Moderator bribed to delete scam accusations against Winna

[Kazkaz27]

Holy shit! Now, that's an event!

- It's incredibly disappointing to see a moderator go rogue, but it's not unexpected for this to happen every once in a long while.

nah i think this wasn't just a moderation mistake; it was a failure of basic ethics. It almost feels like he clicked "Delete ethics" before clicking "Delete topic."

That's good one. Well, at least at top we have ethical person in charge — this must not change and of course Theymos himself must not go rogue.

Hmmmmm and who was it that recently cast doubt upon an OP and their winna.com scam accusation? — Oh yeah, Nutildah.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5588726.new#new

What's wrong with asking evidence to back the words said?

OP shared his story. Much like Nutildah always does. Funny thing is Nutildah can get away with throwing baseless accusations against others and not be questioned or torn down by “superiors”. — Everything is wrong with that.

[Rikafip]

If this keeps happening, who can we trust?

There's no reason to trust any mod by default and just because of his position.

Having said that, this is not a common thing on bitcointalk, mod getting removed from his position due bribery.

[libert19]

Hmmmmm and who was it that recently cast doubt upon an OP and their winna.com scam accusation? — Oh yeah, Nutildah.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5588726.new#new

What's wrong with asking evidence to back the words said?

OP shared his story. Much like Nutildah always does. Funny thing is Nutildah can get away with throwing baseless accusations against others and not be questioned or torn down by “superiors”. — Everything is wrong with that.

It's on people if they don't question Nutildah, don't it? Although, it certainly counts that if you are reputed personality as is the case with Nutildah, people may trust 'naturally' as (s)he has cultivated that trust.

[TryNinja]

Possibly, the ability of this to go undetected was exacerbated by the fact that the topics were deleted by means of moving them to the non-public "Trashcan" section, which isn't an action listed in the public modlog. I will probably change the modlog page to register such moves as deletions in the near future. (Though I'm not sure that anyone monitors the modlog page closely enough for such things to be noticed even then.)

Please add this to modlog. Anyone using my telegram bot would receive a notification about trashed topics, and it would be much easier to not miss such cases.

[mindrust]

Someone should make request to archive those thread to archive.org and archive.today. At very least, it will annoy whoever bribed this former moderator.

A now-removed moderator

His punishment only removed as moderator and a negative tag from you? IMO it's rather lenient.

The other options are:

a- ban him
b- flag him

He already got 6 or more neg trust ratings from DT and that's almost as good as a scam flag. That account is done for.

And banning him would force him to create another acc probably and that's not as good as it sounds because I'd rather have him post with that ruined acc instead giving him a reason to start fresh.

[Myleschetty]

If this keeps happening who can we trust?

Truth is that. We can only have trust in ourselves and hope Theymos will take appropriate action when a problem like this is brought to his attention, or he notices it.

Admin's job should be to enforce the rules, not to be a judge.

That's when something worthwhile is not included, but when there is, rules may be disregarded.

The truth of the accusation against a casino should be determined based on the community, DT member and evidence.

Scam Accusation threads should never be silently removed. If for some reason action has to be taken then a public placeholder should be left and the reason should be mentioned. Then everyone will know what happened.

Yes, and I think this problem will make every action in the accusation section be more noticed by the general public. However, local board moderators should be subject to some additional restrictions regarding post deletion.

[notocactus]

The other options are:

a- ban him
b- flag him

He already got 6 or more neg trust ratings from DT and that's almost as good as a scam flag. That account is done for.

And banning him would force him to create another acc probably and that's not as good as it sounds because I'd rather have him post with that ruined acc instead giving him a reason to start fresh.

I see no reasons to ban him and this forum does not have history to do that. Even very big scammers like Roger Ver, TradeFortress , pirateat40 were not banned. These users are in this thread Legendary profiles of bitcointalk.

Removing the moderator role, and tagging that account are enough.

It's quite a long time I did not see any post from sapta, likely after CM closed, he did not post too much.

[Sandra_hakeem]

what scummy thing to do from both parties, they have no fucking shame whatsoever.
in a way i'm glad this happened so everyone can see the underhanded tactics winna uses, they do everything but the right thing

That was exactly my first thought. Doesn't it cost more to maintain a low profile with a tainted name than it does to practically keep the name clean? It sounds both funny and dumb at the same time.

The perpetrator on the other hand has failed us. I have never thought to trust nobody, but if a MOD can't get a little benefit of doubt on certain issues, especially against scams, then maybe he, and a few more have misrepresented this forum in other shitty deals that we're yet to uncover.

[Mpamaegbu]

I believe this staff you mentioned is an agent for Winna and he was employed to do all he did for them to be protected in the forum.

It's highly disappointing that even those trusted can easily betray that trust and the privileges they enjoy in the forum. It's, indeed, a sad end for both that mod and the services they protected. No one can cover evil forever. It's just a matter of time before it gets exposed.

I took my time and went through the first link theymos shared. It was a bloody mess from bennettwinna and the casino he represents. It leaves a bad taste in the mouth and lack of confidence for gamblers using other casinos too.

[JeromeTash]

Winna did not instruct or authorize anyone to pay for the removal of forum posts or scam accusations.

