keep money in banks, while it is convenient for others to know and control everything. That is why bitcoin has those who are not ready to give up this control and let go of surveillance, because this will disrupt the entire management system. I do not believe that a consensus will ever be reached that satisfies everyone in relation to bitcoin, and for obvious reasons, people like those on this forum will often be outraged by unfair treatment of bitcoin.

[The Cryptovator]

- Have we adopted the wrong way of using bitcoin and shy away from the main idea of satoshi?

Then you have to know the goal of Bitcoin. Bitcoin was created to transfer money worldwide without third-party involvement, meaning decentralised. You should know Bitcoin has been used for cross-border payments without centralised help.

- Are we going about the use of bitcoin the way satoshi would have appreciate more if he were to be here with us?

We are using it already that way as stated above.

- Is there any freedom as in the use of centralized  network when we can actually use a decentralized network?

It's up to you how are you going to use it. By nature Bitcoin always decentralised.

- Whats freedom if holding could be freeze on centralized exchange and also be taxed as capital gain ?

Then don't use centralised exchange and don't store your funds there. If you want freedom then use non-custodial wallet, so one could trace you.

[Z_MBFM]

The concept of Bitcoin certainly gives people financial freedom. But if you use it in a way that it is not under your control, then you will definitely not get financial freedom. If you keep your Bitcoins in a centralized wallet, then it may not be financial freedom for you because for any reason they can freeze your funds and they will have all your information. And you will not have control over your Bitcoin. Just like if you keep your money in the bank, it is no longer under your complete control, if you keep Bitcoin on a centralized platform, it will be like your bank deposit. So in this case, you will not get freedom. But the concept of Bitcoin is completely decentralized and it certainly gives financial freedom to the user and freedom humanity strive.

[Peanutswar]

Based on my experience, it seems its really fulfilling its role. Imagine right now you dont need to get itchy with your head to send funds into another wallet without having a limitation of amount, having a fix high rates, and also tons of KYC needed just to transact. Also you can send funds directly even bought a services with the use of the Bitcoin right now. You dont need to rely on banks because they require you to limit with your money and you dont have full control of it; tons of questions before to get on hand. Having transparency with the blockchain is a must right now; imagine the governments can easily manipulate the records to deal with corruption, and with the use of the blockchain right now, it could be easily identified.

[Queen uloma]

Everything about bitcoin has been made complete through its network because it is decentralized and no any authority can influence anything regarding it, but the issue we have is about our individuality, where by not everyone has the full potential to understand how they can maximize every opportunity in Bitcoin adoption for their own stability and profitability, this is where we must learn how to engage bitcoin on relevant areas that will profit us, because the reason why it was introduced was to serve the purpose of an alternative.

You are very correct, that bitcoin is decentralized meaning, no government, banks or any one can control it, which it’s the major reason why bitcoin is still the strongest digital asset across the world. But the thought of you saying that the system is complete is not really correct because the system is still evolve and the market is unpredictable. Just as you said, the individual understanding is the main issue because it is not everyone that knows bitcoin or understands how it works, some people enter bitcoin investment because of hype not because they have knowledge of it. If you don’t understand what you are doing instead of you to make profit, you will eventually lose more. For me bitcoin doesn’t guarantee profitability due to how the price goes up and down ( volatility), people may lose more if they don’t have good strategy. Bitcoin is good, it gives freedom, but before you go into it you need to understand how it works before you can make good profit.