[PPC] Peercoin - Indicium Logo & PeerAssets Diagram Released

[sportscliche]

My understanding is that shares will be initially offered to people who have demonstrated an interest in supporting the project and help the network function properly in its early, very critical stages.  I'm not under the impression that these are a "group of buddies", who will be disinterested, passive investors.  The shareholders are very important because they have voting responsibilities that will determine the course of the project.  Jordan Lee has stated that the team is looking for business partners and I don't see anything nefarious with that plan.  Pretty much every small company starts that way before going public. 

After the initial offering of 1B NuShares is distributed, they will begin trading on exchanges.

[kokojie]

The distribution scheme of NuShares is a complete disaster, black box operation. How can others have confidence when you distribute this way? I would recommend everyone to stay the hell away from this.

[Wekkel]

The distribution scheme of NuShares is a complete disaster, black box operation. How can others have confidence when you distribute this way? I would recommend everyone to stay the hell away from this.

Like I said, it sounds too complicated.

[sportscliche]

The distribution scheme of NuShares is a complete disaster, black box operation. How can others have confidence when you distribute this way? I would recommend everyone to stay the hell away from this.

But isn't this the same way Facebook started?  Google?  Pretty much every publicly traded company?  The company founders get the initial equity and there may or many not be an IPO.

Is there a requirement that every crypto-asset be initially distributed via mining?  If so, why is this more fair?

[TinEye]

The distribution scheme of NuShares is a complete disaster, black box operation. How can others have confidence when you distribute this way? I would recommend everyone to stay the hell away from this.

But isn't this the same way Facebook started?  Google?  Pretty much every publicly traded company?  The company founders get the initial equity and there may or many not be an IPO.

Is there a requirement that every crypto-asset be initially distributed via mining?  If so, why is this more fair?

Facebook and Google don't claim or are supposed to be decentralized. This thing remains more or less centralized its no better than fiat. Why bother with it then.

[masterOfDisaster]

Facebook and Google don't claim or are supposed to be decentralized. This thing remains more or less centralized its no better than fiat. Why bother with it then.

Nu might be less decentralized now than it will hopefully be in the future. It's necessary for the bootstrap phase of the ecosystem.
Bad decisions by voting can risk the whole concept.
A bad decision for example would be to have shares, but to be passive in terms of voting. Not voting is effectively the same as voting against a custodian, parking rate change or motion.
The whole experiment could fail just because people didn't understand what they are responsible for.

If "this thing" doesn't continue to be more decentralized, it's still better than fiat, because in the fiat word those who lead the central banks and decide are barely responsible for their decisions. Other people pay for wrong decisions. NuShares holders pay with the value of their NuShares for their decisions.
And it's - for some use cases (e.g. for payments) - already better than most other crypto currencies/assets because of the stable price. For sure it's only 10 days after start; ut so far the price stability is remarkable.
That's why I think it's worth bothering with it.

And I think it's worth bothering with it because Nu tests using Peercoins as a backbone currency. This is another interesting experiment.
Do we really know everything yet? I like experiments! Especially the sophisticated ones

What did you say 2009 to Bitcoin?
...this thing will end more or less centralized and its no better than [to be filled out; I suggest one of (fiat; gold; precious metals;)]?

[TinEye]

What did you say 2009 to Bitcoin?
...this thing will end more or less centralized and its no better than [to be filled out; I suggest one of (fiat; gold; precious metals;)]?

The argument brought up by every one of the hundreds of coins here. Conveniently forgetting that Bitcoin had no competition.

[masterOfDisaster]

What did you say 2009 to Bitcoin?
...this thing will end more or less centralized and its no better than [to be filled out; I suggest one of (fiat; gold; precious metals;)]?

The argument brought up by every one of the hundreds of coins here. Conveniently forgetting that Bitcoin had no competition.

Bitcoin was and still is a great invention.
In difference to 2009 Bitcoin now has competition.
And Bitcoin is becoming more and more centralized.

All started with the need for pools to receive an ongoing income for the used hash rate.
It continued with the financial centralization: the need to spend (large) amounts of money for (more and more) specialized hardware (first GPUs, then FPGAs, then ASICs, then ASICs with more and more efficiency in terms of GH/$ and GH/kWh).
It currently is on the way to geographical centralization: mining farms are created where the infrastructure is suficient and electricity costs are low.
One might expect "political" centralization to occur once Bitcoin (mining) becomes banned in certain countries.

