[Matured] Medium Loan Request-10-15% Interest, 30-45 days, Collateral and Escrow

[Killerloop]

Not agreeing to the terms that are in your favor does not make the deal a 'scam'.

Title states collateral will be provided when it is not ---> scammy behaviour. Offered deal is extremely dangerous.

The collateral value overtime is not a consideration in whether I pay or not - I must pay, because you are supposed to pay back your loans no matter what. Am I missing something here?

Yes. The purpose of collateral is to insure the lender against the borrower. For more benefit please read here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collateral_(finance)

To call this standard arrangement a 'scam' because it did not settle in your favor - what a joke. You apparently think loans are supposed to be 100% in your favor and know nothing about how deals like these work. It's a trade off, and 3rd party escrow acting as the insurance against fraud - an option that I favor.

Beginners tend to mix LOAN with INVESTMENT. Is this a loan request or an investment opportunity? Secured loans are supposed to be 100% in the favor of the lender unlike an investment which exposes both parties to risk.
Please check it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loan  --- under SECURED section.

You try to cater serious investors, please act accordingly.

[1715623792]

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[Honeypot]

Not agreeing to the terms that are in your favor does not make the deal a 'scam'.

Title states collateral will be provided when it is not ---> scammy behaviour. Offered deal is extremely dangerous.

The collateral value overtime is not a consideration in whether I pay or not - I must pay, because you are supposed to pay back your loans no matter what. Am I missing something here?

Yes. The purpose of collateral is to insure the lender against the borrower. For more benefit please read here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collateral_(finance)

To call this standard arrangement a 'scam' because it did not settle in your favor - what a joke. You apparently think loans are supposed to be 100% in your favor and know nothing about how deals like these work. It's a trade off, and 3rd party escrow acting as the insurance against fraud - an option that I favor.

Beginners tend to mix LOAN with INVESTMENT. Is this a loan request or an investment opportunity? Secured loans are supposed to be 100% in the favor of the lender unlike an investment which exposes both parties to risk.
Please check it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loan  --- under SECURED section.

You try to cater serious investors, please act accordingly.

What are you even talking about? Collateral is always provided, and has been provided to austin already via maidak holding them as he publicly confirmed.

Next time you want to be taken seriously, understand the difference between 'insure' and 'hand over the money without escrow and trust someone not to steal your collateral'.

Secured loans do not favor the lender 100% - there is no such arrangement in financial deals, only a difference in balance of advantage and disadvantage, especially in the crypto scene. I offer the best and fairest arrangements I can and will support all trusted 3rd party escrow to hold the collateral for my client exactly for any contingencies in loan payment.

You obviously have been burned one too many times with your amateurish attempts at investments and loans, and now want to blame anyone for your grossly ignorant understanding of how financial deals work.

Your history and mine contrast very differently. No one will miss the difference, and especially your lack of proper attitude in engaging other members based on your supposed expertise borrowed from wikipedia about lending practices for different environments.

Serious investors would not be able to comprehend exactly what you are complaining about when you yourself admitted never reading enough to see what I publicly posted and explained.

I could loan a portion of the request to you, but I do not accept escrow and collateral must cover at least 110% of the loan, 120% is better for your safety.
Of course if the altcoin provided rises significantly in value I'm willing to send it back a portion up to the original value coverage... it is not my desire to hamper your trading efforts by devoiding you of liquidity.

PM me if interested.

Notice the fact that he asked for no escrow and simply handing over the collateral directly, when I specifically stated 3rd party escrow being essential.

Why would anyone refuse a 3rd party escrow we can both agree on?

Especially when many of his negative feedbacks against others emphasize importance of escrow?

Full of holes and full of lies. Most people didn't even bother with this type of behavior, but it's time you are called out on your mouth.



Offer ongoing, 4.5 btc left to fill with appropriate collateral held by escrow.

[Killerloop]

What are you even talking about? Collateral is always provided, and has been provided to austin already via maidak holding them as he publicly confirmed.

It is a deposit as he cannot liquidate it in the event the value pummels. He has to TRUST you will honor the deal in such a situation. Very unlikely considering your reactions.

Next time you want to be taken seriously, understand the difference between 'insure' and 'hand over the money without escrow and trust someone not to steal your collateral'.

That's childlish. Proper way of dealing business is escrow and liquidable collateral. Your refusal do to this is a huge red flag as it was already pointed out by another savvy user.

Serious investors would not be able to comprehend exactly what you are complaining about when you yourself admitted never reading enough to see what I publicly posted and explained.

