A perma-bull's take on this situation

[kokojie]

everyone who wanted it has it already. The permabulls keep holding and they ran out of ammo since they were calling the bottom wrong too often already. No new money coming in because nobody buys into these charts. Well, too bad, too sad.
Satoshi should have known better than forcing 10% inflation on us almost a decade into adoption.

Once the panic is on it's over.

Let me guess, you have a different coin to suggest?

are you happy with 10% inflation? Do we need that?

It wont be that high for long. Come the next halving it will..er halve. Whether i am happy about it is irrelevent. The coins are being distributed as per the algorithm and the really high inflation of bitcoin is behind us.

A much better question is whether a centralized mining race is good for bitcoin in the longer term.

Inflation is not the problem, therefore it has little effect on the eco-system even when it's lower. The PoW mining expense is the problem, $500M per year currently, and will grow higher if Bitcoin price rise. Therefore, it's hard for Bitcoin price to rise.

[wachtwoord]

everyone who wanted it has it already. The permabulls keep holding and they ran out of ammo since they were calling the bottom wrong too often already. No new money coming in because nobody buys into these charts. Well, too bad, too sad.
Satoshi should have known better than forcing 10% inflation on us almost a decade into adoption.

Once the panic is on it's over.

Let me guess, you have a different coin to suggest?

are you happy with 10% inflation? Do we need that?

Yes, fees aren't high enough yet to be an incentive to sufficiently protect the network.

[smalltimer]

miners dump themselves in the ground. People loosing confidence. No new money coming in since months because the charts just look super ugly. We need a mircale at this point to save bitcoin. Halving in 2016 is much too late.
Inflation killed off adoption. Like it or not.

Best case would be for it to find its floor here. We are two inches from a panic. If we see that panic it is game over.

[cbeast]

everyone who wanted it has it already. The permabulls keep holding and they ran out of ammo since they were calling the bottom wrong too often already. No new money coming in because nobody buys into these charts. Well, too bad, too sad.
Satoshi should have known better than forcing 10% inflation on us almost a decade into adoption.

Once the panic is on it's over.

Let me guess, you have a different coin to suggest?

are you happy with 10% inflation? Do we need that? Even the dollar can hold value better.

Bitcoin is not ment to be adopted. It's ment for miners to cash out on the noobs.

The inflation is NOT the problem, the inflow of capital due to increased adoption can easily take care of that. The problem is still the PoW mining expense, $500M per year!! the inflow of capital has trouble keeping up with THAT.

That money is 100% deductible just like every other business expense. Do you know the difference between profit and profitability? $500M is nothing on a global scale for any ambitious industry. If the miners weren't making a profit off that $500M then they would stop spending the money. Just think of how many jobs that $500M is creating!

[wachtwoord]

miners dump themselves in the ground. People loosing confidence. No new money coming in since months because the charts just look super ugly. We need a mircale at this point to save bitcoin. Halving in 2016 is much too late.
Inflation killed off adoption. Like it or not.

No we need patience. That's hardly a miracle.

Oh and if you look at the charts on the right zoom level they are still as pretty as ever.

[smalltimer]

note: i was permabull until recently. I turned bear just few days ago after seeing how it dumps on paypal-news. Paypal was ment to take this to 5k$
Now what does it do?

[spazzdla]

I think one thing we can all agree on is that when the next surge does start, it will be swift and it will be violent.

I agree 100%, I think it will take a long time.  Although once it starts its real rise it will rise jump up 100-1000% in a matter of mintues or seconds not even hours or days.

Fallin and X will come on here begging for BTC.  I might give them a microbit.

[inca]

note: i was permabull until recently. I turned bear just few days ago after seeing how it dumps on paypal-news. Paypal was ment to take this to 5k$
Now what does it do?

Price leads sentiment smalltimer, not news events.

Half a billion dollars of VC investment into infrastructure by the end of the year, widespread global merchant adoption and integration, large funds such as GABI entering the market, regulatory engagement, a potential ETF to be approved (opening up a huge potential capital pool of investors) suggests that bitcoin has enormous global future potential. Ask yourself why all this trouble for what is probably only a million active bitcoin users at present.

Patience!

[smalltimer]

I think one thing we can all agree on is that when the next surge does start, it will be swift and it will be violent.

I agree 100%, I think it will take a long time.  Although once it starts its real rise it will rise jump up 100-1000% in a matter of mintues or seconds not even hours or days.

Fallin and X will come on here begging for BTC.  I might give them a microbit.

dude, check the depthcharts again. There's enough coins for everybody.

[smalltimer]

note: i was permabull until recently. I turned bear just few days ago after seeing how it dumps on paypal-news. Paypal was ment to take this to 5k$
Now what does it do?

Price leads sentiment smalltimer, not news events.

Half a billion dollars of VC investment into infrastructure by the end of the year, widespread global merchant adoption and integration, large funds such as GABI entering the market, regulatory engagement, a potential ETF to be approved (opening up a huge potential capital pool of investors) suggests that bitcoin has enormous global future potential. Ask yourself why all this trouble for what is probably only a million active bitcoin users at present.

Patience!

"patience" means: 'be ready to hold during stagnation until it halves'

[inca]

note: i was permabull until recently. I turned bear just few days ago after seeing how it dumps on paypal-news. Paypal was ment to take this to 5k$
Now what does it do?

Price leads sentiment smalltimer, not news events.

