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Author Topic: More secure than bitcoin required!  (Read 976 times)
boconniff40
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March 15, 2012, 05:43:15 PM
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Don't you guys think they should come up with a currency more secure than bitcoin? As of right now encryption is only at AES256 and your IP address is logged in your wallet(throughout the network I'm sure you can use Tor).
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March 15, 2012, 05:46:06 PM
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Who are "they"?

Our family was terrorized by Homeland Security.  Read all about it here:  http://www.jmwagner.com/ and http://www.burtw.com/  Any donations to help us recover from the $300,000 in legal fees and forced donations to the Federal Asset Forfeiture slush fund are greatly appreciated!
boconniff40
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March 15, 2012, 05:50:23 PM
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WHOEVER
John (John K.)
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March 15, 2012, 05:50:52 PM
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Bitcoin is not based on sha alone. It uses the hash of the generated public keys as the address. Even quantum computers doesn't have an algorithm suitable for calculating this.
If bitcoin is even remotely crack able at some point in the future, I'm sure 'they' will release updates to the blockchain pretty soon.

Edit: should've been sha256. The pseudo code is sha256(sha256(a)).

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DeathAndTaxes
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March 15, 2012, 05:51:24 PM
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Bitcoin doesn't use AES256.  The satoshi client does.  

You are free to use a different client, no client (paper offline wallet), or make your own client, or pay someone to design one to your specs.

Still the idea that it is "only" AES 256 is kinda silly.

Quote
The design and strength of all key lengths of the AES algorithm (i.e., 128, 192 and 256) are sufficient to protect classified information up to the SECRET level. TOP SECRET information will require use of either the 192 or 256 key lengths. The implementation of AES in products intended to protect national security systems and/or information must be reviewed and certified by NSA prior to their acquisition and use."

http://csrc.nist.gov/groups/ST/toolkit/documents/aes/CNSS15FS.pdf

Good enough to protect nuclear launch codes but not good enough to protect your personal finances?
boconniff40
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March 15, 2012, 05:53:15 PM
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Bitcoin is not based on æs alone. It uses the hash of the generated public keys as the address. Even quantum computers doesn't have an algorithm suitable for calculating this.
If bitcoin is even remotely crack able at some point in the future, I'm sure 'they' will release updates to the blockchain pretty soon.

lol if IT EVER gets hacked, that's the end of BTC
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March 15, 2012, 05:57:38 PM
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Bitcoin is not based on æs alone. It uses the hash of the generated public keys as the address. Even quantum computers doesn't have an algorithm suitable for calculating this.
If bitcoin is even remotely crack able at some point in the future, I'm sure 'they' will release updates to the blockchain pretty soon.

lol if IT EVER gets hacked, that's the end of BTC

If that is so, then the people capable of doing this would compromise other systems first like NSA.

That's the end of USA.

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March 16, 2012, 07:26:47 PM
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Bitcoin is not based on æs alone. It uses the hash of the generated public keys as the address. Even quantum computers doesn't have an algorithm suitable for calculating this.
If bitcoin is even remotely crack able at some point in the future, I'm sure 'they' will release updates to the blockchain pretty soon.

lol if IT EVER gets hacked, that's the end of BTC

If that is so, then the people capable of doing this would compromise other systems first like NSA.

That's the end of USA.

The end of the world. It's a little scary to think that literally everyone on Earth's life could be ended by the research of some mathematician.


Bitcoin is not based on sha alone. It uses the hash of the generated public keys as the address. Even quantum computers doesn't have an algorithm suitable for calculating this.
If bitcoin is even remotely crack able at some point in the future, I'm sure 'they' will release updates to the blockchain pretty soon.

Edit: should've been sha256. The pseudo code is sha256(sha256(a)).

If I'm not mistaken, isn't Bitcoin ownership and signage based on elliptic-curve cryptography, and therefore vulnerable to Shor's algorithm?

I'm probably wrong; I'm a crypto noob and the explanations I've found of Bitcoins crypto system confused me.

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DeathAndTaxes
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March 16, 2012, 07:32:43 PM
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If I'm not mistaken, isn't Bitcoin ownership and signage based on elliptic-curve cryptography, and therefore vulnerable to Shor's algorithm?

I'm probably wrong; I'm a crypto noob and the explanations I've found of Bitcoins crypto system confused me.

Yes... Kinda.

However Shor's algorithm requires you to know the public key.  The address is a hash w/ cheksum of the public key.  However once you send funds FROM an address the public key is in the blockchain.  One could harden themselves by only using addresses once thus no funds are in any address which has a known public key.  

No public key = no input for Shor's algorithm.

If quantum computing became powerful enough it would require changes in how you used Bitcoin not necessarily Bitcoin itself.  Users, merchants, clients would need to adopt procedures that ensure addresses are used only once and funds never remain in an address with a known public key for long.
mowat
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March 17, 2012, 01:02:33 AM
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The major vulnerability in bitcoin is Windows, not AES 256.
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March 17, 2012, 01:11:16 AM
 #11

Bitcoin does not use AES at all.  Bitcoin does not use encryption.  AES is a symmetric encryption algorithm.

Companies claiming they got hacked and lost your coins sounds like fraud so perfect it could be called fashionable.  I never believe them.  If I ever experience the misfortune of a real intrusion, I declare I have been honest about the way I have managed the keys in Casascius Coins.  I maintain no ability to recover or reproduce the keys, not even under limitless duress or total intrusion.  Remember that trusting strangers with your coins without any recourse is, as a matter of principle, not a best practice.  Don't keep coins online. Use paper wallets instead.
DeathAndTaxes
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Gerald Davis


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March 17, 2012, 02:19:01 AM
 #12

Bitcoin does not use AES at all.  Bitcoin does not use encryption.  AES is a symmetric encryption algorithm.

ECC specifically secp256k1 curve? Wink
wyager
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March 17, 2012, 03:44:36 AM
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If I'm not mistaken, isn't Bitcoin ownership and signage based on elliptic-curve cryptography, and therefore vulnerable to Shor's algorithm?

I'm probably wrong; I'm a crypto noob and the explanations I've found of Bitcoins crypto system confused me.

Yes... Kinda.

However Shor's algorithm requires you to know the public key.  The address is a hash w/ cheksum of the public key.  However once you send funds FROM an address the public key is in the blockchain.  One could harden themselves by only using addresses once thus no funds are in any address which has a known public key.  

No public key = no input for Shor's algorithm.

If quantum computing became powerful enough it would require changes in how you used Bitcoin not necessarily Bitcoin itself.  Users, merchants, clients would need to adopt procedures that ensure addresses are used only once and funds never remain in an address with a known public key for long.

OK, that's what I thought. We could also replace elliptic curve crypto with lattice-based or some other post-quantum crypto.

We also have to worry about hash collision detection; I believe collision detection on quantum computers is an ongoing field of study.

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