bitbollo needs help - Is it worth the blood?

[MotoLM]

LM should definitely be more selective and work harder to avoid introducing potential scams to the community.

I strongly agree with this. I remember a few years ago when he wasn't running many campaigns—maybe three or four. Over time, he's become the manager who runs the most campaigns (not the one that handles the most money overall or has the most slots, but it's a big step). I suppose that during that growth phase, he tried to take on as many campaigns as he could. Now that he's matured as a manager, perhaps it's time for him to focus on quality rather than quantity, thereby avoiding any that might be potential scams.

Whenever my managed contests were criticized by jeremypwr and LoyceV (if I'm not wrong), I slowly paused them. I have been approached by a few users who were interested to assist me running contests but I didn't because I didn't want to be criticized again for them. I have paused them for indefinite time, until I can come with better contest idea.

[bitbollo]

Better contest idea? With today, it's 10 days they continue to shill for this scam casino.

The team member I'm in contact has confirmed me that $100 has been added to bitbollo's frogbet account, as it was supposed to be.

Just 24 hours more or less and... this "trusted" casino it's already doing the same. Just stolen another deposit.
Have you seen that meanwhile they insist that this casino is "to be trusted" and its'everything fine they continue to collect negative reviews?
https://www.trustpilot.com/reviews/6ab45dfa768aeb6598bfe945

...
Eventually, the $100 was processed, which is obviously the good part.
...

They had just made another scam. How you can  expect that I this user/ casino should be trusted?

This is a scam that has been never been addressed despite it's continue to be addressed as completely "normal casino"

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.0 scam accusation
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171394#msg67171394 Links with sister scam casino
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67168369#msg67168369 Links of warnings they was not answering since many days / trust a newbie as "team"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171810#msg67171810 4 scams of the last 6 months (all with the same scheme)

[ChiBitCTy]

I wrote up a long reply here last night and then fell asleep in my computer chair while doing so it aired out so here I am again typing out a bunch of shit. I love when this happens anyways first off did I seriously read someone say whether it’s seven days or six months they got paid justifying that as being ok? This is one of the reasons psychology was one of my all-time favorite courses in college breaking down a human mind when such utterly insanely mind-boggling things are said really is a fascinating topic and scientific bit of research obviously won’t go into the details of that, but generally brains are not wired quite correctly when you try to justify shit like that often times just simply because you wanna make money and are trying to defend those who have paid your money at some point, which digs even deeper that you’re willing to even go there and be that desperate for some signature sats.

I’ll be honest I haven’t read through this whole thread. It’s a lot ..but one thing I can say is BitBollo is a stand-up dude has gone out of his way many times for me completely out of the kindness of his heart and being a guy (or naybe it’s because I’m a fellow wop ). In all seriousness, I agree with those who have been discussing that campaign managers need to do a much better job with selecting their clients. If you can’t make a living here and you’re desperate enough to take on a dodgy client get a fucking job otherwise you’re just morally bankrupt which is just the sickest kind of human being. You could be someone who is promoting knowingly or maybe even worse blindly promoting those who are actively ruining peoples lives this shit I can’t stand for this is the shit that keeps me up at night, so those who have vocal proponents of stricter due diligence they appreciate you.

Anyways, maybe I’m wrong but this just seems like some good form members speaking up and your typical sig spammer dip shits trying to defend shit bad companies because the few days a week helped them with their live streaming Simp tipping.

Bollo 💪

This was all voice text so I imagine a good bit of grammatical and spelling errors. It’s late I got up. A coyote has been recently trying to hunt.m My cats and dad’s been on high alert. Video camera was triggered. I am in no way going to type this out as I’ve now finished my duties on the throne (tmi, yes, but typical 🤷‍♂️ sorry )and going to bed peace all.

[bitbollo]

They can force users to KYC:
https://frogbet.com/terms/

5. Identity Verification (KYC)
We operate a risk-based verification programme. We may, at our sole discretion, at any time, and for any reason, require you to complete identity and/or source-of-funds verification ("KYC") as a condition of continued use of Frogbet. This may include, without limitation, a government-issued photo ID, proof of address dated within the last three months, proof of ownership of a payment method, a selfie or liveness check, and source-of-funds or source-of-wealth documentation.

