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Even in the event that an attacker gains more than 50% of the network's
computational power, only transactions sent by the attacker could be
reversed or double-spent. The network would not be destroyed.
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flipme (OP)
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June 11, 2014, 06:32:54 AM |
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That applies to Bitcoin, but not to it's new financial markets. The more I think about it, the more similarities I find with cases where whole fiat systems were destroyed, or at least damaged to a degree, with methods alike. The perpetrator of those practices, whose name I don't want to drop here, took out billions with each of his coups. Please stop denying the possibility, its there. |
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toknormal
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Activity: 3066
Merit: 1188
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June 11, 2014, 07:36:43 AM |
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ljudotina
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June 11, 2014, 07:38:54 AM |
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51% is totally a problem.
if someone has 51% of hashing power then we have to trust they aren't going to shut bitcoin down one day.
if you want a system where you need to trust someone then it already exists, its called a bank.
Well, basicly, you have to trust few individuals now too. Few owners of pools, or few individuals that pull code requests for BTC core etc. It's not as "no trust needed" as most think it is. |
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halfawake
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June 11, 2014, 07:42:18 AM |
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Cant resist the opportunity to post this:  I suppose the developers could technically fix this with a software upgrade to the way mining is done, but it'd require a hard fork, which would be kind of a nightmare. That's definitely one big advantage of Peercoin over Bitcoin though. That and the power thing, the amount of power used to mine bitcoins is kind of insane. |
BTC: 13kJEpqhkW5MnQhWLvum7N5v8LbTAhzeWj
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ljudotina
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June 11, 2014, 07:44:01 AM |
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Bitcoin is suppose to be a way to stop greed by decentralizing money....
Suppose, but it's failing partiali. ASIC's made it much more centralized than uncentralized. Not fighting mass pooling is making it even more centralized. Devs under paws of largest mining hardware companys, again not so uncentralized.... I love BTC, i hold BTC and i buy BTC and i use BTC, but let's not kid ourselves. We all should know how things really are. BTC is far from it's initial idea. |
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Ron~Popeil
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June 11, 2014, 07:44:34 AM |
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That applies to Bitcoin, but not to it's new financial markets. The more I think about it, the more similarities I find with cases where whole fiat systems were destroyed, or at least damaged to a degree, with methods alike. The perpetrator of those practices, whose name I don't want to drop here, took out billions with each of his coups. Please stop denying the possibility, its there. They could fool the network for a whole 10 minutes before being kicked out. The protocol would then be changed so that they cannot do it again. This is pointless fear mongering. Do we really want those same potential investors reading the constant panicked screeching on here about something that is just not at all likely to occur? |
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ljudotina
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Merit: 1029
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June 11, 2014, 07:49:58 AM |
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I suppose the developers could technically fix this with a software upgrade
Not only that it CAN be done this way, but it SHOULD be done this way. "Hm i have software problem...should i fix it by fixing software, or should i fix it by using hardware". Cmon now...we all know answer to that question. |
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ljudotina
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June 11, 2014, 07:52:47 AM |
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They could fool the network for a whole 10 minutes before being kicked out. The protocol would then be changed so that they cannot do it again.
First of all, it would take more than 10 min. Second, something like that would ireversably criple, if not instakilled trust in BTC and it would never recover from that. Furthermore, if you know you have possible point of attack, and if you wait for attack to happen to fix that hole you arnt that smart really. If you are aware of hole, you fucking fix it NOW when it's safe. You sit down, you plan, you test and deploy fix. You do not do it under pressure and in haste. Or am i wrong? |
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devphp
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June 11, 2014, 07:54:59 AM |
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All Andreas did was mention in this video the possibility of someone pulling off this attack for profit and why this is not feasible. That aspect is obvious and needs no clarification. He didn't say anything of the possibility if a bad actor's intention was to destroy Bitcoin, but exactly that would be the real reason for a 51%-attack and it costs only a small fraction of money world banks have. Nipping the competitor in the bud and laughing how cheap and easy it is - that's where the real danger lies. |
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flipme (OP)
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June 11, 2014, 01:30:31 PM |
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Not profitable, not feasible?
