our USA education system sucks and is obsolete

[Elwar]

It is all about supply and demand.

He mentions that 98% of kindergarteners have this great creative instinct.

So...if there is a demand for such a thing...you have a supply consisting of billions of people that can think at least at the level of a kindergartener.

That is wonderful, supply covered.

Now, what if you want someone with the knowledge to transfer electrons over a large distance at a certain frequency converting it to useful information...then you may need to spend some time to figure out how such things work and might require a background that allows you to understand each of the pieces that go together to get that knowledge. Or more importantly, to come up with new ways of doing such things, better.

Is there a large supply of such people? Is there a large demand for cell phone technology?


But you have a choice, you can be someone that is in plentiful supply with little demand or you can be someone in high demand with limited supply. The result tends to be that you will not have much power (money) if you are part of a huge supply with little demand, while someone that is in huge demand with limited supply will have more power (money).

It tends to be human nature to want more power, not less.

If you want to not learn about things that are in demand...go for it, find yourself. Offer to the world that which billions of other people can offer and find out quickly how well that works out for you. You can artistically put a Subway sub together (until someone else comes along that will do it cheaper).

[TrailingComet]

Still US higher ed in pockets is the best in the world and attracts elite students every year

[umair127]

That's exactly what's going on, teachers want children to memorise answers, I won't use the word 'fact' because that means that the answers people give would have to be correct, so you're having whole generations growing up not knowing basic English and Maths because everybody is so focused on these ridiculous tests. If you think I'm bad, the next generation isn't going to know the multiplication table or know how to do basic grammar soon enough and they'll leave school under false pretences and wonder why they can't even get a starting job at a food chain despite getting A's in everything because the teachers will have lied to them about their future prospects.

I dont know if you ever had watched good times show, but thats what happen to AJ, they passed him just to get to graduate, nor to care if he learned anything in those years of his education. so this coming from a show in the early 80's show saying we had this problem for a very long time.

[Elwar]

Still US higher ed in pockets is the best in the world and attracts elite students every year

Higher education in the US allows people to choose their college.

[Elwar]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

[bryant.coleman]

Still US higher ed in pockets is the best in the world and attracts elite students every year

That is right. There are a lot of foreign students studying in the US from countries such as South Korea, China and India. And recently the Saudis have also realized its importance.

More Saudi Arabians studying in the U.S

http://articles.latimes.com/2013/nov/24/local/la-me-saudi-student-20131125

The club is one sign of the rapid rise of Saudi Arabians studying in the United States. Those numbers fell dramatically after the Sept. 11 attacks; the number of Saudi students dropped by almost a quarter in 2002 and continued to fall for the next two years. But the numbers have grown steadily since 2005 and doubled from the 2010 to 2012 academic years, according to a recent survey. The number of Saudi students in the U.S. last year grew to 44,566 — a nearly 30% increase from 2011. The country ranked behind only China, India and South Korea in the number of students studying in U.S. colleges and universities.

[umair127]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

[sana8410]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

[noviapriani]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

It's hysterical that he actually said that, mostly because he's right and that's so rare for politicians

[umair127]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

It's hysterical that he actually said that, mostly because he's right and that's so rare for politicians

No he isn't.
Long term education decisions shouldn't always be driven by the market.
Often times the market is shortsighted and we undervalue many forms of education and art

The whole idea of university and scholarly pursuit should have at least some degree of independence both from political pressure and economics.

Some of the greatest advancements to human thought and philosophy have come from those deemed less valuable by the markets of their respective time.

[noviapriani]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

It's hysterical that he actually said that, mostly because he's right and that's so rare for politicians

No he isn't.
Long term education decisions shouldn't always be driven by the market.
Often times the market is shortsighted and we undervalue many forms of education and art

The whole idea of university and scholarly pursuit should have at least some degree of independence both from political pressure and economics.

Some of the greatest advancements to human thought and philosophy have come from those deemed less valuable by the markets of their respective time.

We should be encouraging STEM studies. I'm not saying I'm against you going for an English or liberal arts degree, it's just I believe if were going to help someone get an education it should be in science, technology or math, so they could possibly use it in the future for something other than making sure the drive-through orders are correct.

