The robotization of China’s economy - a time bomb or a lifeline?

[WillyAp]

I've seen some videos of their lab about making humanoids and they're looking like humans. This is no longer a race of which glorious in robotics and AI because they always compete with the US.

Many of those vids are AI made. None of them is able to peel an egg.
The Robot revolution is not even at 1% and they claim much more.

[Emitdama]

Of all the countries in the world if you think that China is the one that will have problems later you are kidding yourself, china is one of the most economical one in the world, and that's because they are always in production.

They make a lot of things and right now they are living in the future already, they have a lots of cars that are so futuristic, few of them are even flying, I have watch few videos of some cool cars straight out of James Bond movies.

Robotics innovation from china are confusing enough because they are progressing, if we want to talk about the struggles of china production isn't one of them, innovation isn't one of them and I doubt it will ever be.

China struggles in quality, compared to countries like the US or Japan. It's more focused on quantity, by mass-producing units at a fraction of the cost. This is what China's been doing with both the EV and Robotics industry. Some even say China's AI LLMs are direct copies/clones of their American counterparts (like it's the case of DeepSeek vs ChatGPT). Turns out this is working pretty well for China. It now has a lot of tech at its disposal. Unlike the US, which is lacking behind. Only in terms of production. Technology-wise (quality), the US is still superior. Still, the country fears one day China will reign supreme. It's why Donald Trump has been against China (although he as softened his tone recently).

We can't say what will happen in the future, but one thing is certain, and that is China's position as one of the largest economic players in the world will remain untouched. The West must learn how to deal with this.

As of now, but maybe in future China might lose its position as being one of the largest economic players. There are countries like India leaning towards mass production because labour is much cheaper in these part of the world. The same amount of labour work would cost at least 3x in countries like the US which I think is the reason why they do not run behind mass productions. Countries like US work on quality because they can only build limited products so quality is their main goal.

But for countries like China, they mainly focus on quantity mostly overlooking at the quality. Yes, these products are often cheap but are they really that good? I hardly doubt so. Still people prefer using them just because they are cheaper than the actual market rate.

[Bitcoin Smith]

Of all the countries in the world if you think that China is the one that will have problems later you are kidding yourself, china is one of the most economical one in the world, and that's because they are always in production.

They make a lot of things and right now they are living in the future already, they have a lots of cars that are so futuristic, few of them are even flying, I have watch few videos of some cool cars straight out of James Bond movies.

Robotics innovation from china are confusing enough because they are progressing, if we want to talk about the struggles of china production isn't one of them, innovation isn't one of them and I doubt it will ever be.

China struggles in quality, compared to countries like the US or Japan. It's more focused on quantity, by mass-producing units at a fraction of the cost. This is what China's been doing with both the EV and Robotics industry. Some even say China's AI LLMs are direct copies/clones of their American counterparts (like it's the case of DeepSeek vs ChatGPT). Turns out this is working pretty well for China. It now has a lot of tech at its disposal. Unlike the US, which is lacking behind. Only in terms of production. Technology-wise (quality), the US is still superior. Still, the country fears one day China will reign supreme. It's why Donald Trump has been against China (although he as softened his tone recently).

We can't say what will happen in the future, but one thing is certain, and that is China's position as one of the largest economic players in the world will remain untouched. The West must learn how to deal with this.

As of now, but maybe in future China might lose its position as being one of the largest economic players. There are countries like India leaning towards mass production because labour is much cheaper in these part of the world. The same amount of labour work would cost at least 3x in countries like the US which I think is the reason why they do not run behind mass productions. Countries like US work on quality because they can only build limited products so quality is their main goal.

But for countries like China, they mainly focus on quantity mostly overlooking at the quality. Yes, these products are often cheap but are they really that good? I hardly doubt so. Still people prefer using them just because they are cheaper than the actual market rate.

China makes all kinds of products, the cost makes it look cheaper when we compare it to the cost of producing the same product in the West. The labour workforce is still cheaper in China, but they are moving towards automation so they can just keep producing the products at full potential round the clock. India is also following the same trail but it is safe to say we are atleast a couple decades behind to achieve the same level of infrastructure as China has now and no one can overlook the quality, it is just based on the production cost.

[boyptc]

I've seen some videos of their lab about making humanoids and they're looking like humans. This is no longer a race of which glorious in robotics and AI because they always compete with the US.

Many of those vids are AI made. None of them is able to peel an egg.
The Robot revolution is not even at 1% and they claim much more.

