BitPay is officially now an exchange and no longer just a payment provider.

[Gleb Gamow]

I have an excellent idea. Why don't you take the time to disprove that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA does indeed belong to HashTrade and not BFL, ergo wasn't being used for money laundering and I will leave this forum for good. I've already offered up the same proposal to SLok and Josh Zerlan, but so far they've opted to not take up the mantle, thus giving you the unique opportunity to outshine them two assholes.

Deal?

#ASKFTC

Your an idiot.

Why do I have to go around proving meaningless stuff to you?  Your the one making unfounded allegations, prove your own stuff.  You will find me a lot more agreeable that way.

I particularly dislike how you mislead newbies with this stuff, how many people have gone away with the erroneous thoughts you have expressed in this thread.

What the fuck are you talkin' 'bout? You dislike me misleading newbies with factual stuff, whatever the fuck that's suppose to mean, but you're 100% comfortable with BFL's actions to date. One of us is 100% fucked up in the head, and it ain't the dude penning this post.

I've already proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA truly does belong to BFL and not HashTrade, with your and mine - OUR - peers more-or-less verifying such.


Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/

It's also a 100% fact that the above was gleaned by Sonny Vleisides' site and the address depicted goes to the 1QAH... BWA that was misrepresented by HashTrade as paying BFL via BitPay $1M USD last October 21, 2013, for Monarchs that HashTrade stated in the press release would be available by the end of the year, 2103, and not 2014, now never, hence the FTC's actions.

BTW, the house depicted is the one purchased by BFL of which Sonny Vleisides lives in. If this is not 100% factual, I will leave this forum and never return.

I say that's pretty fuckin' good detective work stemming from a fool such as I, but sadly you've positioned yourself in the opposing camp, which makes everything you're involved in at risk. Of which to that I say makes you the fuckin' idiot for trying to paint me in some unfavorable light oppose to keeping your fuckin' trap shut or, at the very least, of which I kindly requested, engage in an intelligent debate, in which I would have easily backed down.

That said, now about that threatening aspect you mentioned earlier that didn't occur. You can now safely assume that I'm threatening any endeavor you're involved in because you, my friend, are proving yourself untrustworthy due to the simple fact you have aligned yourself with the wrong crowd - BFL, et al. Again, well-played and genius!

#ASKFTC

PS: Where the fuck did you go? You were doing so well and almost had me and my newbie friends convinced that you were right and that I was wrong. SO FUCKIN' CLOSE, BUT NO CIGAR!

You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay.

http://hotornot.com/sonofodi



Sonofabitch, you proved me wrong again. I've mistaken blue berries for blueberries.

[Argwai96]

They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal

Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th.

To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it.

Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions.

#ASKFTC

How would bitpay ever know if a merchant is actually selling items to a customer when they process a transaction? I don't think it is possible as a company could simply use their own bitcoin to pay for their own product and then not ship the product to anyone. No one would ever complain about non-receipt of their goods. It would simply look like a large order as far as bitpay is concerned

EDIT: This would probably actually be a good thing considering that the bank accounts that BFL controls are under the control of the FTC receiver now, while it would be impossible/difficult to be able to control all the private keys of BFL with any amount of certainty

To address what's in bold, BitPay could've easily surmised that something's afoot when weekly purchases(?) were made from BFL in nice round BTC figures, unlike most all other purchases in the past, with the exception of the infamous $1M USD from HashTrade that BFL would have had to let BitPay know what it was for otherwise BitPay wouldn't have been able to release the press release espousing such.

Only BitPay and BFL know for sure that the same bank - Harris - was used for all those ~million-dollar transactions.

#ASKFTC

I don't think this would be enough for bitpay to deny payment to a merchant. The merchant could easily have things priced in even BTC amounts (for various reasons) which would explain this. Also if items are calculated in terms of fiat then it would probably be bitpay that calculates the amount due in terms of bitcoin.

I would also repeat my previous statement.....it is better for BFL to have more money in fiat then BTC as it is much easier for the FTC to seize BFL's bank accounts then it is to seize BFL's private keys

[Gleb Gamow]

You haven't proved squat, all you have is a circumstantial chain of hearsay.

http://sonnyvleisides.wordpress.com/author/sonofodi/

I could make a wordpress site saying that Obama was the man on the moon.  Would you believe me?

Fool

Looks to me you're the fool, for each time you bump this post once with your foolish posts, I get to bump it twice to prove you wrong, thus creating a much larger thread for the media, IRS, FTC, SEC, FBI, NSA, NES, AAA, NCAA, and NASA to sink their teeth into.

