The Serious Altcoin Discussion/News Thread - No FUD, Shilling or Trolling.

[BohemianStalker]

A lot of people are spending BTC they bought just recently or acquired through jobs, etc. The early adopter slice is much smaller than you think.

if you dont mind little offtopic: I read 60%+ Bitcoins have never moved. What do you think of that. Are those Bitcoins lost? Sitting somehwhere in a junkyard on 5 years old laptotps? Or are the early adopters completely GREED RESISTANT and they will never cash out? (They surely havent when the price was 1000USD/BTC)

[DiamondCardz]

60% isn't exactly true, the amount is large but not that large. Some BTC is inevitably already lost. However I believe a large majority of this is forgotten BTC, and will soon be rediscovered, and depending on when it's rediscovered it'll either be kept or promptly sold.

[Nxtblg]

Soon any coin will be anonymous of they want it. It will be a given that a coin is anonymous.


I still see a battle among 'systems' rather than 'coins'. It will all come down to market share once crypto goes mainstream. One person might use to NXT to hold their assets and another might use NEM or Qora. They won't compete because they will ultimately do the same things. But the Black Swan that no one is talking about is if a big name walks into crypto later. It's game over if Apple or Google produce a wallet that can hold digital assets. I believe it's inevitable. Hopefully not though cause they would not let go of centralised access if they can, maybe even convincing people it's not safe if they cant access the blockchain.

That's a risk I used to worry about near the end of last year - but I expected a big fiat bank to dive in. Silly me...

Etherum?

I meant, big banks diving in with explicitly branded cryptos tied to the bank - something like "JPMorganCoin" - and flogged through their official Websites and through all their branches. Say what y'all like about them, but their customer bases are huge. Instant network effect.

[Joerii]

First of all, I really like this attempt to restore some FUD free, troll free sanity to the altcoin section, bravo

I'm waiting to see what will happen to alts when the next big BTC rally comes on. I've noticed that the alts do very well when Bitcoin does well. Buying alts is almost like leveraging Bitcoin price movements. When Bitcoin does poorly, alts crash and burn. But where Bitcoin rises, boy oh boy. New blood flocks into the scene, and alts soar.

Now is a bad time to launch a new coin, if you want positive publicity and a growing market cap, wait until Bitcoint takes off again.

Thoughts ?

[mrvegad]

I posted this before but it fits well here,  just my thoughts about crypto.

I have been asking myself the same question lately and I came to the conclusion that cryptos still have a long way to go. Cryptos are suppose to fight against the current establishment but it seems cryptos mostly fight against each other, scamming people,  putting down others for their ideas. Projects that are closed source,  cryptos starting companies and then hide behind poor excuses of "we don't want people to steal our ideas", "businesses want to deal with a company ". Now if Google came out with a closed source crypto those same people would be calling it a joke and every one here would be calling it a scam.

Cryptos talk about helping people.  How?  From what I have seen so far is that if you have money to buy into IPO's,  calls for participation or mining equipment then cryptos are for you. How does this help people in third world countries? It looks the same system that we have now, those that have money get more while those that don't get left behind. If crypto devs really cared they would either fund their own projects or ask for donations with no promise of return. Look at most coin threads and most of the talk is about the price of the coin, "my coin went up to. 00005, heading to da moon!", sorry but until average joe uses your coin to buy fuel, clothes etc then your coin is worthless.

To the devs with huge egos the same goes to you, until your world changing creation actually does, lose the attitude the only people you are impressing are the sheep.

[DiamondCardz]

[...] Now if Google came out with a closed source crypto those same people would be calling it a joke and every one here would be calling it a scam. [...]

A very valid point. Idea stealing isn't something that should be seen as a thing in crypto. It goes against the entire point of cryptocoins being completely open-source and allowing anyone to review and change the code.

[luigi1111]

I posted this before but it fits well here,  just my thoughts about crypto.
[...]

Cryptos talk about helping people.  How?  From what I have seen so far is that if you have money to buy into IPO's,  calls for participation or mining equipment then cryptos are for you. How does this help people in third world countries? It looks the same system that we have now, those that have money get more while those that don't get left behind. [1] If crypto devs really cared they would either fund their own projects or ask for donations with no promise of return. Look at most coin threads and most of the talk is about the price of the coin, "my coin went up to. 00005, heading to da moon!", sorry but until average joe [2] uses your coin to buy fuel, clothes etc then your coin is worthless.

To the devs with huge egos the same goes to you, until your world changing creation actually does, lose the attitude the only people you are impressing are the sheep.

1. This seems incredibly naive to me, to be a dev you must be all philanthropy? Nary a hope of supporting yourself with your work? People don't really donate in meaningful capacities here. Even XMR, the altcoin that has more "bitcoiners" interested than any other, is struggling for donations (the people doing the coding generally don't work for free). Check out miner developers: they make orders of magnitude more keeping their miners closed and/or private because no one donates anything meaningful.

Even if all they wanted to do was give away their time and "help people", it'd arguably be better for them to behave the same as before and donate their earnings to projects they feel are worthwhile, rather than giving it away for free to all the crypto-community and letting them keep the profits. Are you giving away your mining earnings? Market appreciation earnings?

