Should the government "erase" the student debt?

[lynn_402]

it should be easier to get an education.. the more educated people are, the less shit government can pull. problem is, government doesn't want educated people.

It is easier to get an education.  We have computers now. We have internet. We have YouTube. We have so many new tools thanks to technology that requires us to change our way of action.

I learned how to design and code (front and back end) early in highschool thanks to video lectures I was able to gain access to and stream online.  This was outside of the useless shit I was learning in school.  I was passionate and still am about technology. Then I entered college with a sharp skillet and so much experience and I was surrounded by kids obsessed with video games and cat video games and they thought they were hardcore.  Epic failures.

just because you learned code online on your own doesn't mean everyone else is capable of doing that. most people are just simply not able to learn a useful skill by browsing the web. education also involves other skills where you need to be directly trained for a vocation.

Even if you learn an useful skill online, you still need a qualified individual to confirm that you indeed have a good mastery of that skill.
So even in that situation, going to an university would be useful.

[bitmarket.io]

it should be easier to get an education.. the more educated people are, the less shit government can pull. problem is, government doesn't want educated people.

It is easier to get an education.  We have computers now. We have internet. We have YouTube. We have so many new tools thanks to technology that requires us to change our way of action.

I learned how to design and code (front and back end) early in highschool thanks to video lectures I was able to gain access to and stream online.  This was outside of the useless shit I was learning in school.  I was passionate and still am about technology. Then I entered college with a sharp skillet and so much experience and I was surrounded by kids obsessed with video games and cat video games and they thought they were hardcore.  Epic failures.

just because you learned code online on your own doesn't mean everyone else is capable of doing that. most people are just simply not able to learn a useful skill by browsing the web. education also involves other skills where you need to be directly trained for a vocation.

Even if you learn an useful skill online, you still need a qualified individual to confirm that you indeed have a good mastery of that skill.
So even in that situation, going to an university would be useful.

Yes and no.  I feel my work and experience will speak for itself. And that experience lead to a network of respectable peers whose opinion carries significant weight. That adventure is my resume.  I dropped out my junior year of college because I could not stand it. I was bored to the extreme. And I went to a pretty high end school.  The kill switch went off in my database class.  A room packed with 40+ dudes and some guy got up and shouted 'nano vs vim' and ignited the room in a debate... I got up, walked out, went home, never went back. I could not stand being stuck in such a narrow world.  And I never needed college. I only went for my parents. I was very well off financially since junior year of high school.

[lynn_402]

it should be easier to get an education.. the more educated people are, the less shit government can pull. problem is, government doesn't want educated people.

It is easier to get an education.  We have computers now. We have internet. We have YouTube. We have so many new tools thanks to technology that requires us to change our way of action.

I learned how to design and code (front and back end) early in highschool thanks to video lectures I was able to gain access to and stream online.  This was outside of the useless shit I was learning in school.  I was passionate and still am about technology. Then I entered college with a sharp skillet and so much experience and I was surrounded by kids obsessed with video games and cat video games and they thought they were hardcore.  Epic failures.

just because you learned code online on your own doesn't mean everyone else is capable of doing that. most people are just simply not able to learn a useful skill by browsing the web. education also involves other skills where you need to be directly trained for a vocation.

Even if you learn an useful skill online, you still need a qualified individual to confirm that you indeed have a good mastery of that skill.
So even in that situation, going to an university would be useful.

Yes and no.  I feel my work and experience will speak for itself. And that experience lead to a network of respectable peers whose opinion carries significant weight. That adventure is my resume.  I dropped out my junior year of college because I could not stand it. I was bored to the extreme. And I went to a pretty high end school.  The kill switch went off in my database class.  A room packed with 40+ dudes and some guy gets up and shouts 'nano vs vim' and ignited the crowed in a debate... I got up, walked out, went home, never went back. I could not stand being stuck in such a narrow world.  And I never needed college. I only went for my parents. I was very well off financially since junior year of high school.

Indeed, that can work out. But without any initial contact in the industry which uses the skill you learnt, finding work probably is quite harder than for someone who has a diploma in it. Especially now, considering all of the graduated individuals who are out of work because of the situation of the economy.

