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Author Topic: How United are the States?  (Read 2393 times)
haudenschield
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May 02, 2014, 08:42:28 PM
 #1

Can anyone suggest how Americans generally view the partnership with other states?
Does each state have a strong collective identity, or is it rarely expressed? Is the sense of membership of the USA always stronger than towards individual states?
For example, is there any obvious disquiet about the disproportionate contribution to the economic situation that somes states seem to have contributed?
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May 02, 2014, 09:57:21 PM
 #2

People from some states feel far more loyal to that state than the US as a whole. The most notable example would be Texas.

When Texans travel, they are likely to tell people they're from Texas, not from America.

Although this is more an issue of pride and has nothing to do with patriotism. Most of Texas and the surrounding states are extremely patriotic. All of America's states have totally friendly borders with other states, and even Canada in some spots. No passport required - in fact, a lot of the time there is no I.D. required. There's just a sign on the road that says "You are now entering this state."

The U.S. has a lot of solidarity when we aren't talking about partisan politics.

The world is so connected nowadays that people seem to care less about the distance between them. I can Skype a friend who is 1,000 miles away. Who cares if he's in a different state? No big deal.

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May 02, 2014, 11:13:16 PM
 #3

A large number of people have been moving away from states with high taxes and heavy regulation of business (like New York and California) to states with low (or no) income taxes and a regulatory climate that is more friendly towards business (like Texas, Florida and North Dakota). The governor of Texas has been traveling to other states and actively recruiting businesses to relocate to Texas.
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May 03, 2014, 01:05:05 AM
 #4

I live in Europe now. If I ever wanted to emigrate and start to live in the US which state is the best to live in? I heard that Texas is quite nice place, but people there does not like foreigners too much.


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BitcoinBobbeh
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May 03, 2014, 02:03:12 AM
 #5

I live in Europe now. If I ever wanted to emigrate and start to live in the US which state is the best to live in? I heard that Texas is quite nice place, but people there does not like foreigners too much.

There are better places for a European to start.

Try northern California.

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May 03, 2014, 02:54:40 AM
 #6

A large number of people have been moving away from states with high taxes and heavy regulation of business (like New York and California) to states with low (or no) income taxes and a regulatory climate that is more friendly towards business (like Texas, Florida and North Dakota).

This can be counter-productive.

Normally, Democrat ruled states have very high tax rates, while those ruled by the GOP have lower rates. When businesses move from high-tax states to low-tax states, they also take with them the mostly Democrat-oriented employees. As a result, the GOP becomes weak in these states. Look at the case of Nevada. It turned blue for the exact same reason.

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May 03, 2014, 04:47:36 AM
 #7

A large number of people have been moving away from states with high taxes and heavy regulation of business (like New York and California) to states with low (or no) income taxes and a regulatory climate that is more friendly towards business (like Texas, Florida and North Dakota).

This can be counter-productive.

Normally, Democrat ruled states have very high tax rates, while those ruled by the GOP have lower rates. When businesses move from high-tax states to low-tax states, they also take with them the mostly Democrat-oriented employees. As a result, the GOP becomes weak in these states. Look at the case of Nevada. It turned blue for the exact same reason.

It is the mostly white-collar jobs which are moving to low-tax states. Most of the employees, working with these firms are pro-GOP. The recent phenomenon of Red states turning blue has more to do with demography than inter-regional migration.

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May 03, 2014, 05:06:50 AM
 #8

It is the mostly white-collar jobs which are moving to low-tax states. Most of the employees, working with these firms are pro-GOP. The recent phenomenon of Red states turning blue has more to do with demography than inter-regional migration.

Some of these white-collar industries (such as Banking, Equity trading.etc) are heavily dominated by the pro-Democrat types. Demography is also an important part in the change, but can't ignore this factor also.

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May 03, 2014, 06:48:27 AM
 #9


Does each state have a strong collective identity, or is it rarely expressed?

Yes, and yes.  Americans seem to be oblivious to the fact that Americans in different parts of the empire are very different from one another.  Yet the entire history of the US is ethnic strife between regions.  Take the Civil War for example.  The North says that it was about slavery, the South says that it was about states' rights.  Both views true but superficial.  The truth is that New Englanders and Southerners don't get along and both sides wanted to expand their way of life into the western territories.