Just to keep the context right, and note I'm not in any sense defending BFL in the following; it's just the facts.  In disclosure, I'd rather piss on my Mother's grave than defend the business that they've run.

There hasn't been a conviction, there hasn't been a trial, there haven't been any arrests.  BFL is under a court order that has allowed the FTC to freeze the business, to seize the books, records, and computers, to obtain detailed financial disclosures by BFL and the three named officers, and to interview and take depositions from employees and others.  Much of that will be under penalties of perjury.

The Court has appointed a Temporary Receiver.  He's a lawyer, but he answers to the Judge.  His job now, basically, will be to assemble experts to follow the money.  From the time a pre-order came in, to the time that money left BFL without the order having been fulfilled, they'll try to track where it all went, and to whom it went.  Part of following the money will be following the machines from the time they were assembled to the time they were shipped to customers, if ever.  

BFL gets a day in court next Monday to try to have the order set aside and try to not have all that analysis and digging happen.

The details of the various orders are all in this document, which I think is different than the one which CoinFire has shown, that being the FTC's pleading to the Judge to grant this order, unknown to BFL (that's Ex Parte) .  

http://www.ftc.gov/system/files/documents/cases/140923utterflylabstro.pdf

This is, almost certainly, exactly the document that Techknowledgy asserted that he possessed on Friday (a 33 page, Sealed, Ex Parte order).  His information was spot on, and I'd say his sources are sound.

You bastard! More fuckin' shit I now have to read. Fine! Have it your way. But, tit-for-tat you have to read what took me 5+ hours to pen the other night.

Sonny Vleisides' personal site, and not BFL's: https://web.archive.org/web/20130625050854/http://sonofodi.weebly.com/

According to https://www.blocktrail.com/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ, Sonny Vleisides' bitcoin wallet address - 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ - used to garner sales for bitcoin miner chips didn't pay any mining fees as shown below:



Yet, with one of my old wallets I doled out 0.0035 BTC for the privilege of sending a lot less fewer bitcoins...



The following is all four transactions for the 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ address used by Sonny Vleisides for the supposed sale of bitcoin mining ASIC chips - https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ




All the bitcoins that flowed to 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ (BFL's or Sonny Vleisides' personal account) went to 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs shown above, including the scant amount - 0.01001691 BTC - from 17HSPT3bhYE1rhrwAhi8k6GCGGXRdQimY7 and the 59.9273 BTC from 1DiPE4TnBczmPVoy53tffrd1iNPq87B3PB, the latter seen here: https://blockchain.info/tx/827063279c43c50c3f4c690dbf491071386d80068115f48d0beee7e80b4c7f2f.

Revisiting the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address, the following image depicts 0 BTC tx fees paid when HashTrade supposedly paid BFL via BitPay that infamous million-dollar down payment for their multi-million dollar order of Monarchs as the press release reveals here: http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11283333.htm.

BF Labs, Inc. Processes $1 Million Bitcoin Merchant Transaction for Institutional Bitcoin Mining Hardware Purchase

Butterfly Labs Announces $1 Million Down-Payment on Multi-Million Dollar Order for Next Generation Bitcoin Mining Hardware. Deposit will help enable production of innovative 28nm Monarch card.

<the following image gleaned from https://blockchain.info/tx/1b6ea350c094071412df1f801651263fd65ffa0b89ad6c8626ceeca8755f50bc>



According to the press release, the $1M USD that HashTrade supposedly paid BFL stemming from 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs was paid to BitPay's wallet address 16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf.

ONLY 16 hours later, that same $1M USD equaling 5,562.354 BTC had 437.646 BTC added to it, and a new wallet - 1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd - was created to store 6,000 BTC that has been untouched to this very day, as seen here: https://blockchain.info/tx/ff0fb375a2375b2b9ee7e8daa5759085d8fe8cd85280a97b1dfbb14005f36153, and further illustrated with...



Again, nary a tx fee was paid to the miners, proof with the following:



Note the confirmation time: Only ~11 minutes to get the tx confirmed with nary a fee. I say that's an impossibility for HashTrade to transfer a million dollars worth of BTC to BFL via BitPay if they do indeed maintain the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address, of which I'm 100% confident they DO NOT!

BFL/Sonny Vleisides owns the 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address, as well as the 1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd BWA, for all the bitcoins that make up the 437.646 BTC to round the wallet up to 6,000 BTC also stemmed from BFL.

