Are roulette balls different intentionally?

[alani123]

I was watching a live roulette game the other day and I fell on the occasion where the balls are switched. I guess depending on the company this can happen daily or even multiple times per day. But what I noticed was related to the results mostly.

Although the host of the game kept spinning the ball and managing to hit the same rotations as before, 10 to 11 rotations per spin, the spins were taking less time somehow.

This probably means that the ball had some blemish and it would fall faster to the numbers after hitting a certain lower speed or that it was somehow heavier and in spite of doing the same spins it would fall down faster.

This made me think, do the manufacturers of roulette equipment these differences on their balls intentionally? Or is there a normal chance these small differences can make such a huge difference on the roulette?

Maybe this little entropy can be intentional to keep the players from finding any long term patterns. What do you think?

[stompix]

It's pretty simple balls always get changed
- to avoid balls that get damaged, are defective from the start, that spin around and jump places, and so on
- to avoid cheating, either from an outsider like in this case or from the employee himself
- also, paranoia as they see any string of perfectly normal probability outcomes as being fishy

The different results are exactly because an odd ball would have a different speed, also, a used one will not roll like a new one.
But most importantly of all, the ball that got changed might have been of a different size, a lot of casinos use two sizes for balls as per regulations

[Darker45]

I initially thought it had something to do with making the impression of fairness to players. Switching balls would erase doubts in players that there's something wrong or suspicious with the ball that affects where it lands.

But if the host changed it after a player or some players are making successive wining bets, the suspicion might be coming from the other side. Whenever such things occur, the dealer might also change the ball to stop whatever unusual things happening.

[Cointxz]

This made me think, do the manufacturers of roulette equipment these differences on their balls intentionally? Or is there a normal chance these small differences can make such a huge difference on the roulette?

Maybe this little entropy can be intentional to keep the players from finding any long term patterns. What do you think?

Most of the time it’s to maintenance of the game since this ball can be damage or dirty when use consecutively for a long time. Also there’s a chance that it will develop a bias result when they stick to same ball most of the time.

They regularly do maintenance to make guarantee fairness and smooth operation of the game. However, changing the ball on small round intervals is a bit exaggerated although not bad either.

[ralle14]

These small changes sound too good to be intentional because even in other products we tend to see inconsistencies. Even if it's perfect or passes their quality test, external factors can also affect each ball differently over time.

If i'm the manufacturer i'd rather produce only the best roulette balls just like with sports equipment, unless casinos demand a custom set that suits their needs.

[bitbollo]

I have never seen during a live stream in online casino.
But I am not surprised, there are slight and impressive small differences in these balls after these are used as reported.
this can become (due large numbers) an advantage for the players.
a friend of mine, croupier in a casino, has confessed that it wouldn't be hard to get a specific number / area if he can spin freely the ball...
imagine someone that can exercise ALL DAY tossing the same ball

[yhiaali3]

I think this is the logical explanation as casinos do indeed swap balls and change the direction of the wheel to prevent players or software from detecting any predictable patterns, but this is done through natural mechanical mechanisms and the balls are changed legally.

So I don't think the manufacturers do it intentionally because they are under strict control, and the balls are manufactured precisely to ensure complete randomness.
The real reason for the variation is "natural randomness" resulting from simple ball wear with use or a difference in the launch angle from one presenter to another.

[laspol65]

Each casino platform has multiple balls, and it is not unusual for it to change. There are many tricks in the ball, you will push the ball gently and it will go this way and that, maybe the ball may have scratches. There are irregularities in the ball from any direction, the platform owners make it centered on the ball. You know, gamblers can't find it in any way, so they use this ball as the main tool to deal with someone.
Because the gambling owners know exactly where to do what to do and what to do to irregularize gambling, so they keep the ball and the whole manipulation is hidden in the ball.

[Nrcewker]

Yes what you mentioned is technically possible but I dont think manufacturer do this intentionally. The roulette ball we see is in fact a very sensitive and small object. Small or minute changes can really affect when and where it leaves the roulette track.

Now regarding your observation about the same number of rotations but a shorter spin then I dont think it necessarily matters whether the ball is manipulated or heavier. The ball might simply be losing energy differently or if you know the concept of inertia that might could also be playing a role.

