A good move or stupid idea?

[Royal Cap]

Well the biggest concern is fund recovery. As there is no way to back up the private key with 12 or 24 words, once you lose your device, all your funds are gone for good. Self custody is what cryptocurrencies stand for. The very concept of self custody is about full control of your funds. The ability to deny fund recovery in the name of security goes against this idea, At least  I wouldn't use this for me.

[HajiBagi]

Today or maybe last night, the Keystone company decided to put an end to recovery seed control by the owners, here is the message I got from them.



Tell me friends, how does a seedless architecture sounds to you?

The wallet seed will never leave the chip, that's good but the user never know the seed is quite unique and stupid. I have never known any Bitcoin or cryptocurrency wallet, that does not give private keys or mnemonic seed to users.

With Bitcoin and cryptocurrency, reminders are simple and very similar: It's your key, it's your mnemonic seed, it's your coin.
Another important reminder is always back up your wallet.

Now, Keystore no longer want Keystore users to know about their wallet seed and have ability to back up their wallets. That's speechlessly stupid from the manufacturer and dangerous for users, if you ask my opinion.

I thought it was only me that see that speech sounds stupid, because why will they retired the users seed phrase or wallet back up? What is there plan or what are they planning to do? I have never seen any wallet or any crypto wallet that don’t will not have a back up or seed phrase, i think keystone will have their reasons for doing that but no matter how many excuses they bring, no one will look at what they said and think they sound good, and if this was true, that means many users will want to stop using their wallet, and they lose many customers soon because this does not sound good.

[Die_empty]

I thought it was only me that see that speech sounds stupid, because why will they retired the users seed phrase or wallet back up? What is there plan or what are they planning to do? I have never seen any wallet or any crypto wallet that don’t will not have a back up or seed phrase, i think keystone will have their reasons for doing that but no matter how many excuses they bring, no one will look at what they said and think they sound good, and if this was true, that means many users will want to stop using their wallet, and they lose many customers soon because this does not sound good.

I don't care to know how he got the information. All I care is to verify the authenticity of the information and this is what the Keystone has to say about it.



Op, try to verify every information before taking any action. Thank you for bringing it to public attention. Now you know who you are dealing with and it's good you shouldn't interact with them. If you already click on any link, don't interact further with them.

The message that OP got was not from Keystone. It has been confirmed that it was a phishing attempt.

As a matter of fact, Keystone & Unipass made a merger, and in this article: https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/account-labs-emerges-from-unipass-and-keystone-merger-forging-ahead-in-web3-account-abstraction-301829206.html

They created a Seedless wallet by using the social media option as the backup or access without needed some private-key/mnemonic. Still scary, cause these can be more easily compromised.

The issue with the seedless wallet is real. Instead of having a seed phrase that would be used for recovery, a social media account would be the backup. This simply means handing over your funds and access to it to third parties.

[BitMaxz]

If it requested to log in a wallet with wallet ID (got from information sent to your email), and wallet password, and it's inconvenient. Email can be compromised if people don't secure their emails properly.

Fortunately it's possible to back up a blockchain.com wallet for wallet recovery and if people have their wallet recovery seed phrase, they can migrate to other wallets like Electrum wallet.

Like this.
[Guide] Use CPFP if your stucked transactions from blockchain.com wallet.

I don't know how this wallet changed recent years because I've no longer used it.

That wallet ID is the thing that is missing from me. I think it was sent to my old email before, but there's no way to recover my email without my old SIM card number.
I still have a small amount of BTC on my blockchain wallet, and I am trying to recover it using my backup seed, but I no longer have access to email or the required wallet ID to get the exact wallet.

I still want to recover them honestly, because the price of BTC is growing; at least it's still around $600 if I convert them with the current price and possible can increase more on the next ATH.
The worst thing I did in the past was that I gave my SIM card to my kid without maintaining the SIM card balance until it become inactive no signal anymore. I didn't imagine that it would happen in the future that I would need that SIM card again to recover my wallet.
Unlike other wallets that only require a seed phrase backup, you can immediately recover them in other wallets and make a transaction immediately.

