Cryptology (OP)
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January 10, 2015, 08:45:18 AM |
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It has been reported that Bitstamp's hacker(s) sent all stolen coins, circa 19k to this address: 1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCf https://blockchain.info/address/1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCfFurthermore blockchain.info has tagged the address as "Bitstamp Hack" making it quite simple via a "taint analysis" to check whether any incoming bitcoin payment contains any traces of these stolen coins. The really interesting issue here is whether the thief or thieves will ever be able to spend any of these coins without being caught. This is the ultimate real life experiment in Bitcoin's anonymity. As far as I can see the bitstamp hacker will have a hard time laundering these coins in any sizeable amounts. Please post your views.
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newIndia
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January 10, 2015, 08:49:18 AM |
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elephantas1
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January 10, 2015, 09:01:10 AM |
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whats the point of mixing it is it easier to sell it then?
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LiteCoinGuy
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January 10, 2015, 09:05:23 AM |
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hide your tracks maybe? (so yes)
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H.W.Z
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January 10, 2015, 09:18:12 AM |
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it is really the beauty of the anonymity of bitcoin. But this time it hits the confidence of bitcoin holders hardly! Hopefully it will go through quickly!
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Lauda
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Terminated.
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January 10, 2015, 09:26:47 AM |
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If he knows what he's doing, there is no reason for him to have issues with laundering these coins. He just needs to take his time in doing so. Well at least Bitstamp came back better than it was before.
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"The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks" 😼 Bitcoin Core ( onion)
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Comic Book Coin
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January 10, 2015, 12:26:22 PM |
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Well, that is the thing. If no one would accept those coins or any that originated from those wallets it could be stopped. But, highly unlikely.
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noma
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January 10, 2015, 12:35:29 PM |
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It has been reported that Bitstamp's hacker(s) sent all stolen coins, circa 19k to this address: 1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCf https://blockchain.info/address/1L2JsXHPMYuAa9ugvHGLwkdstCPUDemNCfFurthermore blockchain.info has tagged the address as "Bitstamp Hack" making it quite simple via a "taint analysis" to check whether any incoming bitcoin payment contains any traces of these stolen coins. The really interesting issue here is whether the thief or thieves will ever be able to spend any of these coins without being caught. This is the ultimate real life experiment in Bitcoin's anonymity. As far as I can see the bitstamp hacker will have a hard time laundering these coins in any sizeable amounts. Please post your views. If the coins are sent to someone not aware of bitstamp hack, then there would be almost no use of the tag if it is sent through a mixer.
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1Referee
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January 10, 2015, 03:32:15 PM |
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There are plenty of places where the receivers don't mind to accept these coins.
The thief most likely will get clean coins or fiat in return.
Perhaps by selling them well below current value at some point.
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Nikinger
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January 10, 2015, 04:24:52 PM |
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Fiat cashout should not pose the biggest problem if you travel to the right country first. He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
The bigger challenge comes with the need to explain the money to the taxation authority which is certainly interested in where the money is coming from. With no waterproof explaination for the thief, he would have to spend it without drawing attention which is susceptible to fail some day.
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1EwKrY5Bn3T47r4tYqSv6mMQkUyu7hZckV
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mayax
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January 10, 2015, 05:00:19 PM |
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Fiat cashout should not pose the biggest problem if you travel to the right country first. He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
The bigger challenge comes with the need to explain the money to the taxation authority which is certainly interested in where the money is coming from. With no waterproof explaination for the thief, he would have to spend it without drawing attention which is susceptible to fail some day.
it is so simple to cash out and then to deposit these money without any question from anybody. you just have to think that Bitcoin allows the money laundering and nothing more. ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif)
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pandher
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January 10, 2015, 05:08:47 PM |
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He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
Bitcoin is terrible if talking about hiding assets and thats why it will never be used in the deep webs. Untraceable technologies like Monero are far better fit for privacy needs
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Rannasha
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January 10, 2015, 05:09:46 PM |
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Fiat cashout should not pose the biggest problem if you travel to the right country first. He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
The bigger challenge comes with the need to explain the money to the taxation authority which is certainly interested in where the money is coming from. With no waterproof explaination for the thief, he would have to spend it without drawing attention which is susceptible to fail some day.
it is so simple to cash out and then to deposit these money without any question from anybody. you just have to think that Bitcoin allows the money laundering and nothing more. ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) Deposit the money without any question from anybody? In most (western) countries, banks are obligated to report transactions above a certain amount (that amount typically being well below the $100K or equivalent in local currency) or bunches of transactions that appear correlated and add up to an amount above this limit. Simply dumping $5M on a bank account is going to raise some eyebrows with the hackers local tax department, which in turn might alert law enforcement. So unless the hacker lives in a country with sufficient bank secrecy it might be quite difficult to profit from his newly found wealth.
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sgk
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!! HODL !!
