Monero Economy

[WaxMan]

After reading this whole thread and some topic on reddit i understood that there is no monero economy. Everything seems to be a fake. I'd rather invest all my money to BCN. Coz all of MRO's homies are doing the only business - talking about how smart they are, but in fact BCN team IS the team who work hard, and it’s their right not to communicate if they choose not to.

[CheesyCoiner]

After reading this whole thread and some topic on reddit i understood that there is no monero economy. Everything seems to be a fake. I'd rather invest all my money to BCN. Coz all of MRO's homies are doing the only business - talking about how smart they are, but in fact BCN team IS the team who work hard, and it’s their right not to communicate if they choose not to.

Wake up, dude. Welcome to the real world -_-
I don't know why everybody were so excited with these altcoins... If you want to waste another usefull minutes of your priceless time you can read others mro's threads and find out more information about monero's dirty schemes!

[MaleVoiceJohn]

After reading this whole thread and some topic on reddit i understood that there is no monero economy. Everything seems to be a fake. I'd rather invest all my money to BCN. Coz all of MRO's homies are doing the only business - talking about how smart they are, but in fact BCN team IS the team who work hard, and it’s their right not to communicate if they choose not to.

Wake up, dude. Welcome to the real world -_-
I don't know why everybody were so excited with these altcoins... If you want to waste another usefull minutes of your priceless time you can read others mro's threads and find out more information about monero's dirty schemes!

Are you sure that we should trust them?
Of course i know a lot of info about Bytecoin and i'm thinking that Monero is a regular clone of this amazing currency but not everything that you can read here is obviously true. Never forget about scams...
And never forget that BCN is much more cooler than MRO.

[pinky]

After reading this whole thread and some topic on reddit i understood that there is no monero economy. Everything seems to be a fake. I'd rather invest all my money to BCN. Coz all of MRO's homies are doing the only business - talking about how smart they are, but in fact BCN team IS the team who work hard, and it’s their right not to communicate if they choose not to.

Wake up, dude. Welcome to the real world -_-
I don't know why everybody were so excited with these altcoins... If you want to waste another usefull minutes of your priceless time you can read others mro's threads and find out more information about monero's dirty schemes!

Are you sure that we should trust them?
Of course i know a lot of Bytecoin and i'm thinking that Monero is a regular clone of this amazing currency but not everything that you can read here is obviously true. Never forget about scams...
And never forget that BCN is much more cooler than MRO.

Newbie having monolog with himself, lol
Someone is afraid of competition, just sell, it's not too late to escape out of BCN and you only lose 50% of money, better than waiting and lose 99%.

[Johnny Mnemonic]

Savers are useless non-contributors. Not that there's anything wrong with saving, but economies of scale don't depend on it, and so there's no economic justification to encourage it.

You cannot be more wrong. Saving is simply deferred spending. It's spending later vs. spending now. You could argue that incentivizing spending over saving is transferring prosperity from the future to the present. In the end it's a zero sum.

Don't be ridiculous. If the economy were to collapse tomorrow all your "deferred spending" and "future prosperity" did nothing to help it. Trade volume is always low when saving is incentivized, and won't increase in the future because people decide to suddenly stop saving en masse.

[jokudaman]

Don't be ridiculous. If the economy were to collapse tomorrow all your "deferred spending" and "future prosperity" did nothing to help it.

And what should we do? Forget about monero?

[JazzManLoveBTC]

Don't be ridiculous. If the economy were to collapse tomorrow all your "deferred spending" and "future prosperity" did nothing to help it.

And what should we do? Forget about monero?

Why not? You said somewhere that BCN is the way more amazing than MRO and i'm totally agree with you.

[hbadger]

After reading this whole thread and some topic on reddit i understood that there is no monero economy. Everything seems to be a fake. I'd rather invest all my money to BCN. Coz all of MRO's homies are doing the only business - talking about how smart they are, but in fact BCN team IS the team who work hard, and it’s their right not to communicate if they choose not to.

Wake up, dude. Welcome to the real world -_-
I don't know why everybody were so excited with these altcoins... If you want to waste another usefull minutes of your priceless time you can read others mro's threads and find out more information about monero's dirty schemes!

Are you sure that we should trust them?
Of course i know a lot of Bytecoin and i'm thinking that Monero is a regular clone of this amazing currency but not everything that you can read here is obviously true. Never forget about scams...
And never forget that BCN is much more cooler than MRO.

Newbie having monolog with himself, lol
Someone is afraid of competition, just sell, it's not too late to escape out of BCN and you only lose 50% of money, better than waiting and lose 99%.

+1 lol

[parker928]

Definitely just saw this from part of david latapie's post a few weeks ago comparing darkcoin and monero...i am heavily invested in both, but he kind of hit the head on the nail here with this. plus I lol'd

[counter]

The economy could use some work but that can be said about any coin I'd say.  All I know is I wish I had bought on the last dip.  Just like any other coin timing is everything!

[dnaleor]

The economy could use some work but that can be said about any coin I'd say.  All I know is I wish I had bought on the last dip.  Just like any other coin timing is everything!