We may request verification at any point — including before processing any withdrawal — and may suspend your account, pause gameplay, and withhold any withdrawal or balance until verification is completed to our satisfaction. If you fail to provide requested documentation within a reasonable period, or if we are unable to verify your identity, age, location, or the lawful source of your funds, we may close your account and, to the extent permitted by applicable law and our licence, withhold or forfeit the affected funds.


They have all instruments to seize your funds including a FORCED KYC and as you have already seen they just don't give a fuck and have spent all this time to avoid to pay or even to admit the issue with their "campaign manager". Wait 24 hours and then? They are promoting a scam again, the same group of scammers.
He has been able to offer just "100 usd" but can't stop TO PROMOTE AND ENDORSE A SCAM!
"go ahead piece of shit" this was the maximum answer after 25 messages and more.

Still now they cannot admit we are dealing ONLY WITH A WELL KNOWN SCAM ENTITY!

SCAMS Already known: frogbet.com/luckyanon (2)

Email received few hours ago!

THEY DEFINE THEMSELF AS NO KYC CASINO - Only 10 days they are trusting the team!

The team member I'm in contact has confirmed me that $100 has been added to bitbollo's frogbet account, as it was supposed to be.

SUPPORT THE FLAG = https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;flag=3590

" better contest idea. "

"Better contest idea" They are still not able to collaborate with a scam. Just looking for " a better idea" WINK WINK

edit
Just to post in advance the next scam that will be made.
They continue to bring the discussion up, continue to harrass and to blame, so we can just have more scams to be listed.

Look the due diligence for another scam - just to mantain a proper ratio of "1 scam 1 month".
https://www.askgamblers.com/online-casinos/companies/3-102-945295-srl
The same company that has launched 5 scams now is launching a 6 scam! You can search by yourself.
Guess? Yes! I have identified they are the same scam company in few minutes. Manager? Of course! Any of these sites are just scam.

Another of his sponsorship right now he is having the same issue as frogbet. "Arbitrary constritions" - write to support they will fix it.
These are just company that change name https://www.askgamblers.com/online-casinos/companies/3-102-945295-srl

They use the same license and just make scam.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171394#msg67171394 Links with sister scam casino

Continue to deny the evidence (likewise domain going to expiry in a matter of days is just the endless sympthom of a voluntary scam)

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.0 scam accusation
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67168369#msg67168369 Links of warnings they was not answering since many days / trust a newbie as "team"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171810#msg67171810 4 scams of the last 6 months (all with the same scheme)

[JollyGood]

He called me a spammer, scammer, suckpuppet, shill and others.

~

I think your friend bitbollo needs help. Please help him!

If you had to create a thread to discuss your negative feedback, it would have been more appropriate to focus on that rather than the sarcasm. I could be wrong but it seems as though you only created this thread because your feelings and/or ego was hurt by what bitbollo wrote. As for the matter of the tag, if it were me I would have left a neutral at most.

Having said that, if bitbollo sees you as a shill for a scammer and has left a negative tag that is his decision and if he faces any consequences in return (trust exclusion or tags) then that is a matter I am sure and he has already contemplated.

THEY CONTINUE TO NOT ADMIT THEY ADVERTISE A SCAM! DON'T DEPOSIT HERE! LOOK ON TRUST PILOT TOO!

This casino has stolen my money deposited and missed completely a deadline. The campaign manager has continued to promote it.
As mentioned, its not for 50USD but because they have just stolen my deposit. Did you think appropriate a casino stole deposit of players right? Good to know It's evident that have been a very generous users of this forum has just been completely useless.

I cannot recall engaging with you before (except maybe once or twice very briefly) but keeping that aside, you deserve a lot of credit for creating this thread even though you probably knew you would have to defend yourself against two campaign managers that are well known for helping/supporting each other whenever the need arises.

You had a principle regardless of the amounts of money involved and you took action even though you knew you were going to get some pushback from other members in this thread. I think you deserve a lot of credit for taking action and then for standing by what you believe in regardless of what possible drama were to unfold.

You're making it seem like its totally random whether you will end up promoting a scam or not. The fact is some managers are more likely to promote scams than others. It is 1000% up to the manager to weed out a bad project from the getgo, and they should not be immune from the consequences of lending credibility to scams. "Its just a cost of business" is not a reasonable excuse.

