I'm going to warn you guys one last time.

[Chuckee]

bitcoin is backed by TOR black markets, as long as people buy drugs on the internet bitcoin will have value.
the USD is already dead
...

This response proves how ignorant some of you are, you actually think that the black markets are a negligible part of the economy. Literally billions of dollars go through those markets, and the amount of Internet based drug trade has only increased since the first Silk Road bust. I know someone of the dumber people think somehow the government has ways of monitoring and stopping these markets, but you're wrong. There have been more than 20 successful markets that started operation since the Silk Road was shut down, 3 have shut down, and none were because of being busted. The new Silk Road site is so successful they were able to pay back all the money that was seized during the original bust to the vendors and customers who's money was taken. They paid this back with profit from collecting transaction fees of less than a percent, so clearly they have hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions going on to be making that kind of money.

We've already established that bitcoin is pseudo-anonymous currency. Only a "dumb" person would use bitcoin to buy drugs or anything illegal online, since it can be traced back to them rather easily unless they're using VPNs or proxies, and even then, it's still possible. Worldwide, there are billions being funneled through black markets, but by and large it's done the same way it always has been. Call your guy on the phone, bring cash and make the exchange in person. Cash is much safer than a pseudo-anonymous, traceable digital currency.

[Robert Paulson]

bitcoin is backed by TOR black markets, as long as people buy drugs on the internet bitcoin will have value.
the USD is already dead
...

This response proves how ignorant some of you are, you actually think that the black markets are a negligible part of the economy. Literally billions of dollars go through those markets, and the amount of Internet based drug trade has only increased since the first Silk Road bust. I know someone of the dumber people think somehow the government has ways of monitoring and stopping these markets, but you're wrong. There have been more than 20 successful markets that started operation since the Silk Road was shut down, 3 have shut down, and none were because of being busted. The new Silk Road site is so successful they were able to pay back all the money that was seized during the original bust to the vendors and customers who's money was taken. They paid this back with profit from collecting transaction fees of less than a percent, so clearly they have hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions going on to be making that kind of money.

We've already established that bitcoin is pseudo-anonymous currency. Only a "dumb" person would use bitcoin to buy drugs or anything illegal online, since it can be traced back to them rather easily unless they're using VPNs or proxies, and even then, it's still possible. Worldwide, there are billions being funneled through black markets, but by and large it's done the same way it always has been. Call your guy on the phone, bring cash and make the exchange in person. Cash is much safer than a pseudo-anonymous, traceable digital currency.

the growth of TOR black markets proves you wrong.

[Chuckee]

bitcoin is backed by TOR black markets, as long as people buy drugs on the internet bitcoin will have value.
the USD is already dead
...

This response proves how ignorant some of you are, you actually think that the black markets are a negligible part of the economy. Literally billions of dollars go through those markets, and the amount of Internet based drug trade has only increased since the first Silk Road bust. I know someone of the dumber people think somehow the government has ways of monitoring and stopping these markets, but you're wrong. There have been more than 20 successful markets that started operation since the Silk Road was shut down, 3 have shut down, and none were because of being busted. The new Silk Road site is so successful they were able to pay back all the money that was seized during the original bust to the vendors and customers who's money was taken. They paid this back with profit from collecting transaction fees of less than a percent, so clearly they have hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions going on to be making that kind of money.

We've already established that bitcoin is pseudo-anonymous currency. Only a "dumb" person would use bitcoin to buy drugs or anything illegal online, since it can be traced back to them rather easily unless they're using VPNs or proxies, and even then, it's still possible. Worldwide, there are billions being funneled through black markets, but by and large it's done the same way it always has been. Call your guy on the phone, bring cash and make the exchange in person. Cash is much safer than a pseudo-anonymous, traceable digital currency.

the growth of TOR black markets proves you wrong.

TOR is only as secure as the exit nodes on the network. I assure you, the FBI and other three letter agencies are watching a lot of that traffic and arrest warrants are being written up. Not to mention, the obvious weak link in this entire online black market is not the payment protocol, but the physical delivery. You're giving authorities the address of your home, or at least the pick up location so they can set up a sting.

But this is what you're counting on for bitcoin to become a paradigm changer worldwide? OK, good luck with that.

[notme]

TOR is only as secure as the exit nodes on the network. I assure you, the FBI and other three letter agencies are watching a lot of that traffic and arrest warrants are being written up. Not to mention, the obvious weak link in this entire online black market is not the payment protocol, but the physical delivery. You're giving authorities the address of your home, or at least the pick up location so they can set up a sting.

But this is what you're counting on for bitcoin to become a paradigm changer worldwide? OK, good luck with that.

