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chsados
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January 28, 2012, 12:35:42 AM
 #81

Yes the value in bitcoins is mostly driven by speculation and hope, but those dreams have the potential to transform into reality.

Just think about how the price of a coin is currently determined. People just place bids and asks according to information about where other people are placing their bids and asks

That means the price of bitcoins is non zero as a result of dependent origination (a Buddhist might say). The bids and asks support each other like the two sides of an arch bridge, essentially creating a stable structure out of two opposing forces. This kind of interaction is why it is possible for value in bitcoins to arise out of nothing. Without being backed so to speak.

Pratītyasamutpāda

bitcoin Buddhism? 
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January 28, 2012, 12:47:12 AM
 #82

Yes the value in bitcoins is mostly driven by speculation and hope, but those dreams have the potential to transform into reality.

Just think about how the price of a coin is currently determined. People just place bids and asks according to information about where other people are placing their bids and asks

That means the price of bitcoins is non zero as a result of dependent origination (a Buddhist might say). The bids and asks support each other like the two sides of an arch bridge, essentially creating a stable structure out of two opposing forces. This kind of interaction is why it is possible for value in bitcoins to arise out of nothing. Without being backed so to speak.

Pratītyasamutpāda

bitcoin Buddhism? 

Bitcoin price is an illusion that only stands because we all chose to believe in it.  However, if we maintain the illusion long enough, the Bitcoin economy will develop and we will transition to a fluid, stable currency.  A Buddhist may argue it would still all be based on illusion, but then again, so is every other market in their view.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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January 28, 2012, 12:52:32 AM
 #83

Yes the value in bitcoins is mostly driven by speculation and hope, but those dreams have the potential to transform into reality.

Just think about how the price of a coin is currently determined. People just place bids and asks according to information about where other people are placing their bids and asks

That means the price of bitcoins is non zero as a result of dependent origination (a Buddhist might say). The bids and asks support each other like the two sides of an arch bridge, essentially creating a stable structure out of two opposing forces. This kind of interaction is why it is possible for value in bitcoins to arise out of nothing. Without being backed so to speak.

Pratītyasamutpāda

bitcoin Buddhism? 

~ sitting in lotus position now ~
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January 28, 2012, 01:29:58 AM
 #84

Bitcoin price is an illusion that only stands because we all chose to believe in it.
FTFY

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January 28, 2012, 01:32:11 AM
 #85

Bitcoin price is an illusion that only stands because we all chose to believe in it.
FTFY

A Buddhist may argue it would still all be based on illusion, but then again, so is every other market in their view.
I thought that covered it.

https://www.bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
While no idea is perfect, some ideas are useful.
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January 28, 2012, 01:57:04 AM
 #86

...
In my opinion, the best way to value Bitcoin is to think of it as a publicly owned company.  Right now, there are...
...

That's nice analogy in theory, except Bitcoin is not traded like a publicly-owned company.

When you invest in shares of Western Union, you are doing so in a proven, viable business that is
financially regulated, and accountable to shareholders.

Like MF Global?

When you "invest" in Bitcoins you are entering a world of unregulated if not somewhat nefarious
manipulators, out-of-control margin "gamblers', and over-exuberant traders who are speculating
Bitcoin out of existence with parabolic rallies, pump-n-dump crashes, and Bitcoinica starfish nonsense.

Probably the most important factor in the adoption of Bitcoins: a stable trading price. And when
is that going to happen?

To the point I alluded to in my smart-ass rhetorical question, another way to skin the cat (or for the cat to be skinned) would be if the 'traditional' markets start to fail.  I don't rule that out, and in fact, I am anticipating it to some degree.  To what degree I do not really know, but if people start to feel like they are being bent over and the regulatory and enforcement agencies are not looking out for them, the mathematical certainties of Bitcoin may start to look attractive in spite of the volatility which it exhibits.

I do believe that the goal of the MF Global take-down was, in part, to establish in case law certain features which were introduced into legislation along with the bankruptcy reforms were put into place circa 2005...just in time for the housing bust funny enough.  As I understand things (derived from reading non-mainstream ravings) part of this legislation involved a shuffling in how creditors line up to take haircuts when financial organizations fail.

http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=198650


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January 28, 2012, 05:08:58 AM
 #87

Regulated, accountable markets lend a veil of legitimacy. I would compare it to wikipedia. Before, everyone took what was written by "experts" in textbooks and encyclopedias as gospel. We all know it is impossible to completely avoid bias and misinterpreted/incomplete information. If you read wikipedia articles, this is blatantly obvious, you cannot ignore it. I prefer this to the pretend reality dependent upon trust.
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January 28, 2012, 09:59:26 AM
 #88

The Buddhist perspective explains Bitcoin's magic perfectly. It's also what makes Bitcoin so hard for most people to grasp. The thing about it is that there is no trust among people, but an agreement between machines; as though something were truly created from nothing. Machines aren't alive and yet a glimmer of it has become visible.

As for MFing Global, I find Jesse's Cafe has provided the greatest level of detail with strong insight. It isn't the first, won't be the last, and has decimated any legitimate functionality in traditional western markets for a long time to come.
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