Half a billion dollars of VC investment into infrastructure by the end of the year, widespread global merchant adoption and integration, large funds such as GABI entering the market, regulatory engagement, a potential ETF to be approved (opening up a huge potential capital pool of investors) suggests that bitcoin has enormous global future potential. Ask yourself why all this trouble for what is probably only a million active bitcoin users at present.

Patience!

"patience" means: 'be ready to hold during stagnation until it halves'

Until the halving occurs? Unlikely but possible. Also possible an ETF is approved by December and insider buying drives BTC up to 700 dollars in a week before it explodes through early 2015 with an influx of easy capital.

[spazzdla]

I think one thing we can all agree on is that when the next surge does start, it will be swift and it will be violent.

I agree 100%, I think it will take a long time.  Although once it starts its real rise it will rise jump up 100-1000% in a matter of mintues or seconds not even hours or days.

Fallin and X will come on here begging for BTC.  I might give them a microbit.

dude, check the depthcharts again. There's enough coins for everybody.

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

[smalltimer]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

[notme]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

[smalltimer]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

i can trade myself, i know how it works. But dude, don't tell people the orders wouldn't be real.

So you think there is one large guy who controls all exchanges on international level and that guy holds millions of bitcoin and has billions in capital to drive the price wherever he wants, right? There is no free market here at work, right? Supply and demand is just an illusion, right?

[notme]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

i can trade myself, i know how it works. But dude, don't tell people the orders wouldn't be real.

So you think there is one large guy who controls all exchanges on international level and that guy holds millions of bitcoin and has billions in capital to drive the price wherever he wants, right? There is no free market here at work, right? Supply and demand is just an illusion, right?

First off, I'm not spazzdla.  Second, quit with the hyperbole, it makes it obvious you are trolling instead of trying to have a rational discussion

[smalltimer]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

i can trade myself, i know how it works. But dude, don't tell people the orders wouldn't be real.

So you think there is one large guy who controls all exchanges on international level and that guy holds millions of bitcoin and has billions in capital to drive the price wherever he wants, right? There is no free market here at work, right? Supply and demand is just an illusion, right?

First off, I'm not spazzdla.  Second, quit with the hyperbole, it makes it obvious you are trolling instead of trying to have a rational discussion

true, didn't read the username. Still the same thing. I think the orders are very real right now. Dude, can't tell people "the orders aren't real". Excuse me. lol

[notme]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

i can trade myself, i know how it works. But dude, don't tell people the orders wouldn't be real.

So you think there is one large guy who controls all exchanges on international level and that guy holds millions of bitcoin and has billions in capital to drive the price wherever he wants, right? There is no free market here at work, right? Supply and demand is just an illusion, right?

First off, I'm not spazzdla.  Second, quit with the hyperbole, it makes it obvious you are trolling instead of trying to have a rational discussion

true, didn't read the username. Still the same thing. I think the orders are very real right now.

Real in the sense they are backed by funds on an exchange, yes.  Real in the sense that if someone has enough money to blow through the order books they can take them, yes.  But walls are fickle, that's all he's trying to say.  Not everything is black and white, learn to see the grey.

[cbeast]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

i can trade myself, i know how it works. But dude, don't tell people the orders wouldn't be real.

So you think there is one large guy who controls all exchanges on international level and that guy holds millions of bitcoin and has billions in capital to drive the price wherever he wants, right? There is no free market here at work, right? Supply and demand is just an illusion, right?

First off, I'm not spazzdla.  Second, quit with the hyperbole, it makes it obvious you are trolling instead of trying to have a rational discussion

true, didn't read the username. Still the same thing. I think the orders are very real right now.

Real in the sense they are backed by funds on an exchange, yes.  Real in the sense that if someone has enough money to blow through the order books they can take them, yes.  But walls are fickle, that's all he's trying to say.  Not everything is black and white, learn to see the grey.

Bitcoin exchanges using the Mt Gox model are rigged by design. IIRC someone suggested that Bitcoin exchanges are like casino card games where the dealer is allowed to play and look at everyone's hand. I would add that they can even change the rules as it suits them. Mt Gox is the only one caught rigging so far. The exchanges need to be regulated by an independent third party.

[smalltimer]

Non of those buy or sell walls are real.

now i am really convinced this is a brainwashing cult. The orders are not real? Tell me more.

It is commonly observed that these orders are pulled automatically as their price is approached.

i can trade myself, i know how it works. But dude, don't tell people the orders wouldn't be real.

So you think there is one large guy who controls all exchanges on international level and that guy holds millions of bitcoin and has billions in capital to drive the price wherever he wants, right? There is no free market here at work, right? Supply and demand is just an illusion, right?

First off, I'm not spazzdla.  Second, quit with the hyperbole, it makes it obvious you are trolling instead of trying to have a rational discussion

true, didn't read the username. Still the same thing. I think the orders are very real right now.

Real in the sense they are backed by funds on an exchange, yes.  Real in the sense that if someone has enough money to blow through the order books they can take them, yes.  But walls are fickle, that's all he's trying to say.  Not everything is black and white, learn to see the grey.

sure. What i start to see around here though is this preaching of 'hodling' and 'it will be 10k$ 100% sure' ... i think that's dangerous. And to go to the length of telling people the orders were an illusion tops it off really. Maybe next time better more accurate.

Bitcoin exchanges using the Mt Gox model are rigged by design. IIRC someone suggested that Bitcoin exchanges are like casino card games where the dealer is allowed to play and look at everyone's hand. I would add that they can even change the rules as it suits them. Mt Gox is the only one caught rigging so far. The exchanges need to be regulated by an independent third party.

exchanges could be naked shortselling all they want aswell. Happens on some alt-exchanges, i am sure.