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Author Topic: BitSports Betting (Intro and NFL thread)  (Read 2494 times)
BitSports
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August 11, 2010, 03:09:14 AM
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Welcome! Thanks for coming to check out Bitcoin Sports. Here I plan to host sports bets that allow you to win Bitcoins by betting on your favorite teams. In this particular thread, we are going to start with NFL betting. If there is enough interest, betting will continue all season, and new sports will be added to bet on.


How it works:

Every week, I will list games along with a point spread. This spread will be the same as used by most Vegas casinos and online sports books. You are then able to view your choices, and pick any game that you wish to bet on. Then, you send your Bitcoins to BitSports, along with who you've chosen to win. If your team wins the spread, you double the amount of Bitcoins you've bet!


Step by step:


1) Open, or generate, a new MyBitcoin(mybitcoin.com, mybitcoin.i2p, xqzfakpeuvrobvpj.onion) address. MyBitcoin is necessary because it allows notes to be left from the payer, that the payee can view, and it also shows the address of the payee. This is important for picking your teams later on.

2) Private message me your new MyBitcoin address, and I will give you the BitSports BTC address to send your bets. You MUST have at least five(5) posts on the Bitcoin forum. This number will likely go up as time progresses. This is a necessary precaution to try and minimize the act of any one person creating multiple addresses to make more bets than the maximum I put in place. You are allowed only one address to bet with. Addresses only need to be approved once, and you can then bet as often as you'd like.

WARNING: Do NOT change the MyBitcoin address used for betting, or you will have to notify me before you are allowed to bet again

Bets from addresses in which I did not approve beforehand will be returned

3) Wait for your games to be posted. Every week I will post new matches along with their spreads onto the forum. Once they are posted, you are allowed to bet on those games immediately, and you can bet on them up to the last minute before the scheduled starting time.

4) In order to bet, fill your MyBitcoin wallet, and send your coins to the Bitcoin address I give you. When you click on Send Payment in MyBitcoin, there is a Payment Note section. In this section, you will list the team that you want to bet on, along with the date of the game.

Bets that do not list a team AND date in the note section will be returned

5) Wait for the match to finish, and receive double your bet when you win!



For regular season games, bets are limited to 50 BTC per day per person. This is so I can measure the interest members have, build trust, as well as ensure I can sustain any number of bets in case we have some real sharks around here Wink. You can spread the coins however you'd like between the teams, but please send each bet separately.

For this NFL preseason(August 12-September 2) I am going to start testing the waters, and begin taking bets up to 10 BTC


Requirements:

  • You MUST be of legal gambling age.
  • A free MyBitcoin account.
  • At least five(5) posts on the Bitcoin forum.
  • Bets must be made from an approved address.
  • Bets must include the team, and date in the notes section.


FAQ:

- Which sports will you hold bets for?
For now I only plan on hosting bets for the NFL and NBA, though I am open to all recommendations and will host other sports if there is enough interest.

- Why is a MyBitcoin address needed?
So it's viewable who the payer is on each bet, and so the payer can leave a note while betting to list the team and date of the game.

- How do I bet using a point spread?
Point spreads are used to give even odds to the underdog.
Example: There is a game posted that reads "Team A (+7) vs. Team B (-7)". In this situation, Team A is the underdog. If you bet on Team A, your team can lose by up to 7 points, and you still win the bet. In order for you to win if you bet on Team B, they not only have to win the game, but they have to win by more than 7 points. If B wins by 7 points even, it's a break and your original bet is returned to you. Most spreads use 1/2 points in their spread to minimize any even breaks. Remember, the team with the positive number next to their name is the underdog, and they can lose by up to that many points and still win the spread.

- Can I bet 50 BTC for today's game and 50 BTC for tomorrow's at the same time?
Yes. You can put more than 50 coins into play in a day, as long as the total does not exceed 50 coins of bets per day. For example, if there is a game on every day of the week you'd like to bet on, you can bet up to 350 bitcoins on Monday, as long as there isn't more than 50 Bitcoins in bets per day. 350 coins equals to 50 coins each day of the week.

- When are the winners paid?
Games will usually be payed out under 24 hours after it ends. Due to the fact that these are manual transactions, this will not always be constant, so please allow extra time.




Let the fun begin! Everyone is free to use this thread for any sports or betting discussions. Betters and all of their bets are kept entirely private unless you discuss it. Remember, for the preseason there is a maximum of 10 BTC in bets per day to get everyone used to betting. Please feel free to post any questions, or send me a private message with any questions, recommendations or interest in the event.

Thanks Smiley. I hope you all enjoy this service!

