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Author Topic: [GLBSE] BDK.BND (1%/week) *IN DEFAULT*  (Read 15277 times)
Bugpowder
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October 02, 2012, 10:47:37 AM
 #121

GLBSE hasn't locked trading yet  Tongue
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October 02, 2012, 11:09:41 AM
 #122

GLBSE hasn't locked trading yet  Tongue

And it looks like your assets (not including defaulted loans) are (478+475+85+30) = 1068BTC, while hard debt is 1806, which gives a FV of 0.059. But the ask is 0.0495.  Hmmmm....
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October 02, 2012, 11:15:31 AM
 #123

Just to be absolutely clear -- there is nothing that can happen in the Bitcoiniverse which would cause me to default on BDK.BND. There is no need for investors to worry.

Nothing in the Bitcoiniverse can happen to make him default on BDK.BND.

Guess an economy needs more than pretty words and blind trust to work.
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October 02, 2012, 01:41:27 PM
 #124

Just to be absolutely clear -- there is nothing that can happen in the Bitcoiniverse which would cause me to default on BDK.BND. There is no need for investors to worry.

Nothing in the Bitcoiniverse can happen to make him default on BDK.BND.

Guess an economy needs more than pretty words and blind trust to work.

This needs to be preserved. Also this

Kluge: You, personally, are an idiot. Thinking oh herp derp, I r bankr nao --that's idiocy. Going around now acting like you're some sort of noteworthy character doing things, wheeling and dealing and so forth is risible. You are simply an idiot that helped a bunch of lambs to the slaughter.

Oh, Mr. Citizen Banker-Dentist thinks being called an idiot in a public forum for having been an idiot is unfair and unwarranted? Bully for you. Oh, your mommy always told you you're great and you fart runny rose water? Bully for her. Nobody else cares. What you are is a guy that helped a bunch of lambs to the slaughter.

So drop the pretense, get on your hands and knees and face the music. Oh, he can't take the "pure negativity". Why did you associate with a ponzi if you knew you couldn't take the negativity? Why did you pretend yourself a banker when you're nothing of the sort? What do you think happens to people that play pretend?

Go ahead, whine about how openness is a bad thing because idiots get to be called out and "it's just unfair". So very impressive. And when you're done with that, we can laugh at you over the kronos fiasco, too.  

Un-fucking-believable, the nerve of you idiots. "Limited amount of patience", the gall.

And yes, I claim dibs on having been the first one to tell him this. As I was the first one to say Pirate's a ponzi. Curious about the effect?

So.... Here is a short string of level-headed, professional posts I made this morning in Skype not long after rising from bed:

[5:05:46 AM] Ben Malec: Ah.... Okay. Finally coming out of denial. I'm totally fucked.
[5:05:59 AM] Ben Malec: Totally and utterly fucked.
[5:06:48 AM] Ben Malec: Completely, totally, utterly fucked.
[5:06:52 AM] Ben Malec: Fuck.

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October 02, 2012, 02:34:08 PM
 #125

Kluge, I understand that you don't feel like communicating, but you should reconsider. You're showing goodwill by starting with payments, but communication will go a long way to keep your investors relatively "happy" while you work on repaying your debts. I wish you the best of luck!

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October 02, 2012, 06:13:13 PM
 #126

I want to make sure I have this straight, Kluge, please confirm...

What you're calling "hard debt" is the principal of the bonds (without interest) whereas "soft debt" is the principal plus compounded interest at 1%?

It sounds like you'd like to make good on the full soft debt, but don't foresee that happening, correct?  Though you will continue to pay toward the hard debt until it is extinguished.


Now for the advice part, which I hope you'll not take offense to.  I think most of your bondholders want to see you succeed, and hopefully can provide even more constructive ideas to help you out...

Communication: one of the things that caused other defaulters around here big problems was a lack of communication.  You need to avoid repeating the things you wrote in post 115 of this thread, and instead post a clear plan you can live with as well as weekly updates (even when you don't feel like it).  No need to obsess over every comment (please ignore the trolls), but weekly updates (even without payments) will show you still have some respect for your bondholders.

Income: do you have a source of income?  It's impossible to pay out what you don't have.

Buyback: there are shares for sale on GLBSE below your hard debt/share amount.  You should be buying those back on the open market before paying out divs.  Doing so will cut both the hard and soft debt amounts fastest.  I realize some might see it as unethical to buy those shares at a discount to book value, but keep in mind that someone is asking to get out of their BDK.BND position and is willing to take a loss, so help them - it's a win-win.

