Tips on not getting scammed & a fun callout to serious devs.

[MsCollec]

Good tips from eMunie founder, now when are you going to release your coin. My hair is turning grey, I don't think I have much time left 

[PowerCordZ]

Dont buy coins from devs from second and third world countries, chances are 80% more likely a scam

[Ix]

I completely and absolutely disagree.

Satoshi created a revolutionary currency model  - if you call that a "bad precedent", perhaps you're on the wrong side of the wall.

It's not revolutionary, it copies gold with a highly accelerated timescale and the inability to cope at all with demand. The concept and the structures realized in code - absolutely brilliant, no question. The monetary system - barf.

There was no "community" before Satoshi - he built the community based on a generational leap in socioeconomics theory and cryptographic utility.

A community that has a few thousand people that will rabidly support bitcoin to the ends of the Earth and are unwilling to even discuss alternative systems without foaming, a few thousand more that are trying to engender their own rabid fanbase, and a bunch of people that are taken for a ride. Meh.

[onemorebtc]

if a coin has no premine, is opensource and no ito - i dont really care who the developer is... if he wants to stay anon he can...

i dont think any coin can claim it has a developer: its the majority of its users who decides. if another developer makes a change to the coin and the community likes it more is it suddenly his coin?

a coin - when released - only belong to the community and not an entity

[noelmal]

 

Jog on troll! No billy goats on the bridge for you today.

Yes and thats the way this scam played out (you know its been done more then a few times here already?), make you seem or innocent and such, oh but I paid back any investor that wanted their funds back  , but it wasn't those investors you where scamming now was it (well atleast not yet)? but a scam none the less.

Those you really stole from don't know it....well yet  

You're little vaporware cult group maybe believes your bullshit, many other see right through it, most just cbf calling you out on it.

[unusualfacts30]

Peoples,

I'm getting tired of all the scams on here of the so called "developers" of crypto-currencies, duping people into investing with fancy artwork and blurby (but ambiguous) text.  

It gives ALL of the serious developers in this forum a bad rep, yet its a typical case of the few spoiling it for the many.....actually, it probably isn't, there are WAY more scammy developers that couldn't even put a "Hello World" together without a tutorial than real ones...hmmm.....anyway.

Of course, you investors are partly to blame as you seem to let the fear of missing the next big thing warp your logic to make it emotional.  PLEASE do some due diligence into the developers that you are planning to invest into.  Fake developers are easy to spot if you know what to look for, as are real ones.

Before I get to the topic heading subject matter, here are some tips for telling the difference between serious & fake developers:

1)  Any developer that wants to stay anonymous, RUN!  Gone are the days where this was acceptable, because back then, there was no money to be made ripping people off, so anonymous developers were not a threat

2)  Verify the developers credentials, don't just take his word for it.  A passport picture with the signature and numbers blurred out, and a 2nd/3rd or even 4th picture of that same person doing something crypto related should also be provided.  If the developer is willing, other proof should be provided, it doesn't have to be addresses where they live (unless they are willing to go that far), but a Linked-In account that is aged, or Facebook, even Twitter...can all provide credence to that persons identity.

3)  Voice/Video call them over Skype, or a few of you band together and one of you call them.  An honest developer won't mind, a crooked one will, as they wont have the time to think up lies for your questions, and listening to someones voice can give a lot of tell tale signals as to if they are lying.  Video call is even better, as you'll have a visual and audio queue for any tell tale signs of lying.

4)  Check into their background.  Almost any developer that is skilled enough to develop a crypto-currency (even a BTC code clone with new features) will have done something in the past that has been released and they can prove they worked on.  Ask about previous projects, papers, hell even activity on developer related forums will give you some idea if they know what they are on about.

5)  Developers releasing a new currency should be dedicated, as creating and launching one successfully is akin to starting a business, its hard work and requires 100% dedication to the project.  If they are always unavailable, or on holiday, or "ill", then they probably aren't that dedicated to the cause.  Remember though, some of these real devs also have day jobs & families, so many can't be online daily 24/7...but if its weeks between updates, even on their own forums, leave.

6)  Infrastructure.  Any serious developer would have a website, forum, email etc etc setup for the project they are working on.  No real developer, that was proud of what they were doing would run a project from here with a 1000 page thread.  That is insane and shows either lack of commitment, or just pure disorganization.  Real developers will want a home for that project, and will want to have a community..they will NOT run it from Bitcoin talk!  