The one that I've seen wasn't from AI, it's from a content creator named Joe Hattab, 21m subs. He went to the facility and saw it in flesh.

I don't think that video was made by an AI. But prolly you're right that many of those that have existed were but not his video. Possible his content was sponsored just to show it to the public.

Youtube --> China SHOCKS America: Humanoid Robots, Smart Cities, and Supercars!

[DrBeer]

The question is, where are all those people going to work if the current chores are being executed by automatons?

Theoretically, if there isn't human labor involved, or is involved only in a very minor scale, prices of goods should decrease. This way, living costs as a whole should decrease too, so they wouldn't need to work so hard and so intensively to meet monthly expenses like before.

At same time, people in charge of automated businesses would have surplus money to spend someway else. And when people have spare money, they tend to spend with themselves (entertainment, leisure, welfare). It opens a wide range of opportunities for people to work in fields focused on those elements.

I think that is the way to go. While robots do the hard part, humans occupy their time with meaningful activities which generate pleasure and welfare, and also proportionate them an income to live from.

Herein lies one of the key problems: a huge number of unemployable people are entering the market, and this places a burden on social welfare budgets. Furthermore, they, who were once consumers, are becoming very limited consumers, and internal discontent is growing. Yes, some of them will likely find work in robot maintenance, but that will amount to only a fraction of a percent of the millions of new unemployed.
Who will support them and ensure they maintain their accustomed standard of living?
 

[WillyAp]

Herein lies one of the key problems: a huge number of unemployable people are entering the market, and this places a burden on social welfare budgets
 

That is a self created problem. In Germany the state gives you 2.5 thou Euro, just one word you need to be able to utter, Asylum.
To make 2.5 thou as a German you need to make €4500. Plus you pay the rent, the asylum seeker does not.
You as German pay for insurance,  the asylum seeker does not. and there is much more getting German people into a bad mood.
If you tend to be lazy, fetching money from the state has never been that easy. And the kind of people you invite ......

[DrBeer]

Herein lies one of the key problems: a huge number of unemployable people are entering the market, and this places a burden on social welfare budgets
 

That is a self created problem. In Germany the state gives you 2.5 thou Euro, just one word you need to be able to utter, Asylum.
To make 2.5 thou as a German you need to make €4500. Plus you pay the rent, the asylum seeker does not.
You as German pay for insurance,  the asylum seeker does not. and there is much more getting German people into a bad mood.
If you tend to be lazy, fetching money from the state has never been easy. And the kind of people you invite ......

I completely agree with you here - this pretense of tolerance and "fairy-tale kindness" will lead the EU into huge problems, although they’re already quite noticeable.
I get the feeling that the EU was living in some kind of rose-colored fantasy, thinking that if they gave shelter to the destitute and unfortunate, these newcomers would start working for the good of the country and helping the hosts who gave them shelter... Ha-ha-ha! NO!!!! They’ll become a burden on their hosts, forcing them not only to work harder to support this dead weight, if I may use that word, but also to demand more rights for themselves than their "hosts" have! Why didn’t the EU adopt simple rules: if you’ve asked for asylum, we’ll take you and your family in, and you and your family will receive benefits for a whole year.
BUT! YOU and your family must adapt - learn the language (at least at a basic level), obtain a professional qualification or find work in your existing field, and start paying taxes and working for the benefit of the country that has taken you in, so that you can become a full-fledged citizen rather than a one-sided, resource-consuming resident?
If you can’t manage that in a year, we were happy to have you here, we helped you, but now goodbye forever - you can’t adapt to our rules! With a complete ban on entry into any EU country!  That would be the only, and perfect, incentive, and a truly mutually beneficial alliance between the country and the people who genuinely need help but are ready to contribute to those who helped them!

[qurbanshah02]

We cannot speak against China because if they are making robots it is not a very negative thing at this time. Because so far no one has found anything wrong with robots from there. Even if we do find it, we cannot imagine a bomb from it, so we are happy and jealous of this advance technology of China, they have made something that we do not have, so we should also invent this technology so that we can make many difficult tasks easier with their help. We can do this for lifeline, although some experts say that robots can be quite hostile in the coming time, how much truth there is in this, experts from other countries have not yet proven. Apart from this, it is also present in Japan, gradually many countries are adopting robots so that they can create a good economy of robots and the difficulties of humans become less easy.