As the situation currently stands, certain campaign managers are taking on any project for the sake of adding it to their portfolio. Clearly Hhampuz and icopress apply due-diligence in ways that others do not, their standard is probably far too high for some others to compete with.

We are not perfect, mistakes can be made and scams might inadvertently be promoted too but strict due-diligence should be applied by campaign managers. Royse777 continued to promote the Sinbad mixer even after I created a thread stating that it was going to be shutdown as authorities had traced millions from another money laundering mixer was used to launch it by the same owner. After Sinbad was seized, mixers were banned from the forum. Had Royse777 cancelled the campaign, maybe mixers would not have been banned at that time. It remains possible that mixers could have been banned at a later date but that does not account for the incompetence and gross negligence shown by Royse777 at the time.

Over 99% of the accounts posting in this forum are only here because want to monetise their accounts via signature campaigns. If other opportunities arose from bounties, contests, competitions and free lucky draws as well as paid participation threads then that would be deemed as a bonus. The vast majority of those campaign participants would not care if they were promoting a scam or not (and would not even stop promoting it even if they were convinced it was a scam). Also, we have no idea how many are farmed accounts and how they are affecting the forum.

Let us not avoid one obvious fact, Royse777 and Little Mouse have nothing bad to state about each other and they seem to aid each other when questions against either one of them are raised. From what it seems, this issue could have been resolved as soon as it occurred but as it was not this is the current state of affairs. A combination of not applying due-diligence seems only to be a part of the problem but it is a massive part as nothing else would have followed if the signature campaign was never started. As long as unconditional support is given between cliques, it masks the real problems plaguing the forum.

[sebiesz]

ths thread shows why people should keep screenshots, payment records, and clear agreements when dealing with casino campaigns. it makes disputes much easier to verify.

[hugeblack]

I agree with the views expressed; the reasons cited previously are insufficient to support that flag. LM did not intend to breach or harm the contract (the issue arose from negligence) so I oppose that flag.

The same applies to @Shishir99's situation. I do not know @bitbollo, but I would kindly ask him to remove that negative rating.

Regarding LM, this is the second case where hasty decision-making has led to such a situation; a "neutral" or "negative" trust rating might be warranted. However, changing your projects management approach—such as delaying release escrow until you have verified that everything is correct—is the right way to shift that negative trust to neutral.

[icopress]

I agree with the views expressed; the reasons cited previously are insufficient to support that flag. LM did not intend to breach or harm the contract (the issue arose from negligence) so I oppose that flag.

I assume this is a typo (and I assume you will edit it), because if I didn't know you, I would consider your post manipulative. Your phrase "I agree with the views expressed" makes it sound as if there is only one generally accepted position on this matter, which is not the case. In any event, I have added some information below for your reference.

I supported the flag on frogbet and opposed the flag on Little Mouse. I'm hoping bitbollo will reconsider his stance and work to de-escalate the issue rather than leaving things fractured.

At this stage, the problem is not with Bitbollo. A simple way to remove this flag existed for a long time, yet it was ignored. Perhaps you should look at the situation considering the full picture.

If you recall, before turning to me, b1exch was originally an LM client. As soon as this was announced, systematic attacks against the project and against me began (this is not an isolated case). LM is attacking me and projects associated with me in the name of cLoazyL (as you know, memehunter officially works for LM as he himself has stated).

I analyzed the posts of these accounts, and the AI ​​gave a 99% similarity that they were the same person. I noticed this because the first thing I noticed was the identical level of sarcasm, the spacing between quotes, and certain phrases that begin their posts.

• https://bitlist.co/search?content=ahh&author=memehunter&limit=20&sort_by=date_desc
• https://bitlist.co/search?content=ahh&author=cLoazyL&limit=20&sort_by=date_desc

I mentioned this because b1exch personally told me that LM had access to all the links to their threads on other forums. Please note that at the time of the campaign launch, there were no links on the b1exch website. This unequivocally means that cLoazyL was directed by someone who possessed links that had not been posted on the project's website at the time of my announcement.

