Bitcoin Forum
March 30, 2024, 01:53:54 AM *
News: Latest Bitcoin Core release: 26.0 [Torrent]
 
   Home   Help Search Login Register More  
Pages: [1] 2 3 »  All
  Print  
Author Topic: Bitcoin Transaction Volume  (Read 15777 times)
S3052 (OP)
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2100
Merit: 1000


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 11:15:44 AM
 #1

Just observed that in the past 24 hours, we have

7,149,570.84


Bitcoins sent.

Is this the highest ever? Are there individual big chucnks of BTC sent around? IS Satoshi active again :-)  ??

TalkImg was created especially for hosting images on bitcointalk.org: try it next time you want to post an image
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction.
Raulo
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 238
Merit: 100


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 11:40:58 AM
 #2

It is frequently brought up but it's pointless. Because bitcoin transactions have frequently two outputs, one of which is change, sending 1 BTC every hour from a wallet with 50000 BTC will result in 1.2 million BTC sent, while only 24 BTC was sent to a wallet owned by a different person.

Yesterday, there were several transactions with such a large wallet. Maybe it belongs to  mtgox?

1HAoJag4C3XtAmQJAhE9FTAAJWFcrvpdLM
theymos
Administrator
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 5152
Merit: 12580


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 04:52:06 PM
 #3

Someone was sending the same ~95000 BTC repeatedly. He could have gotten the "daily sent BTC" to 22 million if he kept it up.

1NXYoJ5xU91Jp83XfVMHwwTUyZFK64BoAD
S3052 (OP)
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2100
Merit: 1000


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 05:21:46 PM
 #4

Someone was sending the same ~95000 BTC repeatedly. He could have gotten the "daily sent BTC" to 22 million if he kept it up.

Thanks for clarifying+

dust
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 840
Merit: 1000



View Profile WWW
April 20, 2011, 06:30:49 PM
 #5

Is there anyway a more accurate number could be calculated? One way would be to only count the smaller part of the transaction, assuming people are spending less than half of their total wallet.  This would at least be an underestimate instead of a nearly meaningless number.

Cryptocoin Mining Info | OTC | PGP | Twitter | freenode: dust-otc | BTC: 1F6fV4U2xnpAuKtmQD6BWpK3EuRosKzF8U
steelhouse
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 717
Merit: 501


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 06:41:14 PM
 #6

I think you just found a inescapable vulnerability, what if someone sets up two accounts and they just send bitcoin back and forth.  It would crash the system.  I can see no fix. 
PLATO
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 493
Merit: 250


Don't trust "BBOD The Best Futures Exchange"


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 06:51:18 PM
 #7

If you built up a map of the blocks from blockexplorer you could identify coins that were circulating through small networks, perhaps two wallet files, or a small group of friends

All posts by me after 2012 were a compromised account. Probably by "BBOD The Best Futures Exchange". SORRY Y'ALL
Cryptoman
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 726
Merit: 500



View Profile
April 20, 2011, 06:53:50 PM
 #8

I think you just found a inescapable vulnerability, what if someone sets up two accounts and they just send bitcoin back and forth.  It would crash the system.  I can see no fix. 

This has been discussed.  The fix is transaction fees.

"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history." --Gandhi
steelhouse
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 717
Merit: 501


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 06:56:28 PM
 #9

I think you just found a inescapable vulnerability, what if someone sets up two accounts and they just send bitcoin back and forth.  It would crash the system.  I can see no fix. 

This has been discussed.  The fix is transaction fees.

Knew there had to be a fix somewhere thanks.  When do transaction fees kick in.
ByteCoin
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 416
Merit: 277


View Profile
April 20, 2011, 08:28:41 PM
 #10

A better global metric of transaction volume would be the number of bitcoindays destroyed.

I believe that transactions are prioritized according to the value of the transaction multiplied by the amount of time since the coins were spent. A similar concept is useful in measuring the transaction volume.

If someone has 100BTC that they received a week ago and they spend it then 700 bitcoin days have been destroyed. If they take those 100BTC and send them to several addresses and then spend them then although the total transaction volume could be arbitrarily large the number of bitcoindays destroyed is still 700.

Currently, bitcoindays are replenished at around six million bitcoindays per day which reflects that there are about six million bitcoins in existence.

If there are days when there are few transactions then the total number of bitcoindays increases dramatically. If everyone exchanged all their bitcoins at once then the total number of bitcoindays would be reduced to zero. Some bitcoins will never be spent because the private keys have been lost (or never existed) so the number of bitcoindays will never actually fall to zero.

Note how transaction flooding and mix-network activity do not significantly influence the number of bitcoindays destroyed. I believe that the bitcoindays measure is a good indicator of market health and participation.

ByteCoin
MoonShadow
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1708
Merit: 1007



View Profile
April 20, 2011, 08:37:30 PM
 #11

A better global metric of transaction volume would be the number of bitcoindays destroyed.