[sana8410]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

It's hysterical that he actually said that, mostly because he's right and that's so rare for politicians

No he isn't.
Long term education decisions shouldn't always be driven by the market.
Often times the market is shortsighted and we undervalue many forms of education and art

The whole idea of university and scholarly pursuit should have at least some degree of independence both from political pressure and economics.

Some of the greatest advancements to human thought and philosophy have come from those deemed less valuable by the markets of their respective time.

We should be encouraging STEM studies. I'm not saying I'm against you going for an English or liberal arts degree, it's just I believe if were going to help someone get an education it should be in science, technology or math, so they could possibly use it in the future for something other than making sure the drive-through orders are correct.

I don't think anyone is saying that non-STEM fields should be funded while STEM fields aren't funded.
There's nothing really wrong with that , but as far as practical application is concerned, obviously STEM fields are much more likely to be paid back. I don't think loans should be issued to arts and science majors as though they are all of equal risk. If you're going into a field that is less likely to be able to afford to pay back the loan, then that should factor into whether you get a loan, and it should factor into the loan amount as well.

[counter]

What he talks about in the video is not just a problem with the US system, it's a problem pretty much everywhere in the world. The problem with the US system (I think) is that kids are not allowed to fail, so you bring the standards down so much so that everyone passes, and you limit bright children by forcing them to the standard.

I think that is only part of the problem.  There is also the part that leaves those children caught in the middle of this transition to get caught up in a losing battle where a degree or diploma may not be an option.  Many lives will be affected by this not just the childrens but also the society as a whole.  This issue will obviously have a negative effect on future generations in many ways.

[Wilikon]

Young children could face bullying charges in city



Children as young as kindergarten-age could face misdemeanor charges for bullying under a proposed law advancing in a Southern California city.

The Carson City Council gave preliminary approval this week to an ordinance that would target anyone from kindergarten to age 25 who makes another person feel “terrorized, frightened, intimidated, threatened, harassed or molested” with no legitimate purpose.

A final vote is set for May 20, according to the Daily Breeze (http://bit.ly/1g3JLNT ).

First-time offenders could be ticketed for an infraction and fined $100. A second infraction would cost $200, and a third-time offense could bring a criminal misdemeanor charge.

“If a child is bullying someone, and a parent has to pay a $100 fine as a result of that, a responsible parent will realize their child needs some help,” said Councilman Mike Gipson, who introduced the ordinance and is spearheading a campaign to make Carson bully-free.

Adults who bully would be charged with either an infraction or a misdemeanor, which could come with jail time.

http://news.yahoo.com/young-children-could-face-bullying-charges-city-164036847.html;_ylt=AwrTWfyoBm1T9SEAWpXQtDMD

[dwma]

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

The problem is that online degrees can be scammed and cheating will be rampant.  Yea, they can put a webcam on you as you do the test, but even then.. come'on.  A smart lazy guy with much money will be able to work around that without a problem.

 I know people who are stuck with 1 class that they need an A in to get their GPA up high enough for their degree from our best state school.  They've literally spent thousands getting friends to help them.  The problem though is that the testing is done in person, while the learning is online.  So... at least the scam is prevented, but I wish the poor feller could just get his degree.

[TaunSew]

Stop using the STEM term.  Beyond a few niche engineering degrees, most of the STEM degrees are phucking useless in this economy.  As for engineering, there's been plenty of graduates since the 2008 recession who never got their foot in the door and many engineers older than 40 have been laid off.  There's many people with bachelor and masters in the sciences who can't find more than $13 a hour lab technician jobs.

Although I like this gem of a Math Graduate who is working at a Wharehouse.  
http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=157037383

In some ways a STEM degree can be worse than an Arts Degree, due to stem professors who bell curve their grades or deflate grades (some engineering professors, for instance, refuse to give higher than 60%) and that can ruin a student's GPA and prevents them from applying to law school, accounting, teaching program, et al.  

