ECUADOR HERALDS DIGITAL CURRENCY PLANS

[Wilikon]

 Ecuador is planning to create the world's first government-issued digital currency, which some analysts believe could be a first step toward abandoning the country's existing currency, the U.S. dollar, which the government cannot control.

The virtual currency, which Central Bank officials say they expect will start circulating in December, does not yet have a name and officials would not disclose technical details, though they said it would not be like Bitcoin. The amount of the new currency created would depend on demand.

Deputy director Gustavo Solorzano said it is to exist in tandem with the greenback and, by law, be backed by liquid assets. It would be geared toward the 2.8 million Ecuadoreans - 40 percent of participants in the economy - too poor to afford traditional banking, officials say.

Users initially will be able to make and receive payments at minimal cost using their cellphones, Solorzano said. Such mobile payments schemes are already popular in African nations including Kenya and Tanzania, where they are privately run.

The new currency was approved, and stateless crypto-currencies such as Bitcoin simultaneously banned, by Ecuador's National Assembly last month.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/L/LT_ECUADOR_DIGITAL_MONEY?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2014-08-29-08-28-04


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That's socialism for you: ban what is free and open and make it closed and not free... 

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[wachtwoord]

Poor Ecuadorians When they granted asylum to Assange I thought otherwise of Ecuador.

[wasserman99]

I am not sure this is a good idea. It sounds a lot like ecuador is simply going to be launching a service for it's citizens very similar to pay pal in that it is backed by a central authority (their government) instead of a network of miners.

This also does not look like it will resemble anything to bitcoin, although it may be a precursor of the people in ecuador to using bitcoin more as they get more comfortable paying for things with their phone.

[wachtwoord]

I am not sure this is a good idea. It sounds a lot like ecuador is simply going to be launching a service for it's citizens very similar to pay pal in that it is backed by a central authority (their government) instead of a network of miners.

This also does not look like it will resemble anything to bitcoin, although it may be a precursor of the people in ecuador to using bitcoin more as they get more comfortable paying for things with their phone.

I'd advise everyone in Ecuador to restrict their use of the system as much as possible. I mean, even USD or Euro is better. Fuck I'd prefer Rubles

[Swordsoffreedom]

This will be interesting, in essence the Ecuadorian government will remove its ties to Bitcoin and related currencies break the tie with the US dollar and at the same time go all digital by creating their own digital currency.
I have to admit that it does pique my interest and I want to see how this turns out.

[wachtwoord]

This will be interesting, in essence the Ecuadorian government will remove its ties to Bitcoin and related currencies break the tie with the US dollar and at the same time go all digital by creating their own digital currency.
I have to admit that it does pique my interest and I want to see how this turns out.

In tears 

[Swordsoffreedom]

This will be interesting, in essence the Ecuadorian government will remove its ties to Bitcoin and related currencies break the tie with the US dollar and at the same time go all digital by creating their own digital currency.
I have to admit that it does pique my interest and I want to see how this turns out.

In tears  

Now now it's not a comedy show just yet  
They still have some cred for keeping Assange in that embassy the whole time, but I think your right this will not end well for Ecuador.

He-he but your right not the best PR the world's first digital currency issued by a central bank XD.
But who knows Bangla-Pesa meets the Central Bank ^^.
http://mobile.nation.co.ke/lifestyle/From-Bangla-Pesa-to-bitcoin-alternative-money-goes-global/-/1950774/2201270/-/format/xhtml/-/yw4s2x/-/index.html
(lol trollbox in feburary versus now )

[wasserman99]

I am not sure this is a good idea. It sounds a lot like ecuador is simply going to be launching a service for it's citizens very similar to pay pal in that it is backed by a central authority (their government) instead of a network of miners.

This also does not look like it will resemble anything to bitcoin, although it may be a precursor of the people in ecuador to using bitcoin more as they get more comfortable paying for things with their phone.

I'd advise everyone in Ecuador to restrict their use of the system as much as possible. I mean, even USD or Euro is better. Fuck I'd prefer Rubles

The article said that the digital currency was going to be backed by some kind of asset so in theory it would not be as unstable as most third world currencies are.

[wachtwoord]

I am not sure this is a good idea. It sounds a lot like ecuador is simply going to be launching a service for it's citizens very similar to pay pal in that it is backed by a central authority (their government) instead of a network of miners.

