Crypto-businesses no legal background?

[karmabot]

Hello guys,
I`ve been following the whole btc & crypto discussions since a couple of years now. Undoubtedly a lot has happened especially in the past 2 years and my beliefs are strong that there is a big potential.
Still I often end up having discussions with friends and family as they think that the cryptocurrency environment is fishy. On the one hand I don't care as I am convinced that this is the typical "what the farmer does not know, he does not eat" situation . But on the other hand I fear that governments eventually will decide that trading and shopping with bitcoins etc. are illegal activities due to a lack of taxation and transparency. My question is whether there is a "legal" background, if you know of any lawsuits (apart from the darknet stuff), etc?

[franky1]

legitimate businesses register their companies with the state/government and the tax office. thus they then have to obide by the rules of that state/government.

the issue is that if businesses do not register, and they hide behind PO Boxes, people blame it on bitcoin. when infact it should be common place to not trade with these businesses whether bitcoin or fiat is used, especially online.

as long as a business is revealing real legitimacy and you can either firebomb their offices, slap the CEO with a wet fish, or put a lien/court order against the company then people should not worry what currency is used.

but just like the beginning of the internet, alot of people dont trust handing over credit card numbers to people they cannot physically grab by the throat. and even now the internet is full of sham businesses.

[karmabot]

I guess you have point there, especially with the trust in businesses. However what strikes me is the general attitude governments and other official institutions have when it comes to bitcoins. So far I haven't heard of any real business that successfully works with BTC at the moment apart from exchange platforms and I wonder why? Is it just because of a lack of interest in the public (and particularly in the btc scene) or is there maybe more behind it? For instance why is it that companies like eBay and Paypal are so careful and slow instead of creating a new market?

[1anonymous]

Give the public one reason to use bitcoin when they go to say Overstock

You click buy this

Now it says

CC's mc/visa/amex
Paypal
Bitcoin

Name one reason anyone has any incentive to jump through the hoops of acquiring btc to then buy with it

Name one

The only reason btc had legs a year ago was the consumers had to acquire it for one thing, silk road

No silk road, btc would be 4 bucks not 400

Then silk road got busted and bang, it was a 'news story' so some tech companeis said let's put up a we take btc shingle

So what, more and more stores take it and what, the hype doesn't move it one inch

Until there's a real reason for the 'public' to acquire it, all the merchants taking it as one more payment option means nothing

The average consumer gets a check each week or twice a month, every cent is accounted for

When some of these consumers saw they could buy drugs with it online, they bought btc

Now what compels people to buy it?

Speculation?

Until there's something a consumer wants and that want has a you must use btc price on it

btc isn't going anywhere but down

we can all see the reality of retailers adopting it

So what, they adopt and then less than 1% of their sales are from it

btc needs another silk road type of reason for the mass public to adopt it

just look at btc as a 'consumer'

you are joe blow, you earn a check, the gov knows every penny you make that's 98% of the consumers

you go to buy something on Overstock

why should you acquire btc to use it there?

name one reason

so what reason did the 'consumer' had until end of 2013 to aquire it?

SILK ROAD

that's all that changed really, illegal drugs fueled consumers into btc

silk road got massive media coverage and some speculators and tech companies bought into the idea, so spec money kept the prices up

now it's almost a year later and no consumers are acquiring it and tons of merchants now take it

I've offered btc on lots of sites for over a year, no one uses it, everyone uses paypal or a CC

now I love the idea of it, but, without a real reason that a consumer must use, there's no reason to acquire it

[Soros Shorts]

I guess you have point there, especially with the trust in businesses. However what strikes me is the general attitude governments and other official institutions have when it comes to bitcoins. So far I haven't heard of any real business that successfully works with BTC at the moment apart from exchange platforms and I wonder why? Is it just because of a lack of interest in the public (and particularly in the btc scene) or is there maybe more behind it? For instance why is it that companies like eBay and Paypal are so careful and slow instead of creating a new market?

I have bought a watch, a 47" TV, servers and PC components with BTC on overstock, Dell and Newegg. Aren't these companies legit enough?

[Rishblitz]

I've seen a lot of crypto business fail a very bad sign.

[a447513372]

But on the other hand I fear that governments eventually will decide that trading and shopping with bitcoins etc. are illegal activities due to a lack of taxation and transparency.

Transactions involving bitcoin are taxed the exact same way that any other transaction is taxed. Granted it is somewhat difficult to audit that the proper amount of taxes are being paid on specific transactions however the same could be said with cash fiat

[DannyHamilton]

Name one reason anyone has any incentive to jump through the hoops of acquiring btc to then buy with it

Name one

Increased convenience and lower cost if they already have bitcoins.

Why would I pay fees to convert my bitcoins into USD, then pay additional fees to get those USD deposited onto some sort of debit/credit card, just so I can pay for the products I'm purchasing.  The time, and hassle isn't worth it. It's so much more convenient and so much easier to just spend my bitcoins directly.

In addition, (if you want a second reason) improved privacy.  There is no concern about trusting the merchant to keep my credit card account information private and secure against hackers if I pay with bitcoins.

The only reason . . .

;TLDR

Next time try and focus your thoughts before you post.  Perhaps spend a bit less time and money on SR and your posts won't ramble quite as much.

[franky1]

However what strikes me is the general attitude governments and other official institutions have when it comes to bitcoins. So far I haven't heard of any real business that successfully works with BTC at the moment apart from exchange platforms and I wonder why?

theres over 100,000 businesses accepting bitcoin direct. and probably another 30k that are accepting it online and dont realise it (look at foodler for instance many restaurants dont realise that customers ordering their food through foodler, are bitcoin customers)

but anyway back to the 100k other businesses who do know about bitcoin. as others have already said there are big companies out there.
overstock, dell, expedia, virgin galactic, to name just a few.

even my business accepts bitcoin.

Give the public one reason to use bitcoin when they go to say Overstock

buying bitcoins just to instantly spend IS NOT THE POINT. thats like asking an american to buy euro's to instantly spend on overstock simply because overstock accepts euro's...

the point of bitcoins is to hold for investment, to use if travelling. to hedge against FIAT inflation, to trade asier and cheaper compared to stocks/shares/forex. and here is the big one...

to create new legitimate business.
as long as a business registers with its tax office and sells legitimate goods and doesnt scam customers. thats all that should count. these days if a business wanted to start up, there is TOOO much red-tape. requiring setting up business bank accounts. having to show business plans and 5year plans to bank managers, just to open a proper business account. keeping receipts/bank statements for years.

but imagine being able to accept payments and having all your transactions logged without needing the bank account hurdles, without needing to keep paperwork, because its all dealt with by the blockchain. not to mention the cheaper tx fee's compared to credit card processors. and of course the investment potential. not having to worry about charge back scammers. etc etc

I've seen a lot of crypto business fail a very bad sign.

those businesses were scammy businesses.. but a proper professional and legitimate business has better prospects

[karmabot]

Seeing Btc as an investment volatile as it is to me makes very few sense. Was that Sakamoto's (or whoever is behind it) real intention?

[maurya78]

I agree that we don't yet have a killer app that makes adoption something you have to do
Plugging into retail spends is great but does not even begin to exploit the true potential of blockchain technology