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Author Topic: OpenBazaar.org - Decentralized network that allows for peer to peer commerce  (Read 2478 times)
Lethn
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August 26, 2014, 01:24:12 PM
 #21

I can't wait, I have a couple items for sale on eBay right now and wanting to do a bulk sale but am worried i get paypal screwed.

I've just been looking at this and they have multi-sig payments as well as an arbiter ( escrow ) system, all of this looks very nice.

As for making another silkroad, they've released the code open source so people will inevitably do what they want with it.
commandrix
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August 26, 2014, 02:05:19 PM
 #22

It will be very interesting to see how far OpenBazaar can go. And I like that they've got the source code on GitHub just in case. Smiley
Bitcoinpro
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August 26, 2014, 02:15:15 PM
 #23

ill chuck my turtle beach 4c on their no reserve free postage lol


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paulthetafy
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August 28, 2014, 12:25:31 AM
 #24

I have the same Idea but a bit better and different,  We will be launching our site soon I guess they will be our competitors.  The success of the site will depend on funding to advertise it.  Bitmit had funding to advertise on google, thats why they are successful, cryptothrift dont have the funding for it, hence hardly any traffic.
Why do people think that CryptoThrift doesn't have any traffic?  We average well over 500k page views a month, usually over 1m when we are actively marketing, and process several thousand sales a month.  You are correct that we don't have external funding (yet) which is why our growth has been relatively slow. But for the time being 100% of all revenue after costs is going back into marketing, driving up our user base and traffic quite significantly.

I think too many people assume that it is straightforward to setup a marketplace and have it just run itself.  They don't stop to think why BitMit or Coingig failed.  What they miss is the amount of time it takes to "run" a business like this, handling escrow disputes, removing spam content, actively preventing scammers, marketing, as well as the day-to-day tasks of running a business and of course developing new features.  Now stop to think about how much revenue we might make (charging sellers 2.5% and buyers using escrow 1%) and what volume of trade we would need in order to support a few full-time staff for a business of this size.  This is why the co-founders / operators of CryptoThrift don't get paid a penny for running it. 

I've been asked on several occasions to comment on OpenBazaar in relation to CryptoThrift and have so far declined to, but here goes... The idea of a P2P marketplace is very interesting and I can see the immediate intrigue for having a unique forum for buying and selling merchandise.  I haven't yet understood how it will address the need for escrow.  I do understand the idea of arbiters, but don't believe that Joe Public will understand this concept or trust it.  The reputation system is a brilliant solution.  Joe Public won't understand it or like that they have to "burn" Bitcoin in order to become trusted.  The lack of censorship concerns me.  What is to stop people spamming the marketplace?  What if people post offensive images? Again Joe Public is not going to like that.  Finally, who is Joe Public going to contact for support?  Please take my comments in context and in comparison to CryptoThrift.  OpenBazaar is a project that I am excited about and think that there is a place for it amongst the tech savvy crypto community.  CryptoThrift is a marketplace for Joe Public*.  The two will have some overlapping users for sure, but will still have enough users within their own niches to co-exist. 

*until eBay decide to 1) accept Bitcoin and 2) lower their fees dramatically -which no matter what people say about BrainTree, isn't going to happen because they won't give up the huge margin they can demand via PayPal. 

Thanks
Paul
CryptoThrift co-founder / developer
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August 30, 2014, 08:47:36 PM
 #25

I have the same Idea but a bit better and different,  We will be launching our site soon I guess they will be our competitors.  The success of the site will depend on funding to advertise it.  Bitmit had funding to advertise on google, thats why they are successful, cryptothrift dont have the funding for it, hence hardly any traffic.
Why do people think that CryptoThrift doesn't have any traffic?  We average well over 500k page views a month, usually over 1m when we are actively marketing, and process several thousand sales a month.  You are correct that we don't have external funding (yet) which is why our growth has been relatively slow. But for the time being 100% of all revenue after costs is going back into marketing, driving up our user base and traffic quite significantly.

I think too many people assume that it is straightforward to setup a marketplace and have it just run itself.  They don't stop to think why BitMit or Coingig failed.  What they miss is the amount of time it takes to "run" a business like this, handling escrow disputes, removing spam content, actively preventing scammers, marketing, as well as the day-to-day tasks of running a business and of course developing new features.  Now stop to think about how much revenue we might make (charging sellers 2.5% and buyers using escrow 1%) and what volume of trade we would need in order to support a few full-time staff for a business of this size.  This is why the co-founders / operators of CryptoThrift don't get paid a penny for running it. 

I've been asked on several occasions to comment on OpenBazaar in relation to CryptoThrift and have so far declined to, but here goes... The idea of a P2P marketplace is very interesting and I can see the immediate intrigue for having a unique forum for buying and selling merchandise.  I haven't yet understood how it will address the need for escrow.  I do understand the idea of arbiters, but don't believe that Joe Public will understand this concept or trust it.  The reputation system is a brilliant solution.  Joe Public won't understand it or like that they have to "burn" Bitcoin in order to become trusted.  The lack of censorship concerns me.  What is to stop people spamming the marketplace?  What if people post offensive images? Again Joe Public is not going to like that.  Finally, who is Joe Public going to contact for support?  Please take my comments in context and in comparison to CryptoThrift.  OpenBazaar is a project that I am excited about and think that there is a place for it amongst the tech savvy crypto community.  CryptoThrift is a marketplace for Joe Public*.  The two will have some overlapping users for sure, but will still have enough users within their own niches to co-exist. 