2. Interesting sentiment. The market doesn't agree with you though.

[mrvegad]

1. It worked out well for Linux, it was developed by people giving countless hours to code it and never were paid.

2. I guess we have different opinions on what true worth is.

[luigi1111]

1. It worked out well for Linux, it was developed by people giving countless hours to code it and never were paid.

2. I guess we have different opinions on what true worth is.

1. It worked out WAY better for Microsoft and Apple.

2. Now we're talking about "true" worth? What does that even mean? [NTS] Stuff is worth what someone is willing to pay.

[MaxDZ8]

The Alternate cryptocurrencies forum is a mess.

Sic. Anyhow...

I would like to express my opinion about what's possibly the most important evolution I see.
Keep in mind I do not consider myself a crypto enthusiast. Privacy cool but I don't feel like I need more than what BTC does, asset exchange... what does that even mean? I'm not a trader either. I don't care about how this or that thing makes trading more or less awesome. I don't care about this.
That said.

It seems to me multi-pow isn't getting enough attention.
Now, the degree of multi-pow benefits are still to be investigated but it seems reasonable those benefits are there and even when 2p-pow will roll out, multi-pow will allow broader adoption.

When it comes to decentralization VTC goes great lengths in ensuring it stays decentralized by the means of being committing to be ASIC-proof.

Multi-pow takes this one step further. Even if one algorithm gets centralized, the others still stand a chance of being fair to small miners. ASIC resistance is no more necessary.

It is worth noticing that algorithms can be more rewarding to an architecture instead of another: for example, page 4:

• The ARX-based algorithms, BLAKE and Skein, perform extremely well in software.
• Keccak has a clear advantage in throughput/area performance in hardware implementations
• Grøstl and JH are considerably slower than the other three algorithms in most software implementations

I might add that long chained hashing (albeit useless cryptographically speaking) is inherently resistant to trivial FPGA implementations. We know CryptoNight is so far resistant to GPU, even though I speculate this won't last long. Hopefully some algorithm will take advantage of GPU unique features sooner or later.

So it seems reasonable there is (there will be) a set of algorithms which can be fair to all types of users.

When it comes to choosing a multi-pow coin... there is very little choice. Myriad, Saffron, Spectrum: as for the first I can tell the developers are indeed working towards to evolve the coin to some sort of platform - you might have read their proposed PolyMyr merge mining system.
It is unclear whatever this will work out or not, but at least those are benefits I can perceive and a step in the right direction in my opinion.

Last but not least, I get to play with various algos without making a gazillion wallets.

[ArticMine]

1. It worked out well for Linux, it was developed by people giving countless hours to code it and never were paid.

2. I guess we have different opinions on what true worth is.

1. It worked out WAY better for Microsoft and Apple.

2. Now we're talking about "true" worth? What does that even mean? [NTS] Stuff is worth what someone is willing to pay.

Actually no. With the exception of the desktop and Apple's share of the mobile virtually everywhere else (from in vehicle systems to web servers to supercomputers) it is operating systems with Linux kernels such as GNU/Linux and Android/Linux that dominate. In the mobile market the latter is literally gaining on Apple by leaps and bounds. Virtually all of Microsoft’s and Apple's competitors from Goolge to eBay from Facebook to Twitter are built on top of FLOSS operating systems. The best part is the financial markets buy or sell AAPL or MSFT on any major financial market and the trade will be executed using servers running GNU/Linux. Yes this includes software originally written by projects started non other than Richard Stallman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman and this means even Bill Gates has to rely on FLOSS operating systems in order to sell his MSFT shares to fund his foundation.

[luigi1111]

1. It worked out well for Linux, it was developed by people giving countless hours to code it and never were paid.

2. I guess we have different opinions on what true worth is.

1. It worked out WAY better for Microsoft and Apple.

2. Now we're talking about "true" worth? What does that even mean? [NTS] Stuff is worth what someone is willing to pay.

Actually no. With the exception of the desktop and Apple's share of the mobile virtually everywhere else (from in vehicle systems to web servers to supercomputers) it is operating systems with Linux kernels such as GNU/Linux and Android/Linux that dominate. In the mobile market the latter is literally gaining on Apple by leaps and bounds. Virtually all of Microsoft’s and Apple's competitors from Goolge to eBay from Facebook to Twitter are built on top of FLOSS operating systems. The best part is the financial markets buy or sell AAPL or MSFT on any major financial market and the trade will be executed using servers running GNU/Linux. Yes this includes software originally written by projects started non other than Richard Stallman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman and this means even Bill Gates has to rely on FLOSS operating systems in order to sell his MSFT shares to fund his foundation.

Oh. Sorry I wasn't clear. I don't support MS or Apple (support might be a loose term; I own not a single Apple product, but do own some MS products). FLOSS obviously is getting more and more use in all corners. I much prefer Android over iOS (I also don't get the "gaining on" unless you mean people's opinions of it? It is way more widely used than iOS.) and will probably do the same with a Linux flavor for PC in the future (have to support and use MS at work + I like PC games).

