Boycott GHASH.IO/CEX.IO permanently

[ChuckBuck]

if all people leave ghash, where will the go?

better off to have a 51% ghash, then a 51% unknown.

BTCGuild, Eligius, Slush, Bitminer, Multipool, F2Pool, P2Pool

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[MX450]

The problem is that no one matches cex.io's service.

Cex.io's totally up to date.

The others are living in the stone age...

[ChuckBuck]

The problem is that no one matches cex.io's service.

Cex.io's totally up to date.

The others are living in the stone age...

What's wrong with BTCGuild?  I've been mining there since December, and it's always up.  If there's any outages or downtime it's for like a couple minutes tops.

Stable as a motherf#cka.

[boliu]

if all people leave ghash, where will the go?

better off to have a 51% ghash, then a 51% unknown.

BTCGuild, Eligius, Slush, Bitminer, Multipool, F2Pool, P2Pool

Yes, then you will have the problem of BTCGuild having 51%.

[ChuckBuck]

if all people leave ghash, where will the go?

better off to have a 51% ghash, then a 51% unknown.

BTCGuild, Eligius, Slush, Bitminer, Multipool, F2Pool, P2Pool

Yes, then you will have the problem of BTCGuild having 51%.

Unlikely.  Both Eligius and BTCGuild have always been in the low to mid teens at their highest, and are both very fair pools.

Plus, that Eleuthria guy seems like a stand up guy.   

[Collider]

The longterm solution can´t be "boycott pool X"

The different pools have to improve to get their service up to the level of GH.io, not the other way around.

That means merged mining atleast NMC, 0% pool cost, TX cost payout etc.


Also, for 51% attacks a pool would need to WITHHOLD a large number of blocks from the network, building a side chain which it can verify with its own hash power.
As long as GH.io pools` blocks show up fairly regularly, there is no reason to worry.

[MX450]

The problem is that no one matches cex.io's service.

Cex.io's totally up to date.

The others are living in the stone age...

What's wrong with BTCGuild?  I've been mining there since December, and it's always up.  If there's any outages or downtime it's for like a couple minutes tops.

Stable as a motherf#cka.

I'm not talking about up or down time but the ease of access to trade or sell giga hashes with bitcoins.

That you physically don't need to have a miner is mindblowing and no other pool seem to copy this idea.

It's all a matter of time when physical mining will be impossible for the individual.

Cloud mining is the future and I think the major pools should addopt it due to 51.

You really need to have a flexible mindset in this business.

P.S. besides for clouds I think BTCGuild is the 2nd best after cex.io/ghash.io.

[Bitsaurus]

The longterm solution can´t be "boycott pool X"

The different pools have to improve to get their service up to the level of GH.io, not the other way around.

That means merged mining atleast NMC, 0% pool cost, TX cost payout etc.


Also, for 51% attacks a pool would need to WITHHOLD a large number of blocks from the network, building a side chain which it can verify with its own hash power.
As long as GH.io pools` blocks show up fairly regularly, there is no reason to worry.

So basically you want somebody else to subsidize your mining overhead?  You are willing to destroy BTC for the extra income gained from having 1% less fee?  how shortsighted are you fools?

So other than having the ability to sell miner's hashes through CEX.IO, how extra is ghash.io benefiting from this?  Care to question that?  You think they're offering the pool from some sort of benevolent or altruistic view towards miners?

You don't have to be a cynic to understand that such behavior is not seen in the business world.  Something doesn't smell right.  The fact you peons are willing to overlook that coincides with the fact you are late bandwagoner 

[Collider]

So basically you want somebody else to subsidize your mining overhead?  You are willing to destroy BTC for the extra income gained from having 1% less fee?  how shortsighted are you fools?

So other than having the ability to sell miner's hashes through CEX.IO, how extra is ghash.io benefiting from this?  Care to question that?  You think they're offering the pool from some sort of benevolent or altruistic view towards miners?

You don't have to be a cynic to understand that such behavior is not seen in the business world.  Something doesn't smell right.  The fact you peons are willing to overlook that coincides with the fact you are late bandwagoner  

No, I am saying the longterm solution is creating awesome pools with nice payout systems.

Eligius works with 0% fees just fine.

At the end of the day the "consumer" decides on which service to use. He votes with his choice for the model he likes most. That vote should be respected.

I am not willing to destroy anything, as I am not the destroyer. Even a 51% pool doesn´t destroy anything without malicious intent.