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BitSports
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August 11, 2010, 03:09:35 AM
 #2

8/12
7:30 PM New Orleans (+1.5) vs New England (-1.5)
8:00 PM Carolina (+3.5) vs Baltimore (-3.5)
9:00 PM Oakland (+3.5) vs Dallas (-3.5)

8/13
7:30 PM Buffalo (+3) vs Washington (-3)
7:30 PM Jacksonville (+3) vs Philadelphia (-3)
8:00 PM Kansas (+3) vs Atlanta (-3)

8/14
7:00 PM Tampa Bay (+3.5) vs Miami (-3.5)
7:30 PM Detroit (+3) vs Pittsburgh (-3)
8:00 PM Cleveland (+3) vs Green bay (-3)
8:00 PM Houston (-1) vs Arizona (+1)
8:00 PM Minnesota (+1) vs St Louis (-1)
9:00 PM Chicago (+3) vs San Diego (-3)
10:00 PM Tennessee (+3) vs Seattle (-3)

8/15
1:00 PM San Francisco (-3) vs Indianapolis (+3)
7:00 PM Denver (+3.5) vs Cincinnati (-3.5)

8/16
8:00 PM NY Giants (+1.5) vs. NY Jets (-1.5)

Times in EST
kiba
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August 11, 2010, 03:29:15 AM
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Diablo-D3 won't like this at all. He said gambling will attract the feds.

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August 11, 2010, 03:36:12 AM
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How it works:

Every week, I will list games along with a point spread. This spread will be the same as used by most Vegas casinos and online sports books. You are then able to view your choices, and pick any game that you wish to bet on. Then, you send your Bitcoins to BitSports, along with who you've chosen to win. If your team wins the spread, you double the amount of Bitcoins you've bet!

What happens if the game matches the spread? The house wins?
BitSports
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August 11, 2010, 03:44:12 AM
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There is no United States law that prohibits a person from betting on an offshore sportsbook online. That is why so many of them exist online. Given the fact that I am not located in the US, and Bitcoins are not a U.S. currency, there is nothing illegal here, because there is no law against it. I think Bitcoins will already attract Feds. A sportsbook in which allows only 50 coins to bet per day is not something that should raise too many eyebrows. Even if it does, the important thing to note is there is nothing illegal being done.


What happens if the game matches the spread? The house wins?

The amount of Bitcoins bet are returned. No win, no loss.
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August 11, 2010, 08:09:54 AM
 #6

- Why is a MyBitcoin address needed?
So it's viewable who the payer is on each bet, and so the payer can leave a note while betting to list the team and date of the game.
This should be unnecessary.
Please read this post about a better way for the merchant to keep track of who is sending him money:
http://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=711.msg7837#msg7837
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August 11, 2010, 08:26:39 AM
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Or you can create an address for each receiver and keep track of which address you receive money from. For example, I have 3 users which I receive money from: A,B and C. I create an address for each one of them, and if I get bitcoins to A's address, I suppose A sent them; if to B's address, then it should be B sending money; if to C's address, it is C sending bitcoins to me.

My BC: 1FA57SXagJUq7zhnk5kTQMQmWSE3eBVbMr
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August 11, 2010, 09:20:27 AM
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  Do you plan to automate it with a website?

I am very interested in a general bitcoin prediction market. One model I was considering for simplicity would be to have "contract creators" write terms and mark winners. So you create "New England to defeat New Orleans by 2 or more points" users make offers to buy or sell this contract based on who they expect to win just like offers at MTGOX or other exchange. You would easily get a reputation for marking the winners correctly and the payment would be automated. Other people could write political contracts or economic predictions or whatever. People who write crap like "I'll be happy on January 23rd" just won't get action.

Anyway, sorry to hijack your thread, just wondering if you might be interested in something like that.

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
BitSports
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August 11, 2010, 10:57:34 AM
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Or you can create an address for each receiver and keep track of which address you receive money from. For example, I have 3 users which I receive money from: A,B and C. I create an address for each one of them, and if I get bitcoins to A's address, I suppose A sent them; if to B's address, then it should be B sending money; if to C's address, it is C sending bitcoins to me.

This would require that I also keep track of which team you bet on and for which date you're betting for. I have thought about  this, but the Notes section allows choices to be made much easier than just sending them to a bitcoin address. Even if everyone is assigned their own, I still do not know which game the bet is on. If your team plays 2+ times a week, then it gets really confusing.

Quote from: FreemOney
Do you plan to automate it with a website?
I would love to. Only problem is if I do, I would need some help with that venture as it is not my expertise. Any help and recommendations are welcome.
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August 11, 2010, 06:41:44 PM
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Aceat64 is taking the risk of operating a prediction market website while I code it.