Conversion Rate Risk:  if your income is in USD and your payments are in BTC, any increase in the exchange rate could be a big problem (likewise a decrease could help you).  If you think the BTC is going to keep appreciating like most people around here do, it would benefit you to find a way to convert the debt to USD asap (even part of it).

Family: your family should be the most important thing to you.  Take care of them first.  And stop talking about them in here, it just attracts the crazies.  If you can't make any bond payments for a while because of something family related, make that week's update a little on the vague side.


Quoting today's update so I can find the numbers easily in the future.
10/2/12

Dividend Paid (will be after it hits GLBSE account in ~2h). 1 payment date has passed since last dividend.

Bonds Issued: 19590
"Hard Debt": (19590*.101)= 1978.59BTC
Dividend Payment: 173.59BTC
"Hard Debt" Remaining: (1978.59-173.59)= 1805BTC
Current "Soft Debt" Remaining: (((1959*1.01)+(1959*.01))-(173.59))= 1824.59BTC
Current bond value @ "lock in" rate (this is the amount I claim I am liable for assuming interest does not accumulate after the date I announced default): 0.092139BTC/bond
Current bond value @ "compounded" rate (this is the amount I claim I am liable for assuming interest DOES accumulate after the date I announced default): 0.093139BTC/bond

In the event that I catch up with "soft debt," I will stop paying on BDK.BND debt. So, in that sense, it would be wise to assume it is decreasing in fundamental value with each payment unless you think I'll be unable to ever pay this off, in which case, you could theorize on it increasing or decreasing in "real" value.

ETA: Revised "Soft Debt." Since dividend was made on 10/2 instead of 10/1, I should be liable for compounding interest BEFORE the dividend, not after.

ETA2: At 5/8 confs. Just an FYI - I decided I should at least post each Monday to release the new "Soft Debt" number, and show I'm still alive and aware of what's going on.

ETA3: Dividend has gone out. I've updated OP with critical information. (@GLBSE: ELEVEN confs before a credit, now?! Yeesh!)
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October 02, 2012, 11:11:02 PM
 #127

I want to make sure I have this straight, Kluge, please confirm...

What you're calling "hard debt" is the principal of the bonds (without interest) whereas "soft debt" is the principal plus compounded interest at 1%?

It sounds like you'd like to make good on the full soft debt, but don't foresee that happening, correct?  Though you will continue to pay toward the hard debt until it is extinguished.


Now for the advice part, which I hope you'll not take offense to.  I think most of your bondholders want to see you succeed, and hopefully can provide even more constructive ideas to help you out...

Communication: one of the things that caused other defaulters around here big problems was a lack of communication.  You need to avoid repeating the things you wrote in post 115 of this thread, and instead post a clear plan you can live with as well as weekly updates (even when you don't feel like it).  No need to obsess over every comment (please ignore the trolls), but weekly updates (even without payments) will show you still have some respect for your bondholders.

Income: do you have a source of income?  It's impossible to pay out what you don't have.

Buyback: there are shares for sale on GLBSE below your hard debt/share amount.  You should be buying those back on the open market before paying out divs.  Doing so will cut both the hard and soft debt amounts fastest.  I realize some might see it as unethical to buy those shares at a discount to book value, but keep in mind that someone is asking to get out of their BDK.BND position and is willing to take a loss, so help them - it's a win-win.

Conversion Rate Risk:  if your income is in USD and your payments are in BTC, any increase in the exchange rate could be a big problem (likewise a decrease could help you).  If you think the BTC is going to keep appreciating like most people around here do, it would benefit you to find a way to convert the debt to USD asap (even part of it).

Family: your family should be the most important thing to you.  Take care of them first.  And stop talking about them in here, it just attracts the crazies.  If you can't make any bond payments for a while because of something family related, make that week's update a little on the vague side.


Quoting today's update so I can find the numbers easily in the future.
10/2/12

Dividend Paid (will be after it hits GLBSE account in ~2h). 1 payment date has passed since last dividend.

Bonds Issued: 19590
"Hard Debt": (19590*.101)= 1978.59BTC
Dividend Payment: 173.59BTC
"Hard Debt" Remaining: (1978.59-173.59)= 1805BTC
Current "Soft Debt" Remaining: (((1959*1.01)+(1959*.01))-(173.59))= 1824.59BTC
Current bond value @ "lock in" rate (this is the amount I claim I am liable for assuming interest does not accumulate after the date I announced default): 0.092139BTC/bond
Current bond value @ "compounded" rate (this is the amount I claim I am liable for assuming interest DOES accumulate after the date I announced default): 0.093139BTC/bond

In the event that I catch up with "soft debt," I will stop paying on BDK.BND debt. So, in that sense, it would be wise to assume it is decreasing in fundamental value with each payment unless you think I'll be unable to ever pay this off, in which case, you could theorize on it increasing or decreasing in "real" value.