And it is abundantly clear that the systematic publication of reciprocal "defensive" threads involving LM and R7 is merely the tip of the iceberg, concealing a group of individuals acting in collusion. I once allowed myself to speak quite harshly about a certain manager after being provoked, but that pales in comparison to what goes on behind the scenes (including comments from project owners who, to put it mildly, regret their initial choice due to the utter incompetence of certain individuals).

That's not all ... Another recent precedent

Are you even listening to yourself? It's not my fault that your clients are scammers.
Now I understand the whole situation better after looking at your feedback wall.

1. You're playing the good guy because it benefits you.
2. You are literally abusing your position DT. You added me to distrust list despite legitimate feedback about fraud, just because he's your client.
3. You called your friends because you understand the consequences of openly defending a scammer.
4. You literally destroyed another user's reputation because you were conducting experiments.

It's RapTarX whom I quoted, he was an easy pick because I saw his ranked had changed and I wanted to add something that would feel real but it could be someone else too. I wanted to say this many times, right at that moment too but sadly I couldn’t. I was afraid of being humiliated.

5. Even before this confession, you literally marked the user with a red tag to divert attention from your person.



Each of these points except the first is a compelling argument for you to be excluded from the default trust system.

~Little Mouse

For this reason, I'm adding you to my distrust list and recommending others do the same.

[bitbollo]

Can I read some evidences and not just "in my opinion"?  I have explained why all of these red tag are appropriate. Read just the proofs, after 9 pages of "it's all true" what is "sufficient for you"?

I agree with the views expressed; the reasons cited previously are insufficient to support that flag. LM did not intend to breach or harm the contract (the issue arose from negligence) so I oppose that flag.

Insufficient you mean that I need to post another 5 scam of the last 12 months and you have also evaluated this scam "live right now" ?
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67174787#msg67174787  

Just Asking because I can understand that maybe once there 10 scams "that can be recognized in 2 minutes" someone will say "insufficient" ... why not 15 scams to be scammer? or 20? Or I don't know, how many cards has to peel @yogg to be a scammer? Or cold card, how many hardware need to fail? LOL I love double standards.

...
The same applies to @Shishir99's situation. I do not know @bitbollo, but I would kindly ask him to remove that negative rating.

I am a pharmacist in real life and this is an information that can be find easily. Member of bitcoin Italian association since 2015 blablablabl...
Once this guy has questioned "mental or health help" we haven't nothing to deal anymore and he is untrustworthy. It's rude, offensive, a disturbing comment considering all scams have been confirmed and "campaign manager" call the scammers as "the team". Still looking for better idea! Yeah it's sufficient for a flag!

Many users knows me in real life and trust in many many things and activities. I have never seen someone that promotes 1 scam 1 month have such defense but you can't buy trust of people.
As I have said, such topic is a pure defamation and has just exposed more scam of this "campaign manager".
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171810#msg67171810 4 scams of the last 6 months (all with the same scheme)
This user has never admit the full list of scam, or the total non-sense reaction or worst how it has still endorsed the "casino"
"come on take 100 USD and shut up"

This user has offensively and threateningly quoted and mentioned all the users who have added me to their trust list. Definitely a spammer and a low-quality shill account.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.msg67165341#msg67165341

This user shill and supports a scam casino and an user that has clearly violated an agreement according a written agreement. Shitposter/Low quality too. Check reference.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.msg67165386#msg67165386

Once there are 3 pages of FROGBET TOPIC talking about 7 days of missing payment/stolen deposits, it's completely off topic and pretty scam approach presenting them as "the best tower game". It's the same as @yogg art. Once he was scamming no one was admiring his art. @ChiBitCTy has already explained a glimpse about this.

He has called 7 days as "escaleted fasted as light". I don't trust his judgement. How many days we have to wait before claiming a scam?
I have waited for 7 days and providing ALL ALERTS POSSIBLE.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67168369#msg67168369 Links of warnings they was not answering since many days / trust a newbie as "team"

If all these days / these warnings/ list of scams/ is not enough for adding a trust negative - and the problem has become my person/role - it's evident the DT system is completely failed

[memehunter]

(as you know, memehunter officially works for LM as he himself has stated).

I am no longer working for LM. We parted our ways many months ago.

..............
Rest I will read later if I think it is worth it.