I did and made my reply showing the inherent dangers of such an agreement with you, along with the scammy title which includes the word "collateral".
As I have already told you by PM: childlish behaviour isn't going to win you any friends. This is an investment opportunity and not a secured loan so... wrong section

Let's hear what other users say about this matter

[Honeypot]

What are you even talking about? Collateral is always provided, and has been provided to austin already via maidak holding them as he publicly confirmed.

It is a deposit as he cannot liquidate it in the event the value pummels. He has to TRUST you will honor the deal in such a situation. Very unlikely considering your reactions.

Next time you want to be taken seriously, understand the difference between 'insure' and 'hand over the money without escrow and trust someone not to steal your collateral'.

That's childlish. Proper way of dealing business is escrow and liquidable collateral. Your refusal do to this is a huge red flag as it was already pointed out by another savvy user.

Serious investors would not be able to comprehend exactly what you are complaining about when you yourself admitted never reading enough to see what I publicly posted and explained.

I did and made my reply showing the inherent dangers of such an agreement with you, along with the scammy title which includes the word "collateral".
As I have already told you by PM: childlish behaviour isn't going to win you any friends. This is an investment opportunity and not a secured loan so... wrong section

Let's hear what other users say about this matter

Apparently you missed the part where the value could rocket and I would not be able to profit because, well it's in a collateral.

You also missed the part where the collateral is given to the lender if the payment is not made as per agreement.

Are you blind, or just that short?

Childish and inexperienced seems to be their agreement on your behavior, based on past dealings with you

Offer on going, 4.5 btc with collateral provided via 3rd party escrow.

[Killerloop]

Apparently you missed the part where the value could rocket and I would not be able to profit because, well it's in a collateral.

I did not, you may want to read more carefully my reply dated November 4.

Before borrowing money you should spend some time into reading proper money management techniques:

- forbid collateral liquidation ---> no longer collateral
- include a partial refund in case of value rise --> professional approach.

You also missed the part where the collateral is given to the lender if the payment is not made as per agreement.

That is the purpose of collateral, not something you can add as an extra.

[Honeypot]

Apparently you missed the part where the value could rocket and I would not be able to profit because, well it's in a collateral.

I did not, you may want to read more carefully my reply dated November 4.

Before borrowing money you should spend some time into reading proper money management techniques:

- forbid collateral liquidation ---> no longer collateral
- include a partial refund in case of value rise --> professional approach.

You also missed the part where the collateral is given to the lender if the payment is not made as per agreement.

That is the purpose of collateral, not something you can add as an extra.

Yes you needed that spelled out for you, so there it is

Apparently you are too busy thinking of your profits to understand that forbidding liquidation for anything other then late payment past maturity date is an option, not a requirement for a collateral.

Don't like the basic arrangements? This is a negotiations, and your preferences do not define what secure loan and collateral is.

I do not recall anyone saying those are 'extra', only you are being too much of a little bitch to figure out the obvious statement.

I did not need you to offer any 'partial refunds' to my advantage - you tried to not even use escrow, then asked for large amounts of collateral that can be liquidated to your advantage, and now you think you want to redefine what a 'collateral' is based on your personal preferences while mouthing off about 'professionalism'.

Negotiations and trade apparently means little to you, and your 'offers' are rejected completely.

[austin]

Austin's 3.08 btc portion confirmed and offer is set, collateral adjusted as per agreement, maturity date on the Dec 14th, 0730 GMT.

Maidak thank you for escrow service once again.

Please confirm here for public record.

Remaining portions are 4.5 btc with appropriate collateral, up for negotiations. All interested parties, PM me and post here.

Confirmed.

[Valzador]

Also, liquidating the collateral option is one I rejected and continue to reject, simply because the sheer volatility of crypto currency makes this a very disadvantageous move.

I am at fault for not reading this completely.

User here is NOT offering collateral despite scamming attempts to entice users in thinking so. The very definition of collateral counteracts his assumptions.

He whises to use lenders like a parachute: if everything goes OK and his collateral gains value he will pay, otherwise good luck with him giving back principal + interest and getting back useless coins  

All this weighting on borrowed money.

All offers withdrawn, stay away like the plague!!

Well he's risking his reputation if he wishes to keep all the coins and default on the loans.

I can confirm that Honeypot is offering collateral but I won't reveal what it is, as that's what the OP wants.

[Honeypot]

Also, liquidating the collateral option is one I rejected and continue to reject, simply because the sheer volatility of crypto currency makes this a very disadvantageous move.

