Iran, BTC, the digital dark age and why we're failing

[alani123]

China's population uses VPNs at a rate of about 1/3. Imagine that, among the total population including infants and old people, one in three persons uses a VPN. It's actually a popular culture that operates under wide tolerance from the state. I'm wondering if our case is going to be the same.

The internet is turning hella restrictive and surely there will be very Draconian measures for other sides of life too. Already we're seeing people in the west face criminal action, lose medical licenses etc for social media posts. Many countries are maybe already more Draconian than China. Probably including Germany and the UK.

By the way @d5000 I think you got it the opposite way than it is. The crowd didn't beg for age verification
 There was no popular movement. It was lobbied and the lobbies used the "think of the children" narrative to ease this on the public. The true reasons for age verification are more sinister. Aside of losing anonymity it's also the fact that ads targeting will be more personalized than ever. Already Google and meta were ripe with ads fraud to an extent that they had started losing traction but now they'll solve that problem by simply squashing our rights. Digital ID is the next to be implemented.

And frankly if bitcoin comes to threaten world capitalism the big heads have too much to lose to keep supporting this.
Like yes, maybe they won't come armed to your house for trading crypto P2P (yet) but also they are not going to be willing to provide you with cozy platforms to do it, supported by their investment.

Surely the BlackRock's of the west have their assets more intertwined with crypto now than ever. But to them losing 0.2% of their assets is nothing compared to the regime supporting them losing control of the world order. To them, investments in Raytheon, Palabtir, the overall military industrial complex, western oil are more important.

I think it's now a time to remain more vigilant than ever. If Iran's experiment is successful, we'll have a world power adversary using bitcoin very publicly to go against US interests. And we might see some rapid developments in that case. From delistings to even legislation banning trading of immutable crypto.

[knowngunman]

Now with Iran using bitcoin, who's to say that all the infrastructure around BTC we've come to rely on isn't going to be rug pulled from us?
Maybe it's too early. Or maybe we were too naive to not build more earlier.

But how authentic is this information? Is this claim verified? If yes I would like to read from the source please.

As far as I know, Iran reportedly launched a platform called Hormuz safe for ships transition in the street of Hormuz but it's not fully operational yet. We'll definitely know about it's operational status if anyone has ever use it since it's launched.

I think the issue of accepting BTC to settle payments on the street is just like a proposal yet. There's no report of any confirmed transactions yet on chain linking to that.

If this turn out to be true, then we have so many questions begging for answers.

[Smartprofit]

China's population uses VPNs at a rate of about 1/3. Imagine that, among the total population including infants and old people, one in three persons uses a VPN. It's actually a popular culture that operates under wide tolerance from the state. I'm wondering if our case is going to be the same.

The internet is turning hella restrictive and surely there will be very Draconian measures for other sides of life too. Already we're seeing people in the west face criminal action, lose medical licenses etc for social media posts. Many countries are maybe already more Draconian than China. Probably including Germany and the UK.

By the way @d5000 I think you got it the opposite way than it is. The crowd didn't beg for age verification
 There was no popular movement. It was lobbied and the lobbies used the "think of the children" narrative to ease this on the public. The true reasons for age verification are more sinister. Aside of losing anonymity it's also the fact that ads targeting will be more personalized than ever. Already Google and meta were ripe with ads fraud to an extent that they had started losing traction but now they'll solve that problem by simply squashing our rights. Digital ID is the next to be implemented.

And frankly if bitcoin comes to threaten world capitalism the big heads have too much to lose to keep supporting this.
Like yes, maybe they won't come armed to your house for trading crypto P2P (yet) but also they are not going to be willing to provide you with cozy platforms to do it, supported by their investment.

Surely the BlackRock's of the west have their assets more intertwined with crypto now than ever. But to them losing 0.2% of their assets is nothing compared to the regime supporting them losing control of the world order. To them, investments in Raytheon, Palabtir, the overall military industrial complex, western oil are more important.

I think it's now a time to remain more vigilant than ever. If Iran's experiment is successful, we'll have a world power adversary using bitcoin very publicly to go against US interests. And we might see some rapid developments in that case. From delistings to even legislation banning trading of immutable crypto.

In Russia, 80 percent of the population uses VPNs. Both children and the elderly know how to use them. Meanwhile, the government is actively combating these technologies. VPNs are blocked by both individual IP addresses and protocols. All internet providers (both mobile and landline) use specialized equipment to filter internet traffic. All Russian websites also take action against any user who accidentally accesses their site with a VPN enabled.

You're probably just used to perceiving your freedom and independence as immutable. But in reality, freedom and independence are values ​​we have to fight for every day. Bitcoin, Monero, and a free internet—that's what they want to steal from us. And there's a risk that people will end up in a digital concentration camp before they even realize the scale of this danger. Do you really think the government or BlackRock are interested in your freedom and independence? Of course not! They have their own interests.

