Politics, statism, anarchism, racism; split from: Wall Observer thread

[octaft]

Do any of you statists even know what anarchy is? You all seem to be using the late 20th century propagandised definition for some reason.

All I see is people talking about "survival of the fittest" and "make sure you're on the winning side," which seems to support my definition of it. If that's wrong, then perhaps some anarchy proponents don't even know what anarchy is by your (presumably different) definition, so why don't you enlighten us if we're so wrong? Or you know, you could continue to talk down to people while adding little of substance, which seems pretty typical for anarchists.

[zimmah]

It is quite sad this whole discussion about which human should rule us, while the underlying question is ignored.

The underlying question, a question asked over 6000 years ago by the devil himself, should man govern themselves, instead go having god rule over us?

God then allowed humankind to govern themselves under satan, to prove a point, that point has been proven time and time again, a human leading over other humans will only cause pain, injustice and suffering.

The only one fit to rule is god, choosing anyone else to rule you results in joining the government of the devil, and it off course will lead to suffering.

Don't be stupid and choose for the kingdom of god, there's no other viable option.

Anarchists are somewhat right in the way they are saying a human government is unneccesary/evil but they forget that a form of government is eventually needed to prevent total chaos, thus, even anarchy is wrong. Become a citizen of gods kingdom and reap the benefits of a truly benevolent king who only wants what's best for you, one with both the power, wisdom and will to improve this world, who actually prevents dead and disease, and does not wage war. This kingdom will come, make sure you're part of it.

The answer to the question asked millennia ago will be closed soon, and all human government will be wiped from the earth and replaced with the kingdom of god. This is the essence of the bibles prophecies. This is what Jesus was all about.

[MrPiggles]

It is quite sad this whole discussion about which human should rule us, while the underlying question is ignored.

The underlying question, a question asked over 6000 years ago by the devil himself, should man govern themselves, instead go having god rule over us?

God then allowed humankind to govern themselves under satan, to prove a point, that point has been proven time and time again, a human leading over other humans will only cause pain, injustice and suffering.

The only one fit to rule is god, choosing anyone else to rule you results in joining the government of the devil, and it off course will lead to suffering.

Don't be stupid and choose for the kingdom of god, there's no other viable option.

Sounds like something the Islamic State would say, insert a few "kill all infidels" and "death to the jews"

[findftp]

It's the most ruthless and heavily armed smartest people winning

What's your reason for being involved in bitcoin?

How old are you? Have you ever been in a war zone?

Did the government ever saved you from dying in a war zone?
Did you know it's almost always governments who decide to go to war?

Don't bring a gun to a drone fight.

I make my own drones.

[findftp]

It's the most ruthless and heavily armed smartest people winning

What's your reason for being involved in bitcoin?

How old are you? Have you ever been in a war zone?

Did the government ever saved you from dying in a war zone?
Did you know it's almost always governments who decide to go to war?

I asked my questions because it was apparent from your answer that you have no real experience of life outside of your cushy existence, whereever that may be.

I'll answer your questions

1) I'm involved with bitcoin because it's convenient for my business to accept it
2) Yes
3) Yes

How about you answer my questions?

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

[superresistant]

Do any of you statists even know what anarchy is? You all seem to be using the late 20th century propagandised definition for some reason.

You're right, Anarchy have many definitions and it is pointless to talk about something people have very different definitions.

I wish people knew some basic about discussion before talking.

[MrPiggles]

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

That's what I figured. You probably still live at home with your Mom don't you

[JayJuanGee]

It's the most ruthless and heavily armed smartest people winning

What's your reason for being involved in bitcoin?

How old are you? Have you ever been in a war zone?

Did the government ever saved you from dying in a war zone?
Did you know it's almost always governments who decide to go to war?

I asked my questions because it was apparent from your answer that you have no real experience of life outside of your cushy existence, whereever that may be.

I'll answer your questions

1) I'm involved with bitcoin because it's convenient for my business to accept it
2) Yes
3) Yes

How about you answer my questions?

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

Of course your age and life experiences can be relevant to shed light upon the kinds assertions that you are making; however, it could also be an ad hominem attack if your youthfulness is being used to minimize and/or patronize if you were making otherwise valid arguments/observations.

[findftp]

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

That's what I figured. You probably still live at home with your Mom don't you

Please explain me the urgent reason to disclose my age?

[MrPiggles]

The world will not, and did not before its time, descend into chaos without a huge police state to watch over us all. When gangs of marauders roam the earth, people will defend themselves in equal measure. There has always been crime and always will be, its nature merely shifts depending on local circumstances.

Again, this is solely based on weakness, in this case fear and physical inability.

Yeah, like when IS marched through Iraq and Syria, slaughtering, raping, robbing and what not. The people fought back equally and the whole Islamic State thing never happened, right?

http://news.yahoo.com/netherlands-says-ok-biker-gangs-fight-islamic-state-155136559.html

The Dutch public prosecutor said on Tuesday that motorbike gang members who have reportedly joined Kurds battling the Islamic State group in Iraq are not necessarily committing any crime.
Related Stories

"Joining a foreign armed force was previously punishable, now it's no longer forbidden," public prosecutor spokesman Wim de Bruin told AFP.

