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Author Topic: Altcoins are killing Bitcoin and Cryptocurrency as a whole  (Read 9528 times)
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 12:36:30 AM
 #101

1) For Christ Sakes, a Bitcoin Core Developer as shown on: https://bitcoin.org/en/development, are those that determine what gets added to the Bitcoin code and what doesn't.

No, you seem to be under the impression their exists no other implementations. You do understand their are multiple software stacks that interact with the Bitcoin Blockchain right? Bitcoin Core is just one of them. These aren't "third party" as such a statement is asinine when talking about an open source decentralized project. "Bitcoin core" has the same access and privileges as libbitcoin, btcd, Bits of Proof, bitcoinj, picocoin, caesure, ect...

Again , "third party" doesn't mean anything in an open source decentralized project.

I never said anything about "software developers". A Contributor is NOT a core developer, I can contribute, so can you, that just makes me a contributor, this Bitcoin is Open-Sourced. What don't you understand?

Obviously, you are not a software developer as you would understand that we do consider Github contributors as software developers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_developer




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October 30, 2014, 12:41:50 AM
 #102

1) For Christ Sakes, a Bitcoin Core Developer as shown on: https://bitcoin.org/en/development, are those that determine what gets added to the Bitcoin code and what doesn't.

No, you seem to be under the impression their exists no other implementations. You do understand their are multiple software stacks that interact with the Bitcoin Blockchain right? Bitcoin Core is just one of them. These aren't "third party" as such a statement is asinine when talking about an open source decentralized project. "Bitcoin core" has the same access and privileges as libbitcoin, btcd, Bits of Proof, bitcoinj, picocoin, caesure, ect...

Again , "third party" doesn't mean anything in an open source decentralized project.

I never said anything about "software developers". A Contributor is NOT a core developer, I can contribute, so can you, that just makes me a contributor, this Bitcoin is Open-Sourced. What don't you understand?

Obviously, you are not a software developer as you would understand that we do consider Github contributors as software developers.

1)Third Party does mean something, " In computer programming, a third-party software component is a reusable software component developed to be either freely distributed or sold by an entity other than the original vendor of the development platform." So anyone creating programs using or ontop of Bitcoin constitutes are a 3rd party, like DarkWallet. Also, all those things you mentioned form the Bitcoin codebase, and any pull requests still have to be accepted by none other than the Bitcoin Core Developers. You can't just submit any old pull request and get it published immediately without being it looked over(if that was how it worked, Bitcoin would be destroyed by now).

2)I have never thought of Contributors as software developers. In a way that makes some sense, but it would lead to confusion when trying to explain a Bitcoin Core Developer from a "Core" Contributor on Github. So overall, saying, software developers, is inaccurate or a misleading...Also, why are you mentioning "Software Developers"....You went from Core Developer to Software Developer.
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 12:51:28 AM
 #103

1)Third Party does mean something, " In computer programming, a third-party software component is a reusable software component developed to be either freely distributed or sold by an entity other than the original vendor of the development platform." So anyone creating programs using or ontop of Bitcoin constitutes are a 3rd party, like DarkWallet. Also, all those things form the Bitcoin codebase, and any pull requests still have to be accepted by none other than the Bitcoin Core Developers. You can't just submit any old pull request and get it published immediately without being it overlooked(if that was how it worked, Bitcoin would be destroyed by now).


No, no , no .... you still don't get it. You are completely confused and spreading misinformation. Those 5 Core "Bitcoin core" developers don't have control over other stacks or implementations like libbitcoin and others. Within Alts there is a small team of developers that control the whole coin , within Bitcoin there is one large and mostly used codebase with a large team of developers contributing and peer reviewing and many other codebases that can interact with the Bitcoin blockchain and perform the same actions as Bitcoin core. There is a day and night difference between Bitcoin and any other alt because of this. This means that if a bunch of rogue developers hijacks Bitcoin Core there are other stacks ready to use and already being used right now.

Bitcoin core is only special because it currently has the most developers and users. It has no priveledges or rights above any other software stack that interacts with the bitcoin blockchain!

2)I have never thought of Contributors as software developers. In a way that makes some sense, but it would lead to confusion when trying to explain a Bitcoin Core Developer from a "Core" Contributor on Github. So overall, saying, software developers, is inaccurate or a misleading...