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January 10, 2015, 05:49:14 PM |
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He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
Bitcoin is terrible if talking about hiding assets and thats why it will never be used in the deep webs. Untraceable technologies like Monero are far better fit for privacy needs Sorry, but Bitcoin can be as anonymous as other so-called anonymous coins if used properly. Bitcoins can be traced back to an 'address' but after all it is impossible to figure out who owns the address if the owner has enough caution to cover his tracks. coins purchased via exchanges can be tracable if exchange requires strict KYC, but mined coins have no suc limitation. A miner gets his reward and can use any address to spend them, making it impossible to link these coins to a person. Newer technologies like Dark Wallet and coin mixers are making it even easier than before.
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flipstyle
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January 10, 2015, 11:59:11 PM |
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Fiat cashout should not pose the biggest problem if you travel to the right country first. He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
The bigger challenge comes with the need to explain the money to the taxation authority which is certainly interested in where the money is coming from. With no waterproof explaination for the thief, he would have to spend it without drawing attention which is susceptible to fail some day.
it is so simple to cash out and then to deposit these money without any question from anybody. you just have to think that Bitcoin allows the money laundering and nothing more. ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) Deposit the money without any question from anybody? In most (western) countries, banks are obligated to report transactions above a certain amount (that amount typically being well below the $100K or equivalent in local currency) or bunches of transactions that appear correlated and add up to an amount above this limit. Simply dumping $5M on a bank account is going to raise some eyebrows with the hackers local tax department, which in turn might alert law enforcement. So unless the hacker lives in a country with sufficient bank secrecy it might be quite difficult to profit from his newly found wealth. This is true. In America, the IRS gets raised flags when you deposit something like $10k or more at a time in your bank account. So unless this guy plans on cashing to fiat and living off cash payments or re-distributing the wealth by giving it to his associates/family...he's going to have people in higher places watching his moves and ultimately questioning where it came from. Looks like he's already starting to use mixers to 'clean' the coins stolen. That's pretty cool blockchain can mark the funds as tainted/hacked, but ultimately there are still ways to get around this.
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haploid23
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January 11, 2015, 02:27:50 AM |
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These are stolen coins, the thief did not lose anything monetary from this. So what's the problem with slowly using a mixer over the next few years to get clean coins? It's not hard, all it takes is patience.
And since we're on the topic of real life scenario, the average bitcoin user does not check where their coins originated from, for every single transaction. He can discretely trade these to people, as long as he stays off the exchanges. Again, it will takes patience and risk to do this, but nevertheless just find the right people
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Atdhe
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Atdhe Nuhiu
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January 11, 2015, 04:50:45 AM |
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Fiat cashout should not pose the biggest problem if you travel to the right country first. He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
The bigger challenge comes with the need to explain the money to the taxation authority which is certainly interested in where the money is coming from. With no waterproof explaination for the thief, he would have to spend it without drawing attention which is susceptible to fail some day.
There are tens of countries where you do not pay taxes from foreign income. I guess the thief - if he feels that what you say is a problem - can go there and buy residency for one year.
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Atdhe
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Atdhe Nuhiu
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January 11, 2015, 04:53:18 AM |
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Fiat cashout should not pose the biggest problem if you travel to the right country first. He could easyly meet buyers who wants to buy bitcoins anonymously for using in the deep webs or hiding assets.
The bigger challenge comes with the need to explain the money to the taxation authority which is certainly interested in where the money is coming from. With no waterproof explaination for the thief, he would have to spend it without drawing attention which is susceptible to fail some day.
it is so simple to cash out and then to deposit these money without any question from anybody. you just have to think that Bitcoin allows the money laundering and nothing more. ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) Deposit the money without any question from anybody? In most (western) countries, banks are obligated to report transactions above a certain amount (that amount typically being well below the $100K or equivalent in local currency) or bunches of transactions that appear correlated and add up to an amount above this limit. Simply dumping $5M on a bank account is going to raise some eyebrows with the hackers local tax department, which in turn might alert law enforcement. So unless the hacker lives in a country with sufficient bank secrecy it might be quite difficult to profit from his newly found wealth. You do not need to live in country like Andorra to open an account there. Even if it is tax evasion, they do not care.
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BTCreward
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January 11, 2015, 05:19:03 AM |
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whats the point of mixing it is it easier to sell it then? The point of mixing coins is to prevent your identity from being associated with the theft when you go to sell the coins on an exchange. If the hacker were to sell them he would probably mix them first and then sell them on an exchange. And since we're on the topic of real life scenario, the average bitcoin user does not check where their coins originated from, for every single transaction. He can discretely trade these to people, as long as he stays off the exchanges. Again, it will takes patience and risk to do this, but nevertheless just find the right people
It would be possible that someone would purchase the coins then eventually sell them on an exchange, then be questioned by law enforcement about how they came into possession with the coins.
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m3
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January 11, 2015, 05:50:42 AM |
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Like others have said, the hacker would try to tumble the coins, the real question is are the tumblers legit or could they be honeypots?
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