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Question: We at BitVPS are interesting in knowing if any of you in the community would fancy some DDoS mitigation with your VPS Services
Yes, Definitely.
Yes, But only to cause shit on IRC.
No, I never get attacked and never will.
Maybe, It would be good to have some place to rely on incase of attack
Im curious but only if it was cheap

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Author Topic: DDoS Protected Hosting? Should BitVPS invest in this?  (Read 1546 times)
rapeghost
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June 12, 2012, 10:58:34 AM
 #1


So we're basically considering taking the plunge into protected hosting. It's not cheap. It is so far from cheap. Because of this, before we jump into anything we want a feel from the community.

There have been some attacks launched against Bitcoin services in the past and unfortunately due to the increasing stability+rate of BTC->USD they will only become more popular. Extortion, Blackmail, just plain old idiots attacking people/projects they don't like-- I feel like we're going to see a lot of this in the future so If that is actually the case ... We should get on it now.

I do ask that if you vote you should have owned at least one remote server in your life (VPS, Dedicated Server, Cloud, whatever) or have some plans to host and pay with Bitcoins in the future at some point.
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Nachtwind
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June 12, 2012, 11:12:45 AM
 #2

IS there such a thing as DDoS protection? Before you start services try to find out about the DDoS sizes the community had to face in the past and see if your countermeasures are remotely available to stop/circumvent these.
I have no numbers at hand now, but some of the past ddos were massiv enough to take down the big pools at the same time... and especially for DeepBit and BTCGuild i am quite sure they have a badass bandwith that should sustain a lot of traffic..
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June 12, 2012, 11:39:39 AM
 #3

Both services you listed were hosted on a single dedicated server with no formal DoS mitigation.

The plan we are looking at will stand up to 20gbit bad data and/or a million packets/sec
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June 12, 2012, 02:26:08 PM
 #4

IS there such a thing as DDoS protection? Before you start services try to find out about the DDoS sizes the community had to face in the past and see if your countermeasures are remotely available to stop/circumvent these.
I have no numbers at hand now, but some of the past ddos were massiv enough to take down the big pools at the same time... and especially for DeepBit and BTCGuild i am quite sure they have a badass bandwith that should sustain a lot of traffic..
http://prolexic.com/
They are a bit on the extreme end of the spectrum, and are therefore one of the most expensive. Likely there are cheaper providers that would stand up to most attacks.
MtGox uses Prolexic, and I heard at one point that the cost would be $10k/month.

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June 12, 2012, 02:31:12 PM
 #5

It would depend on the scale of the project I'm currently doing. If it's DDOS prone, like a pool or an exchange, I would definitely get DDOS protection. However, having that choice to turn to when I'm currently DDOS'ed, it would certainly be a plus for the service.

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June 12, 2012, 05:37:05 PM
 #6

Both services you listed were hosted on a single dedicated server with no formal DoS mitigation.

The plan we are looking at will stand up to 20gbit bad data and/or a million packets/sec


Wrong, when BTC Guild was DDoS'd it was on a DDoS protected server for the primary server, with 6 other remote servers at different DCs.  The primary hosting could absorb 30+ gbit/sec attacks.  We've since abandoned the idea of DDoS protected hosting because there really is no such thing (at least within a feasible price range).  1 million packet/sec attacks aren't even close to big enough to protect you from a real DDoS these days.

You will never be able to offer true (or even decent) DDoS protection for a VPS company unless your prices are adjusted (more than tripled) to reflect it.

R.I.P. BTC Guild, 2011 - 2015.
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June 12, 2012, 06:21:08 PM
 #7

Both services you listed were hosted on a single dedicated server with no formal DoS mitigation.

The plan we are looking at will stand up to 20gbit bad data and/or a million packets/sec


Wrong, when BTC Guild was DDoS'd it was on a DDoS protected server for the primary server, with 6 other remote servers at different DCs.  The primary hosting could absorb 30+ gbit/sec attacks.  We've since abandoned the idea of DDoS protected hosting because there really is no such thing (at least within a feasible price range).  1 million packet/sec attacks aren't even close to big enough to protect you from a real DDoS these days.

You will never be able to offer true (or even decent) DDoS protection for a VPS company unless your prices are adjusted (more than tripled) to reflect it.

cant stop, cant stop the dos, HEY!