ETA: Revised "Soft Debt." Since dividend was made on 10/2 instead of 10/1, I should be liable for compounding interest BEFORE the dividend, not after.

ETA2: At 5/8 confs. Just an FYI - I decided I should at least post each Monday to release the new "Soft Debt" number, and show I'm still alive and aware of what's going on.

ETA3: Dividend has gone out. I've updated OP with critical information. (@GLBSE: ELEVEN confs before a credit, now?! Yeesh!)
"Hard debt" is principal + 1% (the buyout value originally outlined in contract) - so .101BTC/bond -- this can be almost certainly be paid off within a year even if everything goes against me.
"Soft debt" is what I believe I owe, and is hard debt + 1% week compounding interest on outstanding "soft debt" balance each Monday. -- this can be paid off if things start going my way and I can get a good chunk of the debt out of the way by the end of the year.


I would enjoy a USD loan to convert this debt to, and have tried, but do not have 2 years' worth of tax-verifiable income. I've gone to three separate CUs, and all refuse to talk about the loan, even if I put our residence (worth ~5x BDK.BND debt) as collateral, without 2 years' consistent, verifiable income. I have multiple plans to get this taken care of (outside of "maybe everyone'll just decide to pay back within a couple months") - I just need some luck for at least one of them to work. I'd prefer to keep most details of those plans to myself, and do not intend to change the way BDK.BND is being repaid. Because these plans require some luck in things working exactly as I'd like them, I cannot either a firm or loose repayment schedule other than "hard debt will probably be repaid within a year, soft debt may or may not be repaid eventually depending on my luck, and I'll give a weekly indication that I'm paying attention to the situation." If I have good luck, I can repay BDK.BND holders soft debt in ~1 month, and depends on me selling off my largest default (~3.7kBTC). This would also probably allow me to pay BDK-holders a reasonable amount instead of the negative equity amount. If I have moderate luck, my credit cards will be off the new member probationary period in ~2-4 months, and I can just load all my debt on there. If I have moderate-poor luck, repayment will rely on my employment income, BTC price doesn't deviate too much from where it is, and repayment will be painfully slow. If I have bad luck, the price of BTC will soar to $20/coin or more without sign of relief, and repayment will likely be unfeasible. If I have horrible luck, I'll be sued into personal bankruptcy.

Quick note @ TheBible: I don't consider having my emergency access to non-legal wife's 401(k) revoked part of "the Bitcoiniverse."

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October 03, 2012, 02:12:25 AM
 #128

Quick note @ TheBible: I don't consider having my emergency access to non-legal wife's 401(k) revoked part of "the Bitcoiniverse."

Yeah, you're quite the victim here.

Man, you wiped out your own wife's retirement account on Internet Funny Munny.  You could have at least stopped at losing all your own money, but no, you had to break someone else before burning out.  That's cold, man.
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October 03, 2012, 01:11:49 PM
 #129

Quick note @ TheBible: I don't consider having my emergency access to non-legal wife's 401(k) revoked part of "the Bitcoiniverse."

Yeah, you're quite the victim here.

Man, you wiped out your own wife's retirement account on Internet Funny Munny.  You could have at least stopped at losing all your own money, but no, you had to break someone else before burning out.  That's cold, man.

I think what actually happened was the wife said "There is no way in hell you are taking my retirement to pay for your stupid online play money!" (paraphrased)

So he didn't actually wipe out the account, he just removed it from the list of assets available to him.

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October 03, 2012, 01:19:21 PM
 #130

If I have moderate-poor luck, repayment will rely on my employment income,

What employment income? Last I checked you were a jobless do-nothing, sitting on his couch all day actively declining job offers relying on internet magic money to make you rich.
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October 03, 2012, 04:31:19 PM
 #131

If I have moderate-poor luck, repayment will rely on my employment income,

What employment income? Last I checked you were a jobless do-nothing, sitting on his couch all day actively declining job offers relying on internet magic money to make you rich.

Sir, your signature! Where did you get it? Can I get one too?

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October 04, 2012, 12:23:43 AM
 #132

Quick note @ TheBible: I don't consider having my emergency access to non-legal wife's 401(k) revoked part of "the Bitcoiniverse."

Yeah, you're quite the victim here.