It is awkward that someone else outside winna wanted the scam accusations removed. Was it an influencer? The marketing guys? A well-wisher? Like they dipped their hands into the pockets and bribed the moderator without winna's involvement?

In each of the referenced cases, we have publicly responded with our side of the situation and explained why we disagree with the version of events presented in the respective accusation. We therefore had no reason to seek the removal of these discussions.

You actually just responded to a fraction of them, and in recent times you had even stopped responding to anything that came up even when you would come online.


The former moderator should also open up and say, 'Who exactly contacted whom? ' Though I have a feeling it's the moderator who initially contacted them for a deal to remove the posts.

[GiftedMAN]

Humans will always be human; to err is human.

But don't sell your worth and conscience for a peanut.

The recent discovery by Theymos should serve as an eye opener to all here that humans will always be humans no matter how much you think you have known them they will one day show  the other side of them which is "humans are greedy".


Some people no longer have conscience because they sold it before they discovered the meaning and in this case you can only still wonder if he wasn't paid enough to have accepted bribe but the answer is nothing is too much.

To everyone who is disappointed right now, I think we should be more careful not to trust people so much because anyone who is caught is the criminal but those who are yet to be caught are all innocent.

[libert19]

Humans will always be human; to err is human.

But don't sell your worth and conscience for a peanut.

The recent discovery by Theymos should serve as an eye opener to all here that humans will always be humans no matter how much you think you have known them they will one day show  the other side of them which is "humans are greedy".

Some people no longer have conscience because they sold it before they discovered the meaning and in this case you can only still wonder if he wasn't paid enough to have accepted bribe but the answer is nothing is too much.

I heard this line somewhere and it's been etched into my brain ever since, it goes something like, 'Everybody can be bought, if somebody says they can't be, it just means, they haven't been offered enough' — I don't know if others agree, or they are extremely moral but I liked it as dialogue.

[cygan]

✂️
Removing the moderator role, and tagging that account are enough.

It's quite a long time I did not see any post from sapta, likely after CM closed, he did not post too much.

but he was online here on the forum today... and people shouldn't just flood @sapta with negative trust ratings - they should also target the user @bennettwinna, who is the official account of winna.com and who also created their official thread.
he, too, should be punished for his bad activities and his account should also be 'ruined'!

[MuffinMaster]

I heard this line somewhere and it's been etched into my brain ever since, it goes something like, 'Everybody can be bought, if somebody says they can't be, it just means, they haven't been offered enough' — I don't know if others agree, or they are extremely moral but I liked it as dialogue.

A lot of people might be offended... but I know what you mean. It's a pretty well-known saying.


I'm curious how it all started. But from what's been revealed, the moderator admitted to everything and likely also explained who paid him.
Probably for the sake of the entire investigation, we won't learn more. At least not for now.

[un_rank]

It's impossible to entirely prevent situations like this, I feel we just have to make the consequence of it great enough that it discourages most from trying it out. I also do not think this should fall under regular scam which the forum doesn't moderate. An action to hide what could be critical evidence is a serious offence and should attract stricter actions on the casino involved.

And banning him would force him to create another acc probably and that's not as good as it sounds because I'd rather have him post with that ruined acc instead giving him a reason to start fresh.

A tagged account for such a serious scam as this should mean the account is as good as banned already. They would not be able to use it to join a campaign and will never hold any forum positions again. They already have enough motivation to want to create an alt if that's what they want to do, but they would not be of any harm to the forum in the way they have been.

- Jay -

[Shishir99]

I saw this thread right after I switched my device. So, I couldn't write anything instantly.
I see only a few people who distrusted him, and he is still DT2. I am quoting those who have sapta in their trust list. theymos, you need to remove him from your trust list as well.

sapta's judgement is Trusted by:
1. theymos (Trust: +28 / =0 / -0) (DT1! (61) 14654 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
2. BTC_Bear (Trust: +0 / =3 / -8) (21 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
3. str4wm4n (Trust: +3 / =4 / -0) (1 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
4. Maidak (Trust: +8 / =1 / -4) (58 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
5. iGotSpots (Trust: +1 / =0 / -1) (54 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
6. sylpalma (Trust: +0 / =0 / -1) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
7. dbshck (Trust: +7 / =0 / -0) (625 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
8. hilariousandco (Trust: +28 / =1 / -0) (DT1! (33) 1933 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
9. segvec (Trust: +1 / =1 / -3) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
10. robelneo (Trust: +5 / =1 / -0) (288 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
11. kro55 (Trust: +0 / =2 / -1) (55 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
12. bit_stacker (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (10 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
13. irfan_pak10 (Trust: +17 / =1 / -0) (DT1! (3) 744 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
14. Fakhoury (Trust: +5 / =0 / -1) (27 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
15. MaoChao (Trust: +6 / =0 / -0) (133 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
16. DARKCHANGE (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
17. TraderCal11 (Trust: +3 / =1 / -0) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
18. janpowal305 (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
19. JYPE (Trust: +0 / =0 / -1) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
20. AakZaki (Trust: +8 / =2 / -0) (DT1! (6) 2017 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
21. aioc (Trust: neutral) (123 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
22. TheUltraElite (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (969 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
23. coin-investor (Trust: neutral) (129 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
24. ryzaadit (Trust: +3 / =1 / -0) (1206 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
25. roycilik (Trust: +12 / =0 / -1) (DT1! (2) 1908 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
26. plr (Trust: neutral) (14 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
27. Kang Bahar (Trust: neutral) (15 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
28. noviann (Trust: neutral) (13 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
29. joniboini (Trust: neutral) (1896 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
30. Rengga Jati (Trust: neutral) (686 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
31. masulum (Trust: +2 / =1 / -0) (1913 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
32. Jaran goyang2712 (Trust: neutral) (49 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
33. pandukelana2712 (Trust: +5 / =9 / -0) (997 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
34. Husna QA (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (DT1! (6) 3442 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
35. Bthd (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (2622 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
36. abhiseshakana (Trust: +2 / =2 / -0) (DT1! (2) 2564 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)