*bows*
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June 13, 2012, 06:13:48 PM
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Both services you listed were hosted on a single dedicated server with no formal DoS mitigation.

The plan we are looking at will stand up to 20gbit bad data and/or a million packets/sec


Wrong, when BTC Guild was DDoS'd it was on a DDoS protected server for the primary server, with 6 other remote servers at different DCs.  The primary hosting could absorb 30+ gbit/sec attacks.  We've since abandoned the idea of DDoS protected hosting because there really is no such thing (at least within a feasible price range).  1 million packet/sec attacks aren't even close to big enough to protect you from a real DDoS these days.

You will never be able to offer true (or even decent) DDoS protection for a VPS company unless your prices are adjusted (more than tripled) to reflect it.

Sounds like you got shitty filtering.

You get what you pay for and you didn't pay either of the two places we're considering for service.
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June 13, 2012, 06:14:59 PM
 #9

The idea is not to 'absorb' the attack but rather to defer it before it reaches your pipes.
This is the plan we are considering.
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June 13, 2012, 09:13:59 PM
 #10

I hate to bring reality to this situation, but I don't want you to waste your money: the major types of websites in Bitcoinland that need DDoS protection shouldn't be using a VPS in the first place. Thus, this is only good for merchants and non-bitcoin-related clients.

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June 13, 2012, 09:17:38 PM
 #11

They do sell dedicateds as well as VPSs. But I still wonder how well such protection would work. Can you get a free trial? Grin

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June 14, 2012, 12:35:11 AM
 #12

rjk,

you know how i do Smiley

maybe free trials. we have to fork over the cash first Smiley
rapeghost
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June 14, 2012, 07:09:57 PM
 #13

and yeah the protection would work on the dedis too
Daily Anarchist
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June 16, 2012, 03:09:44 AM
 #14

I'm for it. It will help to add legitimacy to your service and stand out from the other BitcoinVPS competition. Also, I am one of those paranoids who think that the Bitcoin economy will come under increasing attack in the future by FedGov, either directly or indirectly.

I have a not-so-unrelated question. Why did you choose MPEx or whatever to go public? I would like to buy shares of BitVPS, but would only be interested in doing so on GLBSE.

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June 16, 2012, 06:21:26 AM
 #15

I hate to bring reality to this situation, but I don't want you to waste your money: the major types of websites in Bitcoinland that need DDoS protection shouldn't be using a VPS in the first place. Thus, this is only good for merchants and non-bitcoin-related clients.

This. People who can use a VPS for their operation (a) probably don't need DDOS protection and (b) certainly won't pay for the expensive kind. CloudFlare and a good knowledge of IPtables can make a site fairly resilient without paying anything extra.

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rapeghost
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June 16, 2012, 12:30:12 PM
 #16

I'm for it. It will help to add legitimacy to your service and stand out from the other BitcoinVPS competition. Also, I am one of those paranoids who think that the Bitcoin economy will come under increasing attack in the future by FedGov, either directly or indirectly.

I have a not-so-unrelated question. Why did you choose MPEx or whatever to go public? I would like to buy shares of BitVPS, but would only be interested in doing so on GLBSE.

Hey! My man!

Actually, there's a pass through stock on GLBSE for BitVPS shares. It's not active yet but it will be. its named BIB.BVPS i think.

I actually have a plan to combine GLBSE + MPEX and both owners seem willing as it will mean more volume for both,
rapeghost
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June 16, 2012, 12:30:41 PM
 #17

I hate to bring reality to this situation, but I don't want you to waste your money: the major types of websites in Bitcoinland that need DDoS protection shouldn't be using a VPS in the first place. Thus, this is only good for merchants and non-bitcoin-related clients.

This. People who can use a VPS for their operation (a) probably don't need DDOS protection and (b) certainly won't pay for the expensive kind. CloudFlare and a good knowledge of IPtables can make a site fairly resilient without paying anything extra.

As i said above, we sell more than VPS. This protection will work for both VPS + Dedi servers.
rapeghost
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June 24, 2012, 08:34:32 PM
 #18

Thanks so much to everyone who voted!

It appears we're getting a direct fiber from BlackLotus.net to our rack in California, It's scheduled for early September though (saved us $500/mo by waiting for September)

So that's the deal.

Thanks again, we appreciate it so much!
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