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August 13, 2010, 08:20:27 AM
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You can just make a "balance" for each user. If a user puts something to the address, his balance increases; if he/she wishes to take BTCs from the balance, it decreases; and bets will be paid with that balance.

My BC: 1FA57SXagJUq7zhnk5kTQMQmWSE3eBVbMr
BitSports
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August 15, 2010, 01:15:23 PM
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Thank you for those who have shown interest. I have been in contact with a couple of you regarding an automated service and website, and it seems the best route to wait for that to be finished. Bets for this preseason are off, and I am hoping to have some sort of service running before the NFL regular season begins. If not, there's plenty of sports to host bets for.
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August 16, 2010, 03:23:05 AM
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2) Private message me your new MyBitcoin address, and I will give you the BitSports BTC address to send your bets. You MUST have at least five(5) posts on the Bitcoin forum. This number will likely go up as time progresses. This is a necessary precaution to try and minimize the act of any one person creating multiple addresses to make more bets than the maximum I put in place. You are allowed only one address to bet with. Addresses only need to be approved once, and you can then bet as often as you'd like.

Ooh, time for me to start establishing multiple forum personas and to communicate differently or different types of messages within each forum persona, whilst still providing informative or useful, not so suspicious types of informations.  Doing this will help to allow me to have better chances at this implementation of betting.  I can do it!  I know I can!  There are many neighbors near with wifi and I can easily keep track of which username to log in to with which ip address/wireless network and game the system!

However, I have no interest in sports, nor gambling, so I won't... or will I?  Or maybe I already have multiple forum accounts...  ^_^

Quote
This is a necessary precaution to try and minimize the act of any one person creating multiple addresses to make more bets than the maximum I put in place.
While it may minimize it, someone willing to put forth the effort to game the system (similarly to what I communicated above) may make the idea seem not as successful or reliable as it could be.  Perhaps instead of relying on this forum to guarantee unique users, some other method could be established that is more reliable?
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August 16, 2010, 05:20:01 AM
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While it may minimize it, someone willing to put forth the effort to game the system (similarly to what I communicated above) may make the idea seem not as successful or reliable as it could be.  Perhaps instead of relying on this forum to guarantee unique users, some other method could be established that is more reliable?

There are surely better ways. It depends on what his goal is though. If you want to cap total exposure, then do that and tell people "Sorry, full up" If you want to keep bets balanced on both sides, just close the lagging side. OR spread a market and let the rate fluctuate and people bet with each other.

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
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August 17, 2010, 05:34:51 PM
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I wanted to do an NFL thread, but do it in a different way. Instead of the old fashioned BEARS +3 -110 type stuff, make it pari-mutual like, and invite everyone to bet on both ends.


Example:
minnesota Vikings (+6) [1012] 1CkgLbgjFY............4zUXoRGoVX
   at NEW ORLEANS SAINTS (-6) [937] 15EmRz7U..............nN2tXgv6Ghjz

currently: minnesota +6 -108 / NO -6 +108, because there are 1,012 bitcoins on minnesota +6 and 937 bitcoins on NO.

minnesota vikings (+0) [432] 15VjRaDX..............zrVzN7ixHNsC
   at NEW ORLEANS SAINTS (+0) [817] 1DZ6d5W3..............uVfb2Y2PcoWn

currently: minnesota +189 / NO -189 because there are 432 bitcoins on minnesota to win outright, and 817 on NO to win outright.


If you wanted to bet on minnesota +6, sent bitcoins to 1CkgLbgjFY............4zUXoRGoVX
If you wanted to bet on new orleans moneyline (zero spread) send bitcoins to 1DZ6d5W3..............uVfb2Y2PcoWn
etc....

Then pay out on a pro-rated basis. If there was 100 bitcoins on the winner and 250 on the loser, each winning bitcoin gets 2.5 bitcoin profit and their 1.0 bitcoins returned.

This would encourage market makers to bet on both sides of the game, thus providing liquidity in the market for those who wanted to have straight action. Vig could be taken from the winning bets after a market was established. If another poster wants to offer cheaper vig, so be it! All bets could be up for public viewing, so that everything is verified.

Make sense? I always over do things.

good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgment
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August 17, 2010, 07:53:45 PM
 #16

I wanted to do an NFL thread, but do it in a different way. Instead of the old fashioned BEARS +3 -110 type stuff, make it pari-mutual like, and invite everyone to bet on both ends.