[yahoo62278]

I saw this thread right after I switched my device. So, I couldn't write anything instantly.
I see only a few people who distrusted him, and he is still DT2. I am quoting those who have sapta in their trust list. theymos, you need to remove him from your trust list as well.

sapta's judgement is Trusted by:
1. theymos (Trust: +28 / =0 / -0) (DT1! (61) 14654 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
2. BTC_Bear (Trust: +0 / =3 / -8) (21 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
3. str4wm4n (Trust: +3 / =4 / -0) (1 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
4. Maidak (Trust: +8 / =1 / -4) (58 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
5. iGotSpots (Trust: +1 / =0 / -1) (54 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
6. sylpalma (Trust: +0 / =0 / -1) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
7. dbshck (Trust: +7 / =0 / -0) (625 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
8. hilariousandco (Trust: +28 / =1 / -0) (DT1! (33) 1933 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
9. segvec (Trust: +1 / =1 / -3) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
10. robelneo (Trust: +5 / =1 / -0) (288 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
11. kro55 (Trust: +0 / =2 / -1) (55 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
12. bit_stacker (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (10 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
13. irfan_pak10 (Trust: +17 / =1 / -0) (DT1! (3) 744 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
14. Fakhoury (Trust: +5 / =0 / -1) (27 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
15. MaoChao (Trust: +6 / =0 / -0) (133 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
16. DARKCHANGE (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
17. TraderCal11 (Trust: +3 / =1 / -0) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
18. janpowal305 (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
19. JYPE (Trust: +0 / =0 / -1) (0 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
20. AakZaki (Trust: +8 / =2 / -0) (DT1! (6) 2017 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
21. aioc (Trust: neutral) (123 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
22. TheUltraElite (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (969 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
23. coin-investor (Trust: neutral) (129 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
24. ryzaadit (Trust: +3 / =1 / -0) (1206 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
25. roycilik (Trust: +12 / =0 / -1) (DT1! (2) 1908 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
26. plr (Trust: neutral) (14 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
27. Kang Bahar (Trust: neutral) (15 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
28. noviann (Trust: neutral) (13 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
29. joniboini (Trust: neutral) (1896 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
30. Rengga Jati (Trust: neutral) (686 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
31. masulum (Trust: +2 / =1 / -0) (1913 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
32. Jaran goyang2712 (Trust: neutral) (49 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
33. pandukelana2712 (Trust: +5 / =9 / -0) (997 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
34. Husna QA (Trust: +2 / =0 / -0) (DT1! (6) 3442 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
35. Bthd (Trust: +1 / =0 / -0) (2622 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)
36. abhiseshakana (Trust: +2 / =2 / -0) (DT1! (2) 2564 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)

7 users including me have distrusted the Sapta account so far, I expect that numbers grows as the day goes on. Gotta give people time to login and see this thread. There's no way he stays in DT beyond the next 24 hours.

[theymos]

Please add this to modlog.

OK, it's added now. Moves to Trashcan will show up the same as other removed topics.

Global Moderator Dabs

Dabs was not a global moderator. He was just a mod of the Philippines sections.

[Maidak]

sapta's judgement is Trusted by:
4. Maidak (Trust: +8 / =1 / -4) (58 Merit earned) (Custom Trust list) (BPIP)

7 users including me have distrusted the Sapta account so far, I expect that numbers grows as the day goes on. Gotta give people time to login and see this thread. There's no way he stays in DT beyond the next 24 hours.

Removed.

I've done a lot of business with this guy, and he was always great to deal with.

Man, this really shook the entire forum.

[YOSHIE]

It is very ironic and regrettable, what's more, the bribery case was committed by a local Indonesian moderator. I can't imagine that a position that was supposed to be safe for the entire local Indonesian community, was actually used as a shortcut to get money by bribery.

I don't know what else to say, @sapta, who should have been trusted by the local Indonesian community, actually betrayed the trust given to him, this is the most embarrassing case in history as a local Indonesian moderator.

Gotta give people time to login and see this thread. There's no way he stays in DT beyond the next 24 hours.

I've done what I can do, Trust: I've smoothed it over and put it on the don't trust list.

Sad and very unfortunate, money can darken the eyes.