EDIT:

 Below is the screenshot from early June. 


I am just busy in my personal life for now.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

As the situation currently stands, certain campaign managers are taking on any project for the sake of adding it to their portfolio. Clearly Hhampuz and icopress apply due-diligence in ways that others do not, their standard is probably far too high for some others to compete with.

Word, I have been calling out LM myself and got credited with 2 useless feedbacks from him. This guy really is something else and the way he spoke to Bitbollo is basically a copy of the way he spoke to me. This guy cannot be trusted in my opinion, taking on every casino gig possible, despite the questionable results in the past, just looks very shady. Money over safety of others. Promoting these scam casinos harms other people that actually fall for them, yet of course it's all not his fault.
But hey, if you say something he immediately retaliates, that's the power of DT1. You confuse something and he immediately calls you out for "spreading lies" (despite instant edit and apology) yet that's what he does to earn money. Lie to people that certain sites are a safe place to play.
He even got a certain person to change their trust to distrust, that's the power of the puppetmaster. 

Too bad too many people still don't see his true face, but sooner or later everyone will.

[hugeblack]

I assume this is a typo (and I assume you will edit it), because if I didn't know you, I would consider your post manipulative. Your phrase "I agree with the views expressed" makes it sound as if there is only one generally accepted position on this matter, which is not the case. In any event, I have added some information below for your reference.

Do you mean trust flag or negative trust?

trust flag is based on this topic ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.0, and the reasons cited there are insufficient to support it. As for negative trust, it remains valid for now; LM needs to change the way signature campaigns are managed.
Frankly, I am aware of the issues between campaign managers, but there needs to be an end to this drama.

I am a pharmacist in real life and this is an information that can be find easily. Member of bitcoin Italian association since 2015 blablablabl...
Once this guy has questioned "mental or health help" we haven't nothing to deal anymore and he is untrustworthy. It's rude, offensive, a disturbing comment considering all scams have been confirmed and "campaign manager" call the scammers as "the team". Still looking for better idea! Yeah it's sufficient for a flag!

It is unfortunate to get to know you under these circumstances. You seem like a good person.
I understand why you are upset, and your perspective might change once things have calmed down.
(I am talking about @Shishir99's situation.)

[Free Market Capitalist]

He even got a certain person to change their trust to distrust, that's the power of the puppetmaster. 

I don't think you're referring to me, because if you are, what you're saying is incorrect. But whether you're referring to me or not, this gives me a good opportunity to clarify something. I had icopress on my trust list, and he was the only campaign manager I had. Since I put my list together a while ago, I tend to make few changes, and the only change I’ve made is removing him from my trust list—which isn’t the same as distrusting him. I’m still going to keep seeing his feedback because he’s on DT.

It’s something I’d been thinking about for a while, but I was involved in campaigns managed by LM, and I didn’t know how it might have been interpreted. Now that I have, in principle, nine months of campaigning ahead of me with managers who aren’t involved in this feud, I’ve decided to make the change.

So, there are no campaign managers on my trust list and that's how it's going to stay.

And I’m not going to go on any longer because, as I said the other day, life is going too well for me to waste a lot of time and energy arguing in this section.

[bitbollo]

Better contest idea? With today, it's 10 days they continue to shill for this scam casino.

The team member I'm in contact has confirmed me that $100 has been added to bitbollo's frogbet account, as it was supposed to be.

Just 24 hours more or less and... this "trusted" casino it's already doing the same. Just stolen another deposit.
Have you seen that meanwhile they insist that this casino is "to be trusted" and its'everything fine they continue to collect negative reviews?
https://www.trustpilot.com/reviews/6ab45dfa768aeb6598bfe945

...
Eventually, the $100 was processed, which is obviously the good part.
...

They had just made another scam. How you can  expect that I this user/ casino should be trusted?

This is a scam that has been never been addressed despite it's continue to be addressed as completely "normal casino"

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.0 scam accusation
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171394#msg67171394 Links with sister scam casino
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67168369#msg67168369 Links of warnings they was not answering since many days / trust a newbie as "team"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171810#msg67171810 4 scams of the last 6 months (all with the same scheme)

Looks how there are no evidences for a flag/red trust.
In the same time "campaign manager" confirm that "it's everything ok with one member of the team here 100 USD" some random dude is crying 248 USD directly in trust pilot!
Would you continue to search "better idea" ? They have - customer support - legal support - chat live - mega boss - and no one has been able to respond in a ticket "max 24 hours" .