If I remember correctly, I also have a wallet.aes.json file from the blockchain, the info wallet, including the seed backup, but that file is no longer in possession after I formatted my laptop before.

[slaman29]

I'm going to have to read this more to understand but it seems impossible to my mind that you can recover something without needing to remember or write down an access be it key or seed.

Only way I can think of is biometric but that needs storage somewhere and if something can read me, it will cost a lot or it will break.

It's nothing fancy, it's called MPC, if you've used Binance wallet or other exchange provided web3 wallet you probably have used one, it uses distributed key generation protocol to build the adress from generate key shares. If your wallet brand itself as keyless, never told you to backup your seed phrase but instead upload it to your account's cloud storage and so on, you're definitely using MPC setup. This has been common practice to prevent user from leaking their own seed phrase.

Thanks for the explain, think I get it and no I've never used a wallet provided from any exchange. MM is my only Web3 wallet, and anything else that come along after that I never tried.

Cloud Storage, also, something I'll never fully trust, knowing just how badly the security of those things are (due to humans).

[Comeacross]

Update


X link

Keystone wallet just announced today that they experienced a data breach.

According to them payments information, seed phrase and private keys were not exposed but names, contact details and shipping address were leaked. That's probably how they got op email address.

If you're using Keystone wallet, you should be very careful now. This is how Ledger started with data leaks before the incident that led to lose of assets.

[moneystery]

Update

Keystone wallet just announced today that they experienced a data breach.

According to them payments information, seed phrase and private keys were not exposed but names, contact details and shipping address were leaked. That's probably how they got op email address.

If you're using Keystone wallet, you should be very careful now. This is how Ledger started with data leaks before the incident that led to lose of assets.

That was such bad news because the shipping information could contain sensitive data that could be used by anyone. There have been so many wrench attack cases happening lately, and when that data is sold on the dark web and bought by criminals, it could put the recipients in danger. If anyone is harmed from this data leak, Keystone is the one who's most responsible because they weren't able to protect the data securely.

[suzanne5223]

The air-gapped, open-source, and verifiable firmware is a good feature, but removing user access to the seed cancels a big advantage, which I believe most self-custodial users won't like.
From my own understanding, I believe the term seedless wallet architecture sounds convenient on paper, but its core principle is not convenient for recovery like a seed phrase (or mnemonic).
I do treat it as a red flag and look for alternatives.

[Chinesebaby]

Update


X link

Keystone wallet just announced today that they experienced a data breach.

According to them payments information, seed phrase and private keys were not exposed but names, contact details and shipping address were leaked. That's probably how they got op email address.

If you're using Keystone wallet, you should be very careful now. This is how Ledger started with data leaks before the incident that led to lose of assets.

At least i'm happy that Keystone wallet have now been able to make an official announcement regarding the Gmail OP just shared on this thread when they were claiming to stop the use of wallet seed phrase. Because immediately i saw that i was curious to want to know what other measure was Keystone trying to put in place that will enable its users recover their funds if they lost their devices, because that was the primary reason why wallet seed phrases was added as an important feature. While secondly, this should be another reason why you must always verify emails from the companys trusted social media handle before believing it 100%.

[Mayor of ogba]

Update


X link

Keystone wallet just announced today that they experienced a data breach.

According to them payments information, seed phrase and private keys were not exposed but names, contact details and shipping address were leaked. That's probably how they got op email address.

If you're using Keystone wallet, you should be very careful now. This is how Ledger started with data leaks before the incident that led to lose of assets.

Thank you for letting us know that the email OP shared with us aren't from keystone but from the people who gained unauthorized access to keystone website. Since unknown people have had access to keystone website that means such a thing could happen again in the future, so if I'm among the people using keystone hardware wallet to hold my bitcoin I would move my Bitcoin to another wallet for safety, because prevention is far better than secure.