BitPay may very well control the 16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf BWA used to funnel the infamous $1M USD from supposedly HashTrade to BFL, but, again, I contend that said funds were redirected back to BFL's control via parameters they set on their BitPay account.

The only thing that puzzles me now is how if BitPay was used as the payment service provider for the $1M USD transaction, why were no tx fees accrued?

To recap...

Sonny Vleisides owned the 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ BWA.

Thousands of transactions from BFL ended up going to 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs.

1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs was claimed to be owned by HashTrade to pay the $1M USD down payment for BFL Monarchs.

The $1M USD payment from 1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs plus other transactions stemming from BFL totally 6,000 BTC went to the 1EXDF4fvjRozJ96TjF4SPN7rbTx2ik6Dsd BWA after one hop, supposedly BitPay's BWA 16fus1FKurpDmPtEZLGbg7vRYtH2TEFbYf.

http://www.hashtrade.com/about.html

CoinWare and HashTrade have received substantial venture capital investment from the Jacobson Brothers, in order to help establish these emerging businesses, ensure that they have a strong foundation and secure all the capital equipment necessary to deliver the data processing services that the different business models require.

The Jacobson brothers own the Canadian Bitcoin Embassy and the Miami Bitcoin Embassy, both entities that the Bitcoin Development Fund donated 25 BTC to, of which they, too, have yet to liquidate as seen here: https://blockchain.info/address/1LAT5Zzf12cZqDy86ee2mcWhNZpk9DLf1D. Furthermore, I can easily show other BFL moneys flowing to this very address, not to mention from pools closely aligned with BFL.

All that said, which Bitcoin-themed periodical is going to be the first to publish this revelation? And, why haven't nary a one uncovered any of this before?

~Bruno Kucinskas

All the above was centered around the BWA 1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ that some unknown person included on some mundane website that had nothing to do with Sonny Vleisides even though it's his house that BFL purchased that's included on said site probably snapped by some intruder to frame poor ol' Sonny.

It saddens me that I'm a fool and you're the genius. Look forward to your reply so that I can post twice more, thus bumping this thread three times. I'm sure Josh and Sonny and Jeff and BitPay will be thanking your for your genius efforts.

#ASKFTC

[MineForeman.com]

Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?

Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit.

You are a fool

[Gleb Gamow]

They are essentially a one way exchange in that anyone can open a merchant services account with bitpay, the customer can price something at the amount of bitcoin they wish to sell, then use their own bitcoin to pay for the sale. This would be very similar to how a merchant could potentially swipe their own credit card at their own CC terminal

Again, BitPay is not an exchange. They can ONLY process payments for customers that purchase a product or service off a website, et al. They can not convert BTC to fiat for you or me or even BFL, especially a million dollars worth week after week after week... which is exactly what BFL did just prior to them getting raided on September 19th.

To date, I've uncovered no less than $10M USD that BFL converted to fiat that was deposited into some bank controlled by BFL. BitPay may be able to explain away last year's $1M USD supposedly from HashTrade - which it wasn't - but that's it.

Hell, I'm staring at ~$4M USD missing in only a 30 day period from BFL's coffer. I'm sure so is the IRS and the FBI and the FTC and probably now the CIA, SEC, AAA and NASA (maybe not AAA). BF Labs Inc. has no idea what cans of worms they've opened up due to Sonny, et al.'s, actions. Yet, Josh came here today and tried to quell nerves about BFL's EMC, of which WILL soon be shut down thanks to their former actions.

#ASKFTC

How would bitpay ever know if a merchant is actually selling items to a customer when they process a transaction? I don't think it is possible as a company could simply use their own bitcoin to pay for their own product and then not ship the product to anyone. No one would ever complain about non-receipt of their goods. It would simply look like a large order as far as bitpay is concerned

EDIT: This would probably actually be a good thing considering that the bank accounts that BFL controls are under the control of the FTC receiver now, while it would be impossible/difficult to be able to control all the private keys of BFL with any amount of certainty

To address what's in bold, BitPay could've easily surmised that something's afoot when weekly purchases(?) were made from BFL in nice round BTC figures, unlike most all other purchases in the past, with the exception of the infamous $1M USD from HashTrade that BFL would have had to let BitPay know what it was for otherwise BitPay wouldn't have been able to release the press release espousing such.

Only BitPay and BFL know for sure that the same bank - Harris - was used for all those ~million-dollar transactions.