I'm glad that Bitcoin started that whole thing.
But I bet that e.g. Peercoin has better chances to survive the next 3 years from now.
What do you think will happen when the coinbase reward for solving a Bitcoin block drops from 25 BT to 12.5 BTC?
The last time the halving occured, Bitcoin was not as industrialized as it now is.
We'll see what happens after block 410,00 (now we are at 323,759 (2014-10-04, 09:21 UTC)).
In approximately 1 year and 234 days from now (depending on the development of the hash rate) we'll face that coinbase reward halving.

But maybe I should stop confusing you with arguments - you already have a belief...

[xcapator]

There's shaken confidence in ppc right now and the fact that nubits has to be utilized for PPC to have real value. also consumers don't want to pay high ppc prices so nushare holders get better prices.

How do you conclude that ppc needs nubits to have any value? that simply isn't the case. it had value before anyone even knew what nubits was.

ppc has value indepedent of nubits. nubits is utilized as a usd equivalent, while shareholders receive peercoin dividends based on "nu" growth

[kcal63]

The distribution scheme of NuShares is a complete disaster, black box operation. How can others have confidence when you distribute this way? I would recommend everyone to stay the hell away from this.

But isn't this the same way Facebook started?  Google?  Pretty much every publicly traded company?  The company founders get the initial equity and there may or many not be an IPO.

Is there a requirement that every crypto-asset be initially distributed via mining?  If so, why is this more fair?

No, it bears no resemblance to how those companies were started and taken public.

[kingscrown]

shame BTC dropped, PPC would raise if it didnt

[river333]

Sunny King's update today was pretty interesting:

Weekly Update #111
   

• Mike's work on duplicate stake protocol has been reviewed and scheduled for v0.5. This work introduces a change in the duplicate stake detection, such that when a block is received having the same proof-of-stake with the current best block (the latest block on main chain), the best block would be rolled back and proof-of-stake would be minted on top of previous block. At the same time, the block causing the rollback of best block is broadcasted to other nodes to take actions
• This solution introduces disincentive to minting on multiple branches, that is, this type of minters risk losing the acceptance of their blocks.

Have fun!

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

[masterOfDisaster]

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

Just like SK already concluded: it's a disincentive for minting on multiple branches. Although the economical incentives of doing so have never been good (just a little bit of accumulated interest in the end...), they're defeated with this protocol change.

With the current protocol you have a small chance of raising your accumulated interest over the accumulated interest of minters that only mint on one branch. You can do that by minting multiple branches, having earlier success and receiving more acumulated interest by doing that.

With protocol 0.5 the odds are you lose accumulated interest when tyring to mint on multiple branches (once again compared to minters that only mint on one branch). Duplicate stake detection punishes minting on multiple branches by removing a block that was detected by duplicate stake detection. Successful minting is no longer accelerated by minting multiple branches but delayed (until minting on multiple branches has been stopped!).

[resya]

shame BTC dropped, PPC would raise if it didnt

Many people focus on BTC, but when the bubble expands, some deflation is due to BTC to PPC trade. Everyone knows if BTC expands, PPC is right behind it

[Wekkel]

PPC has some characteristics that makes it more attractive for mainstream actors: a flexible supply and more coins. Psychology counts big, I am afraid. PPC is not done yet as altcoin.

[river333]

Bounties are now available for translating peercoin.net and Peerunity: http://www.peercointalk.org/index.php?topic=3472.0

[Yurizhai]

Peerunity v0.1.1 has been released, includes a minting tab so you can see how likely you are to mint a block:

http://www.peercointalk.org/index.php?topic=3470.msg33598#msg33598

[river333]

Peerbox v0.23 has been released: http://www.peercointalk.org/index.php?topic=3478.0

[edgar]

my old ppc wallet was v.0.3 and wouldnt sync, so i just got the peerunity v0.1.1 wallet which now wont sync either.

the message i get is;

WARNING: Blockchain redownload required approaching or past v0.4 upgrade deadline.


Inside Peerunity;

Catching Up: Downloaded 114848 blocks of transaction history. Last received block was generated 146 days ago...   ALL day.

[river333]

Hi edgar,

This video may be helpful: http://youtu.be/rfQKiKhGck0

Remember to backup your wallet beforehand.