The max leverage for CFDs on Bitcoin is at 1:20.
- Create a nice little bull run, or wait for a bullish sentiment (just happened)
- Buy another coin for your BTC, so it won't hurt the exchange rate (just happened)
- Short as many as any broker lets you, or issue some paper yourself
- Pull your stunt
- Cash out and walk away
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jonald_fyookball
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Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political
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June 11, 2014, 01:42:26 PM |
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Not profitable, not feasible?
The max leverage for CFDs on Bitcoin is at 1:20.
- Create a nice little bull run, or wait for a bullish sentiment (just happened)
- Buy another coin for your BTC, so it won't hurt the exchange rate (just happened)
- Short as many as any broker lets you, or issue some paper yourself
- Pull your stunt
- Cash out and walk away
what does that have to do with 51% attack? anyway, yes it possible but you need lots of money and it could fail as your attempt to create false positive sentiment can turn into (or meet) real positive sentiment... plus the fact that there's not much liquidity for shorting Bitcoin right now. |
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ChuckBuck
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June 11, 2014, 01:52:41 PM |
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Cant resist the opportunity to post this: What does this mean again? Picture makes no sense. $88mill @ $2/GH = 44 PH which is < 88.19303 PH network hashrate or roughly 49% not 51% Close but no cigar. |
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S4VV4S
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June 11, 2014, 06:30:49 PM |
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Hello Neo, my name is Morpheus.
You have come far and have accomplished to be the major player in the GHash power.
I am letting you choose from 3 options:
Take the red pill, and crash Bitcoin together with all your fortune and investment you have made.
Take the blue pill, and pull a double spend here and there and hope nobody notices.
Take the yellow pill, Take NO PILL and KEEP FINDING BLOCKS ONE AFTER THE OTHER!!!!!
Make your choice but do it wisely......
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sed
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June 11, 2014, 06:43:33 PM |
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What I don't understand about this is why miners wouldn't join another pool if they see their current pool is in such a large majority. Who wants to be part of the downfall of the currency they are actively trying to mine?
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jonald_fyookball
Legendary
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Activity: 1302
Merit: 1004
Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political
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June 11, 2014, 06:53:30 PM |
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What I don't understand about this is why miners wouldn't join another pool if they see their current pool is in such a large majority. Who wants to be part of the downfall of the currency they are actively trying to mine?
They should be. Like someone said, there should be a guideline to unjoin or not join any pool above 35%. The danger is that if a pool got to be 51%, they could choose to shut everyone else out, gain 100% of blocks, and then they would be the ONLY pool anyone could make money from. |
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Phinnaeus Gage
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Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
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June 12, 2014, 12:36:20 AM |
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bitcoin will be 69'd before its 51'd  If we're all 69'd before, during and after it's 51'd, not many may consider 86'ing is my 57'd (think Kerry) thought of the day. Before I penned the above, I asked my 7-sided dice if I should do such, whereupon the single rolled answer was 42, hence you're ability to now appreciate my 21,193rd post. |
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BitcoinBeltway
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Activity: 13
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June 12, 2014, 12:41:16 AM |
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bitcoin will be 69'd before its 51'd If we're all 69'd before, during and after it's 51'd, not many may consider 86'ing is my 57'd (think Kerry) thought of the day. Before I penned the above, I asked my 7-sided dice if I should do such, whereupon the single rolled answer was 42, hence you're ability to now appreciate my 21,193rd post. Is it sad that made perfect sense to me? |
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flipme (OP)
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June 12, 2014, 03:41:35 PM |
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Hello Neo, my name is Morpheus.
You have come far and have accomplished to be the major player in the GHash power.
I am letting you choose from 3 options:
Take the red pill, and crash Bitcoin together with all your fortune and investment you have made.
Take the blue pill, and pull a double spend here and there and hope nobody notices.
Take the yellow pill, Take NO PILL and KEEP FINDING BLOCKS ONE AFTER THE OTHER!!!!!
Make your choice but do it wisely......
Oh hi. I had enough of those pills actually and decided to stay cool and keep mining. |
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