And the situation around Iran, in my opinion, doesn't change anything.  The authorities will try to take away your rights and freedoms, and you will try to preserve them... Why would anyone take away your rights and freedoms? Why is this whole nightmare happening? Explaining it all would take a long time...

If you try to answer this question simply, the world has changed radically, technology has become dangerous and accessible, and capitalism is in deep crisis... 🤷

[Lucius]

Iran has been mining BTC for years and uses it to ease sanctions, so I don't see why there is panic now that some companies could pay in BTC for passage through that strait? Honestly, there's not much logic to it, because there are other much more private/anonymous cryptocurrencies that are much harder to track and block than BTC.

A situation in which Iranian BTC addresses are identified and blacklisted in that case is very likely, and considering the share of the US in mining operations, this would mean that any poll in the US could block such transactions.

Has there been a source on Iran mining BTC?

The likelihood of Iran using any other cryptocurrency for payment over passage is extremely unlikely though. XMR and other coins are extremely illiquid. A state actor can't sustain utilizing them without hurting their markets.

You have as many sources as you want (even official Iranian ones), and it was discussed on the forum.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5472016.0

Therefore, the question arises, why would a country that is at war with another country use a currency that is largely controlled by its adversary?

I'd go as far as reversing the question you pose.
Why would any administration in the US continue tolerating western enterprises providing infrastructure and liquidity for a payment tool their adversary is using openly? Especially if it's not a seizable asset.

The US benefits financially from mining BTC and trading it to a much greater extent than Iran does - and Bitcoin has completely centralized around the US, whether it's mining, trading, Saylor, BlackRock or various economic indicators from that country that affect the price of the same.

Iran may partially use Bitcoin (as it has done for years), but let no one fool themselves that they will completely switch everything to BTC transactions because decentralization is as much a curse as it is a blessing.

[Luzin]

BTC USD did well in the last few years but still we failed to protect the fundamentals.

Now with Iran using bitcoin, who's to say that all the infrastructure around BTC we've come to rely on isn't going to be rug pulled from us?
Maybe it's too early. Or maybe we were too naive to not build more earlier.

No one is able to control the fundamental direction of Bitcoin except a dominant world state institution that has control over global politics and economy. What do you want to protect? Let them proceed; Bitcoin is being tested to adjust to circumstances. The shift in direction is increasingly visible now as large ETFs accumulate, governments join in regulating, and centralized exchanges. Fundamentals always move together, they are the ones who make this industry move. Without them, we cannot take advantage of the instability triggered by news about fundamentals. IMO

[d5000]

By the way @d5000 I think you got it the opposite way than it is. The crowd didn't beg for age verification
 There was no popular movement. It was lobbied and the lobbies used the "think of the children" narrative to ease this on the public.

Unfortunately I'm not convinced about this. I say unfortunately because it is often very sad to see what a lot of people believe. And if you have governments or lobbyists to blame, it is easier to prevent anti-privacy measure because you can lobby against such changes. But if the masses beg for a restriction, it is very likely they will get what they want.

Even in this forum there are people who otherwise seem to be educated Bitcoiners, who have defended this kind of age restriction. Comment sections and social media are full of support. And also in personal conversations some people I do not suspect to fall easily for "lobbying" supported that idea, fortunately in some cases I was able to convince them that it is a bad idea.

Often it was like that people once they had read about the law in Australia, they instantly became fervent supporters to apply that also in their own home country. Anti-Technology sentiment in parts of the population ("kids should not have smartphones") also is probably one of the causes.

I think of course some entities may have lobbied for that, but I have not seen really massive campaigns from politicians or businesses. The closest was probably Emanuel Macron in France who rapidly jumped on the Australian train. But there was already huge support in the population for that measures as early as September 2024, when according to an Ipsos poll 80% of the French were supporting it.

[AmoreJaz]

BTC USD did well in the last few years but still we failed to protect the fundamentals.

Now with Iran using bitcoin, who's to say that all the infrastructure around BTC we've come to rely on isn't going to be rug pulled from us?
Maybe it's too early. Or maybe we were too naive to not build more earlier.

No one is able to control the fundamental direction of Bitcoin except a dominant world state institution that has control over global politics and economy. What do you want to protect? Let them proceed; Bitcoin is being tested to adjust to circumstances. The shift in direction is increasingly visible now as large ETFs accumulate, governments join in regulating, and centralized exchanges. Fundamentals always move together, they are the ones who make this industry move. Without them, we cannot take advantage of the instability triggered by news about fundamentals. IMO

I don't think any entity can really manipulate or dictate the direction of btc market. Even holders with large stash of btc can't do such manipulation. So I don't know if there will be future threat on this regard. It has been more than a decade and we've seen that no single entity can manipulate this market.