[boumalo]

Erasing student debt is bad explained in a few minutes :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4n6nJ8FiF4

Bartenders, bouncers and waiters have college degrees and debts : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXpwAOHJsxg

"what kind of career a college education buys you in America"

"Is there anybody here with a college degree? Give me an other Beer"

[FFrost]

No because students will know how valuable education is and won't spend all the time getting shit faced like I did 

[RodeoX]

How about a trade? Perhaps a program that forgives some of your debt in exchange for volunteering. You could chose Americorp, military service, peace corp, or other federal service organizations. You would not only get a break on your debt, but a resume line.     

[beetcoin]

How about a trade? Perhaps a program that forgives some of your debt in exchange for volunteering. You could chose Americorp, military service, peace corp, or other federal service organizations. You would not only get a break on your debt, but a resume line.    

problem is that no one wants to pay for increased funding in education. instead, they rather us spend billions on "defense," so we can exploiter other poorer countries that we treat like colonies.

our government is comfortable with sending our guys abroad to die, but they're not willing to foot the bill if someone comes back handicapped. and the thing is, all of this is done not for our safety, but just for hegemonial dominance. it actually creates more america haters and terrorists than anything.

[bitmarket.io]

How about a trade? Perhaps a program that forgives some of your debt in exchange for volunteering. You could chose Americorp, military service, peace corp, or other federal service organizations. You would not only get a break on your debt, but a resume line.    

That's our tax money paying for them to liquidate their debt. Poor idea.   Unacceptable.

People need to understand that the world is rapidly growing global. You will compete on a global playing field if you wish to be a hotshot. And that's very competitive. There are lots of hungry people out there. And their work ethic blows most of the people away in the US.

I had google try to steal some of my programmers I have in the Ukraine.  Apple's iPhone 4 page was designed and coded by a Ukrainian that now works for me.  The gems are peppered all around the globe, and if you dig for them only on your patch of land, you're toast.

[leex1528]

This topic is getting no where, the bottom line it comes down to is soon more and more students will come from out of states, earn there free degrees here, while Americans cannot afford to go to college. 

We won't be able to compete with jobs, so they will hire overseas.  America will then be the land of people working for Mcdonalds.

They need to do something different or things will never change.

[kuroman]

Can someone explain to me what's the merit of such expensive higher education in the US of A, while I can understand the necessity of private schools but having everyone pays ridiculous sums for higher education is almost criminal, education should be a fundamental right in every country. Having students starting their lives with huge debts is no good.

Erasing student debts is not a solution imo, it's unfair to the people who struggled for years to pay their debts and for the ones that will strugle after the measure is done and over with, the solution is to have at least a free system for the people who cannot afford to pay for their education and lets those who have famillies wealthy enough pay for the children

[CEG5952]

LOL. I'm glad you are apparently quite satisfied with yourself and your computer science background. But are you joking that accountants aren't highly in demand worldwide by every mid-sized and up company? Who do you think runs the books in major multi-national companies? Shit, every IT person I've met in my career were just cogs in the machine. Clearly you view this from within the scope of your anecdotal experience, and don't care to address the issues at hand. That's fine. But the question of education in the scope of macro-economics, and with a productive economy in mind, are a little beyond the clearly biased views you present here.

Nah. You're skillset is worthless. Move on.

it's pretty obvious you know nothing about operating a mid-sized or large company. no such company could survive without competent accounting and legal departments. and IT is just another such department, and yes, you are most definitely expendable too.

Nah. Clearly you're a bozo.

Really persuasive answers. Perhaps next time, a cohesive argument. You clearly know nothing about how businesses operate.

it should be easier to get an education.. the more educated people are, the less shit government can pull. problem is, government doesn't want educated people.

It is easier to get an education.  We have computers now. We have internet. We have YouTube. We have so many new tools thanks to technology that requires us to change our way of action.

I learned how to design and code (front and back end) early in highschool thanks to video lectures I was able to gain access to and stream online.  This was outside of the useless shit I was learning in school.  I was passionate and still am about technology. Then I entered college with a sharp skillet and so much experience and I was surrounded by kids obsessed with video games and cat video games and they thought they were hardcore.  Epic failures.

just because you learned code online on your own doesn't mean everyone else is capable of doing that. most people are just simply not able to learn a useful skill by browsing the web. education also involves other skills where you need to be directly trained for a vocation.

Even if you learn an useful skill online, you still need a qualified individual to confirm that you indeed have a good mastery of that skill.
So even in that situation, going to an university would be useful.

