Redsn0w, negative/neutral/or no trust due to Escrow negligence?

[michaeladair]

If you are posting on this thread, please educate yourself about the previous Escrow issue that occurred with Moreia and Redsn0w or stay out.
Thank you.

As you can see on RedSn0w's trust page here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=211419 He was given negative trust from Quickseller. I personally believe that Redsn0w should either be given no negative trust from the situation or neutral trust. He took responsibility in the end and the deal went well... he ended up ending his escrow service due to the occurrences. I believe Quickseller has no right to give the negative trust to him and he should remove it, if anyone should be the one giving negative trust it should be Moreia, and he is okay with Redsn0w.

Please post your replies on whether the negative trust should be removed or what should happen, Quickseller is being ignorant and not listening to my messages so I decided to take matters to here.

Thank you.

PS: I am doing this as a friend of Redsn0w and because I don't believe he is at the wrong in this matter.

[Vod]

If you are posting on this thread, please educate yourself about the previous Escrow issue that occurred with Moreia and Redsn0w or stay out.
Thank you.

As you can see on RedSn0w's trust page here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=211419 He was given negative trust from Quickseller. I personally believe that Redsn0w should either be given no negative trust from the situation or neutral trust. He took responsibility in the end and the deal went well... he ended up ending his escrow service due to the occurrences. I believe Quickseller has no right to give the negative trust to him and he should remove it, if anyone should be the one giving negative trust it should be Moreia, and he is okay with Redsn0w.

Please post your replies on whether the negative trust should be removed or what should happen, Quickseller is being ignorant and not listening to my messages so I decided to take matters to here.

Thank you.

PS: I am doing this as a friend of Redsn0w and because I don't believe he is at the wrong in this matter.

RedSn0w did screw up in his escrow services - so he should at least at admit that and take steps so it doesn't happen again.

But in the end, all worked out.  So I can see both points of view.   

[michaeladair]

RedSn0w did screw up in his escrow services - so he should at least at admit that and take steps so it doesn't happen again.

But in the end, all worked out.  So I can see both points of view.   

He did admit it and he ended his services in response to it.
I mean, this other guy has no relation to this event...

[redsn0w]

If you are posting on this thread, please educate yourself about the previous Escrow issue that occurred with Moreia and Redsn0w or stay out.
Thank you.

As you can see on RedSn0w's trust page here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=trust;u=211419 He was given negative trust from Quickseller. I personally believe that Redsn0w should either be given no negative trust from the situation or neutral trust. He took responsibility in the end and the deal went well... he ended up ending his escrow service due to the occurrences. I believe Quickseller has no right to give the negative trust to him and he should remove it, if anyone should be the one giving negative trust it should be Moreia, and he is okay with Redsn0w.

Please post your replies on whether the negative trust should be removed or what should happen, Quickseller is being ignorant and not listening to my messages so I decided to take matters to here.

Thank you.

PS: I am doing this as a friend of Redsn0w and because I don't believe he is at the wrong in this matter.

RedSn0w did screw up in his escrow services - so he should at least at admit that and take steps so it doesn't happen again.

But in the end, all worked out.  So I can see both points of view.   

Thanks for michaeladair to this thread ( it was not necessary)  and thanks to vod for the opinion. At the end I've admitted my "stupid" mistake and with the help of the community all was "recovered" but now I think I don't deserve the negative feedback from quickseller.

However thanks again for  your attention , the transparence is the better thing.

[bleeding2323]

atleast you cleared up the issue at hand and made a deal that made both parties happy here, thats what really counts, you made good on your mistake!

[Vod]

Thanks for michaeladair to this thread ( it was not necessary)  and thanks to vod for the opinion. At the end I've admitted my "stupid" mistake and with the help of the community all was "recovered" but now I think I don't deserve the negative feedback from quickseller.

It's not what happens to you that matters, it's how you react to it.

You can get a good example of how NOT to react by looking at the recent issue with takagari.  He made it so much worse for himself.

Give it some time, and contact quickseller in the future.  Let all parties cool down.  Don't keep harassing him if he is not budging. 

[--Encrypted--]

I was thinking of making a thread with the very same topic after seeing that and vod/taka feud (I think someone should address the later btw, it's getting out of control).

I think the negative trust should be removed and replaced with neutral one. it's not like he lied to or scammed anyone.
however, the neutral trust should stand. after all, he did refuse to take the blame before he finally admitted his mistake.

[redsn0w]

Thanks for michaeladair to this thread ( it was not necessary)  and thanks to vod for the opinion. At the end I've admitted my "stupid" mistake and with the help of the community all was "recovered" but now I think I don't deserve the negative feedback from quickseller.