*until eBay decide to 1) accept Bitcoin and 2) lower their fees dramatically -which no matter what people say about BrainTree, isn't going to happen because they won't give up the huge margin they can demand via PayPal. 

Thanks
Paul
CryptoThrift co-founder / developer
Thanks Paul, sadly I didn't even realize Cryptothrift was around and I am a long time user of bitcoin and this forum, definitely need to spread the word around but i understand this can be expensive. I would suggest maybe doing a Signature campaign on here or do a big reddit post but I checked out the site and I do like it, it just needs more buyers/sellers.

There weren't doing a good job on marketing then. This is also the first time I heard Cryptothrift.

Also, the laptop section on Cryptothrift has too few selection choice. They need to attract merchant with wider selection of goods.
dionyziz
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September 01, 2014, 08:44:52 AM
 #26

So is this OpenBazzar going to sell illegal or just legal goods, or maybe both? I was under the impression it was going to be another tor market but doesnt look to be the case.

I believe the idea is to be able to sell whatever the hell you want.  Grin

Hmm, I'm not against the idea, but would like a decentralised ebay site where 'normal' items could be bought and sold. Not sure I want to use a site where I have to sift through CP and weapons etc.

OpenBazaar trust and identity developer here. Thanks for your feedback.

We actually plan on a way to do exactly what you're describing. While these plans have not solidified quite yet, I will describe some of our initial ideas on how to tackle the issue you're mentioning. Here's how it will work.

Anyone can buy and sell anything they want on OpenBazaar with no censorship. However, when you first download the OpenBazaar client, the "projected trust" that you see towards vendors selling 'normal' items is going to be higher than the "projected trust" that you see towards vendors selling more unconventional products.

Because their trust is going to be low by default, when you search for products or browse product catalogs, you aren't going to see too many products that are illegal or otherwise conventionally unacceptable.

The way this will be achieved is that your client will start with certain bootstrapped edges on the web-of-trust from your node towards a selected list of nodes which will be hard-coded into the OpenBazaar client. To begin with, these will be the OpenBazaar developers, but we will grow that list as we mature. We will make sure these entry-point trusted nodes vouch only for "legitimate" sellers according to their opinion (which can vary and won't always be the same for all). We hope in this way to satisfy users who want to use OpenBazaar instead of eBay, avoid trade fees, and keep their purchases anonymous.

We value censorship-resistance a lot, and we believe in freedom of trade. I think people have a fundamental right to exchange goods as they wish, without "morality police" or governments, or even the OpenBazaar developers, deciding which goods are okay to buy and sell and which aren't. Therefore, if you do want to access stores that sell unconventional or illegal goods, of course we can't block or censor that, as we are a distributed market. In fact, we don't want to block these, as the ability to block products introduces single-points-of-failure.

For example, if the OpenBazaar team were able to decide which products are allowed and which aren't, a government with a (secret?) warrant could force us to stop products from being sold. We understand that legality and morality are not always aligned. My views on the matter are detailed on a development team discussion.

The options you have for the case you want to trade goods that are not endorsed by the parties trusted by default are:

* You can lower the trust threshold that is used to decide which stores show up in your search results. However, this can affect your security, but you will be able to see a wider variety of stores.

* You can change your trust relationships on the web-of-trust. You can add new outgoing edges to your node, meaning your projected trust towards them will change based on what your friends vote for. I expect "black market" introductory points that you can add as trusted parties will appear on reddit, on bitcointalk, and other sources and give you access to unconventional markets without sacrificing security. In this case, you should make sure you add several of these in order to avoid centralization of power in your trust network.

* You can access stores directly by user-friendly secure names (namecoin-based). I expect certain trusted vendor names will start appearing on reddit, on bitcointalk, and other sources, and will allow users to discover merchants outside of the OpenBazaar network. (In fact, once a vendor is discovered, the Ricardian contract can also be exchanged in private outside of the OpenBazaar network and imported into the client.)

If you're interested in the technical details behind how the web-of-trust can work, please take a look at my paper A pseudonymous trust system for a decentralized anonymous marketplace. It's not yet complete, but some of our ideas are detailed there.
dionyziz
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September 01, 2014, 08:53:03 AM
 #27

I have the same Idea but a bit better and different,  We will be launching our site soon I guess they will be our competitors.  The success of the site will depend on funding to advertise it.  Bitmit had funding to advertise on google, thats why they are successful, cryptothrift dont have the funding for it, hence hardly any traffic.

Very nice. More is better. Does you project have any official twitter account to follow?

Yes: https://twitter.com/openbazaar
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