"You just can't join a fight against the Netherlands," he told AFP after reports emerged that Dutch bikers from the No Surrender gang were fighting IS insurgents alongside Kurds in northern Iraq.

The head of No Surrender, Klaas Otto, told state broadcaster NOS that three members who travelled to near Mosul in northern Iraq were from Dutch cities Amsterdam, Rotterdam and Breda.

A photograph on a Dutch-Kurdish Twitter account shows a tattooed Dutchman called Ron in military garb, holding a Kalashnikov assault rifle while sat with a Kurdish comrade.

That's actually very interesting, but unless those three bikers actually stop IS, they're not very relevant. IS are an example of what ends up ruling in a vacuum.

[findftp]

It's the most ruthless and heavily armed smartest people winning

What's your reason for being involved in bitcoin?

How old are you? Have you ever been in a war zone?

Did the government ever saved you from dying in a war zone?
Did you know it's almost always governments who decide to go to war?

I asked my questions because it was apparent from your answer that you have no real experience of life outside of your cushy existence, whereever that may be.

I'll answer your questions

1) I'm involved with bitcoin because it's convenient for my business to accept it
2) Yes
3) Yes

How about you answer my questions?

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

Of course your age and life experiences can be relevant to shed light upon the kinds assertions that you are making; however, it could also be an ad hominem attack if your youthfulness is being used to minimize and/or patronize if you were making otherwise valid arguments/observations.

Fair enough, saying I'm an adult should be enough.

[MrPiggles]

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

Of course your age and life experiences can be relevant to shed light upon the kinds assertions that you are making; however, it could also be an ad hominem attack if your youthfulness is being used to minimize and/or patronize if you were making otherwise valid arguments/observations.

I was asking because he genuinely believes that people who are murdered simply failed to be fit enough to survive. I can't imagine anyone with much experience outside of a very cushy life in the suburbs believing anything so ridiculous.

I questioned his age and whether he'd seen human brutality up close because they're both pertinent to understanding how he could hold such a belief.

[zimmah]

It is quite sad this whole discussion about which human should rule us, while the underlying question is ignored.

The underlying question, a question asked over 6000 years ago by the devil himself, should man govern themselves, instead go having god rule over us?

God then allowed humankind to govern themselves under satan, to prove a point, that point has been proven time and time again, a human leading over other humans will only cause pain, injustice and suffering.

The only one fit to rule is god, choosing anyone else to rule you results in joining the government of the devil, and it off course will lead to suffering.

Don't be stupid and choose for the kingdom of god, there's no other viable option.

Sounds like something the Islamic State would say, insert a few "kill all infidels" and "death to the jews"

It's what the bible sais, you're free to belief it or not. But fact remains, no government in human history has ever done what they promised. And no government was ultimately non-corrupt.

Is anarchy the solution though? No, it's not. Only a kingdom ruled by a king that is not human will be the answer to our problems. That king is Jesus himself.

I'm not asking you to take my word for it, I'm just trying to tell you there's a third option everyone forgets about, and the government question is more important than most people realize. In fact it can decide how your life plays out in the next couple of decades.

1) actively support a human government
2) anarchy
3) actively become a citizen of gods kingdom (the option many people forget about)

Please consider returning to gods kingdom, as god is the only one who can rule over us to our own benefit. God cares about us and can provide for all our needs and he will.

[Ibian]

The world will not, and did not before its time, descend into chaos without a huge police state to watch over us all. When gangs of marauders roam the earth, people will defend themselves in equal measure. There has always been crime and always will be, its nature merely shifts depending on local circumstances.

Again, this is solely based on weakness, in this case fear and physical inability.

Please explain how you will defend yourself in "equal measure."

That's called survival of the fittest, not necessarily a bad thing imho.

So it's not a bad thing if 30 people decide to group together to bash you over the head and take your stuff?

It always sucks to be the victim, make sure you're on the winning side.

Thanks for making my case about having no faith in humanity.

More weakness. Sophistry instead of sound arguments. Your "faith in humanity" is just another variant of "but my feels!".

The world is a harsh place, and it won't get any easier with an outlook like that. Work on constructive solutions.

[JayJuanGee]

It's the most ruthless and heavily armed smartest people winning

What's your reason for being involved in bitcoin?

How old are you? Have you ever been in a war zone?

Did the government ever saved you from dying in a war zone?
Did you know it's almost always governments who decide to go to war?

I asked my questions because it was apparent from your answer that you have no real experience of life outside of your cushy existence, whereever that may be.

I'll answer your questions

1) I'm involved with bitcoin because it's convenient for my business to accept it
2) Yes
3) Yes

How about you answer my questions?

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

Of course your age and life experiences can be relevant to shed light upon the kinds assertions that you are making; however, it could also be an ad hominem attack if your youthfulness is being used to minimize and/or patronize if you were making otherwise valid arguments/observations.

Fair enough, saying I'm an adult should be enough.