It's not what happens to you that matters, it's how you react to it.

You can get a good example of how NOT to react by looking at the recent issue with takagari.  He made it so much worse for himself.

Give it some time, and contact quickseller in the future.  Let all parties cool down.  Don't keep harassing him if he is not budging. 

I think that I've reacted  properly , I didn't go away from the forum I tried to resolve the issues generated due my mistake ( email not changed) and at the end  with the help of community no one of the parts has been damaged.

Now he left me negative feedback, but it was not necessary.   

[michaeladair]

It's not what happens to you that matters, it's how you react to it.

You can get a good example of how NOT to react by looking at the recent issue with takagari.  He made it so much worse for himself.

Give it some time, and contact quickseller in the future.  Let all parties cool down.  Don't keep harassing him if he is not budging. 

I actually did contact him, he sent one word messages that were bleak and ignorant. That's why I brought it here...

[Quickseller]

Since I am being extorted by michaeladair to remove my negative trust, or to change it to neutral, I will post here about my trust rating that I gave him. I am not 100% sure what his connection is to Redsn0w per the OP they are friends

Please remove the negative trust that you placed on RedSn0w or at least make it neutral. He is to be trusted but just not for escrow, so put it as neutral or we will have problems.

The negative trust you gave to Redsn0w is unecessary as he did nothing to make him untrustworthy. Please remove it or at least make it neutral trust or I'll be forced to give you negative trust.

For the record he did give me negative trust, however he since removed it when I informed him that what he is/was doing is extortion.

I have really never trusted Redsn0w, as he seems to be too eager to be holding other's money for them. I have seen many signature campaigns pop up where he immediately would offer his services via PM (I know he offered it because you make a post saying that he sent a PM - which is unnecessary BTW, especially when you are wearing a paid signature). He also appear to be building up trust as I have seen you trade with others on default trust list (and have few trades - with the exception of your escrow services - with people who are not on default trust list) this makes me believe the only reason for the trade was for the trust rating. I do not see any received feedback from anyone that was not either using him as escrow or is on default trust list. It appears that he was always the one risking getting scammed when dealing with users on default trust list.

Even though he argues that everything turned out okay (and went smoothly), in the end it did not. He gave both lihuajkl and Moreia a false sense of security when providing his services. My interpretation of how moreia's account was hacked was that it was not sophisticated. The theory seems to be that the email address was public when he took control of the account and did not change it to private (nor did he change the actual email address) - these are what is claimed. It has been said that only one account has ever been hacked because of weak forum security, so I would doubt it was the forum's fault it got hacked.  

Once the account was out of his control, redsn0w appeared to be primarily concerned about his reputation (by saying things like I think someone is trying to ruin my reputation) and wanted to know who was behind the hack. He was not quick to accept responsibility, he repeatedly said that the mistake was unintentional when asked if he will cover the lender's losses. The only acceptable response to that question would be some variation of "yes". It was only when BadBear gave Redsn0w negative trust (that he later removed) that Redsn0w "closed" his escrow service (although it does not appear to be closed). He is still operating as escrow for ActionCrypto.com signature campaign and recently gave Dogedigital positive trust because he escrowed a transaction with today's time stamp (although he could have previously acted as escrow and just added it now).

I made as escrow , great user.

Additionally even though Redsn0w has several neutral trust ratings warning people not to use him as escrow he still received at least one escrow referral as recently as two days ago.

Additionally, unrelated to the escrow transaction at issue, he did on at least one occasion did something that a much older, very trusted escrow provider thought was an attempt to steal his PGP private key as evidenced in the below post found on his escrow thread.

I've sent you a PM for ask something.  Can you please reply ? Thanks .

Another heads up... This user just asked me to use their 3rd party site to generate a PGP key. I can think of no other reason but a scam to want to provide someone with their PGP key. I'm seeing an uptick in scam attempts targeting myself and users of my escrow services. Please be careful and always check trust history before dealing with anyone.

[Quickseller]

I think that I've reacted  properly , I didn't go away from the forum I tried to resolve the issues generated due my mistake ( email not changed) and at the end  with the help of community no one of the parts has been damaged.

Now he left me negative feedback, but it was not necessary.   

You are allowed to act as escrow and have other commitments outside of the forum. Your presence was not the issue, the issue was that you were not there to promise that you would make good on the situation.

[BadBear]

I removed my negative because redsn0w said he would no longer act as escrow, so I didn't see it as necessary. I have seen reports/posts that this is not the case, but haven't had time to look into it.