Due to our two party system, the various ethnicities have to form coalitions.  So right now New England and the Pacific regions are with the Democrats, and the Interior West and the South are with the Democrats.  The Midwest is the swing region.  These coalitions hide many of the regional differences.  For example the Republicans of Georgia and Wyoming have very little in common.

Because Americans do not acknowledge the fact that American politics are driven by ethnicity people use proxies to distinguish friend from foe.

Modern US politics is dominated by really trivial issues, that we call "wedge issues".  The US is in a very secure situation.  The idea of a military invasion is inconceivable and so US foreign policy can be capricious rather than focused on strategic concerns.  So things of no importance to the US drive the foreign policy, such as the latest in Israeli settlement activity or gay rights in Russia.  These things cannot possibly affect Americans, and yet they receive a huge amount of attention.

Other issues are just as trivial.  The more passionate people are about an issue the more likely it is to be a wedge issue.  It is really just like people's loyalties to sports teams, entirely silly.

But remember that this is all under the surface.  Many people just look at themselves and their neighbors and say "we are Americans".  They have no real awareness that by defining themselves as "Americans" only they are therefore defining the term in such a way that it doesn't fit other Americans, which is what causes the petty struggles that dominate US politics.


 
For example, is there any obvious disquiet about the disproportionate contribution to the economic situation that somes states seem to have contributed?

Yes.  Many resent the fact that all of our money goes to DC, NYC, their surroundings (Maryland, Connecticut, New Jersey) and a few other places favored by the elite.  Sometimes you will see an absurd map floating around claiming the opposite, these maps show DC, Maryland, and NYC being the ones supporting the rest of the country.  Ha.  DC's only export is government.  NYC's main export is banking (meaning that they are pulling money from the rest of the country).  Maryland is just where DC workers live.  For example we live in Maryland because my wife works in DC.  She works in DC because DC prints the money.  We would rather live somewhere else, but other places don't have the ability to print infinite money.  If bitcoin ever replaces the dollar we will see a total collapse of DC, NYC, and a few other places.


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May 03, 2014, 07:03:50 AM
 #10

The states are too united in my opinion.

The dictator Lincoln turned our country from a collection of distinct states to a single country with superficial differences between the states.

Any differences between the states are merely "allowed" by the Federal government if they have no real impact.

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May 04, 2014, 01:38:46 AM
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United states are not United you can see that clearly, Dems repubs and other parties, how do you call that United?
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May 04, 2014, 03:53:07 AM
 #12

United states are not United you can see that clearly, Dems repubs and other parties, how do you call that United?

All united behind the idea of bigger government and more debt.

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May 04, 2014, 04:25:50 AM
 #13

United states are not United you can see that clearly, Dems repubs and other parties, how do you call that United?
All united behind the idea of bigger government and more debt.

I disagree with that. The US public debt increased significantly only when the Democrats were in power. The GOP, whenever it could tried to reduce the fiscal deficit and the public debt.

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May 04, 2014, 04:38:17 AM
 #14

US politics are even united. United under a single political party. That single political party pretends it's two parties that agree on every major issue and disagree on a few hot button social issues. This keeps Americans bickering with each other about trivial crap while their nation is stolen from them.

Case in point the posts above and below this one.

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beetcoin
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May 04, 2014, 04:44:01 AM
 #15

United states are not United you can see that clearly, Dems repubs and other parties, how do you call that United?
All united behind the idea of bigger government and more debt.

I disagree with that. The US public debt increased significantly only when the Democrats were in power. The GOP, whenever it could tried to reduce the fiscal deficit and the public debt.

where did you get this info? clinton left a surplus; obama sent out some stimulus because the economy was fractured. let's also not forget that republicans make a killing with the defense industry - it's kind of their thing.
notbatman
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May 05, 2014, 05:44:22 AM
 #16


Does each state have a strong collective identity, or is it rarely expressed?

Yes, and yes.  Americans seem to be oblivious to the fact that Americans in different parts of the empire are very different from one another.  Yet the entire history of the US is ethnic strife between regions.  Take the Civil War for example.  The North says that it was about slavery, the South says that it was about states' rights.  Both views true but superficial.  The truth is that New Englanders and Southerners don't get along and both sides wanted to expand their way of life into the western territories.

Due to our two party system, the various ethnicities have to form coalitions.  So right now New England and the Pacific regions are with the Democrats, and the Interior West and the South are with the Democrats.  The Midwest is the swing region.  These coalitions hide many of the regional differences.  For example the Republicans of Georgia and Wyoming have very little in common.