I was referring to them making 100s of billions of dollars.

Edit: (below) sorry for off-topic. Let's get back to altcoins.

[DiamondCardz]

Back on topic with the discussion of Altcoins, eh? Although I can understand why that discussion came about it is getting off-topic now and this is an Altcoin discussion thread after all.

[Depredation]

What are your opinions on Burst? Does it look like a coin with a positive future? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731923.0

[luigi1111]

What are your opinions on Burst? Does it look like a coin with a positive future? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731923.0

Nice sig.

I'm rather surprised the price isn't more pumped with all the interest it's been getting.

It seems to me to be a bigger rat race than even regular POW, so I'm not sure how I feel about it yet.

[MaxDZ8]

What are your opinions on Burst? Does it look like a coin with a positive future? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731923.0

Considering how storage cost scales down super fast I think it's very easily centralized... one does not even need ASICs to do that. Try buying a SAN.

[DiamondCardz]

What are your opinions on Burst? Does it look like a coin with a positive future? https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=731923.0

Considering how storage cost scales down super fast I think it's very easily centralized... one does not even need ASICs to do that. Try buying a SAN.

Indeed, this could be a problem. Bandwidth is a limiting factor in the coin also but the actual variable of how much storage space you can get can be manipulated very easily. It will probably get better as the coin becomes older, though, just like with Bitcoin.

Also, quick note, this was my 2500th post. Sweet.

[Stinky_Pete]

Also, quick note, this was my 2500th post. Sweet.

Congratulations 

[JohnD]

1. It worked out well for Linux, it was developed by people giving countless hours to code it and never were paid.

2. I guess we have different opinions on what true worth is.

1. It worked out WAY better for Microsoft and Apple.

2. Now we're talking about "true" worth? What does that even mean? [NTS] Stuff is worth what someone is willing to pay.

Actually no. With the exception of the desktop and Apple's share of the mobile virtually everywhere else (from in vehicle systems to web servers to supercomputers) it is operating systems with Linux kernels such as GNU/Linux and Android/Linux that dominate. In the mobile market the latter is literally gaining on Apple by leaps and bounds. Virtually all of Microsoft’s and Apple's competitors from Goolge to eBay from Facebook to Twitter are built on top of FLOSS operating systems. The best part is the financial markets buy or sell AAPL or MSFT on any major financial market and the trade will be executed using servers running GNU/Linux. Yes this includes software originally written by projects started non other than Richard Stallman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman and this means even Bill Gates has to rely on FLOSS operating systems in order to sell his MSFT shares to fund his foundation.

Oh. Sorry I wasn't clear. I don't support MS or Apple (support might be a loose term; I own not a single Apple product, but do own some MS products). FLOSS obviously is getting more and more use in all corners. I much prefer Android over iOS (I also don't get the "gaining on" unless you mean people's opinions of it? It is way more widely used than iOS.) and will probably do the same with a Linux flavor for PC in the future (have to support and use MS at work + I like PC games).

I was referring to them making 100s of billions of dollars.

Edit: (below) sorry for off-topic. Let's get back to altcoins.

If you define success = make billions of dollar then apple and microsoft do outperform all opensource technologies...

If you define success = market reach. Nobody should even think about MS or Apple.

[DiamondCardz]

1. It worked out well for Linux, it was developed by people giving countless hours to code it and never were paid.

2. I guess we have different opinions on what true worth is.

1. It worked out WAY better for Microsoft and Apple.

2. Now we're talking about "true" worth? What does that even mean? [NTS] Stuff is worth what someone is willing to pay.

Actually no. With the exception of the desktop and Apple's share of the mobile virtually everywhere else (from in vehicle systems to web servers to supercomputers) it is operating systems with Linux kernels such as GNU/Linux and Android/Linux that dominate. In the mobile market the latter is literally gaining on Apple by leaps and bounds. Virtually all of Microsoft’s and Apple's competitors from Goolge to eBay from Facebook to Twitter are built on top of FLOSS operating systems. The best part is the financial markets buy or sell AAPL or MSFT on any major financial market and the trade will be executed using servers running GNU/Linux. Yes this includes software originally written by projects started non other than Richard Stallman https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman and this means even Bill Gates has to rely on FLOSS operating systems in order to sell his MSFT shares to fund his foundation.

Oh. Sorry I wasn't clear. I don't support MS or Apple (support might be a loose term; I own not a single Apple product, but do own some MS products). FLOSS obviously is getting more and more use in all corners. I much prefer Android over iOS (I also don't get the "gaining on" unless you mean people's opinions of it? It is way more widely used than iOS.) and will probably do the same with a Linux flavor for PC in the future (have to support and use MS at work + I like PC games).

I was referring to them making 100s of billions of dollars.

Edit: (below) sorry for off-topic. Let's get back to altcoins.

If you define success = make billions of dollar then apple and microsoft do outperform all opensource technologies...

If you define success = market reach. Nobody should even think about MS or Apple.

This is true. However I would appreciate it if from this point onwards discussion returned to altcoins.