This also does not look like it will resemble anything to bitcoin, although it may be a precursor of the people in ecuador to using bitcoin more as they get more comfortable paying for things with their phone.

I'd advise everyone in Ecuador to restrict their use of the system as much as possible. I mean, even USD or Euro is better. Fuck I'd prefer Rubles

The article said that the digital currency was going to be backed by some kind of asset so in theory it would not be as unstable as most third world currencies are.

Depending on the true convertibility. USD was backed by gold too until too many people (most notably the government of great Brittan) started converting.

[Wilikon]

This will be interesting, in essence the Ecuadorian government will remove its ties to Bitcoin and related currencies break the tie with the US dollar and at the same time go all digital by creating their own digital currency.
I have to admit that it does pique my interest and I want to see how this turns out.

In tears 

 

[niothor]

So a digital currency controlled by the government replacing the current "uncontrollable" fiat money.

This is worse than banning bitcoin actually.

You will have basically no means escaping the government control. All your finances will be tracked and they will know everything you purchase , when you send money to your kinds and family in detail.  And they will be able to wipe your deposits with a click.

A lot of them will miss cash payments

[itsAj]

I am not sure this is a good idea. It sounds a lot like ecuador is simply going to be launching a service for it's citizens very similar to pay pal in that it is backed by a central authority (their government) instead of a network of miners.

This also does not look like it will resemble anything to bitcoin, although it may be a precursor of the people in ecuador to using bitcoin more as they get more comfortable paying for things with their phone.

I'd advise everyone in Ecuador to restrict their use of the system as much as possible. I mean, even USD or Euro is better. Fuck I'd prefer Rubles

The article said that the digital currency was going to be backed by some kind of asset so in theory it would not be as unstable as most third world currencies are.

Depending on the true convertibility. USD was backed by gold too until too many people (most notably the government of great Brittan) started converting.

Ecuador abandoned their own currency because of a banking crisis in 2000. They have been using the dollar ever since. They say that the dollar will continue to be accepted as currency and will be used in tandem with the new currency. If one unit of the new digital currency = one dollar and the dollar is still accepted for payment then there would be no reason why they would not allow people to convert back and forth.

[AnonyMint]

Ecuador is entirely missing the point that decentralization and sparse economies-of-scale are what is new in the Knowledge Age.

I was studying Ecuador recently as a potential place to get a 2nd citizenship, and the problem is you can't even home school your kids. The Ministry of Education owns your kids where State 'edumacation' (i.e. indoctrination) is compulsory from age 3 to 17. Military service and voting are also mandatory. Note all of South America is nearly the same but Ecuador, Venezuela, Brazil, and Uruguay (I didn't research Chile) are the most top-down controlling! The Communist (or Fascist) nirvanas are all about masking corruption in an idealism that is fed to the naive population. Run as far as away as you can. These top-down morasses always crash and burn and often with megadeath end game scenarios as the idealism just won't fade without trying to force an ideal outcome, e.g. how the universal health care which (along with lack of native supplies of oil) bankrupted Nazi Germany (after the fall of Germany to the Communists in the prior decade) lead to eugenics culling of the weak, handicapped, and 'inferior' races.

Education fraud in the USA:

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/08/04/fraud-of-education/

[shogdite]

Yeah Ecuador has taken a step backwards with this move, hopefully they'll change their mind as bitcoin adoption spreads across South America.

Will be interesting to see how their new government issued digital currency works out.

[Nemo1024]

So a digital currency controlled by the government replacing the current "uncontrollable" fiat money.

This is worse than banning bitcoin actually.

You will have basically no means escaping the government control. All your finances will be tracked and they will know everything you purchase , when you send money to your kinds and family in detail.  And they will be able to wipe your deposits with a click.

A lot of them will miss cash payments

Agree with you there. I think Ecuador is just a test-bed, to see how this will play out. Norway was recently airing the idea of abandoning cash and going 100% digital in a few years' time. The future is already here.

[AnonyMint]

Ecuador is entirely missing the point that decentralization and sparse economies-of-scale are what is new in the Knowledge Age.