It is only confusing to you because you are obviously not a software developer and are merely reading the words on those pages with no knowledge of how these software projects are actually developed.

Do you see the term "Developer" with Githubs glossary?

https://help.github.com/articles/github-glossary/

How about in Permission levels?
https://help.github.com/articles/permission-levels-for-a-user-account-repository/

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October 30, 2014, 12:54:01 AM
 #104

1)Third Party does mean something, " In computer programming, a third-party software component is a reusable software component developed to be either freely distributed or sold by an entity other than the original vendor of the development platform." So anyone creating programs using or ontop of Bitcoin constitutes are a 3rd party, like DarkWallet. Also, all those things form the Bitcoin codebase, and any pull requests still have to be accepted by none other than the Bitcoin Core Developers. You can't just submit any old pull request and get it published immediately without being it overlooked(if that was how it worked, Bitcoin would be destroyed by now).


No, no , no .... you still don't get it. You are completely confused and spreading misinformation. Those 5 Core "Bitcoin core" developers don't have control over other stacks or implementations like libbitcoin and others. Within Alts their is a small team of developers that control the whole coin , within Bitcoin there is one large and mostly used codebase with a large team of developers contributing and peer reviewing and many other codebases that can interact with the Bitcoin blockchain and perform the same actions as Bitcoin core.

Bitcoin core is only special because it currently has the most developers and users. It has no priveledges or rights above any other software stack that interacts with the bitcoin blockchain!

2)I have never thought of Contributors as software developers. In a way that makes some sense, but it would lead to confusion when trying to explain a Bitcoin Core Developer from a "Core" Contributor on Github. So overall, saying, software developers, is inaccurate or a misleading...


It is only confusing to you because you are obviously not a software developer and are merely reading the words on those pages with no knowledge of how these software projects are actually developed.

Do you see the term "Developer" with Githubs glossary?

https://help.github.com/articles/github-glossary/

How about in Permission levels?
https://help.github.com/articles/permission-levels-for-a-user-account-repository/

According to https://bitcoin.org/en/development, you're wrong...If what you're saying is correct, then that would mean anyone can add anything to the Bitcoin codebase, have it peer reviewed by other random contributors, and accepted. That there doesn't make any sense. The Github pages are owned by people(s), yes code is reviewed before being accepted, but they're reviewed by presumably the Core Developers of Bitcoin: https://bitcoin.org/en/development, or those they give special rights to. Being a contributor does not make you a Core Developer, as again, Bitcoin is Open-Sourced and anyone can contribute.
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 12:58:40 AM
 #105

There is nothing more boring than two people arguing about the definition of a word.


Yes, but it isn't just about semantics. He is very confused to how the development process is done within Github and all the other implementations that interact within Github. He is speaking from the perspective of a non-developer who has never working within the software industry or on any github project and is merely reading words off the page like a layman and getting confused.

He seems to be under the impression that 5 developers control the "Bitcoin" project and is misleading others with his FUD.

Those 5 Core "Bitcoin core" developers don't have control over other stacks or implementations like libbitcoin and others.

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October 30, 2014, 12:59:55 AM
 #106

There is nothing more boring than two people arguing about the definition of a word.


Yes, but it isn't just about semantics. He is very confused to how the development process is done within Github and all the other implementations that interact within Github.

He seems to be under the impression that 5 developers control the "Bitcoin" project and is misleading others with his FUD.

Those 5 Core "Bitcoin core" developers don't have control over other stacks or implementations like libbitcoin and others.

From https://bitcoin.org/en/development, " The Bitcoin system was originally designed by Satoshi Nakamoto. His original Bitcoin codebase is now being maintained as Bitcoin Core by the following developers and a community of volunteers."

You are misinformed..(read the above quote). I know the Core Developers of Bitcoin don't control Bitcoin, they for the moment maintain and decide what's best for it. If they controlled Bitcoin, it would not be Open-Sourced.
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 01:01:40 AM
 #107



From https://bitcoin.org/en/development, " The Bitcoin system was originally designed by Satoshi Nakamoto. His original Bitcoin codebase is now being maintained as Bitcoin Core by the following developers and a community of volunteers."



You understand that "Software developer" = "contributor" on Github right?

inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 01:04:10 AM
 #108

I know the Core Developers of Bitcoin don't control Bitcoin, they for the moment maintain and decide what's best for it. If they controlled Bitcoin, it would not be Open-Sourced.

