A demonstration of how Bitcoin voting works

[Elwar]

You can now pool your bitcoins with others for achieving big, exciting things.

Here is a sample of a Pool of users coming together to plan a Bitcoin cruise http://www.bitpools.com :

<--Snip-->
Voting

The voting option panel for all users will have the options as well as a Send to Address for each option. This is where the users send their bitcoins to cast their vote.

On the right are three buttons used to download files that are used to verify the vote. The Public Key File contains the public Key used to create the Encrypted Key. These two combined are used to encrypt the Vote File. The Vote File contains all Send to Addresses for the vote. This is created so that anyone can have the list of vote addresses after the vote has finished and verify that the results match the results on the Bitcoin Blockchain.

Users can click on the new proposal from the Proposal tab which shows the Proposal is open for voting.

Once the vote date has passed voting is finished and the user will be able to view proposals whose dates have passed.

Clicking on the Past Proposal will show the proposal after the vote has finished. This will include the Private Key File which can be downloaded to decrypt the Encrypted Vote File that could be downloaded before the vote date. There is also the Decrypted Vote File used for verification. The past proposal might not be clickable immediately as the Private Key is stored offline in cold storage, manually moved to the server after the vote.

View Results

There is also the option in the Voting panel of viewing the results. When you click on the View Results button you will get a new window with the vote results displayed.

The Results window will show the Win Total or Min Percent along with the total of the votes. The chart in the top right panel will tell how close the vote was to passing or it will show that it has passed. The bottom panel gives a list of all Send to Addresses and the amounts sent to those addresses. These can all be verified on the Bitcoin Blockchain. You can confirm in the Decrypted Vote File that those are the same addresses in the file created before the vote date.

In this example the proposal does not pass. The 8 users that voted would split the 16 mB Incentive (after mining fees are paid) and the funds from their votes will be returned to their BitPools address. With the Pool messages users can give their opinion on why they did or did not vote for the proposal. This makes it easier for future proposals to put together something more people would vote for.

After getting some feedback from the users and studying the results of the first proposal, for this example, another proposal is created.

After submitting another proposal and another round of voting the proposal is ready for viewing.

This time the proposal passes and the original goal of the BitPools Pool is met.

The Incentive will again be distributed to all users that voted after mining fees are paid.

The total bitcoins will be sent to the proposer's BitPools address (multisig escrow services coming soon) and a new Pool is created consisting only of those who voted for the proposal giving the users a place to discuss the future of their successful proposal and oversee its execution.

This form of voting allows for a solution decided by those willing to fund it. The vote is transparent, anyone can verify the results, and it is secured by a vast network of computers all over the world.

[1715442366]

1715442366

[waldox]

can this be used as a betting system?

say bets on fights

[cryptworld]

can this be used as a betting system?

say bets on fights

that would be great
is there any chance of integration?

[Elwar]

can this be used as a betting system?

say bets on fights

While it could certainly be done at bitpools, with some coordination from the pool users and people creating the proposals...there are websites already created specifically for betting.

Though BitPools would be useful if there is a bet on some site or in Vegas or somewhere that had a large minimum bet, say $100,000. Ten people getting together with 12 bitcoins or so each could pool their money to submit the bet (maybe there are better odds for such a high wager?). If the bet wins, they each get their share of the winnings (coordinated by the user who creates the proposal).

[Peter R]

I saw this for the first time on r/Bitcoin earlier today and become interested. 

If I was a BitPools member voting on the Caribbean cruise proposal, where exactly am I taking on risk?  It sounds like I need to first have a funded BitPools account (in order to vote), so I assume that I need to trust BitPools not to run off with the bitcoin funds, correct?  And then it sounds like if the proposal is accepted, the funds get transferred to the proposer's account, so I would also need to trust that the proposer would actually carry out the proposal and purchase the tickets, correct?

I think this is a potentially very useful service, and I'm not trying to be critical, I'm just trying to understand exactly how it works and what the security assumptions are. 

[Elwar]

I saw this for the first time on r/Bitcoin earlier today and become interested.  

You are correct to look for the risk. It has been my goal to create as little need for trust of BitPools as possible with the end goal being a decentralized system (baby steps).