I dont know about others but yes, in physical roulette physics does play an important role. So if you are asking whether these differences are intentional I dont really and honestly think casino operators or manufacturers do this intentionally.

[red4slash]

That would be a very reasonable thing because to minimize the risk they bear considering that if the ball is used for too long, its performance will decrease. I think this is the same as poker or craps games in a land-based casino because they also always change periodically and the reason will not be much different.

Apart from minimizing scam this is also done for them to show service so that in this case I think it becomes a natural action and even a basis for them to do it.  On the other hand this can also be a consideration for them to disrupt the plans of some players (who are experts) because those who are experts in this game can predict where the ball will fall when it has been used for a long time although the ratio is still small but the probability of winning is greater for gamblers so that casinos will also certainly make this the reason why the ball in roulette is always replaced periodically.

[Julien_Olynpic]

I think this tactic is a bit excessive, aimed at building trust among roulette players and dispelling any suspicions of ball-swapping. However, barring outright fraud, the ball is actually difficult to manipulate. Unless we assume the ball contains a magnet and falls into the slots deliberately, controlled by someone's will. But even a new ball could be a fraudulent counterfeit, come to think of it. On the other hand, even old balls are perfectly playable.

[fullfitlarry]

This made me think, do the manufacturers of roulette equipment these differences on their balls intentionally? Or is there a normal chance these small differences can make such a huge difference on the roulette?

Maybe this little entropy can be intentional to keep the players from finding any long term patterns. What do you think?

I was once witnessed a roulette game in land base casinos and there are several people who are hitting more often. So what the casino do is to switch the ball and somewhat those who are winning wasn't not able to get the 'timing' of the ball, if there are cases like that.

So yes, it could break the momentum of some gamblers who might be seeing or have calculated where the ball will possible land and so they put a bet on it's neighbors. So by changing, the pattern has been broken.

[danherbias07]

Why do whenever I hear the changing of balls in a roulette game, I always think about Ocean's 13.

Anyway, I heard there is what they call biased wheels, and I don't know if that is a myth or if it is real. Maybe casino owners of the casinos still believe it, or there are really circumstances when the roulette ball is acting weird, like jumping inside that cylinder. There's a chance it could be damaged and is not aligned properly anymore due to chipping.

There are a lot of conspiracy theories about it, but I believe many gamblers are just being superstitious whenever a ball change happens.

[Grace333]

So longa as gambling in concerning, you should know that the entire situation and equipment used are built to ensure house edge. However having the roulette ball hit same rotation is an actual confirmation of the precision of building those equipments. Although I've not played a live roulette before, but the simulated version makes it al clear how the games functions.
Well I think there is a deliberate or intentional action by manufactures to make the game and it's pure mathematics.

[acroman08]

The different results are exactly because an odd ball would have a different speed, also, a used one will not roll like a new one.
But most importantly of all, the ball that got changed might have been of a different size, a lot of casinos use two sizes for balls as per regulations

I never knew that they can use two different sizes of balls, I always thought that casinos are required to have identical balls(same size, same weight, same shape) for their roulette, as per regulations(at least that is what I remember reading before. I just learned something new).

[m2017]

I was watching a live roulette game the other day and I fell on the occasion where the balls are switched. I guess depending on the company this can happen daily or even multiple times per day. But what I noticed was related to the results mostly.

It would be best to ask friends who work (or have worked) at a casino running the roulette wheel about this. I imagine they would know such details.

Although the host of the game kept spinning the ball and managing to hit the same rotations as before, 10 to 11 rotations per spin, the spins were taking less time somehow.

So, the ball was moving faster?

This probably means that the ball had some blemish and it would fall faster to the numbers after hitting a certain lower speed or that it was somehow heavier and in spite of doing the same spins it would fall down faster.

Alternatively, it might not have been a defect, but rather a ball with different specifications. Then again, the croupier's "hand" could also play a role. I’ve heard stories from friends who worked in casinos about croupiers learning to control the roulette wheel so precisely that they could land the ball in a specific pocket chosen by someone beforehand. I don’t know how true this is, but people can master anything if they devote enough time to it - just look at any athlete. In other words, a croupier can control the ball, causing it to behave differently.