Because Americans do not acknowledge the fact that American politics are driven by ethnicity people use proxies to distinguish friend from foe.

Modern US politics is dominated by really trivial issues, that we call "wedge issues".  The US is in a very secure situation.  The idea of a military invasion is inconceivable and so US foreign policy can be capricious rather than focused on strategic concerns.  So things of no importance to the US drive the foreign policy, such as the latest in Israeli settlement activity or gay rights in Russia.  These things cannot possibly affect Americans, and yet they receive a huge amount of attention.

Other issues are just as trivial.  The more passionate people are about an issue the more likely it is to be a wedge issue.  It is really just like people's loyalties to sports teams, entirely silly.

But remember that this is all under the surface.  Many people just look at themselves and their neighbors and say "we are Americans".  They have no real awareness that by defining themselves as "Americans" only they are therefore defining the term in such a way that it doesn't fit other Americans, which is what causes the petty struggles that dominate US politics.


 
For example, is there any obvious disquiet about the disproportionate contribution to the economic situation that somes states seem to have contributed?

Yes.  Many resent the fact that all of our money goes to DC, NYC, their surroundings (Maryland, Connecticut, New Jersey) and a few other places favored by the elite.  Sometimes you will see an absurd map floating around claiming the opposite, these maps show DC, Maryland, and NYC being the ones supporting the rest of the country.  Ha.  DC's only export is government.  NYC's main export is banking (meaning that they are pulling money from the rest of the country).  Maryland is just where DC workers live.  For example we live in Maryland because my wife works in DC.  She works in DC because DC prints the money.  We would rather live somewhere else, but other places don't have the ability to print infinite money.  If bitcoin ever replaces the dollar we will see a total collapse of DC, NYC, and a few other places.

A massive forge is being built in NYC they plan on being the next silicon valley.
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May 05, 2014, 11:19:45 AM
 #17

Several astute posts upthread.

I wonder if any of you agree with my theory that many Americans have felt more united due to TV, McDonalds, Walmart, baseball, NFL, pulling them into a common culture, but lurking underneath are ethnic and regional differences that are set to explode into conflict once the Federal debt spigot is turned off over this decade.

In short, we've been held together with massive debt-based consumerism and Federal government largesse (i.e. 75% of GDP now), but our ethnic differences are deep seated and will rise back up once the former dies.

See also the separatist movements post I did in another thread.

I live in Europe now. If I ever wanted to emigrate and start to live in the US which state is the best to live in? I heard that Texas is quite nice place, but people there does not like foreigners too much.

There are better places for a European to start.

Try northern California.

The Hill country region of Texas is populated with Germans.

USA is a melting pot. Go live any where and you can fit in if you don't expect too much from others. I've even done the Hispanic areas such as Corpus Christi or Brownsville. I've done inner city slums in New Orleans and Baton Rouge. I've done Los Angeles, Seattle, etc.

But if you are looking for something closer to European socialism yeah head to California for a duplicate of the fucked up socialism. In conservative regions you wouldn't want to express your politics as your neighbors wouldn't likely agree with you.

I don't know the North East well. I might not fit in there. I hate snow any way.

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May 05, 2014, 11:57:37 AM
 #18

Very united when it comes right down to the crunch

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May 05, 2014, 12:20:41 PM
 #19

United states are not United you can see that clearly, Dems repubs and other parties, how do you call that United?
All united behind the idea of bigger government and more debt.

I disagree with that. The US public debt increased significantly only when the Democrats were in power. The GOP, whenever it could tried to reduce the fiscal deficit and the public debt.

The Republicans had control of the House, Senate and presidency for several years under Bush. Which year did they not run a deficit?

Reagan ran up huge debts, the Bush wars added a lot more debt. For a brief moment, using some unscrupulous accounting techniques there was a surplus under Clinton, that quickly went away.

The US is united under the fact that we have a $20 trillion debt that continues to grow with hundreds of billions of dollars paid toward just the interest on that debt. We will soon owe more in interest than we can even bring in from taxes. We will be united in our own economic destruction.

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May 05, 2014, 01:11:09 PM
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^^^ Still no one added as much debt as Obama has done in the last 6 years. Check this (don't know whether this is 100% accurate or not):


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