As explained, the pool would first have to withhold a large number of blocks from the network to then submit them at once, verifying each block on its own and creating a new sidechain,
which would then become the main chain.

[cloverme]

Personally, I don't think ghash going to attempt a 51% attack. I'm more concerned with the large private pools out there, granted they don't have 45Ph/s to do a 51% yet, but in the coming months, who knows what someone with enough private cash might do. Ghash would have to create a large forked block chain with all the petahashes at their disposal and the evidence of that would be pretty clear.

From a mining perspective, since PPS has pretty much gone away, you have to throw your hashes at the pool that solving the most blocks otherwise you won't make as much money. Less blocks solved by the pool = less money. If btcguild started PPS again, I'd go back to them, but they stopped PPS, so you need to go with who's going to pay the most for the hashes. P2Pool was awful, I took a 45% income hit when I gave it a try.  Maybe in the future when (or if) fees kick in, but right now p2pool doesn't pay like the larger pools, so there's little point. In short, if PPS comes back into the play, great, otherwise there's no incentive to move out of a large pool.

[Bitsaurus]

So basically you want somebody else to subsidize your mining overhead?  You are willing to destroy BTC for the extra income gained from having 1% less fee?  how shortsighted are you fools?

So other than having the ability to sell miner's hashes through CEX.IO, how extra is ghash.io benefiting from this?  Care to question that?  You think they're offering the pool from some sort of benevolent or altruistic view towards miners?

You don't have to be a cynic to understand that such behavior is not seen in the business world.  Something doesn't smell right.  The fact you peons are willing to overlook that coincides with the fact you are late bandwagoner  

No, I am saying the longterm solution is creating awesome pools with nice payout systems.

Eligius works with 0% fees just fine.

At the end of the day the "consumer" decides on which service to use. He votes with his choice for the model he likes most. That vote should be respected.

I am not willing to destroy anything, as I am not the destroyer. Even a 51% pool doesn´t destroy anything without malicious intent.

As explained, the pool would first have to withhold a large number of blocks from the network to then submit them at once, verifying each block on its own and creating a new sidechain,
which would then become the main chain.

The whole concept of decentralization is that you don't have to trust or rely on any 1 agency.  There is no Federal Reserve deciding fiscal policy.  Just miners who decide by majority which protocol to follow.

When somebody acquires 51% you now have to trust that they will have good intentions and not use their power maliciously (as we have seen with the greedy banksters around the world).  Ghash.io has already shown once that they were willing to double spend.  The warnings were made before the first 51% event and still they double spent.

If they control 6 blocks in a row and 51% of the power they essentially can throw away any work submitted by other pools or solo individuals.  Essentially rendering them judge, jury, executioner.

I cannot blame the pool ops for this.  Eleuthria, wizkid, and at one time Slush ran better pools than anything ghash.io could hope to become.  The better pool is not fancy graphics or highest payout.  It's the one where the pool op is responsible to the Bitcoin community.  Ghash.io has shirked that responsibility from day 1, and apparently mindless peons support that in their avarice.

[Bitsaurus]

Personally, I don't think ghash going to attempt a 51% attack. I'm more concerned with the large private pools out there, granted they don't have 45Ph/s to do a 51% yet, but in the coming months, who knows what someone with enough private cash might do. Ghash would have to create a large forked block chain with all the petahashes at their disposal and the evidence of that would be pretty clear.

From a mining perspective, since PPS has pretty much gone away, you have to throw your hashes at the pool that solving the most blocks otherwise you won't make as much money. Less blocks solved by the pool = less money. If btcguild started PPS again, I'd go back to them, but they stopped PPS, so you need to go with who's going to pay the most for the hashes. P2Pool was awful, I took a 45% income hit when I gave it a try.  Maybe in the future when (or if) fees kick in, but right now p2pool doesn't pay like the larger pools, so there's little point. In short, if PPS comes back into the play, great, otherwise there's no incentive to move out of a large pool.

Blatantly wrong.  If 2 people are mining on a small pool with 600MH/s (say 1 USB miner stick each) and you happen to solve a block each person gets 12.5BTC, an amount you would never see if you were on a big pool.

Only thing big pools aid with is decreased risk of variance.  You don't make any more money mining with in the big pond.

[Collider]

Over the same period of time, mining on a small vs large pool (with the same fee) gives you statistically the same amount of payout.

P2Pool is the only pool that supports the main idea behind Bitcoin: decentralisation.