[WillyAp]

I completely agree with you here - this pretense of tolerance and "fairy-tale kindness" will lead the EU into huge problems, although they’re already quite noticeable.
I get the feeling that the EU was living in some kind of rose-colored fantasy, thinking that if they gave shelter to the destitute and unfortunate, these newcomers would start working for the good of the country and helping the hosts who gave them shelter... Ha-ha-ha! NO!!!! They’ll become a burden on their hosts, forcing them not only to work harder to support this dead weight, if I may use that word, but also to demand more rights for themselves than their "hosts" have! Why didn’t the EU adopt simple rules: if you’ve asked for asylum, we’ll take you and your family in, and you and your family will receive benefits for a whole year.
BUT! YOU and your family must adapt - learn the language (at least at a basic level), obtain a professional qualification or find work in your existing field, and start paying taxes and working for the benefit of the country that has taken you in, so that you can become a full-fledged citizen rather than a one-sided, resource-consuming resident?
If you can’t manage that in a year, we were happy to have you here, we helped you, but now goodbye forever - you can’t adapt to our rules! With a complete ban on entry into any EU country!  That would be the only, and perfect, incentive, and a truly mutually beneficial alliance between the country and the people who genuinely need help but are ready to contribute to those who helped them!

In Nature we have a similar organism who tends to kill the host.
Some get cured some kill the host.
I don't know how many children get fed up once they see their parents exposing their parasitical traits.
10 to 15% I hope that number is .

[DrBeer]

We cannot speak against China because if they are making robots it is not a very negative thing at this time. Because so far no one has found anything wrong with robots from there. Even if we do find it, we cannot imagine a bomb from it, so we are happy and jealous of this advance technology of China, they have made something that we do not have, so we should also invent this technology so that we can make many difficult tasks easier with their help. We can do this for lifeline, although some experts say that robots can be quite hostile in the coming time, how much truth there is in this, experts from other countries have not yet proven. Apart from this, it is also present in Japan, gradually many countries are adopting robots so that they can create a good economy of robots and the difficulties of humans become less easy.

Mercury was once used to treat intestinal obstruction, and at first, no problems were noticed either Problems arise later - not suddenly, but gradually, building up until they reach a critical point of no return. The total automation of human jobs will irreversibly lead to global unemployment. Or suggest an alternative - where will the millions and hundreds of millions of people go who will be replaced by humanoid or other robots, which will be much more profitable and less problematic for manufacturers?

P.S. Don’t confuse the automation of assembly lines in Japan with the total replacement of humans by robots in most sectors where people used to work.

[DiMarxist]

Snip

Mercury was once used to treat intestinal obstruction, and at first, no problems were noticed either Problems arise later - not suddenly, but gradually, building up until they reach a critical point of no return. The total automation of human jobs will irreversibly lead to global unemployment. Or suggest an alternative - where will the millions and hundreds of millions of people go who will be replaced by humanoid or other robots, which will be much more profitable and less problematic for manufacturers?

Nice example that you are giving but, I seems to see things differently. In everything we have it's advantage and disadvantage but critically looking at the Chinese situation I will consider it as necessary the reason is that, one China is first producing things to first satisfy themselves, that is meeting up with global demands. Of which China is the world second largest population with over a billion people people which literally means that to meet local demands in the Suppl chain China needs a kind of massive amounts of production which will not be possible with human labour.

We have to take note of the how peculiar that the Chinese situation is before going into conclusion, secondly China is a super world power which is competing with the United States virtually in every sector. The goal of the Chinese is to conquer the world through production and manufacturing and that will not be possible via human efforts, we should know that massive production like this is also creating jobs because, there has to be a supply chain, distribution, packaging, transportations and even logistics which to me is jobs been created as a result of Robotization of the economy.

[fruktik]

The problem is that "inventing" manual labor where it isn’t needed doesn’t achieve anything. Manual labor will still be more expensive than "robotized" labor, and maintenance of the robots’ technical components will most likely boil down to simply replacing modules - a task that robotic systems can perform extremely quickly and cheaply.
 
And while the statement "China isn’t ignoring these problems" sounds debatable - it would be more accurate to say that China is aware of them, but there are no real and effective solutions yet.

The point is that today’s China cannot simply abandon robotization. While it might be theoretically possible, major tech companies would inevitably lobby to protect their interests—no one is going to shut down their operations overnight and walk away from billions in profit.

That is the core problem. It appears the current economic model has reached a point from which there is virtually no way out.

Automation will only continue to gain momentum, and manual labor will become a relic of the past. While it may still be required in certain niches, the demand will be nowhere near what it once was. Unemployment will become a major headache for China, and as living standards gradually decline, the country will face a demographic collapse.