[Hazink]

Well the biggest concern is fund recovery. As there is no way to back up the private key with 12 or 24 words, once you lose your device, all your funds are gone for good. Self custody is what cryptocurrencies stand for. The very concept of self custody is about full control of your funds. The ability to deny fund recovery in the name of security goes against this idea, At least  I wouldn't use this for me.

Proposing a way for their customers to lose their money easily without any form of hope or means of recovery, for them, the seedless wallet will protect users from hackers and scammers, but it's also one of the easiest ways to ever use and lose one coin, imagine the device being stolen, damaged or something and that will be the end of what ever that's been held on the wallet.

[Uhwuchukwu53]

Update


X link

Keystone wallet just announced today that they experienced a data breach.

According to them payments information, seed phrase and private keys were not exposed but names, contact details and shipping address were leaked. That's probably how they got op email address.

If you're using Keystone wallet, you should be very careful now. This is how Ledger started with data leaks before the incident that led to lose of assets.

Thank you for letting us know that the email OP shared with us aren't from keystone but from the people who gained unauthorized access to keystone website. Since unknown people have had access to keystone website that means such a thing could happen again in the future, so if I'm among the people using keystone hardware wallet to hold my bitcoin I would move my Bitcoin to another wallet for safety, because prevention is far better than secure.

I will agree with you that prevention is far better than anything that brings in regret, most times it's good in trying new things but factoring out and applying sense of details is eminent because the system is full of different developer that wants to dominate the market by creating different that the will easy those that is holding or trading Bitcoin and crypto currency generally, just like what we know primarily about wallet seed phrase,where user lack it's access, may sound strange and need good clarification before taking any step in utilizing it's opportunity, for instance just me saving money in bank where ATM card is issue to me fully activated without password or pin that can allowed me access the saving when I hard issue of loss or attack, it's not convincing until more and better understanding directions is presented.

[PVequalNRT]

Keystone wallet just announced today that they experienced a data breach.

According to them payments information, seed phrase and private keys were not exposed but names, contact details and shipping address were leaked. That's probably how they got op email address.

If you're using Keystone wallet, you should be very careful now. This is how Ledger started with data leaks before the incident that led to lose of assets.

The hardware wallets are one of the most tasted components of Bitcoin in ecosystem. I don't think in the history of hardware sales the cold wallets are been attacked this way until recently and I really wondered if this is an attack to shame the idea that hardware wallet are not that great as they said. The way customers data has been breach, I think people should have to start filling anonymous information to get their wallet in other to stay safe.

There maybe some people right now that are having hardware and during the time they filled in their information with take one's, they knew something like this could happened and they decided to do it that way. We need to go back to the traditional ways of Satoshi.

[Nanga Parbat]

The hardware wallets are one of the most tasted components of Bitcoin in ecosystem. I don't think in the history of hardware sales the cold wallets are been attacked this way until recently and I really wondered if this is an attack to shame the idea that hardware wallet are not that great as they said. The way customers data has been breach, I think people should have to start filling anonymous information to get their wallet in other to stay safe.

There maybe some people right now that are having hardware and during the time they filled in their information with take one's, they knew something like this could happened and they decided to do it that way. We need to go back to the traditional ways of Satoshi.

Firstly, they have done good hype about hardware wallets and their positives, but now suddenly recently too many attacks and enough losses are increasing security threats, which are surely done by some groups or people because they are always preparing for this and understand the consequences of this as well. Without any doubt now, it's time to have things that are giving better security and safety of assets. With these doing things anonymously, surely they have enough advantages, but during buying, giving data with all the information, which is another threat, is never being allowed to stay on a good level. Having wallets that need no personal data or anything related to the buyer is always a better option, but it also needs to stay at a secure level for staying safe.