This economic worldwide recession has hurt a lot of white collar professionals but things seem to be going relatively well for blue collar labour, especially in the mining sector.  There are Welders and Technologists making $250K+ in the Canadian Oil Sands.  There's similar good money in the Australian Gold Mines.  Only downside to that life is the 86+ hour work rotations which can strain a marriage and family life but it's great for young men.

[DRZoidberg]

There is no ideal system. Every one has its own difficulties. No one can promise that after even the best college you admit you would find a perfect job. There's a good book of Malcolm Gladwell Outliers: The Story of Success.

[umair127]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

It's hysterical that he actually said that, mostly because he's right and that's so rare for politicians

No he isn't.
Long term education decisions shouldn't always be driven by the market.
Often times the market is shortsighted and we undervalue many forms of education and art

The whole idea of university and scholarly pursuit should have at least some degree of independence both from political pressure and economics.

Some of the greatest advancements to human thought and philosophy have come from those deemed less valuable by the markets of their respective time.

We should be encouraging STEM studies. I'm not saying I'm against you going for an English or liberal arts degree, it's just I believe if were going to help someone get an education it should be in science, technology or math, so they could possibly use it in the future for something other than making sure the drive-through orders are correct.

I don't think anyone is saying that non-STEM fields should be funded while STEM fields aren't funded.
There's nothing really wrong with that , but as far as practical application is concerned, obviously STEM fields are much more likely to be paid back. I don't think loans should be issued to arts and science majors as though they are all of equal risk. If you're going into a field that is less likely to be able to afford to pay back the loan, then that should factor into whether you get a loan, and it should factor into the loan amount as well.

   
if you are going to make more money as a science major
you should be willing to pay more for your credits than an art major

[sana8410]

The future of education will all be online.

Sure kids might go some place with teachers assistants or a type of "babysitter" for a few hours to work on their online assignments, but it will still all be done online.

Florida already offers a full, free curriculum online where you can get full credit including a high school diploma.

The teacher's union is unionizing teachers right out of a job.

On a side note regarding "education paradigms", most of college, and much of grad school could easily be done online. I haven't gone to a single lecture after like 4 months of starting, since I can get everything online and there are better teachers out there than what most schools offer (Khan Academy etc).

But with the huge demand for country club campuses and government guaranteeing loans (even if you pursue something like art history), tuition will never stop increasing.

Right now there's a proposal in California to have the state pay for STEM fields tuition. The student pays it back in the form of an income tax after graduation. The proposal is limited to STEM fields because "he doesn’t want a bunch of lazy arts students taking advantage of free tuition and paying back almost nothing from their negligible future salaries."

It's hysterical that he actually said that, mostly because he's right and that's so rare for politicians

No he isn't.
Long term education decisions shouldn't always be driven by the market.
Often times the market is shortsighted and we undervalue many forms of education and art

The whole idea of university and scholarly pursuit should have at least some degree of independence both from political pressure and economics.

Some of the greatest advancements to human thought and philosophy have come from those deemed less valuable by the markets of their respective time.

We should be encouraging STEM studies. I'm not saying I'm against you going for an English or liberal arts degree, it's just I believe if were going to help someone get an education it should be in science, technology or math, so they could possibly use it in the future for something other than making sure the drive-through orders are correct.

I don't think anyone is saying that non-STEM fields should be funded while STEM fields aren't funded.
There's nothing really wrong with that , but as far as practical application is concerned, obviously STEM fields are much more likely to be paid back. I don't think loans should be issued to arts and science majors as though they are all of equal risk. If you're going into a field that is less likely to be able to afford to pay back the loan, then that should factor into whether you get a loan, and it should factor into the loan amount as well.

   
if you are going to make more money as a science major
you should be willing to pay more for your credits than an art major

Yeah, I think schools should be able to adjust tuition rates based on demand for the class.
I think it's pretty obvious that tuition rates are inflated at this point, though; they are not even remotely commensurate with the value of the education that gets provided.
I guess what I'm getting at is that instead of paying more for science classes, students should just be paying less for art classes. At a certain level, we're saying the same thing. I just prefer the way I'm framing it.

[Wilikon]

http://www.examiner.com/article/private-school-teacher-cites-white-privilege-as-reason-for-common-core-nh?cid=db_articles