[cryptomaniac_xxx]

I've seen some videos of their lab about making humanoids and they're looking like humans. This is no longer a race of which glorious in robotics and AI because they always compete with the US.

Many of those vids are AI made. None of them is able to peel an egg.
The Robot revolution is not even at 1% and they claim much more.

It could be that some of their videos are real like their AI robot running and trying to break the 100 dash world record which it did if I'm not mistaken. And probably this is what Trump is afraid of, that China is beating them on the robotics and AI race.

I know that it might still be far before they can perfect it, but we all know that one idea starts very small but it will evolved so much in the next 5 years that it might be very hard not to acknowledge that China is making some grounds as compare to other countries, specially United States.

[fruktik]

It could be that some of their videos are real like their AI robot running and trying to break the 100 dash world record which it did if I'm not mistaken. And probably this is what Trump is afraid of, that China is beating them on the robotics and AI race.

I know that it might still be far before they can perfect it, but we all know that one idea starts very small but it will evolved so much in the next 5 years that it might be very hard not to acknowledge that China is making some grounds as compare to other countries, specially United States.

I was just thinking about a recent news story: the Chinese have created a highly realistic sex robot. You might ask, what’s the problem with that? Well, there is a problem—and a significant one at that. If such devices were to see widespread demand, it would lead to a serious demographic decline, which in turn would trigger dire economic consequences. So, it’s not all just fun and games. As it turns out, this trend is gaining momentum in that country. People are willing to purchase these artificial partners for their own personal use. Cyberpunk is knocking at the door. )

[Haunebu]

That is one long post op. Skimmed through it and understood what you were trying to convey here. Personally, I do feel that it's a double edged sword. Their population aging issues required robots, but the robots could screw them over which is why this is a complex topic.

We are all just taking sides here, but it will ultimately come down to how the Chinese government manage the transition. If they manage it well, they will continue prospering. If not, they will fall into despair. We will know with time whether this is a bomb or lifeline.

[DrBeer]

Snip

Mercury was once used to treat intestinal obstruction, and at first, no problems were noticed either Problems arise later - not suddenly, but gradually, building up until they reach a critical point of no return. The total automation of human jobs will irreversibly lead to global unemployment. Or suggest an alternative - where will the millions and hundreds of millions of people go who will be replaced by humanoid or other robots, which will be much more profitable and less problematic for manufacturers?

Nice example that you are giving but, I seems to see things differently. In everything we have it's advantage and disadvantage but critically looking at the Chinese situation I will consider it as necessary the reason is that, one China is first producing things to first satisfy themselves, that is meeting up with global demands. Of which China is the world second largest population with over a billion people people which literally means that to meet local demands in the Suppl chain China needs a kind of massive amounts of production which will not be possible with human labour.

We have to take note of the how peculiar that the Chinese situation is before going into conclusion, secondly China is a super world power which is competing with the United States virtually in every sector. The goal of the Chinese is to conquer the world through production and manufacturing and that will not be possible via human efforts, we should know that massive production like this is also creating jobs because, there has to be a supply chain, distribution, packaging, transportations and even logistics which to me is jobs been created as a result of Robotization of the economy.

On the one hand, you’ve perfectly highlighted the key advantages. On the other hand, you haven’t fully considered how this affects the long-term outlook - not from the perspective of solving problems, but from the perspective of global changes. It was for good reason that I cited examples of Chinese solutions that, in the short term, actually solved the problem but, in the long term, created even bigger problems. Let me remind you: the fight against sparrows and birth control...

They fought the damage caused by sparrows = they ended up with millions of victims of famine and ecosystem degradation
They fought uncontrolled population growth = they ended up with the world’s second-most populous country… whose population is aging rapidly, creating a severe imbalance between the working-age population and retirees.

The same applies to the economy, an export-oriented economy (which is exactly what China has), it relies on export markets, and now China is already facing overproduction and high pressure on profits (low margins, high volumes),  and for businesses, the only way out is to reduce internal costs - namely, wages, social insurance, and the provision of meals and housing for employees, etc. How? And this is where we return to the topic’s title.

[WillyAp]

The same applies to the economy, an export-oriented economy (which is exactly what China has), it relies on export markets, and now China is already facing overproduction and high pressure on profits (low margins, high volumes),  and for businesses, the only way out is to reduce internal costs - namely, wages, social insurance, and the provision of meals and housing for employees, etc. How? And this is where we return to the topic’s title.