If they start jailing small time consumers on any sort of scale we will see marijuana legalized within months.  Their interest is in finding the dealers, which people will stand for, preserving their drug war funding.

[Robert Paulson]

bitcoin is backed by TOR black markets, as long as people buy drugs on the internet bitcoin will have value.
the USD is already dead
...

This response proves how ignorant some of you are, you actually think that the black markets are a negligible part of the economy. Literally billions of dollars go through those markets, and the amount of Internet based drug trade has only increased since the first Silk Road bust. I know someone of the dumber people think somehow the government has ways of monitoring and stopping these markets, but you're wrong. There have been more than 20 successful markets that started operation since the Silk Road was shut down, 3 have shut down, and none were because of being busted. The new Silk Road site is so successful they were able to pay back all the money that was seized during the original bust to the vendors and customers who's money was taken. They paid this back with profit from collecting transaction fees of less than a percent, so clearly they have hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions going on to be making that kind of money.

We've already established that bitcoin is pseudo-anonymous currency. Only a "dumb" person would use bitcoin to buy drugs or anything illegal online, since it can be traced back to them rather easily unless they're using VPNs or proxies, and even then, it's still possible. Worldwide, there are billions being funneled through black markets, but by and large it's done the same way it always has been. Call your guy on the phone, bring cash and make the exchange in person. Cash is much safer than a pseudo-anonymous, traceable digital currency.

the growth of TOR black markets proves you wrong.

TOR is only as secure as the exit nodes on the network. I assure you, the FBI and other three letter agencies are watching a lot of that traffic and arrest warrants are being written up. Not to mention, the obvious weak link in this entire online black market is not the payment protocol, but the physical delivery. You're giving authorities the address of your home, or at least the pick up location so they can set up a sting.

But this is what you're counting on for bitcoin to become a paradigm changer worldwide? OK, good luck with that.

these markets have been operating successfully for years, if the government could do anything about them they would have done it already.
yes i am counting on it, illegal drugs are a hundreds billions of dollars industry, if the big drug cartels realize they can cut the middle guys and sell directly on TOR the demand for bitcoin will be huge.

[NotLambchop]

...

Kenneth Slaughter - I genuinely enjoyed meeting Ken.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=252531.msg2767646#msg2767646

You're back

What's your point?

I'm welcoming you back to the forum.  Was a bit worried for you after you vouched for Ken and disappeared for over a year.
How'd that whole Active Mining adventure work out 4 u?
Still keepin' in touch with Ken?

I never went away. How about you check my profile before you open your mouth.

Also you should actually try reading my report! I talked with Ken for a few hours and he seemed like a nice guy. I reported back what he told me and what I saw. People wanted to know if he was a real person and see some pictures.

Once BitFunder went down, I never looked back. I have no idea what happened with all of that. I lost quite a few coins and I'll never get them back.

If you have anything legitimate to say, I'll be here waiting.

Lol, just making polite conversation, you sure didn't post in AM threads since that warm endorsement.  Sorry I missed the 8 posts you made this year, I'll be more diligent in the future.
BTW, if you feel like sharing, whose alt are you?  Just between us?
Only no fibbing

[NotLambchop]

...@"TOR black market is srs bznz" crew:

Where are you guys getting all this funky and totally factual data?  Some rly srs d00d from the intertubes?

[greaterfool]

Paypal and Lawsky == drugs n' black markets. Makes sense.

[Robert Paulson]

...@"TOR black market is srs bznz" crew:

Where are you guys getting all this funky and totally factual data?  Some rly srs d00d from the intertubes?

from the UN
http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2005/06/30/un_report_puts_worlds_illicit_drug_trade_at_estimated_321b/

321 billion and that's from 2005 so that's in 2005 USD purchasing power.

[Chuckee]

these markets have been operating successfully for years, if the government could do anything about them they would have done it already.
yes i am counting on it, illegal drugs are a hundreds billions of dollars industry, if the big drug cartels realize they can cut the middle guys and sell directly on TOR the demand for bitcoin will be huge.

You seem to be very ignorant about the workings of the TCP/IP protocol and network monitoring capabilities. The government and law enforcement agencies do in fact have the resources available to monitor encrypted traffic over the Internet, and with these tools and other traditional methods, they do not have much trouble bringing down the black market sites, much like they did with Silk Road.

Will new ones crop up to replace them? Yes, of course. But people are busted for online drug transactions on a regular basis, although much of it is not well publicized, which somehow leads you to the conclusion that users have impunity against law enforcemement. The introduction of bitcoin makes little difference, since providing your physical address is the weak link. If drug cartels could let you pay with bitcoin, that went through a complex tumbler, and then they could beam the drugs to you Star Trek style, then maybe you'd have something. Until then, you're dreaming.