#ASKFTC

I don't think this would be enough for bitpay to deny payment to a merchant. The merchant could easily have things priced in even BTC amounts (for various reasons) which would explain this. Also if items are calculated in terms of fiat then it would probably be bitpay that calculates the amount due in terms of bitcoin.

I would also repeat my previous statement.....it is better for BFL to have more money in fiat then BTC as it is much easier for the FTC to seize BFL's bank accounts then it is to seize BFL's private keys

Sadly, MineForeman.com can't take lessons from you as to how a discussion, especially of this sensitivity, should be pursued.

Prior to the following transaction amounts from BFL to Bitpay...

$671,385
$1,188,650
$1,219,950
$765,780
$1,206,606
$496,000
$293,032

...there were very little normal sales of products. Prior to that lull were an influx of Monarch orders with at least one $1M USD sale that was supposedly from HashTrade, of which was not.

In approximately a 30-day period, BFL cashed out ~$5,841,403 USD that BitPay had to convert to fiat and deposit in some BFL bank(s).

Surely, with all the eyeballs looking at this at BitPays office, red flags would have been the order of the day, for they would be putting their venerable brand at risk if they simply ignored it.

The FTC saw it clear as day, hence now have control of BFL's https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address, hence it ceasing to conduct BTC transactions witnessed now on the block chain. This is a fact, hence Josh not coming here to dispute it.

Said fact can easily be disputed within minutes, and I'll even tell you how. Josh simply calls up Greg Bachrach and have him declare that he's going to move X BTC - any amount - outta his HashTrade wallet at Y time. Once done, it will prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that I was gravely mistaken and will leave this forum to never return. Luckily, for me, such simple act hasn't and won't occur, for it hasn't happened in the past three weeks. Why? Again, because the FTC has 100% control of HashTrade's wallet. The FTC is such an asshole for stopping HashTrade's business that I'm currently beside myself, for they're the good guys and the FTC should've only directed their efforts toward BFL.

#ASKFTC

[Gleb Gamow]

Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?

Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit.

You are a fool

This thread is the evidence that WILL be presented in front of a judge thanks to Sonny Vleisides' money laundering practices. They'll also be looking into Jeff Ownby's ~100 online casinos, some of which accept bitcoins, of which some of those have had threads penned about them thanks to Jeff Ownby stealing from fellow bitcoiners.

#ASKFTC

[Gleb Gamow]

Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?

Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit.

You are a fool

Obviously, I'm trying to help a situation that you, yourself, contributed to. You witnessed how the community tore Bruce Peterson a new asshole thanks to his continuing to embrace BFL, and he's just a minion. Image what could possibly happen to your brand if you continue on the same path. Your call!

#ASKFTC

[Gleb Gamow]

Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?

Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit.

You are a fool

Again, this fool shows that Sonny Vleisides was pretending that BTC was garnered from the sale of chips using https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ as seen here https://blockchain.info/tx/ce1000c2b32d26f472730d9e6e0c92da946c7beda8e7bdbe654194ea4925f49d, using said address to wash what was mined on EMC.

#ASKFTC

[MineForeman.com]

Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?

Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit.

You are a fool

Again, this fool shows that Sonny Vleisides was pretending that BTC was garnered from the sale of chips using https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ as seen here https://blockchain.info/tx/ce1000c2b32d26f472730d9e6e0c92da946c7beda8e7bdbe654194ea4925f49d, using said address to wash what was mined on EMC.

#ASKFTC

Even if I accept your circumstantial evidence so what?  Coins being tainted by others is not evidence of squat.

It is laughable that you have found a taint from a mining pool and you think that proves something.  All coins have to get mined somewhere, and what has this to do with bitpay?  More taints.

You know, I used to think you were an alright guy before you went on your current crusade of accusing anyone of anything on the flimsiest evidence creating misleading threads with bullshit titles.

[Gleb Gamow]

Why don't you take this "evidence" and put it in front of a judge then?

Let him tell you it's meaningless bullshit.

You are a fool

Again, this fool shows that Sonny Vleisides was pretending that BTC was garnered from the sale of chips using https://blockchain.info/address/1Hq2t6dJcxqZjGda919p4c4tmopNRLciAJ as seen here https://blockchain.info/tx/ce1000c2b32d26f472730d9e6e0c92da946c7beda8e7bdbe654194ea4925f49d, using said address to wash what was mined on EMC.

#ASKFTC

Even if I accept your circumstantial evidence so what?  Coins being tainted by others is not evidence of squat.

It is laughable that you have found a taint from a mining pool and you think that proves something.  All coins have to get mined somewhere, and what has this to do with bitpay?  More taints.