No, you still are spreading misinformation. "Bitcoin Core" is merely one stack that interacts with the Bitcoin blockchain.
There are other stacks they have no control over.

Why is this so hard for you to understand?

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October 30, 2014, 01:04:54 AM
 #109



From https://bitcoin.org/en/development, " The Bitcoin system was originally designed by Satoshi Nakamoto. His original Bitcoin codebase is now being maintained as Bitcoin Core by the following developers and a community of volunteers."



You understand that "Software developer" = "contributor" on Github right?

As said in my previous post:


2)I have never thought of Contributors as software developers. In a way that makes some sense, but it would lead to confusion when trying to explain a Bitcoin Core Developer from a "Core" Contributor on Github. So overall, saying, software developers, is inaccurate or a misleading...Also, why are you mentioning "Software Developers"....You went from Core Developer to Software Developer.


In order to be a contributor, then you'd have to know code and/or cryptography, so you'd have to be a programmer, which are naturally software developers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_developer
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October 30, 2014, 01:06:26 AM
 #110

I know the Core Developers of Bitcoin don't control Bitcoin, they for the moment maintain and decide what's best for it. If they controlled Bitcoin, it would not be Open-Sourced.

No, you still are spreading misinformation. "Bitcoin Core" is merely one stack that interacts with the Bitcoin blockchain.
There are other stacks they have no control over.

Why is this so hard for you to understand?


If this was true, then why can I clone the Github repository and make my own altcoin just like that? Does the Bitcoin codebase not comprise all those different branches?



From https://bitcoin.org/en/development, " The Bitcoin system was originally designed by Satoshi Nakamoto. His original Bitcoin codebase is now being maintained as Bitcoin Core by the following developers and a community of volunteers."


^^^^
| | | |
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 01:11:41 AM
 #111

If this was true, then why can I clone the Github repository and make my own altcoin just like that?

Non sequitur . There are other stacks or software codebases that interact with the bitcoin blockchain and perform all the functions of Bitcoin Core. When you use "Dark Wallet" you aren't using the Bitcoin Core software stack at all but still performing some of the same interactions with the Bitcoin blockchain.

The reason you don't understand this is because you don't understand how Bitcoin or probably any other alt works at a logical level and how the code is written.

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October 30, 2014, 01:16:29 AM
 #112

If this was true, then why can I clone the Github repository and make my own altcoin just like that?

Non sequitur . There are other stacks or software codebases that interact with the bitcoin blockchain and perform all the functions of Bitcoin Core. When you use "Dark Wallet" you aren't using the Bitcoin Core software stack at all but still performing some of the same interactions with the Bitcoin blockchain.

The reason you don't understand this is because you don't understand how Bitcoin or probably any other alt works at a logical level and how the code is written.

...What you're talking about is 3rd parties. DarkWallet uses the Bitcoin Blockchain, as does CounterParty, that doesn't make them a part of Bitcoin, more like an external function or feature which is a 3rd party(http://www.techterms.com/definition/thirdparty)... They themselves(developers for each), don't have the rights to modify the Bitcoin codebase though, only the core developers are able to accept pull requests from contributors.
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 01:19:31 AM
 #113

It's still boring, and you are filling up the thread with shit that has nothing to do with the topic and that nobody cares about..

Actually, this conversion while tedious and boring is very important to the topic at hand. One of the main reasons why people invest in any alt instead of Bitcoin is because they are generally misinformed by the marketing of alts or general ignorance to software development in general.

Many people download Bitcoin QT and are disappointed because it doesn't have the same feature sets as other alt wallets or looks as pretty when most of Bitcoin development has nothing to do with Bitcoin QT.

Bitcoin has a tremendous development advantage above any other alt.

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October 30, 2014, 01:22:38 AM
 #114

It's still boring, and you are filling up the thread with shit that has nothing to do with the topic and that nobody cares about..

Actually, this conversion while tedious and boring is very important to the topic at hand. One of the main reasons why people invest in any alt instead of Bitcoin is because they are generally misinformed by the marketing of alts or general ignorance to software development in general.

Many people download Bitcoin QT and are disappointed because it doesn't have the same feature sets as other alt wallets or looks as pretty when most of Bitcoin development has nothing to do with Bitcoin QT.