This made me think, do the manufacturers of roulette equipment these differences on their balls intentionally? Or is there a normal chance these small differences can make such a huge difference on the roulette?

With different weights (and numbers), like bowling balls? Why not.

Maybe this little entropy can be intentional to keep the players from finding any long term patterns. What do you think?

If one were to speculate on this, it seems plausible that a casino would try to prevent gamblers from observing the game and identifying patterns; however, I believe this calls for the expert opinion of someone who has either worked at a roulette table and knows the ins and outs, or is acquainted with such people.

[Fortify]

I was watching a live roulette game the other day and I fell on the occasion where the balls are switched. I guess depending on the company this can happen daily or even multiple times per day. But what I noticed was related to the results mostly.

Although the host of the game kept spinning the ball and managing to hit the same rotations as before, 10 to 11 rotations per spin, the spins were taking less time somehow.

This probably means that the ball had some blemish and it would fall faster to the numbers after hitting a certain lower speed or that it was somehow heavier and in spite of doing the same spins it would fall down faster.

This made me think, do the manufacturers of roulette equipment these differences on their balls intentionally? Or is there a normal chance these small differences can make such a huge difference on the roulette?

Maybe this little entropy can be intentional to keep the players from finding any long term patterns. What do you think?

While the company that makes the roulette balls will try as hard as they can to make the balls perfectly spherical it's near impossible to make it absolutely perfect so there will be minor blemishes or imperfections on the surface. It's probably one of the reasons that casinos rotate them (if that's what you've sen) because they don't want any single ball to be considered as rigging the game. We don't really know what goes on in these live studios, they don't need to rig such games because they're already weighted towards the house but they do have the ability to control the wheel in ways that the average viewer cannot audit. These games all have natural entropy so if a ball spins 4 times or 6 it doesn't really matter and you could not make any meaningful conclusions unless you track it thousands or tens of thousands of times.

[Don Pedro Dinero]

I think stompix has summed it up perfectly. Changing the balls in roulette games is just as common as changing the decks in card games at the casino, and the reasons he gives for changing the balls could apply to changing the decks as well.

The different results are exactly because an odd ball would have a different speed, also, a used one will not roll like a new one.
But most importantly of all, the ball that got changed might have been of a different size, a lot of casinos use two sizes for balls as per regulations

I never knew that they can use two different sizes of balls, I always thought that casinos are required to have identical balls(same size, same weight, same shape) for their roulette, as per regulations(at least that is what I remember reading before. I just learned something new).

I didn't know about this either but a quick AI search confirms so.

[DanWalker]

Although the host of the game kept spinning the ball and managing to hit the same rotations as before, 10 to 11 rotations per spin, the spins were taking less time somehow.

Actually it is natural to question ball's physical condition if total spin time decrease noticeably even after observing similar 10/11 rotation.
But whatever I cannot attribute this to blemish or additional weight.

You have to acknowledge that element like ball's material, diameter, surface condition, track friction, initial speed, wheel speed, launch position etc all combine to intrinsically alter its deceleration and final drop timing.

I have even observed noticeable change in ball's drop location and outcome distribution when the wheel was slightly unlevel.

[stompix]

~

I never knew that they can use two different sizes of balls, I always thought that casinos are required to have identical balls(same size, same weight, same shape) for their roulette, as per regulations(at least that is what I remember reading before. I just learned something new).

Technically the ball size doesn't matter,  most casinos just pick some that have a round number either inch or mm, such as 18 or 21 mm, but normally regulations just tell the maximum or minimum, msot use 2 for convenience purposes but in some states for example, you could use a dozen and not breach anything.

I'm away, so I can't use a US VPN to access Nevada regulations but here are NY and Pennsylvania:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/regulations/new-york/9-NYCRR-5322.9
https://www.irrc.state.pa.us/docs/2895/AGENCY/2895FF.pdf

There is no enforced size, just limits.
I have no doubt there are some casinos who use more than that just as I said, for paranoia reasons, but they are the minority.