Man, you wiped out your own wife's retirement account on Internet Funny Munny.  You could have at least stopped at losing all your own money, but no, you had to break someone else before burning out.  That's cold, man.

I think what actually happened was the wife said "There is no way in hell you are taking my retirement to pay for your stupid online play money!" (paraphrased)

So he didn't actually wipe out the account, he just removed it from the list of assets available to him.

I sure hope so.
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October 04, 2012, 03:31:00 PM
 #133

"Hard debt" is principal + 1% (the buyout value originally outlined in contract) - so .101BTC/bond -- this can be almost certainly be paid off within a year even if everything goes against me.
"Soft debt" is what I believe I owe, and is hard debt + 1% week compounding interest on outstanding "soft debt" balance each Monday. -- this can be paid off if things start going my way and I can get a good chunk of the debt out of the way by the end of the year.


I would enjoy a USD loan to convert this debt to, and have tried, but do not have 2 years' worth of tax-verifiable income. I've gone to three separate CUs, and all refuse to talk about the loan, even if I put our residence (worth ~5x BDK.BND debt) as collateral, without 2 years' consistent, verifiable income. I have multiple plans to get this taken care of (outside of "maybe everyone'll just decide to pay back within a couple months") - I just need some luck for at least one of them to work. I'd prefer to keep most details of those plans to myself, and do not intend to change the way BDK.BND is being repaid. Because these plans require some luck in things working exactly as I'd like them, I cannot either a firm or loose repayment schedule other than "hard debt will probably be repaid within a year, soft debt may or may not be repaid eventually depending on my luck, and I'll give a weekly indication that I'm paying attention to the situation." If I have good luck, I can repay BDK.BND holders soft debt in ~1 month, and depends on me selling off my largest default (~3.7kBTC). This would also probably allow me to pay BDK-holders a reasonable amount instead of the negative equity amount. If I have moderate luck, my credit cards will be off the new member probationary period in ~2-4 months, and I can just load all my debt on there. If I have moderate-poor luck, repayment will rely on my employment income, BTC price doesn't deviate too much from where it is, and repayment will be painfully slow. If I have bad luck, the price of BTC will soar to $20/coin or more without sign of relief, and repayment will likely be unfeasible. If I have horrible luck, I'll be sued into personal bankruptcy.

Quick note @ TheBible: I don't consider having my emergency access to non-legal wife's 401(k) revoked part of "the Bitcoiniverse."

Thanks Kluge, that's what I was looking for.

On the loan - have you tried prosper.com or lendingclub.com?  Both offer unsecured loans up to $25k and have lenders who fund debt consolidations (basically what you are trying to accomplish).  Locking in your exchange rate could be huge if it keeps rising.

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October 06, 2012, 01:26:49 AM
 #134

KLUDGE ITS YOUR LUCKY DAY!

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October 06, 2012, 01:41:48 AM
 #135

I've been watching the news on GLBSE with interest, but all most everyone has is speculation given Nef's keeping fairly quiet. I have nothing extraordinary to report on my end.

AFAIK, a list will be provided to Issuers. I have no solid plans on how to proceed and will not until I see how the GLBSE situation is resolved and how many more "legal troubles" begin to arise for equity operations. As I have never sold equity, did register IOUCoin with The State, have a relatively small operation, and have never claimed BDK a bank, I doubt I'm at any significant risk. It'll depend on how aggressive investigations are, however. I'm sure there are a handful of obscure laws I've violated along the way which The State could pin on me if they were particularly interested.

As I am not at fault for missing payments between now and when a list is furnished to me, I believe it reasonable not to compound "soft debt" until a list is provided to me. Upon me being furnished a proper list of current investors, repayment will need to be negotiated with every single person individually. "Soft Debt" will not be accruing interest until I've had a reasonable amount of time to get into contact with everyone -- I'll announce when this is, and if you disagree, you can always sue. I will have a more concrete plan on what I believe is and isn't reasonable for "Soft Debt" to prevent non-communicative investors from having a 10kBTC debt from me in 2050 which their children decide to call.

In the extraordinarily slim case I am prosecuted by the SEC or a similar agency, non-legal wife is familiar with a contingency plan and will be able to pay if coins are in my account, though I doubt she'd be able (nor in any condition) to repay what's owed, nor be able to communicate with many tens of individuals to work repayment out. I do not intend to take liability for soft debt interest accrual if I'm incarcerated simply because it'd increase to an unrealistic amount.