Yes and no.  I feel my work and experience will speak for itself. And that experience lead to a network of respectable peers whose opinion carries significant weight. That adventure is my resume.  I dropped out my junior year of college because I could not stand it.

Ahhh, I see now why you're so bitter towards people who managed to graduate from university. You're a dropout who couldn't finish (bored, sure , that's what my towny friends say, too). So you're a college dropout IT guy. How do you measure up against all the college graduate IT guys I know, who -- like me -- are cogs in the machine of top-down organizations? You're pretty clearly biased by the fact that you're a dropout, calling other peoples' skill sets worthless. My guess is you have very little real world experience working in business. You apparently have no clue what kind of demands competitive organizations have. Meanwhile, my in-house counsel friends are shitting all over your salary. Get over yourself.

As another poster said, you are expendable.

[bitmarket.io]

Ahhh, I see now why you're so bitter towards people who managed to graduate from university. You're a dropout who couldn't finish (bored, sure Wink, that's what my towny friends say, too). So you're a college dropout IT guy. How do you measure up against all the college graduate IT guys I know, who -- like me -- are cogs in the machine of top-down organizations? You're pretty clearly biased by the fact that you're a dropout, calling other peoples' skill sets worthless. My guess is you have very little real world experience working in business. You apparently have no clue what kind of demands competitive organizations have. Meanwhile, my in-house counsel friends are shitting all over your salary. Get over yourself.

As another poster said, you are expendable.

No.  You don't get it and never will. You are what I refer to as a normie. A bozo.

The bottom line is we don't need more students going to college majoring in worthless things like you did and then beg for debt forgiveness. Then force all citizens to fork out extra cash to bail them out. Unbelievable.

[CEG5952]

Ahhh, I see now why you're so bitter towards people who managed to graduate from university. You're a dropout who couldn't finish (bored, sure Wink, that's what my towny friends say, too). So you're a college dropout IT guy. How do you measure up against all the college graduate IT guys I know, who -- like me -- are cogs in the machine of top-down organizations? You're pretty clearly biased by the fact that you're a dropout, calling other peoples' skill sets worthless. My guess is you have very little real world experience working in business. You apparently have no clue what kind of demands competitive organizations have. Meanwhile, my in-house counsel friends are shitting all over your salary. Get over yourself.

As another poster said, you are expendable.

No.  You don't get it and never will. You are what I refer to as a normie. A bozo.

The bottom line is we don't need more students going to college majoring in worthless things like you did and then beg for debt forgiveness. Then force all citizens to fork out extra cash to bail them out. Unbelievable.

1) Go ahead and state my position, since you seems so clear on it. I said nothing of the sort.
2) My principle issue is government policy. I don't advocate taxing citizens to bail out student debt. Eliminate incentives for increasing costs and lowering quality of education, encourage social consciousness of the moral bankruptcy of the type of corporate welfare that causes the proliferation of useless Phoenix University clones, and then we can talk about what level of education and specialization is optimal in an industrialized economy.

I'm not sure if you're incredibly dense, or just lazy. If you were capable of comprehending anything I wrote, I never said anything about begging for debt forgiveness. Personally, I'm not dumb enough to bog myself down with debt. I did very well in school, I'm a damn good manager and I am employable across several fields. But this isn't about me. People like you need to break everything down into ad hominems, insults and anecdotes rather than provide a cogent opinion on broad social and macroeconomic issues. So fine, rather than address anything said, create bullshit straw men and call people names. But it doesn't make your opinion look particularly valid.

I'm done here. Best of luck.

[bitmarket.io]

Ahhh, I see now why you're so bitter towards people who managed to graduate from university. You're a dropout who couldn't finish (bored, sure Wink, that's what my towny friends say, too). So you're a college dropout IT guy. How do you measure up against all the college graduate IT guys I know, who -- like me -- are cogs in the machine of top-down organizations? You're pretty clearly biased by the fact that you're a dropout, calling other peoples' skill sets worthless. My guess is you have very little real world experience working in business. You apparently have no clue what kind of demands competitive organizations have. Meanwhile, my in-house counsel friends are shitting all over your salary. Get over yourself.

As another poster said, you are expendable.

No.  You don't get it and never will. You are what I refer to as a normie. A bozo.

The bottom line is we don't need more students going to college majoring in worthless things like you did and then beg for debt forgiveness. Then force all citizens to fork out extra cash to bail them out. Unbelievable.