[redsn0w]

Since I am being extorted by michaeladair to remove my negative trust, or to change it to neutral, I will post here about my trust rating that I gave him. I am not 100% sure what his connection is to Redsn0w, however his profile says he is 18 years old and you have a low maturity level so maybe you know each other from high school or something. You both appear to support coinichiwa and I was informed that you both are active in the NXT forums.

Thanks for your opinion , I don't know  michaeladair. He sent me a PM for first to try help me.

For the record he did give me negative trust, however he since removed it when I informed him that what he is/was doing is extortion.

I have really never trusted Redsn0w, as he seems to be too eager to be holding other's money for them. I have seen many signature campaigns pop up where he immediately would offer his services via PM (I know he offered it because you make a post saying that he sent a PM - which is unnecessary BTW, especially when you are wearing a paid signature). He also appear to be building up trust as I have seen you trade with others on default trust list (and have few trades - with the exception of your escrow services - with people who are not on default trust list) this makes me believe the only reason for the trade was for the trust rating. I do not see any received feedback from anyone that was not either using him as escrow or is on default trust list. It appears that he was always the one risking getting scammed when dealing with users on default trust list.

Even though he argues that everything turned out okay (and went smoothly), in the end it did not. He gave both lihuajkl and Moreia a false sense of security when providing his services. My interpretation of how moreia's account was hacked was that it was not sophisticated. The theory seems to be that the email address was public when he took control of the account and did not change it to private (nor did he change the actual email address) - these are what is claimed. It has been said that only one account has ever been hacked because of weak forum security, so I would doubt it was the forum's fault it got hacked. 

Once the account was out of his control, redsn0w appeared to be primarily concerned about his reputation (by saying things like I think someone is trying to ruin my reputation) and wanted to know who was behind the hack. He was not quick to accept responsibility, he repeatedly said that the mistake was unintentional when asked if he will cover the lender's losses. The only acceptable response to that question would be some variation of "yes". It was only when BadBear gave Redsn0w negative trust (that he later removed) that Redsn0w "closed" his escrow service (although it does not appear to be closed). He is still operating as escrow for ActionCrypto.com signature campaign and recently gave Dogedigital positive trust because he escrowed a transaction with today's time stamp (although he could have previously acted as escrow and just added it now).

I made as escrow , great user.

Additionally even though Redsn0w has several neutral trust ratings warning people not to use him as escrow he still received at least one escrow referral as recently as two days ago.

is this my fault ?

I think that I've reacted  properly , I didn't go away from the forum I tried to resolve the issues generated due my mistake ( email not changed) and at the end  with the help of community no one of the parts has been damaged.

Now he left me negative feedback, but it was not necessary.   

You are allowed to act as escrow and have other commitments outside of the forum. Your presence was not the issue, the issue was that you were not there to promise that you would make good on the situation.

Yes of course , deals that involved forum accounts are not secure ....

Additionally, unrelated to the escrow transaction at issue, he did on at least one occasion did something that a much older, very trusted escrow provider thought was an attempt to steal his PGP private key as evidenced in the below post found on his escrow thread.

I've sent you a PM for ask something.  Can you please reply ? Thanks .

Another heads up... This user just asked me to use their 3rd party site to generate a PGP key. I can think of no other reason but a scam to want to provide someone with their PGP key. I'm seeing an uptick in scam attempts targeting myself and users of my escrow services. Please be careful and always check trust history before dealing with anyone.

Steal a PGP key , are you serious ? In that days I had some invitations to the keybase.io site and I wanted to share them with the users. I've seen that he didn't signed a pgp message in his escrow thread and I wanted to send him an invite



However , now can you change it from  negative to neutral.  I think I don't deserve the neg. feedback, however thanks for your fast response (it seems that you didn't want to reply to my pm).

[Quickseller]

It's not what happens to you that matters, it's how you react to it.

You can get a good example of how NOT to react by looking at the recent issue with takagari.  He made it so much worse for himself.

Give it some time, and contact quickseller in the future.  Let all parties cool down.  Don't keep harassing him if he is not budging. 

I actually did contact him, he sent one word messages that were bleak and ignorant. That's why I brought it here...

My responses to you were constant with how you would expect someone to react when being extorted. Your first message to me implied that something bad would happen if I did not remove my trust.

Please remove the negative trust that you placed on RedSn0w or at least make it neutral. He is to be trusted but just not for escrow, so put it as neutral or we will have problems.

(sic)excuise me?

My second response was me informing you that you were very clearly trying to extort/blackmail me.

The negative trust you gave to Redsn0w is unecessary as he did nothing to make him untrustworthy. Please remove it or at least make it neutral trust or I'll be forced to give you negative trust.