Well, sometimes, I find that people with limited experiences will sometimes make arguments that they fail to realize are naive.. but maybe 5 or 10 years later will come to realize that some of their arguments were lacking in several respects... And also sometimes with age we learn how to frame our arguments a little better in order to make them stronger b/c they are NOT filled with absolute assertions... So ultimately what I am saying is that there may be aspects of your writing that reveals your age, even though you are NOT disclosing it.

On the other hand, if you think that it is unfair that your age is being targeted, then you may want to consider ways to reframe your arguments or at least to concede on certain points until you research further into them... Sometimes a sign of fitting really into the adult world is to possibly concede a few points or maybe delay by saying that you will look into some things further.....or even to concede that some observations are beyond your current set of experiences.

[MrPiggles]

It's what the Koran says, you're free to belief it or not. But fact remains, no government in human history has ever done what they promised. And no government was ultimately non-corrupt.

Is anarchy the solution though? No, it's not. Only a Caliphate ruled by a caliph that is descended from Mohammad will be the answer to our problems. That caliph is Mohammad himself.

I'm not asking you to take my word for it, I'm just trying to tell you there's a third option everyone forgets about, and the government question is more important than most people realize. In fact it can decide how your life plays out in the next couple of decades.

1) actively support a human government
2) anarchy
3) actively become a citizen of Islamic State (the option many people forget about)

Please consider returning to Islamic State, as Allah is the only one who can rule over us to our own benefit. Allah cares about us and can provide for all our needs and he will.

Fixed that for you Mr Abu Mosa

[spooderman]

Is it a case that, everytime the price dips, the bitcoin community switches into remains a criptocrypto-anarchist sect community?

FTFY

[empowering]

Crypto Anarchy Cyberstates and Pirate Utopias. - Pete Ludlow - (Tim C May, David Brin et al)

http://monoskop.org/images/4/42/Ludlow_Peter_Crypto_Anarchy_Cyberstates_and_Pirate_Utopias.pdf


Cyphernomicon Timothy C May


http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.805/articles/crypto/cypherpunks/cyphernomicon/CP-FAQ

For people interested in cryptography, and in the topics being discussed today regarding "anarchy" and society, and the state and defining and redefining the definitions of its reach and its boundaries in an ever increasing technological age, then the above is some good/interesting (essential?) background reading. 

[JayJuanGee]

My age is not relevant. It's childish to ask for it.

Of course your age and life experiences can be relevant to shed light upon the kinds assertions that you are making; however, it could also be an ad hominem attack if your youthfulness is being used to minimize and/or patronize if you were making otherwise valid arguments/observations.

I was asking because he genuinely believes that people who are murdered simply failed to be fit enough to survive. I can't imagine anyone with much experience outside of a very cushy life in the suburbs believing anything so ridiculous.

I questioned his age and whether he'd seen human brutality up close because they're both pertinent to understanding how he could hold such a belief.

Definitely experience levels and even age could be relevant to assessing how one comes to such ridiculous beliefs.... especially when people are making claims about free market and survival of the fittest and all those kinds of bullshit generalizations that may NOT play out in a variety of circumstances (including the real world), and this time, I had attempted to avoid getting into some of the discussions of the role of government because it seems that people frequently make some pretty out-there assertions and really fail to particularize the multifaceted existence of government.

In this regard, government screws a lot of things up, but I cannot embrace the diving into various solutions that causes us to throw out the baby with the bath water or to get rid of government without having various functional systems in place.. to replace it (if that really were some kind of meaningful objective).

[octaft]

Do any of you statists even know what anarchy is? You all seem to be using the late 20th century propagandised definition for some reason.

You're right, Anarchy have many definitions and it is pointless to talk about something people have very different definitions.

I wish people knew some basic about discussion before talking.

Why is it pointless to gather information on the opinions of others? If it turns out that it's the different definition of anarchy causing the dispute, then a simple clarification from the anarchists would indicate that, and we could further the discussion.

So again, somebody, enlighten us "weak statists" about what makes you big strong anarchy man.

Fair enough, saying I'm an adult should be enough.

You're ducking his real point and you know you're doing it.

It makes no difference if you're 16 or 60, the question is have you ever seen human brutality from anywhere outside of a computer screen? Have you ever witnessed it, experienced what it's like to be there, to be a victim of it? Because if you can't, then you really have no earthly idea how you would actually respond in that situation.

More weakness. Sophistry instead of sound arguments. Your "faith in humanity" is just another variant of "but my feels!".

The world is a harsh place, and it won't get any easier with an outlook like that. Work on constructive solutions.

Uhh, you do realize I said I lack faith in humanity. It is my belief that many do not commit crimes out of fear for the law, not out of any moral obligation. Furthermore, it is my belief that if shit hits the fan, a great amount of people that didn't need to commit crimes in our current society will be willing to do anything up to and including murder to ensure their own are fed.

Is a world where you could wind up with the business end of a hammer in the back of your skull without warning a world you want to live in? Is a world where leaders are decided by how bloodthirsty they are, and power vacuums are created constantly a world you want to live in? If so, then I'd ask you the same question: how much human brutality have you experienced?

And if you truly think you're "hard" enough to survive in that environment, just remember that unless you're the hardest guy in the world, there's always someone harder.