1) Go ahead and state my position, since you seems so clear on it. I said nothing of the sort.
2) My principle issue is government policy. I don't advocate taxing citizens to bail out student debt. Eliminate incentives for increasing costs and lowering quality of education, encourage social consciousness of the moral bankruptcy of the type of corporate welfare that causes the proliferation of useless Phoenix University clones, and then we can talk about what level of education and specialization is optimal in an industrialized economy.

I'm not sure if you're incredibly dense, or just lazy. If you were capable of comprehending anything I wrote, I never said anything about begging for debt forgiveness. Personally, I'm not dumb enough to bog myself down with debt. I did very well in school, I'm a damn good manager and I am employable across several fields. But this isn't about me. People like you need to break everything down into ad hominems, insults and anecdotes rather than provide a cogent opinion on broad social and macroeconomic issues. So fine, rather than address anything said, create bullshit straw men and call people names. But it doesn't make your opinion look particularly valid.

I'm done here. Best of luck.

I don't like to go through the back 'n forth talk. I'm a man of action. And my action is to leap to the [absolutely valid and correct] conclusion and save the world some time.  You lawyers love to do the talking and debate.  Clowns like this get nothing done.  I don't respect them.  End of story.  

What justifies my conclusion? Raw intuition. It never failed me and always sunk logic.

[leex1528]

How did this argument get from about student loans, too insulting each other's jobs:(

Seriously. 

Student loans need to be fixed.  They are so wrong right now that it isn't funny.  People have to work 3 jobs to make dues and pay their bills.

[boumalo]

How did this argument get from about student loans, too insulting each other's jobs:(

Seriously. 

Student loans need to be fixed.  They are so wrong right now that it isn't funny.  People have to work 3 jobs to make dues and pay their bills.

The government has to get out of the way and stop inflating the tuitions costs

When the government starts to get interested in a market, the prices go up : "If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it"

[yayayo]

No, I don't think the government should do that, because I think debts should always be paid by those who contracted them. Otherwise people will be encouraged to contract even more debts, because they don't feel the consequences of their actions.

Also with the government stepping in, debt does not sudddenly disappear - it still has to be repaid. Debts of the government must be paid by all citizen. It's not fair to force all citizen to pay for the debts of a certain group who took loans to achieve a competitive advantage against others.

ya.ya.yo!

[cookmac]

Not erase it completely, but at least give a serious break.

My friends are still without jobs and some do, but its still not the same since 2008.

[leex1528]

No, I don't think the government should do that, because I think debts should always be paid by those who contracted them. Otherwise people will be encouraged to contract even more debts, because they don't feel the consequences of their actions.

Also with the government stepping in, debt does not sudddenly disappear - it still has to be repaid. Debts of the government must be paid by all citizen. It's not fair to force all citizen to pay for the debts of a certain group who took loans to achieve a competitive advantage against others.

ya.ya.yo!

I agree with you and disagree.  When I started college loans were not half as bad as they are now.  I kinda went during the Lets raise them by 20% every year period(Exaggerating).  Anyway, I took a few years off a college, went back and had to take out more loans.  Now I pay a ton of money in interest, the school prices are insane. 

It just isn't college that is the problem.  It is the simple fact that inflation has not kept up with the current price of everything, else we would all be making minimum of $11/hr in the US.  It would raise the salary of everyone though as well....The problem is students can get so far in debt they can never pay it back, and will have to pay it back for the rest of their life...  That isn't the greatest...to basically teach our kids of the next generation, well you gotta go to school to compete....but you also won't be able to afford it....so basically we are saying go work at Mcdonalds to them.

Solution:  Drop interest rates on all people with student loans by 4% at least for 2 years.  Or they can choose 0% for 1 year.  and then it will resume its normal rate after said time.

Lower the cost of tuition by around $2,500 per year, maybe more.  Lower the interest rate of college loans in general, this is to help the future of America...help them out a little bit...

[commandrix]

What the government should do is get tuition back under control, for publicly funded universities anyhow. Probably private schools will follow the example of public schools when students who are already pretty smart about how much college costs start shopping for the best education they can find for the money. And if students get their loans from the government, they should NOT have to pay interest on top of income tax when they land a job.

If you want to become a certified IT professional, you could probably get the appropriate certifications just from watching Youtube videos. If you want to become a programmer, you could probably create a few good Android apps just so you'll have a portfolio and then go freelance. There have been times when I thought a college education was overrated. Think about it.