It sounds like I need to first have a funded BitPools account (in order to vote), so I assume that I need to trust BitPools not to run off with the bitcoin funds, correct?

You are correct that if you want to participate you must fund your BitPools account with bitcoins. However, there are two major game changers with BitPools. One is the voting and the other is how you fund your account. You have full control over the bitcoins in your account. Read the demonstration on How To page on the site. You provide a bitcoin address with your funds. This is to verify that you have the funds in the first place to even participate in the discussion. BitPools never touches your bitcoins until you vote.

And then it sounds like if the proposal is accepted, the funds get transferred to the proposer's account, so I would also need to trust that the proposer would actually carry out the proposal and purchase the tickets, correct?

This is where the risk lies and you are trusting BitPools briefly on the vote date to transfer the funds (but to break this trust on one proposal and one vote would break the trust for the whole point of the site).
But yes, there is risk in trusting the proposer to follow through with what is essentially a contract with the voters. To mitigate the risk the plan is for the option of using escrow and multisig transactions for implementation of the proposals. The plan for the most secure proposal transaction would be having the voters designate a person or group to have control over one part of a multisig transaction, the proposer would have control over another part and a third party escrow service would hold the third. If the transaction goes through without a hitch, then the voters accept it and move the money. If there is a dispute the escrow service determines the outcome. As there are many different types of proposals I imagine there would be a lot of specialist escrow services (real estate, construction, businesses, generic, etc.)

As the site is young I have focused first on making things as simple as possible, the goal of first just getting people used to the concept on little projects. Proposers will need to prove to the voters that they are trustworthy and do what they can to demonstrate that there is little to no risk. And as time goes on I will continue to add functionality to help whittle that risk down to nothing.

[franky1]

can this be used as a betting system?

say bets on fights

you dont need any integration from specific third party services

just display 2 addresses
1winblahblahblah
1loseblahblahblah

and simply API the balance of both to your own website.

Voting does not need any special technology, or special service, it can be self managed using your own code, the same code available for the last 4 years.

look at https://www.mintpal.com/voting as a prime example. they dont need bitpools or other services to manage their voting, they do it themselves

any outsider can send funds to the addresses. mintpal does not ask you to credit a privkey they own before hand. its just a display of addresses. all mintpal owns is the recipient privkeys, not the sender

[Peter R]

Thanks for the reply, Elwar.  I'm glad to hear that the user has full control over the funds in his account.  

The issue with trusting the proposer is also an opportunity.  In the example of the Caribbean cruise, the proposer doesn't actually have to participate in the event.  The proposer could act more like a travel agent, keeping a commission for himself.  He would thus be incentivized to ensure that the participants are happy so that he could have, for example, "98% positive feedback on 16 successful proposals."  As he establishes positive trust ratings, users will naturally favour his proposals, and he would earn higher commissions on average.  

[Elwar]

The issue with trusting the proposer is also an opportunity.  In the example of the Caribbean cruise, the proposer doesn't actually have to participate in the event.  The proposer could act more like a travel agent, keeping a commission for himself.  He would thus be incentivized to ensure that the participants are happy so that he could have, for example, "98% positive feedback on 16 successful proposals."  As he establishes positive trust ratings, users will naturally favour his proposals, and he would earn higher commissions on average.  

Exactly, trust will come with experience and I plan on adding ways for users to add credibility to their profile (link to their bitcointalk account, Facebook, ID verification, credit check, etc). As well as an Ebay style rating system for both proposers and escrow services.

I have been with Bitcoin since 2010 and have seen every different scam and hack there is. I take all of that into account.

Though down the road I would not mind making money off of the website, I am rather well off financially already so the main goal of BitPools is to create a useful tool for Bitcoin users that government currency cannot accomplish.

[Ron~Popeil]

The issue with trusting the proposer is also an opportunity.  In the example of the Caribbean cruise, the proposer doesn't actually have to participate in the event.  The proposer could act more like a travel agent, keeping a commission for himself.  He would thus be incentivized to ensure that the participants are happy so that he could have, for example, "98% positive feedback on 16 successful proposals."  As he establishes positive trust ratings, users will naturally favour his proposals, and he would earn higher commissions on average.  