I was studying Ecuador recently as a potential place to get a 2nd citizenship, and the problem is you can't even home school your kids. The Ministry of Education owns your kids where State 'edumacation' (i.e. indoctrination) is compulsory from age 3 to 17. Military service and voting are also mandatory. Note all of South America is nearly the same but Ecuador, Venezuela, Brazil, and Uruguay (I didn't research Chile) are the most top-down controlling! The Communist (or Fascist) nirvanas are all about masking corruption in an idealism that is fed to the naive population. Run as far as away as you can. These top-down morasses always crash and burn and often with megadeath end game scenarios as the idealism just won't fade without trying to force an ideal outcome, e.g. how the universal health care which (along with lack of native supplies of oil) bankrupted Nazi Germany (after the fall of Germany to the Communists in the prior decade) lead to eugenics culling of the weak, handicapped, and 'inferior' races.

Education fraud in the USA:

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/08/04/fraud-of-education/

So when you continued your search for second citizenship where did you arrive at?

Also what was your reason for second citizenship? Lower taxation on wealth (and wealth appreciation)?

Australia would be best (for residency) as even though they participate in the "5 eyes" (NSA crap) they are turning away from socialist (first to repeal carbon taxes) and have wide open spaces (heck you can lease 100,000 hectares for $20,000 per year). I am trying to protect against the scenario where US passports would be canceled and I would be forced back to my neurotic homeland. Australia will be the safest if the global economy turns down and the bandits are roaming in South America to rape your wife and gut you with a machete. Drugs (use at least marijuana is ubiquitous and trafficking cartels) are apparently a significant issue in South America.

Easier to immigrate to New Zealand if you can tolerate the cooler, wet climate. I can't.

If you want to do South America (e.g. Argentina or Paraguay, or don't have kids so Uruguay is okay), you need to establish security even if you are in a remote location (men do roam on horses).

If you can qualify for Dominica or St. Kitts economic citizenship, that might be best for tax purposes and if you can establish residency where ever you like and remain mobile. Uruguay provides a 5 year tax holiday and after that they don't tax capital gains and only 12% on worldwide income.

It is a complex mix of considerations and will vary for each person's situation. Collect a lot of facts, then sort through it.

[bryant.coleman]

Rafael Correa is one of the most corrupt heads of state in the Latin American region. He has sold off millions of hectares of rain-forest to logging and exploration companies, putting the native people living there at great risk. He is very good in vote rigging and persecuting the opposition members. He is the Latin American version of Muammar Gaddafi. Now this lowlife wants to ban Bitcoin..... 

[niothor]

So a digital currency controlled by the government replacing the current "uncontrollable" fiat money.

This is worse than banning bitcoin actually.

You will have basically no means escaping the government control. All your finances will be tracked and they will know everything you purchase , when you send money to your kinds and family in detail.  And they will be able to wipe your deposits with a click.

A lot of them will miss cash payments

Agree with you there. I think Ecuador is just a test-bed, to see how this will play out. Norway was recently airing the idea of abandoning cash and going 100% digital in a few years' time. The future is already here.

I think Israel has a plan to become the first country with no cash.
When I think of Norway I don't see too many pros from a no cash policy but when I look back at Romania and see the tax evasion happening here , all the black market commerce I start to wonder what such an experiment would bring .

[anglo byte]

If the people of Ecuador get used to trading in an electronic currency on cell phones, one of the existing barrier to entry for bitcoin will be weakened

[AnonyMint]

Armstrong's intepretation:

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2014/09/03/ecuador-will-be-the-first-country-to-start-digital-currency/

[Nemo1024]

When I think of Norway I don't see too many pros from a no cash policy...

The major pro is stopping the mints. Norway is largely non-cash as it were already. You cannot pay with cash in hospitals or medical centers. Many shops already have cashless counters. If you try to pay with cash for public transportation in Oslo, you pay higher price than if you were using a prepayed card (equivalent of €6.15 per hour instead of €3.70) and such cards can be mostly charged cashlessly. When I think about it, the last time I held cash was about 4 months ago...

[Wilikon]

When I think of Norway I don't see too many pros from a no cash policy...

The major pro is stopping the mints. Norway is largely non-cash as it were already. You cannot pay with cash in hospitals or medical centers. Many shops already have cashless counters. If you try to pay with cash for public transportation in Oslo, you pay higher price than if you were using a prepayed card (equivalent of €6.15 per hour instead of €3.70) and such cards can be mostly charged cashlessly. When I think about it, the last time I held cash was about 4 months ago...