[Robert Paulson]

these markets have been operating successfully for years, if the government could do anything about them they would have done it already.
yes i am counting on it, illegal drugs are a hundreds billions of dollars industry, if the big drug cartels realize they can cut the middle guys and sell directly on TOR the demand for bitcoin will be huge.

You seem to be very ignorant about the workings of the TCP/IP protocol and network monitoring capabilities. The government and law enforcement agencies do in fact have the resources available to monitor encrypted traffic over the Internet, and with these tools and other traditional methods, they do not have much trouble bringing down the black market sites, much like they did with Silk Road.

Will new ones crop up to replace them? Yes, of course. But people are busted for online drug transactions on a regular basis, although much of it is not well publicized, which somehow leads you to the conclusion that users have impunity against law enforcemement. The introduction of bitcoin makes little difference, since providing your physical address is the weak link. If drug cartels could let you pay with bitcoin, that went through a complex tumbler, and then they could beam the drugs to you Star Trek style, then maybe you'd have something. Until then, you're dreaming.

so the all mighty government has all these powers to monitor the entire internet and yet the black markets continue to thrive more than ever.
silkroad was down for maybe a week and then went right back to business, if that's the best the government can do then i have no doubt the black markets will continue to grow.

i don't know what the government is doing but there are more drug listings on the TOR black markets than ever before, clearly the government is failing.

[NotLambchop]

...@"TOR black market is srs bznz" crew:

Where are you guys getting all this funky and totally factual data?  Some rly srs d00d from the intertubes?

from the UN
http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/articles/2005/06/30/un_report_puts_worlds_illicit_drug_trade_at_estimated_321b/

321 billion and that's from 2005 so that's in 2005 USD purchasing power.

My special friend, of course the drug trade is srs bznz, but don't confuse the real drug trade with the neckbeards trading on TOR.

[Chuckee]

these markets have been operating successfully for years, if the government could do anything about them they would have done it already.
yes i am counting on it, illegal drugs are a hundreds billions of dollars industry, if the big drug cartels realize they can cut the middle guys and sell directly on TOR the demand for bitcoin will be huge.

You seem to be very ignorant about the workings of the TCP/IP protocol and network monitoring capabilities. The government and law enforcement agencies do in fact have the resources available to monitor encrypted traffic over the Internet, and with these tools and other traditional methods, they do not have much trouble bringing down the black market sites, much like they did with Silk Road.

Will new ones crop up to replace them? Yes, of course. But people are busted for online drug transactions on a regular basis, although much of it is not well publicized, which somehow leads you to the conclusion that users have impunity against law enforcemement. The introduction of bitcoin makes little difference, since providing your physical address is the weak link. If drug cartels could let you pay with bitcoin, that went through a complex tumbler, and then they could beam the drugs to you Star Trek style, then maybe you'd have something. Until then, you're dreaming.

so the all mighty government has all these powers to monitor the entire internet and yet the black markets continue to thrive more than ever.
silkroad was down for maybe a week and then went right back to business, if that's the best the government can do then i have no doubt the black markets will continue to grow.

i don't know what the government is doing but there are more drug listings on the TOR black markets than ever before, clearly the government is failing.

They can't just walk in and shut a place down, they need to follow due process and obtain court orders before that can happen. You see that a silk road replacement rises without being immediately taken down, and from that you draw the conclusion that the online black market is thriving and invincible? There's a lot of money to be made by these site operators, which drive them to take up the business, and if they remain small, they might be able to fly under the radar for some time. But I would warn you, if you're doing any business with these markets or considering it, think carefully. You and every other user will be monitored. and you're putting yourself at great risk.

[onealfa]

LOG chart trend line tells me everything :


And the forecast:
1 month = 300-400 $
1 year = 1,300 - $2,000 $
2 years = 7,000- 9,000 $
3 years = 30,000- 50,000 $
5 years = 300,000 - 600,000 $
30 years =  (price is irrelevant , fiat becomes minor part of world economy)
60-80 years  =  (FIAT no longer exists)

[Xiaoxiao]

LOG chart trend line tells me everything :


And the forecast:
1 month = 300-400 $
1 year = 1,300 - $2,000 $
2 years = 7,000- 9,000 $
3 years = 30,000- 50,000 $
5 years = 300,000 - 600,000 $
30 years =  (price is irrelevant , fiat becomes minor part of world economy)
60-80 years  =  (FIAT no longer exists)

[Robert Paulson]

these markets have been operating successfully for years, if the government could do anything about them they would have done it already.
yes i am counting on it, illegal drugs are a hundreds billions of dollars industry, if the big drug cartels realize they can cut the middle guys and sell directly on TOR the demand for bitcoin will be huge.