I am at fault for not reading this completely.

User here is NOT offering collateral despite scamming attempts to entice users in thinking so. The very definition of collateral counteracts his assumptions.

He whises to use lenders like a parachute: if everything goes OK and his collateral gains value he will pay, otherwise good luck with him giving back principal + interest and getting back useless coins 

All this weighting on borrowed money.

All offers withdrawn, stay away like the plague!!

Well he's risking his reputation if he wishes to keep all the coins and default on the loans.

I can confirm that Honeypot is offering collateral but I won't reveal what it is, as that's what the OP wants.

Thank you for confirming, Valzador. I try to reach the fairest deal possible on equitable terms.

Offer on going, 4.5 btc portion remaining with collateral and conditions as outlined in the OP.

[Killerloop]

Well he's risking his reputation if he wishes to keep all the coins and default on the loans.

I can confirm that Honeypot is offering collateral but I won't reveal what it is, as that's what the OP wants.

This is indeed true and a huge red flag, however I'm not commenting on users choices... it is your money and you do what you want with it.

The purpose of my posts here is to make sure everyone understand that what he is offering is not collateral by definition.

It is some kind of 'deposit to escrow' which may or may not lose value. If its value rises he is safe since escrow holds the coins and he can redeem them by paying.
The breach happens in case the value lowers.... he is no longer financially compelled to uphold his part of the bargain since he will trade a good asset (plus interest) for a losing one. You'll have to believe his word for this.... which makes to whole concept of collateral null and void.

The fact that he did not mention partial redeeming is just inexperience, it is a common condition of loans when another currency is used as true collateral not this kind of weird hybridation that OBVIOUSLY favors him despite his weird attempts at denying this.

That being said if these conditions are enough for someone to gamble, go ahead! I'm not suggesting that he will not pay... he is just making false advertisement and claims.

[Honeypot]

Well he's risking his reputation if he wishes to keep all the coins and default on the loans.

I can confirm that Honeypot is offering collateral but I won't reveal what it is, as that's what the OP wants.

This is indeed true and a huge red flag, however I'm not commenting on users choices... it is your money and you do what you want with it.

The purpose of my posts here, aside from taking a good laugh at someone who is climbing mirrors trying to defend what cannot be defended, is to make sure everyone understand that what he is offering is not collateral by definition.

It is some kind of 'deposit to escrow' which may or may not lose value. If its value rises he is safe since escrow holds the coin and he can redeem them by paying.
The breach happens in case the value lowers.... he is no longer financially compelled to uphold his part of the bargain since he will trade a good asset (plus interest) for a losing one. You'll have to believe his word for this.... which makes to whole concept of collateral null and void.

The fact that he did not mention partial redeeming is just inexperience, it is a common condition of loans when another currency is used as true collateral not this kind of weird hybridation.

That being said if these conditions are enough for someone to gamble, go ahead! I'm not suggesting that he will not pay... he is just making false advertisement and claims.

Now we have one ignorant italian boy bitching and moaning through PM and this thread, trying to defend himself after making some very ignorant comments.

If you knew how to invest, trade and spot legitimacy, maybe you wouldn't have been scammed so many times, and now try to bitch and nitpick at every loan thread when deals don't go your way

You think you can keep mouthing off about 'real collateral' and 'real security' when I have clearly outlined why this is financially and contractually very disadvantageous for one party in the cryptocurrency environment. I have also outlined that aside from these conditions, I negotiate to reach the fairest terms possible for both sides.

You refused escrow the first time around and tried to get a deal where you would be in direct control of the collateral - this is not a red flag, it's a confession of scam or at the very least extremely ignorant attitude that doesn't even deserve a serious consideration. Having a mutually agreed 3rd party escrow is essential for obvious reasons.

You then asked for liquidation option when I have clearly stated beforehand why that is not feasible, and then proceeded to squeal 'scam' - even though it was you who didn't even bother to read the terms.

You then proceeded to 'argue' about what you think is a 'right' definition of a 'secure' collateral and bitch about 'false advertisement' when in fact, you just happened to get mouthy and couldn't finish what you started without getting put in your place

If you knew the value of rep and had actual contacts and activities within crypto currency instead of spending most of your time whining and losing on deals, you would understand just how important it is


Offer ongoing, several requests at hand and options available. PM for details and confirm on the thread.

[Killerloop]

I must add: false advertisement and claims plus this kind of attitude everyone can see in the above post. Now my country of origin in getting into the discussion?  