That is only one part of an otherwise huge country.
People seem to judge the entire country based on a few videos, of which 40% is just AI produced.
The rural population has hardly any internet. Communities have railways to bring parts of their livestock into a city where they can sell it for a higher price. Money for a change other than the local barter business. 

Lets face it you cannot trust the numbers coming out of China. Out of many countries actually. Forging numbers is the new game. 

[DrBeer]

The same applies to the economy, an export-oriented economy (which is exactly what China has), it relies on export markets, and now China is already facing overproduction and high pressure on profits (low margins, high volumes),  and for businesses, the only way out is to reduce internal costs - namely, wages, social insurance, and the provision of meals and housing for employees, etc. How? And this is where we return to the topic’s title.

That is only one part of an otherwise huge country.
People seem to judge the entire country based on a few videos, of which 40% is just AI produced.
The rural population has hardly any internet. Communities have railways to bring parts of their livestock into a city where they can sell it for a higher price. Money for a change other than the local barter business. 

Lets face it you cannot trust the numbers coming out of China. Out of many countries actually. Forging numbers is the new game. 

I completely agree, and I can confirm that the Chinese government often "ndulges" in attempts to paint a rosy picture that differs from reality. Moreover, this applies to all areas of life and the economy. There is a sufficient amount of interesting analysis of the real situation in China, and both the facts and the figures contradict the official narrative.
I’ve been to China once. I was truly impressed by their modern cities, but as soon as I traveled deeper into the country, the picture took a sharp turn for the worse with every kilometer.

P.S. State propaganda has always existed and always will,  its main goal is to "hammer home" the narrative that "everything is fine here, we’re the best, and we have the very best for our people". I remember this from the propaganda in the USSR… you know how that all ended
 

[Abiky]

Mercury was once used to treat intestinal obstruction, and at first, no problems were noticed either Problems arise later - not suddenly, but gradually, building up until they reach a critical point of no return. The total automation of human jobs will irreversibly lead to global unemployment. Or suggest an alternative - where will the millions and hundreds of millions of people go who will be replaced by humanoid or other robots, which will be much more profitable and less problematic for manufacturers?

P.S. Don’t confuse the automation of assembly lines in Japan with the total replacement of humans by robots in most sectors where people used to work.

It's true that automation of human jobs will lead to global unemployment. But that doesn't mean the economy will collapse. In fact, many experts are predicting that the future will be one where you will do absolutely nothing while AI and robots take care of everything. They will handle everything from production, to capital allocation, etc. The economy will be flowing as usual. Only that instead of being driven by humans, it will be driven by machines. Governments will simply collect taxes from companies (those in-charge of the AI and robotics infrastructure) directly. Meanwhile, people will get paid some money (Universal Basic Income) while doing nothing.

China knows that robots are the future. So it's deploying them at a large scale to take over the world. The country is advancing at a very fast pace. Perhaps it will reach as far as surpassing the US someday? Only time will tell...

[DrBeer]

Mercury was once used to treat intestinal obstruction, and at first, no problems were noticed either Problems arise later - not suddenly, but gradually, building up until they reach a critical point of no return. The total automation of human jobs will irreversibly lead to global unemployment. Or suggest an alternative - where will the millions and hundreds of millions of people go who will be replaced by humanoid or other robots, which will be much more profitable and less problematic for manufacturers?

P.S. Don’t confuse the automation of assembly lines in Japan with the total replacement of humans by robots in most sectors where people used to work.

It's true that automation of human jobs will lead to global unemployment. But that doesn't mean the economy will collapse. In fact, many experts are predicting that the future will be one where you will do absolutely nothing while AI and robots take care of everything. They will handle everything from production, to capital allocation, etc. The economy will be flowing as usual. Only that instead of being driven by humans, it will be driven by machines. Governments will simply collect taxes from companies (those in-charge of the AI and robotics infrastructure) directly. Meanwhile, people will get paid some money (Universal Basic Income) while doing nothing.

China knows that robots are the future. So it's deploying them at a large scale to take over the world. The country is advancing at a very fast pace. Perhaps it will reach as far as surpassing the US someday? Only time will tell...

I’m familiar with this theory. It vaguely resembles the utopian idea of communism.
I’ll ask a couple of very simple questions:
- In this model, who will manage the distribution of resources, and who will decide who consumes what and how much?
- How will a society function when there is no employment, an abundance of free time, and no consumption issues?