That it extortion

Per google

extortion (n) - the practice of obtaining something, especially money, through force or threats.

You were threatening me with negative trust if I did not remove the trust rating on Redsn0w, someone who you admit is your friend (showing a clear conflict of interest)

[michaeladair]

*What he said here*.

Uhm, #1 I removed the negative trust not because you called it Extortion, but because I made this topic and it wasn't necessary after.
#2 The Coinichiwa thing was for a free btc campaign they were giving out a few days ago, both of us being on it was a coincidence.

[redsn0w]

I removed my negative because redsn0w said he would no longer act as escrow, so I didn't see it as necessary. I have seen reports/posts that this is not the case, but haven't had time to look into it.

*I've asked the  admin of actionCrypto.com , if he still want me to manage his signature campaign and he replied :

Hello redsn0w
As you stopped your escrow service will you continue for this site?

Thanks

Yes I will continue to manage this signature campaign , if the admin of the site want (I think it is not a problem).

Yes, please continue doing this campaign.

Have you fixed your issues?

I think that I've reacted  properly , I didn't go away from the forum I tried to resolve the issues generated due my mistake ( email not changed) and at the end  with the help of community no one of the parts has been damaged.

Now he left me negative feedback, but it was not necessary.   

You are allowed to act as escrow and have other commitments outside of the forum. Your presence was not the issue, the issue was that you were not there to promise that you would make good on the situation.

The problem is that the negative feedback is not necessary (at my point of view) I'm still managing the *actionCrypto signature campaign because he want it , and hold the funds of the altcoin  FINDCOIN ( but that before my mystake not after).

[Quickseller]

Additionally, unrelated to the escrow transaction at issue, he did on at least one occasion did something that a much older, very trusted escrow provider thought was an attempt to steal his PGP private key as evidenced in the below post found on his escrow thread.

I've sent you a PM for ask something.  Can you please reply ? Thanks .

Another heads up... This user just asked me to use their 3rd party site to generate a PGP key. I can think of no other reason but a scam to want to provide someone with their PGP key. I'm seeing an uptick in scam attempts targeting myself and users of my escrow services. Please be careful and always check trust history before dealing with anyone.

Steal a PGP key , are you serious ? In that days I had some invitations to the keybase.io site and I wanted to share them with the users. I've seen that he didn't signed a pgp message in his escrow thread and I wanted to send him an invite

Those are his words not mine

I removed my negative because redsn0w said he would no longer act as escrow, so I didn't see it as necessary. I have seen reports/posts that this is not the case, but haven't had time to look into it.

He is still holding funds for a signature campaign , just paid out to participants today and there is no mention of him returning funds to the owner of the site nor that he is going to resign. Per the OP of the campaign he is holding funds in 1GkgLFg9YVyvLzKbsipzJJjy5r33mpv4ki and per the blockchain there is ~.46 BTC in the address.

[michaeladair]

I removed my negative because redsn0w said he would no longer act as escrow, so I didn't see it as necessary. I have seen reports/posts that this is not the case, but haven't had time to look into it.

He is still holding funds for a signature campaign , just paid out to participants today and there is no mention of him returning funds to the owner of the site nor that he is going to resign. Per the OP of the campaign he is holding funds in 1GkgLFg9YVyvLzKbsipzJJjy5r33mpv4ki and per the blockchain there is ~.46 BTC in the address.

Let the ones that are being hurt by the person to be giving out negative trust. Not an outsider.
I know that sounds a little Hypocritical, but my point still stands.

[redsn0w]

He is still holding funds for a signature campaign , just paid out to participants today and there is no mention of him returning funds to the owner of the site nor that he is going to resign. Per the OP of the campaign he is holding funds in 1GkgLFg9YVyvLzKbsipzJJjy5r33mpv4ki and per the blockchain there is ~.46 BTC in the address.

Read the post above  yours ...

Yes and also for the FINDCoin project , but before my mistake not after.The transparency is the first thing , I didn't make nothing wrong it was only the  mistake (generated by me) that "ruined" me.

[Quickseller]

*What he said here*.

Uhm, #1 I removed the negative trust not because you called it Extortion, but because I made this topic and it wasn't necessary after.
#2 The Coinichiwa thing was for a free btc campaign they were giving out a few days ago, both of us being on it was a coincidence.

You directly threatened me and saw that your threat did not work. If you can can find a different definition of extortion that does not match what you did then I would be wiling to concede on that point, but I don't think you can.

#2 - I concede the conichiwa message has nothing to do with anything however per the OP you are friends with him - even if this is not the case it is not relevant