7)  Finally, and this is my fun call out to our developers here.  Any developer worth his salt, especially developing a P2P distributed system like a crypto currency will have gear, and probably quite a good stack of it.  Someone developing a crypto on an solitary old laptop isn't going to cut it.  Real developers will invest into hardware to get the job done before they even ask for any investment, and most likely will have collected plenty of gear over the years from previous projects they have done in the past.  At the very least, they'll probably have a laptop & a desktop in their arsenal.  If your developer is coding on a single Asus Netbook, I'd probably walk away.

So developers, please post your development setups for all to be awed at and prove your worth in regard to point 7 of my "don't get scammed tips".  If you are so hardcore as to have so much stuff you need multiple pictures, please post it.

Whoever has a setup better than this from Swordfish gets a prize

+1

I have exchange conversation with coinsource Dev and he will make it more strict for these scammers to come back with their ponzi scheme.

1). Skype video chat

2) 2-4 ID proof and show them during video chat

3) Everyone in Dev team needs to provide those proof and needs to be on video chat.

More proof from Dev outside USA

- Above are few things I've recommended and those will be done for all future Devs.

Even though he did hurt lot of investors and he will get punished sooner or later. It has taught everyone their lesson and everyone will think twice before putting money on new dev and overall it'll make crypto more safer for new/old investors. I've also recommended them to create crowdfunding for any help they need with capital for making it more strict for devs.

[Fuserleer]

 

Jog on troll! No billy goats on the bridge for you today.

Yes and thats the way this scam played out (you know its been done more then a few times here already?), make you seem or innocent and such, oh but I paid back any investor that wanted their funds back  , but it wasn't those investors you where scamming now was it (well atleast not yet)? but a scam none the less.

Those you really stole from don't know it....well yet  

You're little vaporware cult group maybe believes your bullshit, many other see right through it, most just cbf calling you out on it.

*YAWN*  Make sure you have your apology ready for the new year, as soon after I'll be calling you out on it. 

Oh wait, you'll be one of those guys that are too yellow to actually have some decency and respect to offer an apology when you are proven wrong, and will probably instead decide to go and slump in the shadows and pretend you never said anything....

Its guys like you that have turned decent, smart people away from this site...all mouth and opinion, but never produce anything, even if it failed, it wouldn't matter, at least you tried.  But no, much easier to sit there fapping away calling everyone else out.....sad.

[noelmal]

 

Jog on troll! No billy goats on the bridge for you today.

Yes and thats the way this scam played out (you know its been done more then a few times here already?), make you seem or innocent and such, oh but I paid back any investor that wanted their funds back  , but it wasn't those investors you where scamming now was it (well atleast not yet)? but a scam none the less.

Those you really stole from don't know it....well yet  

You're little vaporware cult group maybe believes your bullshit, many other see right through it, most just cbf calling you out on it.

*YAWN*  Make sure you have your apology ready for the new year, as soon after I'll be calling you out on it.  

Oh wait, you'll be one of those guys that are too yellow to actually have some decency and respect to offer an apology when you are proven wrong, and will probably instead decide to go and slump in the shadows and pretend you never said anything....

Its guys like you that have turned decent, smart people away from this site...all mouth and opinion, but never produce anything, even if it failed, it wouldn't matter, at least you tried.  But no, much easier to sit there fapping away calling everyone else out.....sad.

How in any single word is your reply anything to do with defending the FACT that you stole your own bitcoins? Classic change the topic and spin it on the messenger.

[Fuserleer]

Good tips from eMunie founder, now when are you going to release your coin. My hair is turning grey, I don't think I have much time left 

When its ready, as I've been saying for the past 6 months.  I wanna do it right, because I believe what we have is good enough to compete with anything head on that is currently in the works.

Whether I'm right about that, well, different matter, who knows!

[Fuserleer]

 

Jog on troll! No billy goats on the bridge for you today.

Yes and thats the way this scam played out (you know its been done more then a few times here already?), make you seem or innocent and such, oh but I paid back any investor that wanted their funds back  , but it wasn't those investors you where scamming now was it (well atleast not yet)? but a scam none the less.

Those you really stole from don't know it....well yet  

You're little vaporware cult group maybe believes your bullshit, many other see right through it, most just cbf calling you out on it.

*YAWN*  Make sure you have your apology ready for the new year, as soon after I'll be calling you out on it.  