Exactly, trust will come with experience and I plan on adding ways for users to add credibility to their profile (link to their bitcointalk account, Facebook, ID verification, credit check, etc). As well as an Ebay style rating system for both proposers and escrow services.

I have been with Bitcoin since 2010 and have seen every different scam and hack there is. I take all of that into account.

Though down the road I would not mind making money off of the website, I am rather well off financially already so the main goal of BitPools is to create a useful tool for Bitcoin users that government currency cannot accomplish.

This has potential for a lot of different applications. Do you foresee any regulatory issues?

[jeffersonairplane]

I'm digging the website layout and design. Looks really clean and I love the concept.

[PalmerLaura]

Wow that's a big step towards digital democracy, for sure!

[Elwar]

This has potential for a lot of different applications. Do you foresee any regulatory issues?

I do not. At least not for BitPools itself. People fulfilling the proposals may need to deal with their local laws.

The site is not hosted in the US, I will be incorporating from a non-restrictive country and although I am a US citizen I do not live in the US.

As for the current legality of it in the US. Because all transactions are in bitcoin the FinCen regulations do not apply (definitely checked on this with a lawyer early on) and each individual should follow their IRS rules.

[phillipsjk]

Can you explain what exactly a "send address" is? The Block-chain does not store "send addresses", only destination addresses.

Coin inputs (including votes) can have more than one  "send" address associated with them. Pay to script hash addresses do not really have public keys associated with them. The hashed script may include several or no public keys.

[Ron~Popeil]

This has potential for a lot of different applications. Do you foresee any regulatory issues?

I do not. At least not for BitPools itself. People fulfilling the proposals may need to deal with their local laws.

The site is not hosted in the US, I will be incorporating from a non-restrictive country and although I am a US citizen I do not live in the US.

As for the current legality of it in the US. Because all transactions are in bitcoin the FinCen regulations do not apply (definitely checked on this with a lawyer early on) and each individual should follow their IRS rules.

Yeah hosting it outside the US is smart. The government is more interested in shaking down people that can actually pay them large sums of money. Your average user is not likely to be a target.

[Meuh6879]

sorry, but, for a vote ... i send 1µBTC only 
i can wait 2 days and the vote, too ...

[Elwar]

Can you explain what exactly a "send address" is? The Block-chain does not store "send addresses", only destination addresses.

Coin inputs (including votes) can have more than one  "send" address associated with them. Pay to script hash addresses do not really have public keys associated with them. The hashed script may include several or no public keys.

The vote panel shows a "Send To Address" basically saying send bitcoins to that address. I try to make things as simple for the user as possible. With such a complex idea it is not that easy.

[Elwar]

sorry, but, for a vote ... i send 1µBTC only 
i can wait 2 days and the vote, too ...

The site allows for votes as small as 1 Satoshi.

Though without force, such votes tend to be meaningless...more like opinion polls.

But voting with your money actually puts value to your vote that does not require centralized control.

[kingscrown]

sorry, but, for a vote ... i send 1µBTC only 
i can wait 2 days and the vote, too ...

The site allows for votes as small as 1 Satoshi.

Though without force, such votes tend to be meaningless...more like opinion polls.

But voting with your money actually puts value to your vote that does not require centralized control.

Keep in mind if you have 'greater plan' you will put money on votes. Ie Cryptsy and coins putting BTC to get there just to pump n dump.
The idea is great but to keep it safe.. might not be as easy as you consider

[Elwar]

Keep in mind if you have 'greater plan' you will put money on votes. Ie Cryptsy and coins putting BTC to get there just to pump n dump.
The idea is great but to keep it safe.. might not be as easy as you consider

There's no way to pump n dump, it's using bitcoins not an alt currency.

There are so many things that can be done with bitcoin that people trying to come up with Bitcoin 2.0 or alts just have not tapped into the full potential that the blockchain provides.

This is the most secure voting system in the world because it would require more computing power than all of the mining computers to tamper with the votes. Even an alt coin specifically designed for voting would not be as secure.