Example:
minnesota Vikings (+6) [1012] 1CkgLbgjFY............4zUXoRGoVX
   at NEW ORLEANS SAINTS (-6) [937] 15EmRz7U..............nN2tXgv6Ghjz

currently: minnesota +6 -108 / NO -6 +108, because there are 1,012 bitcoins on minnesota +6 and 937 bitcoins on NO.

minnesota vikings (+0) [432] 15VjRaDX..............zrVzN7ixHNsC
   at NEW ORLEANS SAINTS (+0) [817] 1DZ6d5W3..............uVfb2Y2PcoWn

currently: minnesota +189 / NO -189 because there are 432 bitcoins on minnesota to win outright, and 817 on NO to win outright.


If you wanted to bet on minnesota +6, sent bitcoins to 1CkgLbgjFY............4zUXoRGoVX
If you wanted to bet on new orleans moneyline (zero spread) send bitcoins to 1DZ6d5W3..............uVfb2Y2PcoWn
etc....

Then pay out on a pro-rated basis. If there was 100 bitcoins on the winner and 250 on the loser, each winning bitcoin gets 2.5 bitcoin profit and their 1.0 bitcoins returned.

This would encourage market makers to bet on both sides of the game, thus providing liquidity in the market for those who wanted to have straight action. Vig could be taken from the winning bets after a market was established. If another poster wants to offer cheaper vig, so be it! All bets could be up for public viewing, so that everything is verified.

Make sense? I always over do things.

Does your payout depend on the action on both sides when you bet or the balance of action at the time of closing?

Sorry, I'm thick. It's time of wager, right? What about when betting starts and there is nothing yet bet on either side? What are the odds?

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
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August 17, 2010, 09:03:31 PM
 #17

I wanted to do an NFL thread, but do it in a different way. Instead of the old fashioned BEARS +3 -110 type stuff, make it pari-mutual like, and invite everyone to bet on both ends.


Example:
minnesota Vikings (+6) [1012] 1CkgLbgjFY............4zUXoRGoVX
   at NEW ORLEANS SAINTS (-6) [937] 15EmRz7U..............nN2tXgv6Ghjz

currently: minnesota +6 -108 / NO -6 +108, because there are 1,012 bitcoins on minnesota +6 and 937 bitcoins on NO.

minnesota vikings (+0) [432] 15VjRaDX..............zrVzN7ixHNsC
   at NEW ORLEANS SAINTS (+0) [817] 1DZ6d5W3..............uVfb2Y2PcoWn

currently: minnesota +189 / NO -189 because there are 432 bitcoins on minnesota to win outright, and 817 on NO to win outright.


If you wanted to bet on minnesota +6, sent bitcoins to 1CkgLbgjFY............4zUXoRGoVX
If you wanted to bet on new orleans moneyline (zero spread) send bitcoins to 1DZ6d5W3..............uVfb2Y2PcoWn
etc....

Then pay out on a pro-rated basis. If there was 100 bitcoins on the winner and 250 on the loser, each winning bitcoin gets 2.5 bitcoin profit and their 1.0 bitcoins returned.

This would encourage market makers to bet on both sides of the game, thus providing liquidity in the market for those who wanted to have straight action. Vig could be taken from the winning bets after a market was established. If another poster wants to offer cheaper vig, so be it! All bets could be up for public viewing, so that everything is verified.

Make sense? I always over do things.

Does your payout depend on the action on both sides when you bet or the balance of action at the time of closing?

Sorry, I'm thick. It's time of wager, right? What about when betting starts and there is nothing yet bet on either side? What are the odds?


It would be pari-mutual, like horse racing. You get the odds at kickoff, not the odds at time bet. While at first this may seem like a bad thing, it would encourage betting on both sides, making deeper, safer markets.

Example:
you bet 50 on heads and 50 on tails on the superbowl cointoss. Now assume someone else bets 10 on heads, making it heads [60] and tails [50]. Tails is paying +120 (60/50).

* if it comes out heads, you lose 50 on tails bet, and make 41.67 on heads bet, net -8.33.
* if it comes out tails, you lose 50 on heads bet, but make 60 on tails bet +10.00

Since it is a 50/50 proposition, your net effect is 0.5*-8.33 + 0.5*10.00 = +0.835 bitcoins in the long run. In fact, if the coin toss really is a 50/50 prop, you can only win in the long run by putting up an even amount on each side.

Of course, when someone sees that a 50/50 prop is paying 1.2 per 1.0, they might just put 10 on tails outright.

Before betting, you would want to know the market size, as you would get screwed putting up 100 bitcoins in a market where there is 40 on one side and 30 on the other.  But all it would take would be a few bookmakers putting up a thousand or so on each side to make it reasonable.


good judgment comes from experience, and experience comes from bad judgment
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