Oh wait, you'll be one of those guys that are too yellow to actually have some decency and respect to offer an apology when you are proven wrong, and will probably instead decide to go and slump in the shadows and pretend you never said anything....

Its guys like you that have turned decent, smart people away from this site...all mouth and opinion, but never produce anything, even if it failed, it wouldn't matter, at least you tried.  But no, much easier to sit there fapping away calling everyone else out.....sad.

How in any single word is your reply anything to do with defending the FACT that you stole your own bitcoins? Classic change the topic and spin it on the messenger.

I think it's past your bedtime, you're having trouble thinking....if I stole my own BTC, they wouldn't be stolen would they!  

You tell me how on earth I prove I don't have something in my possession and I'll gladly do it.  But as far as I'm aware, that is impossible to do.

[MsCollec]

Good tips from eMunie founder, now when are you going to release your coin. My hair is turning grey, I don't think I have much time left 

When its ready, as I've been saying for the past 6 months.  I wanna do it right, because I believe what we have is good enough to compete with anything head on that is currently in the works.

Whether I'm right about that, well, different matter, who knows!

+1 keep up the good work, even thou all your ideas have been stolen already.

[noelmal]

 

Jog on troll! No billy goats on the bridge for you today.

Yes and thats the way this scam played out (you know its been done more then a few times here already?), make you seem or innocent and such, oh but I paid back any investor that wanted their funds back  , but it wasn't those investors you where scamming now was it (well atleast not yet)? but a scam none the less.

Those you really stole from don't know it....well yet  

You're little vaporware cult group maybe believes your bullshit, many other see right through it, most just cbf calling you out on it.

*YAWN*  Make sure you have your apology ready for the new year, as soon after I'll be calling you out on it.  

Oh wait, you'll be one of those guys that are too yellow to actually have some decency and respect to offer an apology when you are proven wrong, and will probably instead decide to go and slump in the shadows and pretend you never said anything....

Its guys like you that have turned decent, smart people away from this site...all mouth and opinion, but never produce anything, even if it failed, it wouldn't matter, at least you tried.  But no, much easier to sit there fapping away calling everyone else out.....sad.

How in any single word is your reply anything to do with defending the FACT that you stole your own bitcoins? Classic change the topic and spin it on the messenger.

I think it's past your bedtime, you're having trouble thinking....if I stole my own BTC, they wouldn't be stolen would they!  

You tell me how on earth I prove I don't have something in my possession and I'll gladly do it.  But as far as I'm aware, that is impossible to do.

Now ain't that the beauty of the scam, and the irony is its pulled off almost exclusively by those on the forum who are the most experts in securing bitcoin  

You though you really can't let go of attack the person angle can you, got to sneak that into every reply, that's a sign of arguing on the internets too much.

[Fuserleer]

Pot finally meets Kettle!  So accusing me of being a scammer isn't an attack on my person?

I've just had a browse through your post history, seems you are the first to call scam on anything and everything, and you've never had a single good word to say about me or the project. 

So on that note, in the troll box you go and ignored 

[rugrats]

I completely and absolutely disagree.

Satoshi created a revolutionary currency model  - if you call that a "bad precedent", perhaps you're on the wrong side of the wall.

1. It's not revolutionary, it copies gold with a highly accelerated timescale and the 2. inability to cope at all with demand. The concept and the structures realized in code - absolutely brilliant, no question. The monetary system - barf.

There was no "community" before Satoshi - he built the community based on a generational leap in socioeconomics theory and cryptographic utility.

3. A community that has a few thousand people that will rabidly support bitcoin to the ends of the Earth and are unwilling to even discuss alternative systems without foaming, a few thousand more that are trying to engender their own rabid fanbase, and a bunch of people that are taken for a ride. Meh.

1. A consensus-based unregulated digital currency that exists independent of the existing fiat currency system sans traditional gatekeepers, and as I've said earlier, based on a generational leap in socioeconomics theory and cryptographic utility - you barf at this as if even a remotely similar, competing technology exists before? Your have a strange definition of revolutionary.

2. "inability to cope at all with demand"
Please elaborate. I''m curious to see which end you'll be leaning towards. It would be good if this doesn't veer towards your own crypto.

3. I realize your earlier account was banned, which would explain your intense dislike of the Bitcoin community as a whole. However, it doesn't change the fact that said community exists because of Satoshi. You originally accused Satoshi of "fracturing" the community, oblivious to the fact that he created the community and said "fracture" occurred long after he's left the scene. The fact that you keep returning here to promote your crypto shows you too want to leverage the knowledge/wealth of the community. Am I wrong?

