What if power was free?

[Belltactical]

Hi.  I'm a newbie and have been loking at the economics of mining.  It seems that one if the biggest obstacles is the cost of power to run miners making the return on investment questionable so I have a newbie question.

What if the power to run ASIC mining hardware was free?  I happen to have a massive solar array on my roof.  The previous owner covered the entire roof of my house with solar panels but never  for reasons I can't understand, did anything other than wire them up.  I've confirmed that they work, generate massive amounts of power and I have a supply source for storage batteries that would be very economical for me.

So, the simple question is that with all things being equal, how much of a difference would it make if I could eliminate the cost of power from the equation in determine the financial return on investment in the overall cost of things.  With prices for Mining hardware coming down almost daily, is the cost of power that significant that getting it for free would make this a viable undertaking? 

Like I said, I'm a complete noob on this and just starting to get my head around everything but from all the research I've done, it seems the cost for power is one of the biggest obstacles in running a mining farm and actually making some money off this adventure.

I'd appreciate any help/advice.  Thanks in advance.

[oblivi]

Go to coinwarz and you can calculate your profit given coin difficulty and power usage. If you can get away with free mining then why the fuck not? it sounds great. I wish I had space to install massive solar panels.

[Belltactical]

Kind of what I thought.  Based on the amount of panels, it looks like the previous owners sized it to completely live off the grid and for some unknown reason (the guy died - I bought the house from his estate) got it all wired up and terminated in a junction box but that's as far as he went. 

[mwizard]

You are almost certain to be better off connecting the solar panels up for your own use and trying to sell the spare power back to the local power company if possible.  Even if all you can earn from selling power is say $0.05 per KWh this is likely to be your most profitable path.

Mining is not likely to be profitable.  Just for the discussion I will assuming the house has a 15kW solar system (typically 60 * 250 watt panels) and all of this is available for mining.  This would allow you to draw say 3.0kW over 24 hours with batteries for overnight power.  You would need at least 16 hours at 200 amps from 12 volt batteries.  This is at least 3200 AmpHours of 12V battery storage.  That is a lot of batteries.

Running say two Antminer S4s or similar will give you 4 terrahash.  You would currently earn about $24 per day.  And this will decline as difficulty rises.  In total you may earn say $6,000.  For this you need to buy the miners ($3,000), set up the batteries, set up any power conversion/charging electronics and run the lot.   The simplest solution for batteries may be to just put the batteries across the normal 12V supply to the miner, isolated by a diode from the normal daylight power feed.  Otherwise you will also need power converters.

I wish you luck.  

It would be interesting if you could say how much solar power you actually have available and more details on what you are planning.  

[odolvlobo]

In your case, the energy is not free, since you can use it to lower your electricity bill and maybe even sell it back to the power company.

Anyway, power costs are generally small compared to the cost of the equipment.

[turncoat_ewok]

I think BTC mining is almost dead. There is a very small chance of making profit from BTC mining. You may make a good amount of profit, if your power is free.

[Sonny]

I think BTC mining is almost dead. There is a very small chance of making profit from BTC mining. You may make a good amount of profit, if your power is free.

True that it is very hard to make profit from bitcoin mining nowadays, but that doesn't mean bitcoin mining is almost dead.

There will always be people having the most efficient hardware and cheapest costs, and they will be there mining bitcoin with profit.
Those with less efficient hardware or more expensive electricity will eventually switch down their machines, and that will help the other miners.

[Sonny]

So, the simple question is that with all things being equal, how much of a difference would it make if I could eliminate the cost of power from the equation in determine the financial return on investment in the overall cost of things.  With prices for Mining hardware coming down almost daily, is the cost of power that significant that getting it for free would make this a viable undertaking? 

Like I said, I'm a complete noob on this and just starting to get my head around everything but from all the research I've done, it seems the cost for power is one of the biggest obstacles in running a mining farm and actually making some money off this adventure.

I'd appreciate any help/advice.  Thanks in advance.

Electricity cost is a big factor in determining mining profit.
Take the Antminer S4 Batch 1 (https://bitmaintech.com/productDetail.htm?pid=00020140916100720380cS1tRWd00684) as an example.
It consumes about 1400W and so if you run it 24/7, the monthly power consumption would be ~1008 kWh. So if your electricity rate is $0.1 per kWh, you will need to pay $100.8 a month.

But electricity cost is not the only factor. Another big factor is the future difficulty increase rate, which is not easy to be correctly estimated.

[Velkro]

Power will never be free, someone always must pay for it. Maybe when cold fusion will be used in every country, then power will cost close to nothing

[deadweasel]

Yes, get on your bicycle turbine and power is free.  But food is not.

[Undefeatable]

If power is free, difficulty would be 10x of what it now and no body profit other then manufacturer.. so its still the same..

[Bonam]

Even with free power, you will be hard pressed to even recoup the capital expenditure of buying any miner that's currently shipping, let alone make any profit. Bitcoin mining just isn't profitable any more except when done on a huge scale with special discounts from the manufacturers.

Far far better simply just to sell any excess electricity you have as electricity.

[dynamox]

You are somewhat missing the poin... if power was free, as in power "in general", no one would need to work because automatization would be widespread enough for most jobs to be redundant, so an economy can't and isn't necessary when humanity has reached free power (post scarcity). Geothermal tecnology is pretty much free power.

[Pkofet]

If power is free, difficulty would be 10x of what it now and no body profit other then manufacturer.. so its still the same..

You are somewhat missing the poin... if power was free, as in power "in general", no one would need to work because automatization would be widespread enough for most jobs to be redundant, so an economy can't and isn't necessary when humanity has reached free power (post scarcity). Geothermal tecnology is pretty much free power.

CMIIW, OP was just saying he has a massive solar array on his roof and so he doesn't have to pay for the electricity.
It is not that someone has invented the technology to generate free energy for everyone in the world...

[polynesia]

There already are people who are mining in regions where electricity is cheap or subsidized.

[orsotheysaid]

There already are people who are mining in regions where electricity is cheap or subsidized.

Well I know some people using their welfare money to pay the electricity while mining, does that constitute free energy? lol

[Stedsm]

There already are people who are mining in regions where electricity is cheap or subsidized.

Such as iceland. People set up mining "farms" to generate bitcoins at a rapid rate. Incredible.

[beaknuke]

unless u can find another purpose for the solar (light lighting a building) then dont bother imo, the mining system is starting to look weak on return unless you have a lot of power for short term.

So, don't forget to take in account the repairs u will need on solar over the years

[dumbdragon]

unless u can find another purpose for the solar (light lighting a building) then dont bother imo, the mining system is starting to look weak on return unless you have a lot of power for short term.

So, don't forget to take in account the repairs u will need on solar over the years

Solar is a stupid investment right now since the installation costs are huge and there is little evidence of repair cost budgeting since its relatively modern.

[fathur01]

unless u can find another purpose for the solar (light lighting a building) then dont bother imo, the mining system is starting to look weak on return unless you have a lot of power for short term.

So, don't forget to take in account the repairs u will need on solar over the years

Solar is a stupid investment right now since the installation costs are huge and there is little evidence of repair cost budgeting since its relatively modern.

Its a high investment but you eventually make roi, even though its 10 years or so. You help out with the environment!