[sukamasoto]

if you think that causes them to boycott
cex.io in my opinion not the right choice to make cloud GHS mining as prices can change at any time,
cex.io if I do not think the cloud point extraction but more trading to GHS

[cloverme]

Blatantly wrong.  If 2 people are mining on a small pool with 600MH/s (say 1 USB miner stick each) and you happen to solve a block each person gets 12.5BTC, an amount you would never see if you were on a big pool.

Only thing big pools aid with is decreased risk of variance.  You don't make any more money mining with in the big pond.

Yes, you're 100% right. 1 miner can solve a block and get the reward no matter what hashing power they have, even a 1gh/s usb miner.  Now, in reality, the more hashes you process per second, the likelihood (not probability) of you solving a block is greater. I used p2pool for a week and earned 45% less BTC than I earned with the same hashing power using ghash.
Bottom line is p2pool is pplns plus a % fee.  Oh wait, I forgot the 0.5% subsidy a node gets for the solved block. 

p2pool is not popular because it suffers from the fact that miners will always act in a way to directly maximize their profits. We can cry in our cups all day about 51% and how p2pool should be this amazing solution. However at the end of the day, it's just less money in the miners pocket.

[johstacy]

Blatantly wrong.  If 2 people are mining on a small pool with 600MH/s (say 1 USB miner stick each) and you happen to solve a block each person gets 12.5BTC, an amount you would never see if you were on a big pool.

Only thing big pools aid with is decreased risk of variance.  You don't make any more money mining with in the big pond.

Yes, you're 100% right. 1 miner can solve a block and get the reward no matter what hashing power they have, even a 1gh/s usb miner.  Now, in reality, the more hashes you process per second, the likelihood (not probability) of you solving a block is greater. I used p2pool for a week and earned 45% less BTC than I earned with the same hashing power using ghash.
Bottom line is p2pool is pplns plus a % fee.  Oh wait, I forgot the 0.5% subsidy a node gets for the solved block. 

p2pool is not popular because it suffers from the fact that miners will always act in a way to directly maximize their profits. We can cry in our cups all day about 51% and how p2pool should be this amazing solution. However at the end of the day, it's just less money in the miners pocket.

You can Solo Mine it can take up to 4 days to crack a block. I have little money. $(

[Bitsaurus]

Blatantly wrong.  If 2 people are mining on a small pool with 600MH/s (say 1 USB miner stick each) and you happen to solve a block each person gets 12.5BTC, an amount you would never see if you were on a big pool.

Only thing big pools aid with is decreased risk of variance.  You don't make any more money mining with in the big pond.

Yes, you're 100% right. 1 miner can solve a block and get the reward no matter what hashing power they have, even a 1gh/s usb miner.  Now, in reality, the more hashes you process per second, the likelihood (not probability) of you solving a block is greater. I used p2pool for a week and earned 45% less BTC than I earned with the same hashing power using ghash.
Bottom line is p2pool is pplns plus a % fee.  Oh wait, I forgot the 0.5% subsidy a node gets for the solved block.  

p2pool is not popular because it suffers from the fact that miners will always act in a way to directly maximize their profits. We can cry in our cups all day about 51% and how p2pool should be this amazing solution. However at the end of the day, it's just less money in the miners pocket.

I agree with your generalized statement that I bolded, but consider this:
Would you rather have 9.5 BTC (assuming the pool took a 5% fee) worth 650 USD or 10.1 BTC worth $580 USD.  You think BTC price has fluctuated down for no reason?  The scare of 51% is clearly dominating the market.

Now let's play this worse case scenario - Ghash.IO does do some stupid attack and BTC become a has been coin leading to some other coin such as LTC or PPC taking over (LTC still has issues with centralization).  How much are you 10.1BTC x $0 USD worth now - nothing.

If miners are looking strictly at gaining the most BTC then yes they are more likely to get them at Ghash.IO -  but they are showing their stupid side.  Greed makes people stupid and illogical - and that is clearly evidenced here.

For some of us who have 10K+ BTC this is not a casual hobby but our future, and I don't give a rats ass about some 1-2% more mining income when I'm risking the whole boatload.

[knightcoin]

I wondering how much they are paying for new cryptography chip accelerator ...

[tntdgcr]

build better alternatives , reward users for usage , easier said than done.

[wpgdeez]

The problem is that no one matches cex.io's service.

Cex.io's totally up to date.

The others are living in the stone age...

What's wrong with BTCGuild?  I've been mining there since December, and it's always up.  If there's any outages or downtime it's for like a couple minutes tops.

Stable as a motherf#cka.

I've been having much better payouts since leaving the Guild.