Further, I noticed you missed the third part of my quote. I'll just repost it to keep the discussion in perspective.

Fyi, I'm excited to see how you will substantiate your rather extreme positions.

I think Satoshi set a very bad precedent, and he also knew it. Instead of uniting a community, it is totally fractured based on greed.

I completely and absolutely disagree.

Satoshi created a revolutionary currency model  - if you call that a "bad precedent", perhaps you're on the wrong side of the wall.
There was no "community" before Satoshi - he built the community based on a generational leap in socioeconomics theory and cryptographic utility.
As far as "fracturing" the community, Satoshi made his position quite clear during the early days with BitDNS (the precursor to Namecoin).

I think it would be possible for BitDNS to be a completely separate network and separate block chain, yet share CPU power with Bitcoin.  The only overlap is to make it so miners can search for proof-of-work for both networks simultaneously.

The networks wouldn't need any coordination.  Miners would subscribe to both networks in parallel.  They would scan SHA such that if they get a hit, they potentially solve both at once.  A solution may be for just one of the networks if one network has a lower difficulty.

I think an external miner could call getwork on both programs and combine the work.  Maybe call Bitcoin, get work from it, hand it to BitDNS getwork to combine into a combined work.

Instead of fragmentation, networks share and augment each other's total CPU power.  This would solve the problem that if there are multiple networks, they are a danger to each other if the available CPU power gangs up on one.  Instead, all networks in the world would share combined CPU power, increasing the total strength.  It would make it easier for small networks to get started by tapping into a ready base of miners.

The advent and, subsequently, abuse and corruption of alternative cryptocurrencies is a byproduct of capitalism, human greed and the apathy of the forum administrators.

[Fuserleer]

Good tips from eMunie founder, now when are you going to release your coin. My hair is turning grey, I don't think I have much time left  

When its ready, as I've been saying for the past 6 months.  I wanna do it right, because I believe what we have is good enough to compete with anything head on that is currently in the works.

Whether I'm right about that, well, different matter, who knows!

+1 keep up the good work, even thou all your ideas have been stolen already.

Thanks  And they haven't actually, there is still a few left that not even Mrs.Fuserleer knows about  (also kudos points for actually being one of the few that recognize that a lot of the stuff out there atm was originally my idea!)

Doesn't matter anyway, they are all spread around different currencies, most implemented badly IMO.  Nothing is the complete package, or is slick enough to pull in enough momentum to topple BTC, or even LTC for that matter.

However, what with Mr.Bridge Lurker and us, this threads getting off topic, its not about eMunie or my alleged criminal activities

[Ix]

rugrats, I'm not going to devolve way off topic with you. I was speaking to Fuserleer as someone who I know recognizes the same thing. I'm done arguing about bitcoin with fanatics, I spent about 2 years doing it already, feel free to look at the posting history of etlase2 (save the scammer that used it to scam someone recently after the purchase of it). My account being banned has nothing to do with it. I didn't miss the third part of your quote, it isn't relevant so I ignored it.

[Fuserleer]

rugrats, I'm not going to devolve way off topic with you. I was speaking to Fuserleer as someone who I know recognizes the same thing. I'm done arguing about bitcoin with fanatics, I spent about 2 years doing it already, feel free to look at the posting history of etlase2 (save the scammer that used it to scam someone recently after the purchase of it). My account being banned has nothing to do with it. I didn't miss the third part of your quote, it isn't relevant so I ignored it.

I think IX's point is that demand is not constant and can move up or down.  BTC has a constant supply generation that cant react to, nor cares about demand.  If you have a moving demand, but the supply is fixed, then it's down to the other variable in the equation to take up the difference, which is price.

That is similar in parallel to Gold, except we know the supply parameters of BTC, we don't with Gold.  The end result is the same though, no real control over supply of Gold just as with BTC, so the price is the only variable that can move.

Another similarity with BTC & Gold, is that while there is not control over supply, both can be bought and hoarded en mass leading to a bubble, and nothing can be done about it.

The above was one of the main reasons I decided to develop eMunie as opposed to doing something with BTC (plus the fact that the economic model is based on the medieval theory of "Value By Labour")

From a technical standpoint Bitcoin is genius.  As a tool to kickstart to decentralization of wealth, its genius.  From an economic standpoint, it sucks.

[Crestington]

 

Jog on troll! No billy goats on the bridge for you today.