Bitcoin has a tremendous development advantage above any other alt.

Adoption and things coming forth from that, is it's only advantage. Having people make things for Bitcoin that aren't released on the mainnet doesn't matter, I think that's what your referring to. That's what seperates the need for altcoins from Bitcoin, altcoins can incorporate all sorts of features on its mainnet without fear of backlash which gives it room to grow and have wide opinions from it's users on the features etc, unlike Bitcoin.

Also, investing in Bitcoin may only be worthwhile in the longrun. In the immediate future, investing in altcoins gives way more room for decent price increases than it would be just investing in Bitcoin.
inBitweTrust
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October 30, 2014, 01:24:36 AM
 #115

...What you're talking about is 3rd parties. DarkWallet uses the Bitcoin Blockchain, as does CounterParty, that doesn't make them a part of Bitcoin, more like an external function or feature which is a 3rd party(http://www.techterms.com/definition/thirdparty)... They themselves(developers for each), don't have the rights to modify the Bitcoin codebase though, only the core developers are able to accept pull requests from contributors.

3rd party is a nonsensical term within a decentralized project. Most of satoshi's code has been thrown away anyways and there is no "official" stack. You can use any stack you want to interact with the blockchain, they are all part of Bitcoin.

You understand that even the core developers of Bitcoin core want multiple stacks interacting with the blockchain that they have no control over right?

altcoins can incorporate all sorts of features on its mainnet without fear of backlash

This is dangerous and a sign that you don't understand what makes for good software.


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October 30, 2014, 01:26:59 AM
 #116

...What you're talking about is 3rd parties. DarkWallet uses the Bitcoin Blockchain, as does CounterParty, that doesn't make them a part of Bitcoin, more like an external function or feature which is a 3rd party(http://www.techterms.com/definition/thirdparty)... They themselves(developers for each), don't have the rights to modify the Bitcoin codebase though, only the core developers are able to accept pull requests from contributors.

3rd party is a nonsensical term within a decentralized project. Most of satoshi's code has been thrown away anyways and there is no "official" stack. You can use any stack you want to interact with the blockchain, they are all part of Bitcoin.

You understand that even the core developers of Bitcoin core want multiple stacks interacting with the blockchain that they have no control over right?

3rd party is not a nonsensical term as here is the definition," In computer programming, a third-party software component is a reusable software component developed to be either freely distributed or sold by an entity other than the original vendor of the development platform.". Decentralized means there isn't any group of users that explicitly control the entire thing, such as a company.

While Bitcoin is decentralized, that doesn't mean it lacks order, which is what you seem to think, that decentralization=lack of any order. There still needs to be people well versed in the field to be making the final decisions on what goes where and when, otherwise it would be chaos.
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October 30, 2014, 01:35:00 AM
 #117

3rd party is not a nonsensical term as here is the definition," In computer programming, a third-party software component is a reusable software component developed to be either freely distributed or sold by an entity other than the original vendor of the development platform.". Decentralized means there isn't any group of users that explicitly control the entire thing, such as a company.

While Bitcoin is decentralized, that doesn't mean it lacks order, which is what you seem to think, that decentralization=lack of any order. There still needs to be people well versed in the field to be making the final decisions on what goes where and when, otherwise it would be chaos.

I never insinuated Chaos. Lets ignore the semantics as we are in 2 completely different worlds.

Here is the bottom line:
Name one other alt with more than one software stack that can perform the same actions and have the same privileges with the alts blockchain as the first stack that was developed for that coin.

Do you understand why this is important?

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October 30, 2014, 02:15:25 PM
 #118

Altcoins allow a easy way in to new investors,

How is investing in altcoins easier than bitcoin? As far as I'm aware bitcoin has the most onramps and sellers and most alts require you to buy bitcoin first before investing in their alt.

A lot of investors are reluctant to get into Bitcoin due to the price and think that the return will not be so much. The think that some altcoins provide a higher return. Eventually they sell off, and the money flows into Bitcoin.


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October 30, 2014, 03:08:38 PM
 #119

As long as people want them they will be around and people will want them as long as they can earn on them. So there you have it. Simple as that.

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October 31, 2014, 12:01:38 AM
 #120

Best coin names so far:

"Day-Trade-Coin"
"Zeitgeistcoin"

 Grin Grin The people are so stupid...
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