I'll keep y'all posted as I'm made aware of or create relevant information.
-Ben

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October 06, 2012, 01:43:54 AM
 #136

KLUDGE ITS YOUR LUCKY DAY!
Yes... spies told me of your IRC posts. Wink

I'll admit what's happened with GLBSE is pretty convenient for me. My account was hacked months ago wiping out all securities I held on there, and the last thing I did on there was make a large-ish dividend payment on BDK.BND, so all I had in there was maybe 4 or 5 coins.

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
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October 06, 2012, 02:04:21 AM
 #137

KLUDGE ITS YOUR LUCKY DAY!
Yes... spies told me of your IRC posts. Wink

I'll admit what's happened with GLBSE is pretty convenient for me. My account was hacked months ago wiping out all securities I held on there, and the last thing I did on there was make a large-ish dividend payment on BDK.BND, so all I had in there was maybe 4 or 5 coins.

It wasn't hacked.  It was Nefario helping himself.   Wink

I'm not a Coinbase fan -- I placed a buy order, they took the funds out of my account, then a week later the price went up and they canceled the buy and closed my account.  You've been warned.  Use a different exchange.
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October 06, 2012, 02:15:25 AM
 #138

KLUDGE ITS YOUR LUCKY DAY!
Yes... spies told me of your IRC posts. Wink

I'll admit what's happened with GLBSE is pretty convenient for me. My account was hacked months ago wiping out all securities I held on there, and the last thing I did on there was make a large-ish dividend payment on BDK.BND, so all I had in there was maybe 4 or 5 coins.

It wasn't hacked.  It was Nefario helping himself.   Wink
..... That never occurred to me...

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October 06, 2012, 03:25:29 AM
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His name is Nefario.  How could you people not see this coming?  How did you not learn your lesson after getting scammed by a guy named pirate?
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October 10, 2012, 06:14:20 AM
 #140

Sorry for not updating on Monday. Figured out why phone tether failed, finally (haven't had much time to look). Phone is unrooting itself (judging by Google, I'm the only person on Earth with this issue on an S3 through Sprint) which causes wifi tether to fail. It does this both during reboots and randomly while on. It resets to stock recovery image.... I've dinked around with some options this time... will see if it sticks.

I have been receiving some second-hand legal advice atop my own research. I believe I qualify for certain exceptions to usual Accredited Investor laws, and that GLBSE, which acted as both broker and exchange, afforded operators of underlying operations related to GLBSE securities certain legal protections. However, should anyone choose to act on contracts without that legal buffer (GLBSE), they may be acting criminally, even if an operator is clearly not facilitating any type of securities exchange. As such, I will not be claiming anything through GLBSE, nor do I have immediate plans to act on any information coming directly from GLBSE. I'm actively seeking first-hand legal advice from someone relevant which should help me decide how to proceed -- I sure don't know what I'm doing... CFR's fucking impossible to read and comprehend. It's like... For possible exemptions, refer to section (2) of §9313-C. §9313-C (2_: Exemptions allotted under §9311 1(c) are permitted unless conditions of §9313 2(d) and §9313 2(f) are made, in which case §9408 4(a) requirements must be met to satisfy the conditions of §9310-B 3(a), as defined in section 1504(a) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (26 U.S.C. 1504(a)), as amended by §9590 and §9591.
[a]In a condition where the entity is a "magnanimous actuarial," as defined in §9311 1(c), filing must occur as outlined in §9311 1(c) except when acting as a "snatch latch," as defined in §9313-C 5(a).

Anyway... "Soft Debt" did not earn interest on 10/8/12 due to reasons I've given in previous posts. "Soft debt" likely will not increase any time in October, but possibly in November, depending on when GLBSE releases .csv files to Issuers, what's in them, and whether or not I'm legally allowed to act on the information.

For reference:
Bonds Issued: 19590
"Hard Debt": (19590*.92139)= 1805BTC
"Soft Debt": (1959*.093139)= 1824.59BTC
Current bond value @ "lock in" rate (this is the amount I claim I am liable for assuming interest does not accumulate after the date I announced default): 0.092139BTC/bond
Current bond value @ "compounded" rate (this is the amount I claim I am liable for assuming interest DOES* accumulate after the date I announced default): 0.093139BTC/bond
*"soft debt" or "compounded debt" accumulates interest only on Mondays where I have the possibility to repay. It does not accumulate interest while I do not have access to repay bond-holders, such as when GLBSE is down and I do not have ability to repay unit-holders. Please refer to Board 78.0, Topic 79923, Message 1248967, Paragraph 3 for more complete explanation, as amended by Board 78.0, Topic 79923, Message 1261518.

Don't mix your coins someone said isn't legal
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