Yes and thats the way this scam played out (you know its been done more then a few times here already?), make you seem or innocent and such, oh but I paid back any investor that wanted their funds back  , but it wasn't those investors you where scamming now was it (well atleast not yet)? but a scam none the less.

Those you really stole from don't know it....well yet  

You're little vaporware cult group maybe believes your bullshit, many other see right through it, most just cbf calling you out on it.

*YAWN*  Make sure you have your apology ready for the new year, as soon after I'll be calling you out on it.  

Oh wait, you'll be one of those guys that are too yellow to actually have some decency and respect to offer an apology when you are proven wrong, and will probably instead decide to go and slump in the shadows and pretend you never said anything....

Its guys like you that have turned decent, smart people away from this site...all mouth and opinion, but never produce anything, even if it failed, it wouldn't matter, at least you tried.  But no, much easier to sit there fapping away calling everyone else out.....sad.

How in any single word is your reply anything to do with defending the FACT that you stole your own bitcoins? Classic change the topic and spin it on the messenger.

I think it's past your bedtime, you're having trouble thinking....if I stole my own BTC, they wouldn't be stolen would they!  

You tell me how on earth I prove I don't have something in my possession and I'll gladly do it.  But as far as I'm aware, that is impossible to do.

Maybe we should add to this list the ability to handle conflict resolution effectively, you got lured in by the trolls with your Emunie project pretty easily until something that wasn't a big deal, became a big deal to people. I know you are on the up and up, drama follows you though.

[Fuserleer]

I've no problem with courteous and respectful questions, no matter the subject.  Outright accusations and aggressive ego's I never have and never will stand for and parties taking such an approach will be met with the same attitude in retaliation.

I believe in treating others as you yourself would like to be treated, and I do until provoked.  If people can't or don't abide by the same, then I have no problem taking off gloves

Also, I'm used to drama, bad luck, short end of every stick all my life.....if I ever write an auto-bio, you should pick up a copy, it'll be entertaining hehe

[rugrats]

rugrats, I'm not going to devolve way off topic with you. I was speaking to Fuserleer as someone who I know recognizes the same thing. I'm done arguing about bitcoin with fanatics, I spent about 2 years doing it already, feel free to look at the posting history of etlase2 (save the scammer that used it to scam someone recently after the purchase of it). My account being banned has nothing to do with it. I didn't miss the third part of your quote, it isn't relevant so I ignored it.

As far as I am concerned, I am responding directly to your statements. And thanks for calling me a Bitcoin fanatic - I feel all warm inside.
I don't think I am going to scour through your post history just to find something that can substantiate your arguments.
Also, the third part of my quote is relevant because it counters your accusation of Satoshi fracturing the community.

1. I think IX's point is that demand is not constant and can move up or down.  BTC has a constant supply generation that cant react to, nor cares about demand.  If you have a moving demand, but the supply is fixed, then it's down to the other variable in the equation to take up the difference, which is price.

2. That is similar in parallel to Gold, except we know the supply parameters of BTC, we don't with Gold.  The end result is the same though, no real control over supply of Gold just as with BTC, so the price is the only variable that can move.

3. Another similarity with BTC & Gold, is that while there is not control over supply, both can be bought and hoarded en mass leading to a bubble, and nothing can be done about it.

4. The above was one of the main reasons I decided to develop eMunie as opposed to doing something with BTC (plus the fact that the economic model is based on the medieval theory of "Value By Labour")

5. From a technical standpoint Bitcoin is genius.  As a tool to kickstart to decentralization of wealth, its genius.  From an economic standpoint, it sucks.

Fuserleer, I must confess that Ix's dismissive attitude towards Satoshi, Bitcoin and the community as a whole was what prompted me to engage him in the first place.

1. I've heard similar arguments before, and I was interested to see which direction he will take. Resolving the pressure of demand with inflation (creating new product units) diminishes both the real and perceived value of the product. I think we've all learned that from fiats, yes?

2. The single similarity doesn't really justify the "barf" remark. Bitcoin is revolutionary. It's a fact.

3. I think the same can be said of any product - unless someone has found a loophole in the law of supply and demand.

4. I take it you mean the labor theory of value? I am very interested to see how you've developed a currency model using ltv. I'll probably check it out.

5. I disagree. Bitcoin has lost one of its central tenets - decentralization, which has effectively crippled its wider adoption. However, Satoshi's entire model as a whole is still revolutionary, as was his code.