Well, whatever, the dude asking for BTC to dig a treasure out was of the same sort but at least way more nice.

 

[Honeypot]

I must add: false advertisement and claims plus this kind of attitude everyone can see in the above post. Now my country of origin in getting into the discussion? 

Well, whatever, the dude asking for BTC to dig a treasure out was of the same sort but at least way more nice.

 

Most people can see that you are trying to dig up any possible excuse to talk trash after you were refused a deal that gave you 100% advantage - Can't take being called out on your attitude?

His attitude did a 180 degree turn into a petulant kid's mouthy tantrum after the 'no escrow, liquidation anytime to his advantage' was refused, and the accusation of 'scam' came after his very own admission via pm about how he didn't even read the thread. Now he insists he 'knows' what a 'proper' collateral is when half of his feedbacks are full of failed scam attempts and tantrums about how others did not give him the deal he wanted.

Kid mouths off about 'scams' right off the bat without even reading the thread (by his own admission no less) after the other side would not deal on completely disadvantageous terms - and now hopes for 'niceties'. Just got out of college?

It's noted that you never answered any of your obvious mistakes I called you out on, and keep trying to switch topics. Get out, and do not deal again on any threads made by serious investors. Maybe another scammer will satisfy your idea of 'secure' loan and steal your money to make you feel at home again


Offer still ongoing, 4.5 btc

[Killerloop]

Keep trash talking and lying if you want. It doesn't move me and I do not see anything worth answering.

You are unpolite, unprofessional and a liar. Period.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=577765.0

[Honeypot]

Keep trash talking and lying if you want. It doesn't move me and I do not see anything worth answering.

You are unpolite and unprofessional. Period.

Cheeky and disrespectful, not to mention a liar is what you are, and thus you receive no respect in turn.

Might want to check you are the only one these responses are directed towards. Professional and direct approach is a two way street, one which you failed to respect.

You couldn't leave it well enough alone after being told off for your lying accusations via pm, and now you are here being dissected for all your mistakes and false claims after making the mistake of going public with your lies. Thanks to that, you will now have a public reference to your false accusations and a proof to show you cannot deal on an even basis and like to make false accusations to simply stir up nonsense for other people when deals don't go your way.

I have dealt with plenty of people on even basis, and no one went crying 'scam' when the deal was not to their liking - if it didn't work, then we understood it as such and parted on even terms. Some have later come back and we managed to work something out. It was the offer that was made to even you before you went straight to acting like a little whore and started screaming left and right trying to provide lying description of my contract.

You provide no answers, only lying accusations based on what you think, and cry scam when it doesn't go your way. I only provide the clear straightforward basic framework and ask that people negotiate within those basic parameters.

No one is precluded from the negotiations except you.

[Killerloop]

You provide no answers, only lying accusations based on what you think, and cry scam when it doesn't go your way. I only provide the clear straightforward basic framework and ask that people negotiate within those basic parameters.

No one is precluded from the negotiations except you.

Nor I do wish to be included. I'm an investor not a gambler... nothing wrong with it but it is not my thing.

I've provided link to definitions, you breach all of them. Persisting and babbling won't change it.

[Honeypot]

You provide no answers, only lying accusations based on what you think, and cry scam when it doesn't go your way. I only provide the clear straightforward basic framework and ask that people negotiate within those basic parameters.

No one is precluded from the negotiations except you.

Nor I do wish to be included. I'm an investor not a gambler... nothing wrong with it but it is not my thing.

I've provided link to definitions, you breach all of them. Persisting and babbling won't change it.

Then scram


Typical. What a transparent and obvious attempt at back pedaling by linking of all sources, wikipedia. What a 'clean' and 'proper' way to do things

Go and hide behind your next pathetic excuse you want to make for carelessly mouthing off before 'babbling' on someone else's thread. You clearly have no intent of dealing honestly unless it is to your advantage.

[Killerloop]

Then scram

Make me.

Your lies are of no effect. As you can see you get no more replies nor offers as it is only natural.

[Honeypot]

Then scram

Make me.

Your lies are of no effect. As you can see you get no more replies nor offers as it is only natural.

LOL 'make me'

Little whore and its mouth is going places here.

Don't worry, got 2 more offers while you were mouthing off here lol

[Killerloop]

LOL 'make me'

Little whore and its mouth is going places here.

Don't worry, got 2 more offers while you were mouthing off here lol

Of course of course

Sadly...good for you, not so good for them as they take unfair risks.