This is a really good idea, and would be a great way to measure velocity.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
eMansipater
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 294
Merit: 273



View Profile WWW
April 20, 2011, 09:51:48 PM
 #12

A better global metric of transaction volume would be the number of bitcoindays destroyed.
This is a really good idea, and would be a great way to measure velocity.
+1
Excellent point, ByteCoin!

If you found my post helpful, feel free to send a small tip to 1QGukeKbBQbXHtV6LgkQa977LJ3YHXXW8B
Visit the BitCoin Q&A Site to ask questions or share knowledge.
0.009 BTC too confusing?  Use mBTC instead!  Details at www.em-bit.org or visit the project thread to help make Bitcoin prices more human-friendly.
Stephen Gornick
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2506
Merit: 1010


View Profile
April 21, 2011, 08:51:00 AM
 #13

I believe that the bitcoindays measure is a good indicator of market health and participation.

Of course this activity will not reflect activity that occurs within eWallet services such as MyBitcoin and Mt. Gox.  Those transactions made between accounts within the service are never seen by the Bitcoin network.

Unichange.me

            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █
            █


Gavin Andresen
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1652
Merit: 2164


Chief Scientist


View Profile WWW
April 22, 2011, 02:54:09 PM
 #14

A better global metric of transaction volume would be the number of bitcoindays destroyed.

Very good idea.  Anybody want to implement it?  I've got a Python tool that walks the block chain gathering transaction statistics:
  https://github.com/gavinandresen/bitcointools/blob/master/statistics.py

Teaching it to compute 'bitcoindays destroyed' shouldn't be terribly hard.  I think.

This morning I taught it to add just the smallest or just the largest output in each TxOut and report the range to get an estimate of 'true' transaction value being exchanged without counting change TxOuts or mining pool payouts.

So, to be conservative, assume that the biggest-value TxOut for every transaction is change and the smallest is the actual bitcoins being transferred.  Taking the smallest TxOut of all the transactions last month, an average of about 35,000 BTC were sent per day.

This month the average is about 55,000 BTC per day.   Add in the MtGox trading volume to get a reasonable lower estimate of something like 70-80,000 BTC changing hands every day.

How often do you get the chance to work on a potentially world-changing project?
S3052 (OP)
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 2100
Merit: 1000


View Profile
April 22, 2011, 05:08:32 PM
 #15

This is a great approach. thanks so much Smiley

error
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 588
Merit: 500



View Profile
May 22, 2011, 09:38:25 PM
 #16

http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=9300

3KzNGwzRZ6SimWuFAgh4TnXzHpruHMZmV8
abednego
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 58
Merit: 0



View Profile WWW
June 29, 2011, 05:43:36 PM
 #17

Two questions maybe someone can answer:

How could one determine the ACTUAL number of BTC transfered daily?

Where do transaction fees go?
MoonShadow
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1708
Merit: 1007



View Profile
June 29, 2011, 05:46:09 PM
 #18

Two questions maybe someone can answer:

How could one determine the ACTUAL number of BTC transfered daily?


www.bitcoinwatch.com

Quote
Where do transaction fees go?

Transaction fees are added to the block reward given to the miner who finds the solution to the block your transaction is included within.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
DamienBlack
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 56
Merit: 1


View Profile
June 29, 2011, 05:47:41 PM
 #19

I think you just found a inescapable vulnerability, what if someone sets up two accounts and they just send bitcoin back and forth.  It would crash the system.  I can see no fix. 

This has been discussed.  The fix is transaction fees.

Knew there had to be a fix somewhere thanks.  When do transaction fees kick in.

Transaction fees have already kicked in. Right now, we still get a pretty quick response even if we don't pay transaction fees. But if the network ever started getting clogged, you could pay a small transaction fee to be given higher priority. In the future, it is possible that transactions without fees take days, while transactions with fees go much quicker.  
davux
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 288
Merit: 263


Firstbits.com/1davux


View Profile WWW
July 05, 2011, 05:25:55 AM
 #20

Right now, we still get a pretty quick response even if we don't pay transaction fees. But if the network ever started getting clogged, you could pay a small transaction fee to be given higher priority. In the future, it is possible that transactions without fees take days, while transactions with fees go much quicker.

As the volume of transactions gets higher and the incentive for finding blocks gets lower (bitcoins per block get divided by 2 every 4 years, and difficulty is rising quickly), isn't there a risk that in the future, fees become the main incentive, increase dramatically in price (and also become unavoidable)? Then doing a bitcoin transaction would be for rich people only. We certainly don't want Bitcoin to become a rich people tool – those who can afford the high taxes.

1DavuxH9tLqU4c7zvG387aTG4mA7BcRpp2
México (Oaxaca) – France - Leeds
Pages: [1] 2 3 »  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!