We are approaching 9 pages about this scam - still not enough evidence. What is a better, a selection of scam of the pasts, or wait a few weeks for the next scam?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594694.0 scam accusation
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171394#msg67171394 Links with sister scam casino
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67168369#msg67168369 Links of warnings they was not answering since many days / trust a newbie as "team"
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=5594724.msg67171810#msg67171810 4 scams of the last 6 months (all with the same scheme)

[AHOYBRAUSE]

He even got a certain person to change their trust to distrust, that's the power of the puppetmaster.  

I don't think you're referring to me, because if you are, what you're saying is incorrect. But whether you're referring to me or not, this gives me a good opportunity to clarify something. I had icopress on my trust list, and he was the only campaign manager I had. Since I put my list together a while ago, I tend to make few changes, and the only change I’ve made is removing him from my trust list—which isn’t the same as distrusting him. I’m still going to keep seeing his feedback because he’s on DT.

It’s something I’d been thinking about for a while, but I was involved in campaigns managed by LM, and I didn’t know how it might have been interpreted. Now that I have, in principle, nine months of campaigning ahead of me with managers who aren’t involved in this feud, I’ve decided to make the change.

So, there are no campaign managers on my trust list and that's how it's going to stay.

And I’m not going to go on any longer because, as I said the other day, life is going too well for me to waste a lot of time and energy arguing in this section.

Not sure why you would think I meant you, haha. I was talking about my experience with someone close to LM changing their "opinion" about me once LM was beefing against me.
But if what you wrote meant that you changed your trust for me into distrust (for whatever reason), then so be it. I meant somebody else obviously.

[memehunter]

I don't think you're referring to me,

No, he was referring to me.
@AHOYBRAUSE you removed your trust feedback way back from my profile and I never said anything in fact I did not even care. You gave it you removed it your choice, no questions.
I acted based on how I felt about you. If you think I acted based on certain influence, you are just wrong.
There is a tipping point when someone acts but there is always chain of events to consider (I have zero interest in going through all of them here publicly, privately perhaps but I dont think it will lead us anywhere) which I did.

[AHOYBRAUSE]

I don't think you're referring to me,

No, he was referring to me.
@AHOYBRAUSE you removed your trust feedback way back from my profile and I never said anything in fact I did not even care. You gave it you removed it your choice, no questions.
I acted based on how I felt about you. If you think I acted based on certain influence, you are just wrong.
There is a tipping point when someone acts but there is always chain of events to consider (I have zero interest in going through all of them here publicly, privately perhaps but I dont think it will lead us anywhere) which I did.

LOL, the puppet still has strings attached.  . Tipping point my ass, I didn't even speak to you unless it was in some poker thread where you posted some terribly played hand. 

Anyway, goodby to you. Please leave the forum again, it was better that way.

[memehunter]

I don't think you're referring to me,

No, he was referring to me.
@AHOYBRAUSE you removed your trust feedback way back from my profile and I never said anything in fact I did not even care. You gave it you removed it your choice, no questions.
I acted based on how I felt about you. If you think I acted based on certain influence, you are just wrong.
There is a tipping point when someone acts but there is always chain of events to consider (I have zero interest in going through all of them here publicly, privately perhaps but I dont think it will lead us anywhere) which I did.

LOL, the puppet still has strings attached.  . Tipping point my ass, I didn't even speak to you unless it was in some poker thread where you posted some terribly played hand. 

Anyway, goodby to you. Please leave the forum again, it was better that way.

Good to see that you are so unbothered about a puppet's opinion lol.

[Elainebue]

seems like the important part here is getting all the details documented before things get more heated. if there's a dispute over funds, the transaction records and messages should probably make it easier to see what actually happened. the arguing back and forth isn't really helping either side.

[Airaze]

yeah once a money dispute turns into personal arguments, it gets a lot harder to figure out what actually happened. i'd rather see the transaction details and the full conversation laid out first. that would make it easier for people reading the thread to judge the situation.