You know, I used to think you were an alright guy before you went on your current crusade of accusing anyone of anything on the flimsiest evidence creating misleading threads with bullshit titles.

Flimsiest? I thought I did a pretty damn good job connecting the dots, thus you're the only real one negating my findings.

Hell, the court records even showed that the https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA belonged to BFL, hence it now being under their control, and even verified to at least two bitcoiners on this forum. How much more proof do I need to show?

#ASKFTC

[MineForeman.com]

Hell, the court records even showed that the https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA belonged to BFL, hence it now being under their control, and even verified to at least two bitcoiners on this forum. How much more proof do I need to show?

#ASKFTC

SO WHAT?

Even if you get a court to accept something that was posted on a wordpress site that was deleted after being captured by a third party that uses the same username of someone on a social dating site that has used a photo that is used by someone else on a site saying it was someone?  (Flimsiest defined).

That proves that BFL used bitcoins for chip sales....  uhhh

Idiot

[Gleb Gamow]

Hell, the court records even showed that the https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs BWA belonged to BFL, hence it now being under their control, and even verified to at least two bitcoiners on this forum. How much more proof do I need to show?

#ASKFTC

SO WHAT?

Even if you get a court to accept something that was posted on a wordpress site that was deleted after being captured by a third party that uses the same username of someone on a social dating site that has used a photo that is used by someone else on a site saying it was someone?  (Flimsiest defined).

That proves that BFL used bitcoins for chip sales....  uhhh

Idiot

You forgot the part where the chips were paid for with BTC directly from mined coins via EMC's BWA, albeit a tad flimsy, but I'm asking for a tad of latitude here.

#ASKFTC

[MineForeman.com]

You forgot the part where the chips were paid for with BTC directly from mined coins via EMC's BWA, albeit a tad flimsy, but I'm asking for a tad of latitude here.

#ASKFTC

Great!  Join up two flimsy bits of evidence and we have a REALLY flimsy "fact".

You have built a case on bullshit, why should anyone give you latitude?  While accusing people may be an amusing hobby of yours have you ever thought that it could cause damage to real people?  Newbies are reading this shit and may believe what you have to say.

I am not defending anyone else, but you're just making shit up.  Truth is probably the victim I am most interested in defending.

[Gleb Gamow]

You forgot the part where the chips were paid for with BTC directly from mined coins via EMC's BWA, albeit a tad flimsy, but I'm asking for a tad of latitude here.

#ASKFTC

Great!  Join up two flimsy bits of evidence and we have a REALLY flimsy "fact".

You have built a case on bullshit, why should anyone give you latitude?  While accusing people may be an amusing hobby of yours have you ever thought that it could cause damage to real people?  Newbies are reading this shit and may believe what you have to say.

I am not defending anyone else, but you're just making shit up.  Truth is probably the victim I am most interested in defending.

Asking for latitude was sarcasm attached to a fact and not to flimsy evidence. And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth?

THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE!

BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference.

[MineForeman.com]

And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth?

Yes, people come to this forum to learn and you fill them up with your bullshit.

THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE!

You love the attention, you thank people for posting in your threads because it brings them to the top again, your a total attention hore and accusing people of stuff gets you the most attention at the moment... so here we are.

BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference.

He was running away from you because you're a kook!  You make shit up and blast it out to as many people as possible to make yourself feel wanted.  Reality is, you're a joke.  Seriously, when bitcoin's get together the start conversations with "Did you hear the latest shit Phinnius is spouting" (Happened to me more than once).

I apologize for being so harsh, but this shit has to stop.

[Gleb Gamow]

And, seriously, you don't honestly believe that I'm trying to harm newbies do you, for that the furthest from the truth?

Yes, people come to this forum to learn and you fill them up with your bullshit.

THIS AIN'T NO MOTHERFUCKIN' HOBBY OF MINE!

You love the attention, you thank people for posting in your threads because it brings them to the top again, your a total attention hore and accusing people of stuff gets you the most attention at the moment... so here we are.

BTW, this 1QAH... BWA episode started over a year ago, and BitPay had yet to denounce it after several attempts, even Tony going outta his way to purposely avoid me not once, not twice, but three times when I approached him at the Chicago conference.

He was running away from you because you're a kook!  You make shit up and blast it out to as many people as possible to make yourself feel wanted.  Reality is, you're a joke.  Seriously, when bitcoin's get together the start conversations with "Did you hear the latest shit Phinnius is spouting" (Happened to me more than once).