You seem to be very ignorant about the workings of the TCP/IP protocol and network monitoring capabilities. The government and law enforcement agencies do in fact have the resources available to monitor encrypted traffic over the Internet, and with these tools and other traditional methods, they do not have much trouble bringing down the black market sites, much like they did with Silk Road.

Will new ones crop up to replace them? Yes, of course. But people are busted for online drug transactions on a regular basis, although much of it is not well publicized, which somehow leads you to the conclusion that users have impunity against law enforcemement. The introduction of bitcoin makes little difference, since providing your physical address is the weak link. If drug cartels could let you pay with bitcoin, that went through a complex tumbler, and then they could beam the drugs to you Star Trek style, then maybe you'd have something. Until then, you're dreaming.

so the all mighty government has all these powers to monitor the entire internet and yet the black markets continue to thrive more than ever.
silkroad was down for maybe a week and then went right back to business, if that's the best the government can do then i have no doubt the black markets will continue to grow.

i don't know what the government is doing but there are more drug listings on the TOR black markets than ever before, clearly the government is failing.

They can't just walk in and shut a place down, they need to follow due process and obtain court orders before that can happen. You see that a silk road replacement rises without being immediately taken down, and from that you draw the conclusion that the online black market is thriving and invincible? There's a lot of money to be made by these site operators, which drive them to take up the business, and if they remain small, they might be able to fly under the radar for some time. But I would warn you, if you're doing any business with these markets or considering it, think carefully. You and every other user will be monitored. and you're putting yourself at great risk.

its been a year since silkroad was reopened, plenty of time to follow due process (as if anyone in the US still cares about that), if its still operating its because the government can't do anything to stop it.

[Wandererfromthenorth]

bitcoin is backed by TOR black markets, as long as people buy drugs on the internet bitcoin will have value.
the USD is already dead
...

This response proves how ignorant some of you are, you actually think that the black markets are a negligible part of the economy. Literally billions of dollars go through those markets, and the amount of Internet based drug trade has only increased since the first Silk Road bust. I know someone of the dumber people think somehow the government has ways of monitoring and stopping these markets, but you're wrong. There have been more than 20 successful markets that started operation since the Silk Road was shut down, 3 have shut down, and none were because of being busted. The new Silk Road site is so successful they were able to pay back all the money that was seized during the original bust to the vendors and customers who's money was taken. They paid this back with profit from collecting transaction fees of less than a percent, so clearly they have hundreds of millions of dollars in transactions going on to be making that kind of money.

We've already established that bitcoin is pseudo-anonymous currency. Only a "dumb" person would use bitcoin to buy drugs or anything illegal online, since it can be traced back to them rather easily unless they're using VPNs or proxies, and even then, it's still possible. Worldwide, there are billions being funneled through black markets, but by and large it's done the same way it always has been. Call your guy on the phone, bring cash and make the exchange in person. Cash is much safer than a pseudo-anonymous, traceable digital currency.

False.
 
BTC is decently anonymous for its purpose in online black markets.
There are pretty easy money laundering techniques (buy altcoins in a BTC-E account through Tor, send the altcoins in another BTC-E account through Tor, exchange them for BTC, cash the BTC at your exchange, two different blockchains, unlinkable, untracable).
Furthermore, there are already services (DarkWallet) or altcoins being developed with this purpose in mind.

Then, there are obvious HUGE advantages (both for the vendor and for the consumer) in using an online black market than the old fashioned "call your guy, make the deal" way if you're not dumb enough to see that.

I don't agree with what Chuckee said though, I'm just saying that what you said is false.


DISCLAIMER: I'm not encouraging anybody to engage in illegal activities, just stating the obvious facts.

[WiiD]

LOG chart trend line tells me everything :


And the forecast:
1 month = 300-400 $
1 year = 1,300 - $2,000 $
2 years = 7,000- 9,000 $
3 years = 30,000- 50,000 $
5 years = 300,000 - 600,000 $
30 years =  (price is irrelevant , fiat becomes minor part of world economy)
60-80 years  =  (FIAT no longer exists)

What is so funny? US-Dollar will be like Zimbabwe Dollar then:

[Wilhelm]

Bitcoin will go up!!!

[Wandererfromthenorth]

Anyway, some of you guys have to drop the r(etard)/bitcoin "BTC is amazing and fiat is evil" ideas.

BTC is safer than fiat? are you out of your goddamn minds?
If you had to choose to put all your money in BTC or to hold only fiat what would you do?