Is your ID linked to all those prepaid cards?

[4mherewego]

I so am gonna short this... If US gov couldn't do a homepage for health care, good luck that Ecuador will be able to secure a bad implementation of bitcoin.

[Nemo1024]

When I think of Norway I don't see too many pros from a no cash policy...

The major pro is stopping the mints. Norway is largely non-cash as it were already. You cannot pay with cash in hospitals or medical centers. Many shops already have cashless counters. If you try to pay with cash for public transportation in Oslo, you pay higher price than if you were using a prepayed card (equivalent of €6.15 per hour instead of €3.70) and such cards can be mostly charged cashlessly. When I think about it, the last time I held cash was about 4 months ago...

Is your ID linked to all those prepaid cards?

For the most part, yes. You buy them using your bank card (national payment system), so there is a link. And most people nowadays pay for their tickets (either single fare or 7- or 30-day) through their phones, using VISA payment - another link. And then many directly link their travel cards to an on-line account "for ease of monitoring what your active tickets look like".

Actually, using the phone and a 30-day ticket is the most anonymous way after cash - you pay once and then you only have to show the phone's screen to the driver.

[niothor]

When I think of Norway I don't see too many pros from a no cash policy...

The major pro is stopping the mints. Norway is largely non-cash as it were already. You cannot pay with cash in hospitals or medical centers. Many shops already have cashless counters. If you try to pay with cash for public transportation in Oslo, you pay higher price than if you were using a prepayed card (equivalent of €6.15 per hour instead of €3.70) and such cards can be mostly charged cashlessly. When I think about it, the last time I held cash was about 4 months ago...

Is your ID linked to all those prepaid cards?

For the most part, yes. You buy them using your bank card (national payment system), so there is a link. And most people nowadays pay for their tickets (either single fare or 7- or 30-day) through their phones, using VISA payment - another link. And then many directly link their travel cards to an on-line account "for ease of monitoring what your active tickets look like".

Actually, using the phone and a 30-day ticket is the most anonymous way after cash - you pay once and then you only have to show the phone's screen to the driver.

Can you buy a sim card wit no id in Norway?

There are talks about a new law here that would require everyone to present their id and be registered in the mobile operator database even for prepaid card. This would kill the anonymity of those kind of payments.

[Nemo1024]

Can you buy a sim card wit no id in Norway?

There are talks about a new law here that would require everyone to present their id and be registered in the mobile operator database even for prepaid card. This would kill the anonymity of those kind of payments.

No. You must provide an ID for any type of SIM card.

[Wilikon]

Can you buy a sim card wit no id in Norway?

There are talks about a new law here that would require everyone to present their id and be registered in the mobile operator database even for prepaid card. This would kill the anonymity of those kind of payments.

No. You must provide an ID for any type of SIM card.

Wow. That sucks. Big time. Of course "why be worry if you have nothing to hide" can be heard all over your place I would imagine.

[niothor]

Can you buy a sim card wit no id in Norway?

There are talks about a new law here that would require everyone to present their id and be registered in the mobile operator database even for prepaid card. This would kill the anonymity of those kind of payments.

No. You must provide an ID for any type of SIM card.

Wow. That sucks. Big time. Of course "why be worry if you have nothing to hide" can be heard all over your place I would imagine.

Actually I did a small research about calls..
Last year we had 17.4m calls to the emergency 112 in our country , out of which 70,91%  have been false.

10.892 people have received a fine while more than 5 times this number , over to 50 000 haven't been yet identified.
One of the most outrageous case happened last winter when such a fake call put an ambulance on a 1.5 hour drive to a snow covered village where they got stuck. In the meantime in the same county 1 man died because there was no ambulance available.

Just by looking at those numbers I can see why an id would be required.

Ps.
I think that a ten year sentence would be mild for such a "prank" Instead ,  the maximum you can get is a ~250 euros fine.

[raganius]

Ecuador's digital currency would be a great joke.

If the people of Ecuador get used to trading in an electronic currency on cell phones, one of the existing barrier to entry for bitcoin will be weakened

True, that would be the only good outcome, after all.