I bought on teh dip (below 2 mBTC) but should have bought more

Anyway, I really hope that in a few months time, a TSR-like website will accept XMR

[ivanlabrie]

The economy could use some work but that can be said about any coin I'd say.  All I know is I wish I had bought on the last dip.  Just like any other coin timing is everything!

I bought on teh dip (below 2 mBTC) but should have bought more

Anyway, I really hope that in a few months time, a TSR-like website will accept XMR

It's a must, imho. Auction style, a la Ebay, or something like SR.

[Roy Badami]

Forgive me for saying this again, but using inflation as a means to pay miners (or anyone else) sounds a lot like a government "trick".

It is, in a way, except that it's exactly Satoshi's trick that makes these coins possible. Since the network has no access to resources from outside the network, it can only rely on internal resources to reward miners. Which basically comes down to issuing coins out of thin air. No one disputes that this is how PoW coins work. The only issue is what happens "in a long time" when the rewards diminish to near zero or zero.

If you don't like issuing coins out of thin air, then you really can't like Satoshi-style PoW coins. You wouldn't be alone, BTW, there are plenty of critics.

Obviously there is a difference between issuing coins until certain max cap is reached (or at least tending towards a limit - as in calculus -), and issuing coins forever at an ever growing rate (which is what happens when you set a % of inflation).

One resembles the mining of gold, the other one is exactly like fiat.

Well, actually, in reality there are always some more uneconomic gold reserves that would become economic if the price went up enough.  And no one knows the number and size of the as-yet-undiscovered gold fields..... so the economics of gold as a currency is nowhere near as clear cut as you imply.

That, and the big one is that there's really no way to know the amount of gold that's been mined already.  There's a popular figure that's often bandied about, but it's really just an educated guess - and there's no way to confirm it.

roy

[human]

There have been a lot of discussions why the community chose Monero over Bytecoin. Bytcoin was 80% secret-mined for example. You can be sure that just a few people have like 50 % of all Bytecoins which will ever exist.

[dewdeded]

Subbed.

[aminorex]

Savers are useless non-contributors. Not that there's anything wrong with saving, but economies of scale don't depend on it, and so there's no economic justification to encourage it.

You cannot be more wrong. Saving is simply deferred spending. It's spending later vs. spending now. You could argue that incentivizing spending over saving is transferring prosperity from the future to the present. In the end it's a zero sum.

More than that.  Saving is required for capital formation.  Many enterprises and much innovation depends upon capital formation.  Without capital formation it is much closer to net zero-sum.  With capital formation, it is more like win-win than it is without it.

[aminorex]

The economy could use some work but that can be said about any coin I'd say.  All I know is I wish I had bought on the last dip.  Just like any other coin timing is everything!

Until proven otherwise you should assume you have no timing edge and just use dollar cost averaging to buy in.  It works.

[ivanlabrie]

The economy could use some work but that can be said about any coin I'd say.  All I know is I wish I had bought on the last dip.  Just like any other coin timing is everything!

Until proven otherwise you should assume you have no timing edge and just use dollar cost averaging to buy in.  It works.

That would work, to a certain extent but I prefer to actively manage my portfolio and increase in btc and usd valuation, while aiming to hold a good amount of xmr over time.

[smooth]

Savers are useless non-contributors. Not that there's anything wrong with saving, but economies of scale don't depend on it, and so there's no economic justification to encourage it.

You cannot be more wrong. Saving is simply deferred spending. It's spending later vs. spending now. You could argue that incentivizing spending over saving is transferring prosperity from the future to the present. In the end it's a zero sum.

More than that.  Saving is required for capital formation.  Many enterprises and much innovation depends upon capital formation.  Without capital formation it is much closer to net zero-sum.  With capital formation, it is more like win-win than it is without it.

Yup. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savings_identity

The caveat is that not all investment is actually useful investment. For example, building up inventory of unsold goods is considered investment in accounting terms, even though the goods may not be wanted and may never be sold.

That said, you do need savings for there to be (good) investment.

[Johnny Mnemonic]

Savers are useless non-contributors. Not that there's anything wrong with saving, but economies of scale don't depend on it, and so there's no economic justification to encourage it.

You cannot be more wrong. Saving is simply deferred spending. It's spending later vs. spending now. You could argue that incentivizing spending over saving is transferring prosperity from the future to the present. In the end it's a zero sum.

More than that.  Saving is required for capital formation.  Many enterprises and much innovation depends upon capital formation.  Without capital formation it is much closer to net zero-sum.  With capital formation, it is more like win-win than it is without it.

Yup. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savings_identity

The caveat is that not all investment is actually useful investment. For example, building up inventory of unsold goods is considered investment in accounting terms, even though the goods may not be wanted and may never be sold.

That said, you do need savings for there to be (good) investment.

Guys I'm not claiming that saving is unimportant. I'm talking about savings in the form of unspent currency. I was responding to hbadger's claim that inflation punishes savers. There are plenty of appreciable saving/investment vehicles that will result in greater long term yields. Incentivizing saving in the currency itself, however, will only serve to kill its velocity. Economies of scale require a currency that moves.

I hate to bring fiat into the argument, but despite all it's problems the U.S. dollar does a great job at supporting large-scale economies. Even with a 2.5% - 4% annual inflation (definitely not "saver friendly"), capital formation does not seem to be a problem. Go figure.