I apologize for being so harsh, but this shit has to stop.

Seriously, no apology needed in that regard, for I fully expect that such occurs on a regular basis.

It doesn't take much to stop this kook from claiming that this particular episode is false. A simple transfer from HashTrade would suffice. But, like I've stated, such is impossible now because the FTC has control of the wallet.

[QuestionAuthority]

Bruno, BitPay isn't and never has been an exchange. They are more like "Bitcoin power of attorney" than an exchange. A merchant authorizes BitPay to trade at an exchange on the merchants behalf and BitPay locks in an exchange rate at time of sale and deposits the fiat into the merchants account. I don't think it matters how much BFL used BitPay as long as BitPay reported per the AML/KYC law. 

[Gleb Gamow]

Bruno, BitPay isn't and never has been an exchange. They are more like "Bitcoin power of attorney" than an exchange. A merchant authorizes BitPay to trade at an exchange on the merchants behalf and BitPay locks in an exchange rate at time of sale and deposits the fiat into the merchants account. I don't think it matters how much BFL used BitPay as long as BitPay reported per the AML/KYC law.  

This thread was sparked by the following post:

I'm too lazy to figure out what you are ranting and raving about this time, but I don't see why BFL selling bitcoins to Bitpay would be considered illegal or fraudulent. Merchants exchange bitcoins to fiat through Bitpay all the time. Why can't BFL? Those TOS that you quoted may apply to you, but they don't have to apply to everyone.

Here we have a seasoned Bitcoiner, odolvlobo, not seeing why BFL SELLING BTC to BitPay for fiat would be considered illegal, claiming to be too lazy as to figure out what I'm ranting and raving about. Hence this thread, to show him and the rest of the world that what took place on a grand scale was indeed illegal, and it all started virtually exactly a year ago when BitPay first put out the press release depicting that HashTrade paid BFL $1M USD for Monarchs using BitPay, in turn BitPay deposited $1M USD into BFL's bank account. The bitcoin wallet address that was used per documents that BitPay, themselves, indirectly depicted was https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs as seen in the following press release: BF Labs, Inc. Processes $1 Million Bitcoin Merchant Transaction for Institutional Bitcoin Mining Hardware Purchase. BFL's Jeff Ownby following up BitPay's press release with one of his own.

The https://blockchain.info/address/1QAHVyRzkmD4j1pU5W89htZ3c6D6E7iWDs bitcoin wallet address was created and used prior to HashTrade ever having a web presence and is mostly funded from EMC's bitcoin wallet addresses directly and indirectly, ergo it truly belongs to BFL and not HashTrade. The maneuver was probably orchestrate by BFL to launder their ill-gotten gains from mining bitcoins using their customer's miners as can easily be shown. The PR stunt was designed solely to liquidate said BTC to fiat deposited into BFL's bank account to be extracted ASAP as the FTC has declared and shown as proof that that was exactly what BFL did. In fact, BFL was in the process of liquidating the rest of the BTC in the 1QAH wallet successfully converting $5M+ prior to the raid. Unfortunately, there was ONLY $1.2M USD left in the Harris bank account when the FTC finally was able to freeze it with a court order. Over $5M USD was also converted to fiat via different wallet addresses.

BitPay was 100% privy to the supposed HashTrade deal last year, for they're the ones that released the first press release, not BFL, for BFL's Jeff Ownby is on record in stating that they wished BitPay had not jumped the gun, but no damage was done in that regard in his eyes, thus a moot issue.

TAINT has nothing to do with what I've uncovered and presented in this thread as proof that something illegal on a grand scale transpired that involves BitPay and BFL, thanks to the latter's money laundering attempts with some success, again halted by the FTC so that BFL's customer base may be able to get some of there monies back.

BFL's EMC should be shut down as well, for very few, if any, regular customers are using that free service 100% overseen by Josh Zerlan. I contend that those who are mining there now are BFL's industrial clients and BFL themselves, at the very least over 90% of the 2,000+ miners currently using the EMC pool.

Further, EMC was using Dwolla to convert to fiat when its customers opted for such. It'll be interesting to find out if EMC was using BFL's name or Josh Zerlan's, since EMC customers were under the impression that Josh was the owner and not BFL all the way up to the spring of this year. If in Josh's name, then there's another issue that BFL will have to contend with thanks to KYC laws.

#ASKFTC

[Lethn]

Nevermind, topic creation is working as normal now.

[belk]

Yeah! Congratulations to Bitpay! In the next few weeks or months, another payment provider will crossover to an exchange.